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Paris mayor demands black feminist festival that 'prohibits' white people be banned
- Thread starter Shiggy
- Start date
WaterAstro
Member
Because hate on either side just makes it worse.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
The women are hating how?
In a wry humor sense, the group could have established a no-white area just by being a black collective.
Frozenprince
Banned
Well you see, asking for a private event to be for only a select group is the same as decades of systemic discrimination.
excelsiorlef
Member
I'm shocked
MilkyJoe
Member
Nah, he's committed now.
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
Indeed. Turns out there was a dose of misinformation many fell for, me included. The organizers were actually smart not to break the law with an openly segregating public event. Crisis averted.
GhostTrick
Banned
Golden_Pigeon
Banned
Interesting fact: the feminist have been doing the same thing since the 80's in France, but was never outlawed or generated such a shitstorm.
It's exactly the same principle, applied to racial discrimination.
It's exactly the same principle, applied to racial discrimination.
GhostTrick
Banned
Yes, except I believe that racial discrimination is a lot more sensitive topic in France.
Yet, you never heard them complaining about that bar only for "white people" in Nord. Of course not, it's one of them :")
excelsiorlef
Member
So you're ok with women only but not black only?
GhostTrick
Banned
Wowowow hold on with the fast conclusions. Read the poster I answered to:
His point was it existed for women since 80s and it never caused that shitstorm.
Now read my answer again and you'll see that I'm talking why it made such a shitstorm and it makes more sense.
Now as for being for it or not, it depends. I'm not for the idea of having such things barring some exceptions. There was an exemple about women in general thrown in the thread, which was about a place were beaten women could stay, which makes sense to be a women only place.
As for a place being for black women only, I'm totally for it in USA for exemple, because in USA, being open about ethnicity is a thing. When a country blatantly ask about your ethnicity and allow that when you apply for a job, I definitely see why it poses a problem for PoC.
In France, I dont have a problem when it's in a private place. Even though, I dont think it's a good idea, people are free to do whatever. You know what, even in public space, while I disapprove, I can see why that association wanted that non-mixed space.
My problem though is when you sum it up as a "black/white" thing when it's more than that in France because of it's colonial past.
PdotMichael
Banned
Like that you are a joke character?
Golden_Pigeon
Banned
So you're saying that non-mixed feminist reunion is a sexist discrimination ?
I think it's way more tied to the jacobinist foundations of France. The ideal of one people only linked by the french nationality and the french language, not forming religious/cultural/linguistic subgroups.
Also, job discrimination because of ethnicity is as strong in France than in the US.
Maybe we don't have our ethnicity in our ID, but we do have it in our appearances and names.
GhostTrick
Banned
I'm not saying that. I'm answering to your comment about why it makes such a shitstorm. If you are french like me, you know that these days, there's a lot of tensions on that side nowadays.
And yes, I know about that, but there's a difference between discrimination because of your employer, and discrimination organized/allowed by your country. And I say that as a guy with a name that is the most connoted in term of ethnicity in France.
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
It is definitionally both (spaces in which discrimination [i.e. identifying and assigning meaning to differences between people, and giving unique or preferential treatment, such as expanded access to public spaces, to one group] is used to achieve segregation of various subsets of the population according to the features discriminated for), just of a variety some happen to think is morally, politically, or philosophically acceptable. This is a potentially logically valid belief, but it is, nevertheless, the underlying belief, ridiculous though the leap to Jim Crow and apartheid may be.
Edit: Saw the update, holding racially and sexually exclusive events in private is a fine compromise, in terms of staying square with the law.
KarneeKarnay
Member
As I said earlier, this is a blatant controversy bait. Either the Mayor or the Festival just want attention and they are using race as the topic. Something that in France and a lot of places the Hot Topic right now.
This isn't about the Feminist/Black Struggle. This is about someone either making more money, seeking support in an election, or just plain looking for attention.
This isn't about the Feminist/Black Struggle. This is about someone either making more money, seeking support in an election, or just plain looking for attention.
Golden_Pigeon
Banned
All right i admit that i understood you're comment the wrong way. I perfectly understand why something like that provoke a shitstorm, another thing is to accept it
I don't think that USA allow/organize discrimination, i think it's way more advanced in term of anti-discrimination legislation than France.
no I was giving you an opportunity to move beyond the superficial "public means public and segregation is bad" oversimplifications, but I understand that people don't want to dig too deeply here.
rimshot
Everyone knows that the best hustle in the world is a black feminism festival. That's why the white people were mad; they couldn't get in on the plan.
GhostTrick
Banned
All right i admit that i understood you're comment the wrong way. I perfectly understand why something like that provoke a shitstorm, another thing is to accept it
I don't think that USA allow/organize discrimination, i think it's way more advanced in term of anti-discrimination legislation than France.
Well, for instance, I think that the fact that USA allow for job interviewers to ask for your ethnicity is shocking.
KarneeKarnay
Member
Golden_Pigeon
Banned
This is not related to positive discrimination laws ?
GhostTrick
Banned
Is it ? Honest question, I'm clueless on that.
All I heard is that it's true that some employers would ask about your ethnicity and we both know this wouldn't fly at all in France.
Sgt. Kabukiman
Banned
Mass_Pincup
Banned
That's not what happened though.
This controversy was put up by far right activist on twitter, which prompted our biggest far right news media (think breitbart) to put an article on it which made it viral.
This wasn't started by either by the Festival or the Mayor.
Hidalgo handled it pretty badly though.
That's what I said earlier, Hidalgo just had a knee jerk reaction based on far right cries.
Pretty sad to see this to be honest.
GhostTrick
Banned
You keep bringing this up, and I don't think you understand it. In the US, there are forms you can fill out when applying for a job to state you gender, ethnicity, if you are a veteran, and if you have a disability. These forms are optional (an employer has to present them to you, you can elect to not answer). These questions are used to gather statistical information, they are not meant to have an impact on the application process.
Funyarinpa
Member
I think I see the point now. I still believe that inclusion is the better way to go about social progress, but I see the need for ethnically/sexually exclusive gatherings now.
Glad to hear this was sorted out.
Glad to hear this was sorted out.
GhostTrick
Banned
Well I understand it: Even for statistical purposes, ethnic statistics are illegal in France. Plain and simple.
That...doesn't seem to be true? It's illegal for the census to ask such things, but not illegal for such information to be collected via surveys or polls, or by public institutions who need such information to preform their duties.
Alx
Member
All collection of ethnic or religious information is by default forbidden, according to the law of January 6th 1978. Specific exceptions can be granted, for example for scientific purpose, but it is a case by case authorization.
http://www.lemonde.fr/les-decodeurs...s-statistiques-ethniques_4628874_4355770.html
GhostTrick
Banned
It is illegal in France for polls or public institutions to ask about your ethnicity. The best thing they can do is to ask about your parents birthplace.
Mass_Pincup
Banned
Fdesouche
Discrimination is discrimination. That's awful that you'd condone it.
GhostTrick
Banned
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Knew it :"")
You know what, on second thought, Anne Hidalgo should've said and done nothing.
Unless they get an exception.
I can see why elements within France debate this policy.
Really curious about it
GhostTrick
Banned
Yeah. For all you know, France might be the most racially discriminatory nation in the world...
That's the pacte republicain in france there's no black, white, jew, christian etc.. but only french so that explain this policy
GhostTrick
Banned
Yeah. For all you know, France might be the most racially discriminatory nation in the world...
What ???
Are you French ? Do you live in France ?
Exactly. Hence why the state doesn't allow such statistics.
Umm, no?