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The Official Halo 3 Thread

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Metroidvania said:
Question. Didn't brutes join the covenant AFTER the events of halo....which take place 20 years after this?
No, the Brutes were the first Covenant to officially make contact with the humans on Harvest.

Unofficially, it was the Jackals. I'd seriously recommend checking out Contact Harvest for anyone who's interested in the story of Halo Wars. The more trailers I see, the more I get the vibe that Staten was really making a prequel to it. I knew there'd be connections, but there seems to be a lot more of them in the wake of these new trailers.
 
Damn, that Halo Wars cinematic was awesome! (Although I admit I liked Serina better with shorter hair)

So I'm guessing that was an earlier Arbiter, one who dies sometime after the events depicted in this cinematic and before the events of Halo 2?

And I'm loving the Flood implications, I'm really hoping they make some kind of appearance.
Heck, I'll even be happy with a bunch of hibernating Flood in pods at the end of the game to imply the greater threat in the future.
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That cinematic was pretty sweet. I have to admit, I'm fond of the Playstation era of long CG cutscenes in RPGs popping with eye candy.

And if that video is any indication, these things are going to be pretty lengthy. That's an awesome sign for the story prospects of Halo Wars. Considering how little direct storytelling of this manner there is in the Halo trilogy, I think it's more than welcome.
 
Has somebody made a topic about this yet? GAF will be interested, I'm sure.

GT comments say that an Uncharted voice actor's in this.
 
A niggle with the cutscene - didn't like the marine using "pleanty of bad guys". Sounded a bit clichéd. Otherwise I'm still looking forward to it. I love RTSs and I'd love to see more of Ensembles take on the universe.
 
I enjoyed that cinematic. Variety is nice and Im liking Ensemble's take on Halo. I don't view it as a bad thing that it doesn't feel like something Bungie would do.
 
I have no interest in halo wars as a game, i'm just hoping someone snips all the CG together so i can watch that and get the gist of what happened.
 
The cutscene doesn't look as bad as Trasher had me thinking it was. I enjoy the fine details only CG can pull off. The problem is, these types of scenes create a more intimate atmosphere but the player will then be pulled a couple hundred feet back and commanding unnamed, disposable troops towards giant mobs of no-named aliens.

I'm definitely interested in watching how the story plays out but I'm still not that excited to play through it.
 
The only thing that bothered me about that trailer were the Elite voices because they spoke a little too fast.

This Arbiter seems like a douchebag. D:
 
EazyB said:
The cutscene doesn't look as bad as Trasher had me thinking it was. I enjoy the fine details only CG can pull off. The problem is, these types of scenes create a more intimate atmosphere but the player will then be pulled a couple hundred feet back and commanding unnamed, disposable troops towards giant mobs of no-named aliens.

I'm definitely interested in watching how the story plays out but I'm still not that excited to play through it.
I guess what I was trying to say is that the voices of the elites just made me cringe. I dunno why, but they did. The cinematic itself looks great though. If I wasn't an RTS fan I would at least buy the game for its cinematics. I'm hoping that there's at least one with the chief in it. :D

Also, is that confirmed that it's the Arbiter? I thought the armor looked identical, but I wasn't 100% positive (with it all not being Bungie etc.).

And a question to all of those people out there that have read all the books and whatnot: In any of the books does it mention an Arbiter (not the one we have come to know in Halo 2 and 3)?
 
What the hell is an Arbiter doing there?

Is it a time of extraordinary crisis for the Covenant? Is the hegemony in danger of falling apart?

At least it has babes with big tits.
 
Frenck said:
What the hell is an Arbiter doing there?

Is it a time of extraordinary crisis for the Covenant? Is the hegemony in danger of falling apart?
Yeah I was wondering the same things.

I'm hoping Voc will come in here and lay down pages and pages of info about all Arbiters past and present. I would love me some 35,000 words about the Arbiter. I still am not completely sure what the purpose of the Arbiter is for the Covenant. In Halo 2 it just seems like they give out the role of being the Covenant's bitch to whoever they dislike, and then they send them on a suicide mission.
 
Trasher said:
Yeah I was wondering the same things.

I'm hoping Voc will come in here and lay down pages and pages of info about all Arbiters past and present. I would love me some 35,000 words about the Arbiter. I still am not completely sure what the purpose of the Arbiter is for the Covenant. In Halo 2 it just seems like they give out the role of being the Covenant's bitch to whoever they dislike, and then they send them on a suicide mission.

The Arbiter is the Prophets' tool. He is directly under their command, willing to do their bidding without second thought and he would give his life or the lifes of his fellow Covenant soldiers if it is necessary.

The Halo 2/Halo 3 Arbiter can't command Covenant troops and is not part of the military caste. Unfortunately we don't know if that is true for all Arbiters or just the one created in Halo 2. He was branded a traitor and wears the mark of shame. Maybe the other Arbiters, who weren't limited in this way, could command troops after all. I doubt it though because the Arbiter is not part of the military caste.

What Halo Wars' writers don't seem to get is that there doesn't have to be an Arbiter during all times. Arbiters are created when the Covenant is in danger of falling apart either due to resistant future members (Hunters) or rebellious underprivilegded members (Grunts) and they are to vanish with the danger they were created to fight. It's like a death sentence for the Elite who becomes the Arbiter.

I don't see the need for the creation of an Arbiter during Humanity's early encounters with the Covenant as depicted in Halo Wars and at the moment we have to assume that Arbiters (mark of shame or not) can't command Covenant troops. They are political assassins, suicide bombers but they aren't commanders according to available Halo canon.
 
Trasher said:
they give out the role of being the Covenant's bitch to whoever they dislike, and then they send them on a suicide mission.


Yooouuuuu got it. :)


edit: Frenck, think about that scene in halo 2 though where they bring him into the Mausoleum of the Arbiter, and there's like hundreds of pods [presumably] with bodies in them or something.
 
Wow that cut-scene was badass. Just the fact that Masterchief wasn't involved, the tone of the entire scene, the CG, the new characters... I'm pumped.
 
Sai-kun said:
Yooouuuuu got it. :)


edit: Frenck, think about that scene in halo 2 though where they bring him into the Mausoleum of the Arbiter, and there's like hundreds of pods [presumably] with bodies in them or something.

The Covenant is damn old and it has been on the verge of collapse many times. We only know about 2 major incidents that caused the creation of an Arbiter and those seemed to have been random examples by the Prophet of Mercy. Maybe those two examples were just the most publicly known uses of an Arbiter to resolve a crisis.

Remember, the Prophets didn't create an Arbiter when they found the first Halo ring, they didn't create an Arbiter when Humanity destroyed said Halo ring and they didn't create an Arbiter after the first modern Flood outbreak on Installation 04. Those events didn't pose a threat to the hegemony, thus no Arbiter was needed.

Humanity doesn't pose a threat to the Covenant either, not in a physical way at least. Truth's knowledge about them is dangerous, their existence is dangerous but their fleet and their weapons are laughable in comparison to the Covenant's arsenal. You can't create an Arbiter to either A) destroy Humanity or B) destroy the knowlege of their heritage. We don't know anything about the nature of the Grunt Rebellion to name one example. I'm pretty sure the Arbiter was used to kill their leaders and the cowardly Grunts who were left didn't want to put up a fight.

For complete genocide you need the military caste and their fleet.
 
Mr Vociferous said:
I am officially on an island with this Halo War stuff.

I thought that cinematic was awesome. Not exactly sure what you guys expected.

Edit: Looks like godhandiscen is here with me. It is now a party.
I'm with you on this Voc. That cut scene is awesome, and a lot better than most of those in Halo 3. I think the Arbiter we see in this cut-scene is not the same one from Halo 2 and Halo 3.
 
Frenck said:
What Halo Wars' writers don't seem to get is that there doesn't have to be an Arbiter during all times. Arbiters are created when the Covenant is in danger of falling apart either due to resistant future members (Hunters) or rebellious underprivilegded members (Grunts) and they are to vanish with the danger they were created to fight.
It would appear that you've read Contact Harvest based on your mentioning of the taming of the Hunters and the Grunt rebellion, but I'm not sure, because about 50% of the Covenant story in the novel centers around the Minister of Fortitude, our main antagonist, who is calling the shots during the year 2531 and is also very aware of the threat to the Covenant posed on Harvest. The threat of the Forerunner's relationship to the humans, which clearly materializes in a rather public way when they uncover Forerunner relics.

In fact, I don't think there could be many examples of a better time to argue for an Arbiter's existence than their efforts to take the first human world, Harvest. Even more so, now that we see concrete evidence of Forerunner property on the planet. I don't want to give away the story of the book, because it's easily the best one out of the five out right now, but it's pretty obvious to me the specific reasons why he would have an Arbiter involved in this process.
Humanity doesn't pose a threat to the Covenant either, not in a physical way at least. Truth's knowledge about them is dangerous, their existence is dangerous but their fleet and their weapons are laughable in comparison to the Covenant's arsenal. You can't create an Arbiter to either A) destroy Humanity or B) destroy the knowlege of their heritage. We don't know anything about the nature of the Grunt Rebellion to name one example. I'm pretty sure the Arbiter was used to kill their leaders and the cowardly Grunts who were left didn't want to put up a fight.
Firstly, we know a lot about the Grunt rebellion. We know that it started due to breeding disputes on High Charity amongst both Grunts and Jackals. We know that despite the creation of an Arbiter the Sangheili fleet resorted to glassing half of the Grunt's homeworld to put an end to the uprising. There's a lot we know about it. Not everything, obviously, but a significant portion.

Secondly, the humans take Harvest back initially, crushing the Covenant forces as hinted in Fall of Reach and as depicted in the Halo Wars trailers. The human threat, at first, is very real because the Covenant underestimate them. The metaphorical threat, which is that the humans are "related" to the Forerunners, is even more real, because if that knowledge were widely known it would bring about the end of their religion. This is why Fortitude would likely need a fervent, devout zealot whose mission would likely end in death to lead the ground forces in the seizing of Forerunner property from human control.

An Arbiter is powerful, he is disposable and if our knowledge of the history portion of the fiction proves accurate, he's likely the reason that the Covenant end up winning the planet back and later destroying it.
 
Mr Vociferous said:
Even more so, now that we see concrete evidence of Forerunner property on the planet. I don't want to give away the story of the book, because it's easily the best one out of the five out right now, but it's pretty obvious to me the specific reasons why he would have an Arbiter involved in this process.
Yeah. We don't know what the Covenant have found on Harvest. It could have warranted the formation of the Arbiter for all we know.
 
Trasher said:
I'm hoping Voc will come in here and lay down pages and pages of info about all Arbiters past and present. I would love me some 35,000 words about the Arbiter. I still am not completely sure what the purpose of the Arbiter is for the Covenant. In Halo 2 it just seems like they give out the role of being the Covenant's bitch to whoever they dislike, and then they send them on a suicide mission.
Fortitude, who later becomes a hierarch known as the Prophet of Truth, has been known to use the mantle of the Arbiter for selfish reasons. He used it when he was trying to quell the Sesa Refumee and he used it against the humans to acquire another well-known relic, the Sacred Icon of Delta Halo.

Other than that we only know of a handful of times in which the Arbiter was used. A handful out of hundreds. It would make sense that at this point, where the Covenant are at most risk of legitimately falling apart because of Truth's lies, would he raise an Arbiter for the culling of the Forerunner artifact. He even says it here: "The hierarchs grow impatient." This Arbiter is directly reporting to Truth, Regret and Mercy.

Dax01 said:
I think the Arbiter we see in this cut-scene is not the same one from Halo 2 and Halo 3.
The Arbiter in Halo 2 and Halo 3 is the Supreme Commander of the Fleet of Particular Justice. He's the ultimate bad guy you never get to fight in Halo: Combat Evolved, but everything you do during the game is in direct relationship to the orders he's issued for the Covenant. He was the one who ordered the razing of Reach, by proxy he was responsible for the release of the Flood on Installation 04 and its eventual destruction at the hands of the demon.
 
Still not a fan of the top-heavy Elites, but that cinematic was pretty pimp. Definitely a bit more realism being injected, so I can see why some would be a bit put off, but there's nothing vomit inducing in that clip.
 
Did I post in this thread last night?

If anyone ever suggests you drink a 'Cactus Flower', do not listen to them. It is very much a thing that is vomit-inducing.

Like the trailer, except for some of the dialogue/voice-acting.
 
Many human colonies have Forerunner relics scattered around their surface. I don't buy that reason. I would've bought it as a reason in Contact Harvest because that was the first contact with the UNSC and the Covenant didn't know how powerful they were. It's obvious that a lot has happened in the timeframe between the AI conversation at the end of Contact Harvest and the opening cinematic of Halo Wars.

It just doesn't seem significant enough to me. If I remember correctly there wasn't even a hint in Contact Harvest that an Arbiter would be needed and it didn't detail his involvement in the Grunt Rebellion either, as in what exactly he did.

The Harvest campaign is just a skirmish for both sides. Even though Cole had the biggest fleet in the history of mankind under his command, it was just a sign of things to come. They beat each other up a bit and got a sense of what they are up against. It was not a time of extraordinary crisis for the Covenant. It would have been if Truth hadn't done his job so well. There is no way anyone in the Covenant would get suspicious. He didn't need to send an Arbiter to cover up evidence. Any Forerunner relics found on Harvest make an even stronger point for the Covenant religion and the hatred for humanity.

If the Prophets didn't create an Arbiter during the events of Halo 1 or as soon as they discovered the Spartans, there is no reason to create one for a skirmish against an underpowered foe on a meaningless planet.

My original point was that for Ensemble the Arbiter is just a cool looking Elite dude who shouts around orders. It's Halo on the surface but it seems a bit shallow beneath.
 
Mr Vociferous said:
The Arbiter in Halo 2 and Halo 3 is the Supreme Commander of the Fleet of Particular Justice. He's the ultimate bad guy you never get to fight in Halo: Combat Evolved, but everything you do during the game is in direct relationship to the orders he's issued for the Covenant. He was the one who ordered the razing of Reach, by proxy he was responsible for the release of the Flood on Installation 04 and its eventual destruction at the hands of the demon.
Yes Voc, I know this. ;)

Time for pictures of my quest for the Annual achievement with JDFox, The Gold Avengr, and Dan.

So here we are at the start. Dan is the Chief, I'm Arby, TGA is the red elite, and JDFox is the blue elite.
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Coming up on the control center, the elites work together to kill one combat form.
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Dan likes to dual-wield.
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Tough situation to do with the Iron Skull on; lucky I had rockets.
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Good shot of JDfox; he constantly had his light on.
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Dan and I cover TGA and Fox's six while they take care of enemies in front of them.
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Finally, at the top, TGA owns with the hammer.
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Last flood form I think. Everyone concentrates their fire on this one form; it didn't survive for very long.
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Heading out with the ghosts. "LET'S DO THIS!"
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Half-way there. Nothing shall stand in our way.
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Very careful coordination.
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We shall not surrender!
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And finally, onwards toward victory.
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Lots of fun. Dan, can't wait to play your levels on SI!:D
 
Frenck said:
Many human colonies have Forerunner relics scattered around their surface.
Well, a few things: this is the first human-occupied Forerunner property and secondly we have no idea of the significance of the relic either. Whatever the case, it's the furthest thing from a run-of-the-mill planetary siege for the Covenant. Plus, I can't reiterate this enough, they were losing at this point.

The Harvest campaign is just a skirmish for both sides. Even though Cole had the biggest fleet in the history of mankind under his command, it was just a sign of things to come. They beat each other up a bit and got a sense of what they are up against. It was not a time of extraordinary crisis for the Covenant. It would have been if Truth hadn't done his job so well. There is no way anyone in the Covenant would get suspicious. He didn't need to send an Arbiter to cover up evidence. Any Forerunner relics found on Harvest make an even stronger point for the Covenant religion and the hatred for humanity.
There are a lot of assumptions here. First, I don't think you can call the formation of the "biggest fleet in the history of mankind" a skirmish. Secondly, we don't know what crises (sic) might exist during this time or how Truth handled the war post-Contact Harvest. Clearly, he made bad decisions otherwise they wouldn't have lost it to the humans.

If the Prophets didn't create an Arbiter during the events of Halo 1 or as soon as they discovered the Spartans, there is no reason to create one for a skirmish against an underpowered foe on a meaningless planet.
Well we don't know if they didn't create multiple Arbiters during those points in the timeline. There's no evidence either way. That being said, the events of Halo: Combat Evolved happen over a few days...hours really. It's likely and even implied in Halo 2 that the hierarchs had little or no knowledge of the ring until it was destroyed.

My original point was that for Ensemble the Arbiter is just a cool looking Elite dude who shouts around orders. It's Halo on the surface but it seems a bit shallow beneath.
And I guess this is really the point. You believe that this was the reason why Ensemble decided to use an Arbiter and I do not. I don't think we have enough insight into Halo Wars to make an assumption like that unless we're making presumptions about non-Bungie Halo developers which I refuse to do. For all we know, some of these elements could have already been scribed into the story bible long before Ensemble was tapped by Microsoft to handle the project.

For that reason (and because I'm heading out with my son in about five minutes ;-P), I won't belabor the point. You feel like Ensemble is doing a poor job with Halo's license (at least regarding this Elite), and I don't think we've seen enough to support that conclusion.
 
Shake Appeal said:
Did I post in this thread last night?

A bunch of people were on last night :p

I thought the Halo Wars trailer was fine, except for the Elite voices; thought they were godawful. Everything else was good though. I still have absolutely no interest in the game though; I do not like RTS games to any extent, no matter what kind of wrappings it may have.
 
Dax01 said:
Yes Voc, I know this. ;)

Time for pictures of my quest for the Annual achievement with JDFox, The Gold Avengr, and Dan.

And finally, onwards toward victory.
25jgrc9.jpg


Lots of fun. Dan, can't wait to play your levels on SI!:D

Nice shots Dax, although I don't recall any screens taken when we did it... :P
 
godhandiscen said:
You are so negative about anything "Halo" not made by Bungie.
I'm trying to give everything a fair shake. My approach to Halo Wars is look at is as a game made by a different developer, that just happens to be Halo. Just being in the Halo universe means squat to me. Tweak the enemies so they weren't Grunts and Elites, and that would be a pulpy, cliché cinematic from Bald Space Sim #7,957. The music didn't do anything for me other than dance around the Halo theme. The dialog was trying to be snappy yet serious and ended up corny. I did like the set up and visual style. Pacing was good. Overall I thought it was kind of blah.

I'm very interested in the story - the setting is shit-hot - and I saw some stuff I liked about the game at PAX (the interface, art style and audio design especially). I'm *really* picky with my games these days; I only buy four or five retail games a year lately. Odds are Halo Wars won't be one, but I'll try the demo and see how it goes. But I'm not going to just fap to everything that has Halo slapped on it.
 
I thought the trailer was pretty good. Not too revealing, but it sets up the story nicely.

The only problem was the god-awful cringe-worthy piano. It was like a quietly weeping emo kid using one hand to bang out a few notes on the piano and using the other hand to jack off to it.

urk said:
Definitely a bit more realism being injected, so I can see why some would be a bit put off
I think the additional realism is a good thing.
 
Self Induced said:
I thought the trailer was pretty good. Not too revealing, but it sets up the story nicely.

The only problem was the god-awful cringe-worthy piano. It was like a quietly weeping emo kid using one hand to bang out a few notes on the piano and using the other hand to jack off to it.
Ouch, harsh. My guess would be that this cutscene is very early on in the game, where much of the music would be deliberately modest.

Steven Rippy & the ES audio department knows how to make one heck of a rousing score, trust me (see: pretty much every Ensemble game ever made).
 
Frenck said:
Many human colonies have Forerunner relics scattered around their surface. I don't buy that reason. I would've bought it as a reason in Contact Harvest because that was the first contact with the UNSC and the Covenant didn't know how powerful they were. It's obvious that a lot has happened in the timeframe between the AI conversation at the end of Contact Harvest and the opening cinematic of Halo Wars.
Huhwha?

The invasion of Contact Harvest happens AFTER this scene - by a week or two. This video is dated February 4. It's not until a week later that Fortitude's plan to take the planet's goodies for himself is implemented.

The fight going on here is first contact.
 
Speaking of the score, duduks are going to be used somewhere in the game. Needless to say, I'm intrigued by that (Gladiator had some great duduk tracks, see "Duduk of the North").
 
GhaleonEB said:
I'm trying to give everything a fair shake. My approach to Halo Wars is look at is as a game made by a different developer, that just happens to be Halo. Just being in the Halo universe means squat to me. Tweak the enemies so they weren't Grunts and Elites, and that would be a pulpy, cliché cinematic from Bald Space Sim #7,957. The music didn't do anything for me other than dance around the Halo theme. The dialog was trying to be snappy yet serious and ended up corny. I did like the set up and visual style. Pacing was good. Overall I thought it was kind of blah.

I'm very interested in the story - the setting is shit-hot - and I saw some stuff I liked about the game at PAX (the interface, art style and audio design especially). I'm *really* picky with my games these days; I only buy four or five retail games a year lately. Odds are Halo Wars won't be one, but I'll try the demo and see how it goes. But I'm not going to just fap to everything that has Halo slapped on it.

I'd have to agree with Ghaleon on this one. I was not impressed at all, the voice acting was stiff and boring (the commander guy and elites were especially bad), the music was terrible and most of all I didnt get a "Halo" vibe from it. Yes the scene with the snow was visually impressive, but I find it hard to believe that people in here are comparing it to Blizzard's.
 
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