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[Mercador]

I played only once on XSX, it's so much less playable than my PC... Granted, my PC got a recent card (4070) but still, that engine is so old and I don't see anything that would requires that much power.

 

[That Damn Kid]

Another starfield thread

 

[ratburger]

Dude, this is absurd, why aren't they using the direct storage API!? They're brute forcing the decompression on the fucking CPU.

Looking at those times, the loading is likely single-threaded too.

 

[cripterion]

Some shameful shit.
Game looks quite bad in several areas and add this to top it all off...

 

[blastprocessor]

- Very light on VRAM usage, using less than 4GB at 1440p/optimized settings

I wonder if this game uses sampler feedback.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Do i need to repost the gif of skyrim and the 10.000 cheseroll or the crysis one with the barrels?

Those examples are made with an editor or people wasting dozens of hours to pick up 10.000 potatoes, during normal gameplay you are never gonna see any of that.


I'm not sure why some call that nextgen when it is at best a neat trick that was possible almost 15 years ago...

Like, at a certain point you have to left the engine go if that is the features that cockblock SO many other features of modern engines.

And from my understanding, there are other mothods to achieve object persistency with other engine without completely fucking up other things.

Doors scooping up objects in Skyrim? Honestly, sure, repost the gif, i probably missed it.

Next gen is maybe a tad overblown but at the same time, 98% of modern games have not even beaten the wave of good AI & Physics games from the 2010's so, we just kind of forget that it's a feature, physics, while the rest of games basically skip all these details to have the best damn graphics.

 

[ZehDon]

Again - why? Reviewers are not punishing developers for technical performance, neither are consumers.

According to Steam Reviews, consumers aren’t happy with how the game performs. Given that 80% are using hardware that Bethesda didn’t bother optimising for, feels like they’re being punished plenty.

 

[Balducci30]

Doors scooping up objects in Skyrim? Honestly, sure, report the gif, i probably missed it.

Next gen is maybe a tad overblown but at the same time, 98% of modern games have not even beaten the wave of good AI & Physics games from the 2010's so, we just kind of forget that it's a feature, physics, while the rest of games basically skip all these details to have the best damn graphics.

Honestly I’m with you on this - I wish more companies would sacrifice fidelity for pushing physics and vfx forward more - I would love if Bethesda put this attention on things like Fire and Water as well

 

[SKYF@ll]

Considering the quality of the graphics, I find myself wondering why this game is so unusually heavy.
Is it due to the unusually small VRAM usage?
(Screenshots from my Xbox Series X)

 

[Fake]

Considering the quality of the graphics, I find myself wondering why this game is so unusually heavy.

Bad optimization. An old ass engine that was never optimize on consoles to begin with.
PC is simply brute force. Unless people are dumb to believe in that 'is time to upgrade your pc' bs.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

I am playing and just visited some Mars base (in the main quest, like second or third mission) and I am morbidly fascinated that this is how the game looks there, like someone made this, played this, and was like "yep that's good enough to ship in 2023" and that someone happens to be the largest multitrilion dollar corporation on earth


At least the outside and some other bases look better, but still

2nd. Apple has them beat.

 

[BlackTron]

Wow Intel/Nvidia is a mess and the Xbox won't let you use mouse/kb in this game.

Once again how can I have this pile of gaming hardware and end up in such a lame situation Microsoft? There's always gotta be some sort of fun sapping catch.

My laptop is in for the ride of its life

 

[Heisenberg007]

Considering the quality of the graphics, I find myself wondering why this game is so unusually heavy.
Is it due to the unusually small VRAM usage?
(Screenshots from my Xbox Series X)

I just want to know who saw these trees, thought it was a good design, and approved them.

 

[Fake]

I just want to know who saw these trees, thought it was a good design, and approved them.

The same guy putting inspiring phrases on the game objects and modern jokes thats for sure.

 

[Sakura]

The physics gifs posted above are impressive but what people also forget about the engine is that it keeps track of the position of everything. You can have 1000 rolls of toilet paper in a store room but more importantly they will persist indefinitely. Travel to the other end of the universe and back and they will still be there. It's the reason why save file sizes and loading times bloat over the course of the adventure. The state of everything is kept constant and it's what makes Bethesda's games completely unique in the industry.

You could do this in any engine really. All depends on how you code the functionality. It also doesn't really excuse the other problems.

In reality, they probably keep using this engine because, A) It's royalty free (switching to UE, for example, would mean they would have to pay royalties to Epic), B) Creating a new engine from scratch is very difficult and time consuming, C) Everybody at Bethesda is already familiar with this engine/it is easy to use, D) The modding scene.

Considering the lack of modernisation of the engine over the years, I'm guessing that maybe they just don't have (enough) skilled engineers to actually improve the thing. It could be a thing where the suits up top think, "If they games are still selling, then why change?".

 

[GymWolf]

Doors scooping up objects in Skyrim? Honestly, sure, repost the gif, i probably missed it.

Next gen is maybe a tad overblown but at the same time, 98% of modern games have not even beaten the wave of good AI & Physics games from the 2010's so, we just kind of forget that it's a feature, physics, while the rest of games basically skip all these details to have the best damn graphics.

Does it change anything not having automatic doors? Do you think that potatoes rolling when the door open is anything more than simple havok?

 

[sinnergy]

Interesting about hyperthreading from Alex , this is what they say PC space:

Conclusions. While turning off SMT/Hyper-Threading might hinder your performance in work-oriented tasks if you are a competitive gamer like myself and you want the best possible latency, turning off SMT/Hyper-Threading is a step in the right direction.

On series clock is also faster , how many games would run on only the physical cores on Series X, if Starfield even does this ..

I found it interesting.

 

[sinnergy]

I just want to know who saw these trees, thought it was a good design, and approved them.

Sometimes there is more than design , but managers that like to release a game.. sadly . Just saying .

 

[Team Andromeda]

You can find videos from 2020 of Digital Foundry and others hyping the SSD and direct storage etc. as eliminating load times. Seems like they overhyped the console like they overhyped this game.

This comment from 3.5 years ago showed how people believed it (and why wouldn't they, they were told by 'trustworthy' sources that it was true).

Microsoft Reveals How Xbox Series X Is Going To Beat PS5

Incredible power! Ray tracing! Xbox One enhancements!

www.purexbox.com

The catch is that it isn't true. 3.5 years later the most hyped Xbox first party game releases at 4k (upscaled), 30fps and with terrible load times.

DF excuse me while laugh and all consoles are hyped up. I remember when SONY fans were saying because of the SDD the likes of R&C couldn't even be done on the PC and yet even the Steam deck can handle it

The catch is you seem just looking for any reason to bash the game, so sad and so pathetic.

 

[DeaDPo0L84]

So only the worst version of Starfield is actually exclusive to Xbox?

 

[DeaDPo0L84]

Next gen...

 

[Stare-Bear]

Didn’t expect the XSX to run the game with most settings turned to “low”.

The developers really need to go back and think what is actually needed in the game. Yes, it’s really amazing that you can leave a sandwich on a table and it will be there forever, but it doesn’t add anything to the gameplay. Those resources are desperately needed elsewhere.

 

[Elysium44]

Considering the quality of the graphics, I find myself wondering why this game is so unusually heavy.
Is it due to the unusually small VRAM usage?
(Screenshots from my Xbox Series X)

Yikes, it's almost like two different games in one. Some of the interiors look 10/10 and as good as anything in gaming. But those shots would look average even for dare I say PS3/360.

 

[SlimySnake]

Considering the quality of the graphics, I find myself wondering why this game is so unusually heavy.
Is it due to the unusually small VRAM usage?
(Screenshots from my Xbox Series X)

I just want to know who saw these trees, thought it was a good design, and approved them.

That level doesn’t hold up to inspection but it looks good overall in motion. Even the trees. Maybe the xsx settings are too low but on PC it looks fine.

 

[Zathalus]

So only the worst version of Starfield is actually exclusive to Xbox?

Yes, the worse version of a game is usually reserved for a console. To the surprise of no one.

 

[Filben]

I wait for a Bethesda that doesn't load every single time you enter a compound, house or any different location.

Dude, there's games for two decades that managed that... there's a game from 2001 that has only two loading screens, not counting loading a save game, the entire game.

 

[Physiognomonics]

Did someone ask for another Starfield thread?



@adamsapple isn't feeling well today so I'm replacing him.

- Missing basic features such as DLSS, FOV sliders, gamma and contrast adjustment, and HDR
- Says it's great that modders added that but also blames Bethesda for being such a huge studio with a massive budget that doesn't have those features
- DLSS is much better than FSR. Less ghosting, less flickering, and an overall more stable image
- AF looks poor at times and forcing it through the NVIDIA control panel results in weird shadow glitches. Cannot recommend forcing it
- AMD GPUs run MUCH better than Intel/NVIDIA GPUs, outperforming their counterparts by up to 40%. The 6800 XT for instance consistently outperforms the 3080 by over 25%
- Ultra Shadows also cause significant stutters on NVIDIA/Intel cards
- Similar story with CPUs but not in terms of performance. Hyperthreading seems to be broken on Intel where it results in WORSE performance compared to no Hyperthreading. SMT doesn't exhibit such behavior
- No shader compilation stutters but it does have stutters when crossing invisible lines in the game world. They can be mitigated with more powerful hardware than can halve the frame time spikes
- Very light on VRAM usage, using less than 4GB at 1440p/optimized settings
- PC is the best way to play it by far, provided you're willing to circumvent the inherent limitations
- Very long load times on Series X, 37 seconds from the main menu into game whereas on a PC with a 12900K and NVME drive, it takes less than 11 seconds, suggesting there is no usage of Direct Storage
- Recommends people with older NVIDIA cards (3070 and below) to wait for more patches/driver updates

Obviously as this game has being designed to run on XSS. So designed to run on 8GB (CPU + GPU) machine. Which is a shame for such ambitious game.

 

[Denton]

Dude, there's games for two decades that managed that... there's a game from 2001 that has only two loading screens, not counting loading a save game, the entire game.

Gothic 1, game made by like 15 people in released in 2001, large 3D world with characters with daily schedules, all interiors seamless, no loadings.

 

[Heisenberg007]

That level doesn’t hold up to inspection but it looks good overall in motion. Even the trees. Maybe the xsx settings are too low but on PC it looks fine.

No, it's the design of these trees -- not just the graphical fidelity.

If you look at the top, all of those trees have the same flat heads as if they were all cut with a sharp object in a straight line, and then all of them were squeezed from the top. It looks so weird.

Trees have look gorgeous in this generation (Plague Tale, Horizon FW, Ragnarok, etc.), and these look awful.

 

[elbourreau]

That level doesn’t hold up to inspection but it looks good overall in motion. Even the trees. Maybe the xsx settings are too low but on PC it looks fine.

Come on, it's ugly AF ...

We have better foliage and we are working on a VR title !!! XD XD -I'm kinda jocking, but though-

 

[MidGenRefresh]

That level doesn’t hold up to inspection but it looks good overall in motion. Even the trees. Maybe the xsx settings are too low but on PC it looks fine.

New Atlantis looks great.

 

[MidGenRefresh]

No, it's the design of these trees -- not just the graphical fidelity.

If you look at the top, all of those trees have the same flat heads as if they were all cut with a sharp object in a straight line, and then all of them were squeezed from the top. It looks so weird.

Trees have look gorgeous in this generation (Plague Tale, Horizon FW, Ragnarok, etc.), and these look awful.

Dude, it’s an alien planet with alien looking trees. There are other planets with more Earth like trees, pine trees, palm trees etc.

 

[M1chl]

Didn't expect PC load times to be that much faster than Series X you'd think they would use the Velocity Architecture/direct storage

I think there is already too much ducktape on that engine

 

[artsi]

The physics gifs posted above are impressive but what people also forget about the engine is that it keeps track of the position of everything. You can have 1000 rolls of toilet paper in a store room but more importantly they will persist indefinitely. Travel to the other end of the universe and back and they will still be there. It's the reason why save file sizes and loading times bloat over the course of the adventure. The state of everything is kept constant and it's what makes Bethesda's games completely unique in the industry.

It's a neat parlour trick without any real gameplay significance. Unique yes, but worthless.

Instead of 1000 toiler paper rolls with persistence I'd rather have:

- Vehicles
- Seamless loading
- Good performance
- Raytracing

Even the physics themselves are lackluster, all you can interact with is clutter but small furniture like chairs etc. is static.
Compare to CP2077 where you can blow up furniture piece by piece in firefights, it has way more advanced physics.

 

[Darsxx82]

That level doesn’t hold up to inspection but it looks good overall in motion. Even the trees. Maybe the xsx settings are too low but on PC it looks fine.

The vegetation settings do not change the detail, only the drawing distance.

The fact is that, if you watch the video, most settings barely have a visual difference between medium and ultra, making it very difficult to differentiate or even detect with images side by side. In fact, only the one related to shadows produces a relevant impact on oo performance.

That Alex proposes the majority of medium options and some low has more to do with the almost zero visual difference with ultra in those options while you scratch some extra frame of performance.

The game looks a lot better than some are trying to make believe. The engine has its limitations due to age, but the leap compared to previous games is immense in many sections and especially in short distances and details.

 

[Eotheod]

So that's why I am getting such incredible FPS, my combo 3800X and 6800XT doing numbers.

I've installed a total of I think seven mods: Undelayed Menu (60FPS), Smooth Ship Reticle (60FPS), Cleanfield for no intro shit, Compact Inventory (12 items option), Starfield Achievement Enabler (Bethesda seemingly stops achievements if you mod), BetterHud (XP/Discovery down bottom) and scanner weight on scanner watch. The fact these were all available so quickly is amazing, and that is all I've felt needed to be modified as everything else is ace.

Considering the quality of the graphics, I find myself wondering why this game is so unusually heavy.
Is it due to the unusually small VRAM usage?
(Screenshots from my Xbox Series X)

Those screenshots don't seem...right to me. Surely the XSX is not drawing crap trees like that, because they definitely do not look like that on PC. Obviously varied platform specifications, but that is seriously bad geometry.

 

[twilo99]

Obviously as this game has being designed to run on XSS. So designed to run on 8GB (CPU + GPU) machine. Which is a shame for such ambitious game.

BG3 wasn’t designed for the xss, are you satisfied with how that’s turned out in terms of performance?

 

[damidu]

Dude, it’s an alien planet with alien looking trees. There are other planets with more Earth like trees, pine trees, palm trees etc.

yeah alien trees, which suspiciously look like low-poly copy pasted video game trees from 2 decades ago

 

[MidGenRefresh]

yeah alien trees, which suspiciously look like low-poly copy pasted video game trees from 2 decades ago

I don't know what to tell you. Game is full of diverse biomes with all sort of flora and fauna. On PC, it looks amazing. I haven't played it on console.

This is the same planet as New Atlantis:

And this is another planet:

 

[M1chl]

Considering the quality of the graphics, I find myself wondering why this game is so unusually heavy.
Is it due to the unusually small VRAM usage?
(Screenshots from my Xbox Series X)

Its because the engine is from 2006 only with ducktaped features, you will never get good results

 

[damidu]

I don't know what to tell you. Game is full of diverse biomes with all sort of flora and fauna. On PC, it looks amazing. I haven't played it on console.

This is the same planet as New Atlantis:

And this is another planet:

those doesn’t look anything special either especially in this day and age

but did you maybe think vegetation might got extra downgraded on new atlantis, because its the worst performing part of the game? instead of coming with alien trees “artistic intent” excuse

 

[MidGenRefresh]

those doesn’t look anything special either especially in this day and age

but did you maybe think vegetation might got extra downgraded on new atlantis, because its the worst performing part of the game? instead of coming with alien trees “artistic intent” excuse

Show me procedural generation that looks better than Starfield. There are 1000 planets, no shit it’s not going to look as good as curated corridor 10 hour long game.

 

[DJ12]

Show me procedural generation that looks better than Starfield. There are 1000 planets, no shit it’s not going to look as good as curated corridor 10 hour long game.

No Man's Sky.

 

[MidGenRefresh]

Treeeeeeees

 

[Thaedolus]

The Series X load times are baffling to me. It doesn't even use direct storage on PC and it loads up in like 5 seconds.

 

[SlimySnake]

The Series X load times are baffling to me. It doesn't even use direct storage on PC and it loads up in like 5 seconds.

Nah, the game’s loading is cpu bound and that cpu sucks.

The first load into the game is 25 seconds on my PC. 7.5 gbps ssd with an 5.0 ghz Intel cpu. Alex is getting faster loading because his cpu is even faster than mine.

Fast traveling is faster on my pc and on Xbox because it’s not doing that initial load.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Show me procedural generation that looks better than Starfield. There are 1000 planets, no shit it’s not going to look as good as curated corridor 10 hour long game.

Star Citizen



Scales better on hardware than Starfield too with solar system map and seamless landing and take off, on a modified infamous single threaded graphic engine

 

[MidGenRefresh]

Star Citizen



Scales better on hardware than Starfield too with solar system map and seamless landing and take off, on a modified infamous single threaded graphic engine

Any examples with flora and fauna?

 

[Mr Moose]

Show me procedural generation that looks better than Starfield. There are 1000 planets, no shit it’s not going to look as good as curated corridor 10 hour long game.

Horizon.

 

[MidGenRefresh]

Horizon.

Horizon what? Forza Horizon 5? Horizon Forbidden West? Every inch of these games worlds was touched and polished by human's hand.