OMG Aero said:NoE already confirmed it for the 3rd of December.
Great.
OMG Aero said:NoE already confirmed it for the 3rd of December.
Saying 1 or 3 did either would be nonsense as well.KevinCow said:Saying DKC2 lacks variety, though? That's just nonsense.
Yep, that's it. I've gone through various N+ games with nary a complaint, chew through Mega Man games like they're marshmallows, 1cc'd Metal Slug 3, beat Ghosts n Goblins games, Ninja Gaiden games, and Castlevania games with nary a cry of "that's unfair" to be heard, but the one afternoon it took me to beat DKC2 was such an utter hell on my weak gaming skills that I imagined a Rare game had bad collision like all their bloody games do.KevinCow said:It sounds to me like you were just bad at the game and instead of admitting that you decided to blame the game.
It's okay, I know I've done that before too.
Saying DKC2 lacks variety, though? That's just nonsense.
Segata Sanshiro said:Yep, that's it. I've gone through various N+ games with nary a complaint, chew through Mega Man games like they're marshmallows, 1cc'd Metal Slug 3, beat Ghosts n Goblins games, Ninja Gaiden games, and Castlevania games with nary a cry of "that's unfair" to be heard, but the one afternoon it took me to beat DKC2 was such an utter hell on my weak gaming skills that I imagined a Rare game had bad collision like all their bloody games do.
See, it sounds to me like you like the game so instead of admitting it may have faults, you're pushing criticism back onto anyone who dares to complain. It also sounds to me that you like to dress in little pink ballerina outfits and listen to Raffi all day long.
What is there to elaborate on? The collision is off. You take hits from things that didn't touch you. You jump in on an angle to land on an enemy's head and instead the game reads it as you hitting the front and you die. It's not shittacular or anything, but it's off a bit, and it causes hits where the player should get away clean. The wonky collision in the DKC games is pretty well-known... speedrunners on the games even use it to their advantage.flak57 said:Could you elaborate? I've honestly never heard of this complaint before this thread.
Segata Sanshiro said:What is there to elaborate on? The collision is off. You take hits from things that didn't touch you. You jump in on an angle to land on an enemy's head and instead the game reads it as you hitting the front and you die. It's not shittacular or anything, but it's off a bit, and it causes hits where the player should get away clean. The wonky collision in the DKC games is pretty well-known... speedrunners on the games even use it to their advantage.
KevinCow said:I'm not calling your leet gamer skillz into question. I'm saying you had some issues with the way the game played, and instead of adjusting to it like millions of other people who played the game were somehow able to, you declared it a fault of the game and blamed your deaths on it.
Mr_Moogle said:Seems like a shame Retro couldnt get David Wise to work on this. Didnt he leave RARE just recently?
I actually think the music of the SNES games has more personality than the modern update.
The "running into doorknobs" thing is a separate issue from the collision. It describes how Rare designs their levels in their games. Many better developers will introduce new gameplay concepts in non-lethal settings, to give the player a chance when they do run into it in a lethal situation. Rare does not do this. They have never done this. They often introduce new gameplay elements that will kill the player the first time they run into them. They usually make up for this by tossing a lot of lives at the player, as in DKC, or by laughing and saying "fuck ya", like in Battletoads.KevinCow said:And I've run through DKC2 and 3 many times without ever dying in a way that I'd blame on the game, be that with the collision or being "run into doorknobs" or whatever. DKC1, yeah, it had some collision issues. Minor ones, mostly when riding Winky or Expresso. But it was ironed out by the second game, as were pretty much any other issues.
I'm not calling your leet gamer skillz into question. I'm saying you had some issues with the way the game played, and instead of adjusting to it like millions of other people who played the game were somehow able to, you declared it a fault of the game and blamed your deaths on it.
Segata Sanshiro said:The "running into doorknobs" thing is a separate issue from the collision. It describes how Rare designs their levels in their games. Many better developers will introduce new gameplay concepts in non-lethal settings, to give the player a chance when they do run into it in a lethal situation. Rare does not do this. They have never done this. They often introduce new gameplay elements that will kill the player the first time they run into them. They usually make up for this by tossing a lot of lives at the player, as in DKC, or by laughing and saying "fuck ya", like in Battletoads.
I obviously was able to adjust to the weird collision, as I beat the game in an afternoon, but that doesn't mean it's not a fault. What kind of weird logic is that? Lots of people love the Fallout/Elder Scrolls games, but it doesn't make them any less buggy.
Basically your position is that the game is perfect. Cool. Cheers to you, that doesn't help me a lick and won't stop me from hoping the faults I found in the older games won't be present in this newer one.
If a game can be cleared in an afternoon by someone who isn't very good at it, then how fast did you pro-stars do it? A half hour? Christ.flak57 said:It sounds like the game isn't for you, and that you may not have been very good at it. I've never experienced any collision issues outside of Winky and Expresso, and the occasional annoyance of jumping during a cartwheel attack that has resulted in a few deaths, and I never felt that the new gimmick presented in each level was a trial and error experience. I just developed a certain rhythm and speed to play the game that I could handle those obstacles.
Segata Sanshiro said:The "running into doorknobs" thing is a separate issue from the collision. It describes how Rare designs their levels in their games. Many better developers will introduce new gameplay concepts in non-lethal settings, to give the player a chance when they do run into it in a lethal situation. Rare does not do this. They have never done this. They often introduce new gameplay elements that will kill the player the first time they run into them. They usually make up for this by tossing a lot of lives at the player, as in DKC, or by laughing and saying "fuck ya", like in Battletoads.
I obviously was able to adjust to the weird collision, as I beat the game in an afternoon, but that doesn't mean it's not a fault. What kind of weird logic is that? Lots of people love the Fallout/Elder Scrolls games, but it doesn't make them any less buggy.
Basically your position is that the game is perfect.
I'm not going to plug my Wii in, fire up the game, and play to find an example for someone who thinks any problems I find with the game must be something wrong with me, not the game. I'll find something, you'll explain it away, I'll find something else, you'll explain it away again. It's a waste of time for both of us. You think the game is nearly perfect, I think the game is flawed, and neither one of us has enough respect for the other to actually come to any kind of agreement or reconciliation on this.KevinCow said:I seriously want an example of this trial and error gameplay you keep talking about. Just one, in the entirety of DKC2.
KevinCow said:I seriously want an example of this trial and error gameplay you keep talking about. Just one, in the entirety of DKC2.
Segata Sanshiro said:So here's what's going to happen. I'm going to exit this thread, and I am never going to bring up Donkey Kong Country on these boards again. I will put it on the list of things that cannot be talked about along with just about every other game in existence. Everyone, have a lovely tea party, and I hope we all enjoy the new game. I won't be saying if I do enjoy it or not, though, because there is absolutely no worth in talking about games around here.
Cheers.
cantona222 said:First: Wario Land The Shake Dimension
Then: New Super Mario Bros Wii
Now: Kirby's Epic Yarn
Soon: Donkey Kong Country Returns.
Nintendo is setting a new 2D console platforming golden age one more time.
The spiked tires were worse than the wheels, but I never felt they were unfair. And considering that there are multiple DK barrels throughout levels, something like that is even less likely to result in a death.AdventureRacing said:The big cheese wheels.
There are a lot of spots i can think of in DKC where you will be walking along only to have an enemy come from off screen really fast giving you almost no chance to react.
Segata Sanshiro said:I'm not going to plug my Wii in, fire up the game, and play to find an example for someone who thinks any problems I find with the game must be something wrong with me, not the game. I'll find something, you'll explain it away, I'll find something else, you'll explain it away again. It's a waste of time for both of us. You think the game is nearly perfect, I think the game is flawed, and neither one of us has enough respect for the other to actually come to any kind of agreement or reconciliation on this.
So here's what's going to happen. I'm going to exit this thread, and I am never going to bring up Donkey Kong Country on these boards again. I will put it on the list of things that cannot be talked about along with just about every other game in existence. Everyone, have a lovely tea party, and I hope we all enjoy the new game. I won't be saying if I do enjoy it or not, though, because there is absolutely no worth in talking about games around here.
Cheers.
Why on Earth would I remember a specific instance from a game I played through in one afternoon and didn't care much for?KevinCow said:I expect you to counter my points so I can respond with my own points?
Well.
Yeah.
That's called a discussion.
I mean, what, you just expect to say that a widely acclaimed game really isn't all that great without people trying to counter your points? And then when asked to provide specific examples, you pussy out of the whole conversation? I'm pretty fucking surprised to see that from you of all people.
Incidentally, no, I don't expect you to pop the game back in to find an example. I just expect that if it was that big an issue, you'd probably be able to remember at least one specific instance.
Segata Sanshiro said:Why on Earth would I remember a specific instance from a game I played through in one afternoon and didn't care much for?
And you know, I'm not just going to pussy out of the conversation. I'm going to pussy out of the boards. The lack of numbers has made the sales talk terrible, the biz talk is so choked with virals and apologist fanboys that it's completely terrible, and the gaming talk has always been terrible. That pretty much leaves trolling, and if that's all my contribution is going to be, I'm better off leaving.
People who don't suck know where to find me. Adios, GAF.
MYE said:Fixed
Segata Sanshiro said:Why on Earth would I remember a specific instance from a game I played through in one afternoon and didn't care much for?
And you know, I'm not just going to pussy out of the conversation. I'm going to pussy out of the boards. The lack of numbers has made the sales talk terrible, the biz talk is so choked with virals and apologist fanboys that it's completely terrible, and the gaming talk has always been terrible. That pretty much leaves trolling, and if that's all my contribution is going to be, I'm better off leaving.
People who don't suck know where to find me. Adios, GAF.
here on this forum i assumescitek said:I don't particularly suck and I have no idea where that might be.
scitek said:I don't particularly suck and I have no idea where that might be.
KevinCow said:Probably ShitGAF. Don't worry, if I'm right, it's not even worth knowing about.
Maffis said:It looks good, but some of that music worries me.
Had some great music, but yea I think Segata's deal has little to do with this game and more to do with him being sick of the boards.AniHawk said:god damnit, dkc is not a great game and never was. certainly not worth this shitfest.
edit: the recent conversation, not dkcr.