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Opinion News Indie Indie Dev Josh Loveridge about Playstation 4K rumour 'Just propaganda, no truth to that' - Including full interview.

freefornow

Member
Feb 13, 2013
1,538
718
605
Where is dot point 15?

15. I'm saying this to balance out the negative comments towards my exclusive development platform.
 
Last edited:
May 8, 2020
3,542
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640
Short History on why he’s partnering with Sony:

Josh Loveridge

First title was on Xbox, 2018. His company has 3 indie titles under his belt.

New game is a PS4 exclusive: Costume Kingdom (probably coming to PS5 but can’t comment due to NDA)


Sony treated his team much better compared to MS. Felt more supported as a whole by Sony for the titles his team wanted to create. Says Sony was happy to work with them. Found some resistance when working with MS.

Alludes to MS not liking certain genres that don’t sell, and shooting down concepts/pitches. If he wanted to do his game he had to go somewhere else. Took his game to Sony and released it. Sony is very open with developers and knows how to build a community of developers. Sony treats their developers right – both in house, and partners. There is a player base for any gaming genre and Sony understands that. Saying no to a specific genre because it hasn’t sold well is not the way to go. Strong arm tactics don't work.

That treatment and synergy is one of the many reasons that their game is Sony exclusive. Sony's help gave his his team room to grow and is thankful for the opportunities.

Open to acquisition and open to collaboration.

Multiplatform release:

His team is open to releasing in more platforms if one of their games becomes a hit. Certified developer for all big 3 console platforms. Prefer to focus resources on one platform first to make the best game possible (Playstation).

Regarding 4k rumors and FUD surrounding PS5 by “insiders”:

4K drama is nonsense. If there’s any way possible to make games run in 4k; games for Sony’s PS5 would do it.

Lowest common denominator hold back games.

Which system to choose next-gen?:

If your friends are on Xbox and you like Xbox, play Xbox.

If you like Sony/Playstation, stick to Playstation – they’re better at building communities and they treat their players and developers better (than Microsoft).

Sony’s COVID aid fund:

The COVID Fund initiative was real – wasn’t smoke and mirrors. Helps small and stressed developers.

Could Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart be done on Xbox Series X?:

Thinks Ratchet could be done on Series X if Insomniac really wanted to make the game work on Series X.

Cross-buy/Backwards compatibility:

Thinks next-gen versions should be free (doesn't specificy if upgrades should be free). If there is a licensing fee or a cost levied on the developer by Sony then it's understandable if a developer charges a fee.....IF NOT it should be free. Transparency is key.

Next-gen predictions and opinion on exclusives:

Foresees Sony to continue to be the market leader next-gen.

Likes Sony’s and Nintendo’s coexistence by targeting different demographics.

Disparity in the quality as well as quantity of exclusive games is BIG between Sony and Microsoft. He thinks that it looks like it will continue next-gen.

Recommends to pre-order a PS5 if you want the best gaming experience. Says you will regret purchasing an Xbox if you expect content of quality up to par with what Sony offers. Says this disparity in some ways goes back to how Sony treats developers.

Bound to be some competition for that initial PS5 stock - so pre-order fast. Predicts PS5 will sell out pretty quickly compared to Xbox Series X. Current gen install base disparity should be a tell sign.

Lining up the exclusives and the studios between Sony and MS – night and day difference.

Big contrast in company culture between Sony/MS that translates to the direction the companies take in delivering the product to consumers (gamers).

Regarding Halo Infinite:

Insulting that they wasted so much money. Specially on a trailer (Halo Infinite/Slipspace engine teaser trailer 2019) that wasn’t representative of the game in 2020. Felt like a snakeoil salesman trying to sell you fake goods.

Prefers transparency and gameplay showcase when demoing and promoting a game if possible. Ubisoft and Sony in the past made similar mistakes with Watch Dogs and Killzone.

Knows some developers who put out the Halo Infinite showcase. Says they felt shamed for confusing players, and that overall it was a wasted opportunity.

Says there is often a big disconnect between marketing departments from big studios and what gamers want from promotional content (Gameplay).

Assassins Creed Valhalla sort of made the same mistake as Halo Infinite recently.

Prefers to show his games by showing gameplay so that consumers are informed of what the game is. If you like what you see you buy it . If you don’t like what you see he doesn’t want you to spend your hard earned money on something you don’t want. Tricking and misleading the consumer is bad.

Thinks there should be regulation for video promo material of games. An enforcement mechanism that promotes transparency in marketing material to distinguish between gameplay and cinematic trailers.

Dev cycles and development hell:

Prefers short dev cycles as an indie developer - 1 year.

Cites Anthem development as something to not be followed. EA had what is known as stress casualties with rooms dedicated for people having a mental breakdown due to stress and long development.

Engaging the community:

Thinks engaging the player is key. Player is the most important thing. Positivity is king. Important to give back to on-the-fence consumers that watch games on Streams.

Gamers have become desensitized about the harm trolling criticism has on games/developers. Encourages developers to engage with gamers regardless and that transparecy alleviates a lot of the problems.
 
Last edited:

MrFunSocks

Banned
Jul 9, 2020
3,019
5,437
645
Sony treated his team much better compared to MS. Felt more supported as a whole by Sony for the titles his team wanted to create. Says Sony was happy to work with them. Found some resistance when working with MS.
Working with MS? He's an indie. MS don't have to work with him, he's the one making the game lol. MS don't have to have anything to do with him at all other than certifying his game for release.

It sounds like he wanted to get a paid partnership to make his game exclusive, and Sony were more open to that so he's flying the sony flag.
 
Mar 27, 2020
9,489
27,704
700
Uncharted bunghole
Working with MS? He's an indie. MS don't have to work with him, he's the one making the game lol

I don't know if Microsoft has anything similar but PlayStation has the Indie Initiative headed by Shuhei Yoshida.


"I’m pleased to formally announce the PlayStation Indies initiative. With PlayStation Indies, we hope to spotlight and support the best of the best indie games being published on PlayStation and the entire indie community as a whole. Our goal is to make PlayStation the best place to develop, find, and play great indie games."

Alot of Indies are going to work with Sony through this program. With that said I wouldn't be surprised if Microsoft has something similar.

Edit: Video from the article for those interested.

 
Last edited:

jigglet

Member
May 18, 2020
1,564
3,192
545
Doesn't propaganda imply some sort of centrally controlled source?

No this is just from a disparate bunch of fanboys on both sides.
 

Max_Po

Member
Mar 1, 2015
3,240
4,222
595
Guy who's developing a PS4 exclusive Indie game praises Sony.

BTW this is his game:

Craig gone fishing... !!!
 

SoraNoKuni

Member
Jun 14, 2015
439
399
420
26
Hollow Bastion(Greece)
Well the current gen proves him right about the creative freedom Sony gives to developers in contrast with MS.

Ms wants more cashgrabbing gaas pachinko games they should have collaborated to create an xbox pachinko with konami if continuous milking over a product is their thing.
 
May 8, 2020
3,542
8,743
640
Working with MS? He's an indie. MS don't have to work with him, he's the one making the game lol. MS don't have to have anything to do with him at all other than certifying his game for release.

It sounds like he wanted to get a paid partnership to make his game exclusive, and Sony were more open to that so he's flying the sony flag.

Beautiful isn't it?



O say can you see by the dawn's early light
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming.....
 

GHG

Member
Nov 9, 2006
23,049
26,246
1,845
Jose92 Jose92

This is the summary that should be in the OP:

Short History on why he’s partnering with Sony:

Josh Loveridge

First title was on Xbox, 2018. His company has 3 indie titles under his belt.

New game is a PS4 exclusive: Costume Kingdom (probably coming to PS5 but can’t comment due to NDA)


Sony treated his team much better compared to MS. Felt more supported as a whole by Sony for the titles his team wanted to create. Says Sony was happy to work with them. Found some resistance when working with MS.

Alludes to MS not liking certain genres that don’t sell, and shooting down concepts/pitches. If he wanted to do his game he had to go somewhere else. Took his game to Sony and released it. Sony is very open with developers and knows how to build a community of developers. Sony treats their developers right – both in house, and partners. There is a player base for any audience/genre and Sony understands that. Saying no to a specific genre because it hasn’t sold well is not the way to go. Strong arm tactics don't work.

That treatment and synergy is one of the many reasons that their game is Sony exclusive. Sony help gave his his team room to grow and is thankful for the opportunities.

Open to acquisition, open to collaboration.

Multiplatform release:

His team is open to releasing in more platforms if one of their games becomes a hit. Certified developer for all big 3 console platforms. Prefer to focus resources on one platform first to make the best game possible (Playstation).

Regarding 4k rumors and FUD surrounding PS5 by “insiders”:

4K drama is nonsense. If there’s any way possible to make games run in 4k; games for Sony’s PS5 would do it.

Lowest common denominator hold back games.

Which system to choose next-gen:

If your friends are on Xbox and you like Xbox, play Xbox.

If you like Sony/Playstation, stick to Playstation – they’re better at building communities and treat their players and developers better (than Microsoft).

Sony’s COVID aid fund:

The COVID Fund initiative was real – wasn’t smoke and mirrors. Helps small and stressed developers.

Could Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart be done on Xbox Series X?:

Thinks Ratchet could be done on Series X if Insomniac really wanted to make the game work on Series X.

Cross-buy/Backwards compatibility:

Thinks next-gen versions should be free (doesn't specificy if upgrades should be free). If there is a licensing fee or a cost levied on the developer by Sony then it's understandable if a developer charges a fee but IF NOT, it should be free. Transparency is key.

Next-gen predictions and opinion on exclusives:

Foresees Sony to continue to be the market leader next-gen.

Likes Sony’s and Nintendo’s coexistence by targeting different demographics.

Disparity in quality/quantity of exclusive games is BIG between Sony and Microsoft. He thinks that it looks like it will continue.

Recommends to pre-order a PS5 if you want the best gaming experience. You will regret purchasing an Xbox if you expect content of quality up to par with what Sony offers. Says this disparity in some ways goes back to how Sony treats developers. Bound to be some competition for that initial PS5 stock - so pre-order fast. Predicts PS5 will sell out pretty quickly compared to Xbox Series X. Current gen install base disparity should be a tell sign.

Lining up the exclusives and the studios between Sony and MS – night and day difference.

Big contrast in company culture between Sony/MS that translates to the direction the companies take in delivering the product to consumers (gamers).

Regarding Halo Infinite:

Insulting that they wasted so much money. Specially on a trailer (Halo Infinite/Slipspace engine teaser trailer 2019) that wasn’t representative of the game in 2020. Felt like a snakeoil salesman trying to sell you fake goods.

Prefers transparency and gameplay showcase when demoing and promoting a game if possible. Ubisoft and Sony in the past made similar mistakes with Watch Dogs and Killzone.

Knows some developers who put out the Halo Infinite showcase. Says they felt shamed for confusing players, and that overall it was a wasted opportunity.

Says there is often a big disconnect between marketing departments from big studios and what gamers want from promotional content (Gameplay).

Assassins Creed Valhalla sort of made the same mistake as Halo Infinite recently.

Prefers to show his games by showing gameplay so that people are informed of what the game is. If you like what you see you buy it . If you don’t like what you see he doesn’t want you to spend your hard earned money on something you don’t want. Tricking and misleading the consumer is bad.

Thinks there should be regulation for video promo material of games that enforces transparency in marketing material to distinguish between gameplay and cinematic trailers.

Dev cycles and development hell:

Prefers short dev cycles as an indie developer - 1 year.

Cites Anthem development as something to not be followed. EA had what is known as stress casualties with rooms decidacated for people having a mental breakdown due to stress and long development.

Engaging the community:

Thinks engaging the player is key. Player is the most important thing. Positivity is king. Important to give back to on the fence, non-consumers that watch your games on Streams.

Gamers have become desensitized about the harm of trolling criticism has on games/developers. Encourages developers to engage with gamers and potential consumers regardless and that transparecy alleviates a lot of the problems.
 
Jun 12, 2014
362
1,003
525
Because it's obvious he's disgruntled and leans towards Playstation. Xbox has the better hardware, that's not even up for debate.

Xbox has the better hardware? If you say better GPU I can see a point.. at least is more powerful than ps5.. if we are talking general architecture, I/O, ssd, controller features I see a clear ps5 advantage.. and there is yet many things we don’t know about this two machines.. games as always will clear things up..

Nevertheless I don’t think he is talking about TF but general dev experience with both companies and from a customer perspective the experience with both and it thinks in that regard ps5 is better.. and if we talk first party games output is not even a contest..
 
Jun 12, 2014
362
1,003
525
Short History on why he’s partnering with Sony:

Josh Loveridge

First title was on Xbox, 2018. His company has 3 indie titles under his belt.

New game is a PS4 exclusive: Costume Kingdom (probably coming to PS5 but can’t comment due to NDA)


Sony treated his team much better compared to MS. Felt more supported as a whole by Sony for the titles his team wanted to create. Says Sony was happy to work with them. Found some resistance when working with MS.

Alludes to MS not liking certain genres that don’t sell, and shooting down concepts/pitches. If he wanted to do his game he had to go somewhere else. Took his game to Sony and released it. Sony is very open with developers and knows how to build a community of developers. Sony treats their developers right – both in house, and partners. There is a player base for any gaming genre and Sony understands that. Saying no to a specific genre because it hasn’t sold well is not the way to go. Strong arm tactics don't work.

That treatment and synergy is one of the many reasons that their game is Sony exclusive. Sony's help gave his his team room to grow and is thankful for the opportunities.

Open to acquisition and open to collaboration.

Multiplatform release:

His team is open to releasing in more platforms if one of their games becomes a hit. Certified developer for all big 3 console platforms. Prefer to focus resources on one platform first to make the best game possible (Playstation).

Regarding 4k rumors and FUD surrounding PS5 by “insiders”:

4K drama is nonsense. If there’s any way possible to make games run in 4k; games for Sony’s PS5 would do it.

Lowest common denominator hold back games.

Which system to choose next-gen?:

If your friends are on Xbox and you like Xbox, play Xbox.

If you like Sony/Playstation, stick to Playstation – they’re better at building communities and they treat their players and developers better (than Microsoft).

Sony’s COVID aid fund:

The COVID Fund initiative was real – wasn’t smoke and mirrors. Helps small and stressed developers.

Could Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart be done on Xbox Series X?:

Thinks Ratchet could be done on Series X if Insomniac really wanted to make the game work on Series X.

Cross-buy/Backwards compatibility:

Thinks next-gen versions should be free (doesn't specificy if upgrades should be free). If there is a licensing fee or a cost levied on the developer by Sony then it's understandable if a developer charges a fee.....IF NOT it should be free. Transparency is key.

Next-gen predictions and opinion on exclusives:

Foresees Sony to continue to be the market leader next-gen.

Likes Sony’s and Nintendo’s coexistence by targeting different demographics.

Disparity in the quality as well as quantity of exclusive games is BIG between Sony and Microsoft. He thinks that it looks like it will continue next-gen.

Recommends to pre-order a PS5 if you want the best gaming experience. Says you will regret purchasing an Xbox if you expect content of quality up to par with what Sony offers. Says this disparity in some ways goes back to how Sony treats developers.

Bound to be some competition for that initial PS5 stock - so pre-order fast. Predicts PS5 will sell out pretty quickly compared to Xbox Series X. Current gen install base disparity should be a tell sign.

Lining up the exclusives and the studios between Sony and MS – night and day difference.

Big contrast in company culture between Sony/MS that translates to the direction the companies take in delivering the product to consumers (gamers).

Regarding Halo Infinite:

Insulting that they wasted so much money. Specially on a trailer (Halo Infinite/Slipspace engine teaser trailer 2019) that wasn’t representative of the game in 2020. Felt like a snakeoil salesman trying to sell you fake goods.

Prefers transparency and gameplay showcase when demoing and promoting a game if possible. Ubisoft and Sony in the past made similar mistakes with Watch Dogs and Killzone.

Knows some developers who put out the Halo Infinite showcase. Says they felt shamed for confusing players, and that overall it was a wasted opportunity.

Says there is often a big disconnect between marketing departments from big studios and what gamers want from promotional content (Gameplay).

Assassins Creed Valhalla sort of made the same mistake as Halo Infinite recently.

Prefers to show his games by showing gameplay so that consumers are informed of what the game is. If you like what you see you buy it . If you don’t like what you see he doesn’t want you to spend your hard earned money on something you don’t want. Tricking and misleading the consumer is bad.

Thinks there should be regulation for video promo material of games. An enforcement mechanism that promotes transparency in marketing material to distinguish between gameplay and cinematic trailers.

Dev cycles and development hell:

Prefers short dev cycles as an indie developer - 1 year.

Cites Anthem development as something to not be followed. EA had what is known as stress casualties with rooms dedicated for people having a mental breakdown due to stress and long development.

Engaging the community:

Thinks engaging the player is key. Player is the most important thing. Positivity is king. Important to give back to on-the-fence consumers that watch games on Streams.

Gamers have become desensitized about the harm trolling criticism has on games/developers. Encourages developers to engage with gamers regardless and that transparecy alleviates a lot of the problems.

Great summary, thanks.

Sometimes the truth hurts but no lies detected in what was said by this guy..
 
Oct 26, 2018
15,474
21,427
785
I don't know if Microsoft has anything similar but PlayStation has the Indie Initiative headed by Shuhei Yoshida.


"I’m pleased to formally announce the PlayStation Indies initiative. With PlayStation Indies, we hope to spotlight and support the best of the best indie games being published on PlayStation and the entire indie community as a whole. Our goal is to make PlayStation the best place to develop, find, and play great indie games."

Alot of Indies are going to work with Sony through this program. With that said I wouldn't be surprised if Microsoft has something similar.

Edit: Video from the article for those interested.

Sony plugging indies? Yup, sounds like PS launch time as they need games to fill the first few years.

Give it 3 years and every preview, mention, E3 show, streamed show will be only first party Sony games.
 

supernova8

Member
Jun 2, 2020
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415
Great summary, thanks.

Sometimes the truth hurts but no lies detected in what was said by this guy..

I suppose he leans towards Sony but if he's telling the truth about how they treat devs then I guess we cannot expect anything else. They had an amazing showing of indie stuff for the PS4 launch. I too believe that Sony will win this generation again.
 

Tschumi

Banned
Jul 4, 2020
2,639
3,115
590
Japan
Is anyone surprised that xBox has a less favourable environment for new and interesting games? I mean, the proof is in the pudding, when was the last time the xBox had a streak of great titles like PS4 just had? Is it because all the studios they buy up and flush with money are crap? I doubt it!

I think xBox have entirely ceded the ground on gaming quality, and they're just trying to power up their addictive rinse-and-repeat gameplay models. We'll see if I'm right or wrong in 6-12 months.
 

Jon Neu

..he neus nothing
Jan 21, 2018
3,991
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Republic of Catalonia
Two possibilities:
1. He speaks the truth.

2. I dont like what he says, so I use the fanboy card.

I personally think, he is more right than most people would like it to be.
But whatever, time will tell, again.

3. He says ridiculous fanboy crap and the fanboys of the Sony side love him because confirmation bias.
 

MrFunSocks

Banned
Jul 9, 2020
3,019
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645
Can someone actually shed some light on what this supposed PS5 4K rumour is?


Xbox has the better hardware? If you say better GPU I can see a point.. at least is more powerful than ps5.. if we are talking general architecture, I/O, ssd, controller features I see a clear ps5 advantage.. and there is yet many things we don’t know about this two machines.. games as always will clear things up..

Nevertheless I don’t think he is talking about TF but general dev experience with both companies and from a customer perspective the experience with both and it thinks in that regard ps5 is better.. and if we talk first party games output is not even a contest..
General architecture? Care to elaborate?
 
Last edited:

93xfan

Member
Feb 23, 2013
2,655
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Didn't dusk golem already get outed for talking a pile of made up crap. Admitted to making stuff up to balance out the negative xbox comments going around.

Not at all. He said he brought up what he has heard to balance things out, not that he made up hearing the info.
 
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Jon Neu

..he neus nothing
Jan 21, 2018
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I've seen some screenshots of that discord.

Are you saying it's fake?

There are also hundreds of Sony discords, but somehow their existence hasn’t been used to justify the most ridiculous conspiracy theories ever.

Can someone actually shed some light on what this supposed PS5 4K rumour is?

Some dude on twitter said the PS5 is struggling to get games at 4K while the XSX isn’t.

And this is the console wars now, bringing discords, randos on youtube and twitter and indie devs that work in exchange for a sandwich and a beer.
 

prinz_valium

Member
Oct 15, 2013
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LMAO

Says something is propaganda and bullshit and says the exact same thing about the other manufacturer. So this time and about MS it's true, but the other not?

You can't believe anything anymore on the Internet
 
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Whitecrow

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May 7, 2018
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3. He says ridiculous fanboy crap and the fanboys of the Sony side love him because confirmation bias.

4. Sony outsold XBox 3:1 and:
MS doesnt care about selling XBoxes.
MS is literally burning money in order to make people play their games.
XBox have less exclusives.

Lets not pretend that Sony doesnt deserve its massive success ok?
 
Last edited:

Rubberwald

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Feb 18, 2019
562
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Sony treated his team much better compared to MS. Felt more supported as a whole by Sony for the titles his team wanted to create. Says Sony was happy to work with them. Found some resistance when working with MS.

This is a bit weird. MS store is full of indie games from pretty much every type of genre. Before this, I have only heard good things about how ID@Xbox treats and supports small developers. He either never communicated with them at all or there's clearly some miscommunication.
 

FeiRR

Banned
May 22, 2013
3,533
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820
Poland
This is a bit weird. MS store is full of indie games from pretty much every type of genre. Before this, I have only heard good things about how ID@Xbox treats and supports small developers. He either never communicated with them at all or there's clearly some miscommunication.
Microsoft demanded timed exclusivity from indie devs at the beginning of current generation. After the backlash from many devs, they changed their policies.
 
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llien

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Feb 1, 2017
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Come on guys, XSeX GPU is 20%+ faster than PS5 GPU, no random dude commenting on it can change it.

Whether that difference is enough for PS5 to have "trouble in 4k", will depend on what is taken as baseline, but it is hard for me to imagine someone taking XSeX, so, no issues.

Peace and Harmony.

Guy who's developing a PS4 exclusive Indie game praises Sony.
There ain't no stopping confirmation bias.

I blame Cerny and Microsfot. The former for being too conservative of the spec, the latter for being to crazy and pushing it too far.
 
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MrFunSocks

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Jul 9, 2020
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Some dude on twitter said the PS5 is struggling to get games at 4K while the XSX isn’t.

And this is the console wars now, bringing discords, randos on youtube and twitter and indie devs that work in exchange for a sandwich and a beer.
I thought that might be it, but then thought surely not because that would be a stupid thing for fanboys to get riled up about because nowhere did he say that the PS5 struggles with 4K in general or can't do 4K games. I might have given the fanboys a bit too much credit in thinking they could interpret things correctly though haha.
 

martino

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Apr 25, 2013
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How to spot people with big confirmation bias behavior :
  1. go ad hominen if they don't like the content (experience , no dev kit, shilling)
  2. go full authority argument if they like it.

what should happen :
  • wait or ask for more content / proof in both case.
 
Feb 15, 2013
8,872
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775
London
Sony plugging indies? Yup, sounds like PS launch time as they need games to fill the first few years.

Give it 3 years and every preview, mention, E3 show, streamed show will be only first party Sony games.

You're having a laugh, MS is the one releasing Xbox without any new first party game at launch, unless i've missed something. That is unacceptable, given how dire their output has been the past 2 years on XB1.
 
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ZywyPL

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This is the most interesting part:

8. “Expect space to become an issue on next gen consoles.” He says that games will be using more textures, more shading, bigger levels, higher resolutions and more intensive space taking features. (Yikes)

So apparently the 4K assets will take over the duplicated data and the games will take up more space than they already do.
 
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DavidGzz

Gold Member
Jan 7, 2018
2,135
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Glad MS said no to that game, and I'd hope 4k was possible with it. Looks rough.