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Growing obesity and ‘fat shaming’ in the middle east

cryptoadam

Banned
Growing obesity and ‘fat shaming’ in the middle east

Egyptian President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi sparked a social media backlash earlier this month when during a televised discussion with Health Minister Hala Zayed he chided his constituents for being overweight and called on his fellow citizens to lose weight.

As Zayed read off the latest figures on the nation’s obesity rate, including that the finding that 75 percent of Egyptians are overweight, al-Sisi interrupted her. Turning to the audience he asked: “Why are we doing this to ourselves?”


He reportedly poked fun at the prime minister – seated next to him – telling him he should not put on more weight, before launching into a 20-minute soliloquy about how Egyptians should exercise more. The next morning the president was photographed cycling through a Cairo suburb, sporting sweat pants, an athletic jacket and a baseball cap.

Though his supporters welcomed his remarks, many Egyptians responded negatively on social media with a mixture of jokes and criticisms. One meme depicted a woman being taken away by a police officer while she tells him: “What’s wrong? I only gained two kilos.”

Other responses slammed al-Sisi for taking an elitist, “fat-shaming” stance that fails to offer concrete steps targeting the problem. The president’s austere economic reforms, they charged, greatly increased the cost of fresh produce, making cheaper junk food more appealing; this, as millions of Egyptians already live under the poverty line.

Yet no one is disputing that the North African country has an obesity problem. The World Health Organization estimates that 63 percent of Egyptians are overweight and 36 percent are obese, one of the highest obesity rates in the world.

The problem also includes high rates of diabetes, cardiovascular diseases and cancer, all major risk factors for morbidity and mortality,” Ali H. Mokdad, Professor of Health Metrics Sciences and an obesity expert at the University of Washington, told The Media Line.

The problem, however, is not confined to Egypt. “It is also true for many countries in the region, especially Gulf states,” he added.

These nations urgently need a plan targeting obesity, one that involves various sectors and places strong emphasis on eating a balanced diet and increasing levels of physical activity, he explained.

“To reduce weight, there needs to be political will and initiatives that encourage a change of eating behavior. These steps include making fresh fruits and vegetables available at a reasonable price, providing exercise opportunities in safe environments (especially clear of cars, such as parks and sidewalks), implementing policies for restaurants and food manufacturers that allow for healthy options and require clear labels about what food contains,” Mokdad said.

“Parents should serve as role models for their children, and the medical system has to be involved at the level of prevention.”

Elsewhere in the region, obesity is a growing concern. Subhi M. Abu Abid, a specialist in morbid and chronic obesity at Ichilov Medical Center in Tel-Aviv, told The Media Line that the rate of overweight people among both Palestinians and Israelis is about the same.

More than a third of the population is obese, of which 10% is morbidly obese, he explained.

“This is the main medical challenge in the region because it is often includes other ailments such as diabetes, hyper-tension, joint problems and sterility. When patients lose weight, many of these accompanying afflictions often disappear.”

“Education about obesity should start at school,” Abu Abid continued. “Lately, we are seeing teenagers who are 160-170 kg. [353-375 pounds], something we have never seen before. We learn that they often sit at and play on a computer without moving, while they eat and eat. People therefore need more instruction about what and what not to eat and the vital importance of exercise.”

“In short, the Egyptian president’s call is right and needs to be followed up with concrete steps to ensure that if Egyptians decide to live healthier, the system will support their behavioral changes,” Mokdad concluded.

Looks like obesity isn't only a Western world thing.

I will say Sisi did more than what our Western leaders would do calling out the fatties. Will the Middle East get its obesity problem under control before the west does?
 

DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
About 1/6ths of my paycheck goes toward Medicaid/Medicare. An increasing number of health issues in the USA are either directly or tangentially related to being overweight.

It's not like we're talking about innocent children being teased in grade-school by their classmates. We're talking about grown adults who cannot control their impulses and are costing their neighbors hundreds of billions of dollars every year. Adults who coincidentally pass these same bad habits on to their children, by the way.

It seems smart that any modernized nation would take a strong stance against it. Teasing it is far better than resorting to "fat taxes" like they do in Europe.
 

lil puff

Member
About 1/6ths of my paycheck goes toward Medicaid/Medicare. An increasing number of health issues in the USA are either directly or tangentially related to being overweight.

It's not like we're talking about innocent children being teased in grade-school by their classmates. We're talking about grown adults who cannot control their impulses and are costing their neighbors hundreds of billions of dollars every year. Adults who coincidentally pass these same bad habits on to their children, by the way.

It seems smart that any modernized nation would take a strong stance against it. Teasing it is far better than resorting to "fat taxes" like they do in Europe.
I agree. I have people in my own family with this issue.

I have no idea if it's impulse control or mental health, but yeah even some of my younger family members are starting gaining weight and eating issues early. Parents pass that shit right on down.

When my neice was young she got to the point where she didn't care about the shaming she got, but I know she was internalizing her self-esteem the entire time.

It's a difficult issue though. There is a fine line between GUVT telling Me what to Eat.
 

DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
I agree. I have people in my own family with this issue.

I have no idea if it's impulse control or mental health, but yeah even some of my younger family members are starting gaining weight and eating issues early. Parents pass that shit right on down.

When my neice was young she got to the point where she didn't care about the shaming she got, but I know she was internalizing her self-esteem the entire time.

It's a difficult issue though. There is a fine line between GUVT telling Me what to Eat.
Obesity is higher among low-income families. Gov't welfare is also higher among low-income families.

At some point, the theoretical dilemma of the Gov't telling you what to eat must give way to the actual dilemma of the Gov't funding your family's obesity.

I'm not trying to diminish the heartbreak that comes with so-called "fat shaming". I've been fat for periods of my life and I felt bad for it, but that's partially due to the fact that your physiology becomes predisposed toward depression and sadness when you are overweight. If the goal is to avoid feeling bad, losing extra fat is a proven method to meet that aim.
 

lil puff

Member
Obesity is higher among low-income families. Gov't welfare is also higher among low-income families.

At some point, the theoretical dilemma of the Gov't telling you what to eat must give way to the actual dilemma of the Gov't funding your family's obesity.

I'm not trying to diminish the heartbreak that comes with so-called "fat shaming". I've been fat for periods of my life and I felt bad for it, but that's partially due to the fact that your physiology becomes predisposed toward depression and sadness when you are overweight. If the goal is to avoid feeling bad, losing extra fat is a proven method to meet that aim.
What you're saying is true. I just don't think the public will take in that sort of logic.

Didn't they recently stop the healthy school lunch program? That would have been a nice subtle way of teaching kids about eating healthy, exercise and overall well being. Without it seeming forced or insulting. Because most adults are going to do what they do.
 

highrider

Banned
You have to create a culture that encourages exercise and eating right. Most nations fail miserably at this. I would say Serbian people are a good example to follow. They encourage being fit, sports and exercise, eating healthy foods. They also don’t discourage competition among children, they integrate it.
 

Antoon

Banned
Its pretty natural considering how greasy the Egyptian cuisine is. They have like 60% oil in everything, and the sweet stuff is 99% sugar. Now thanks to Social media/phones the lazy town grows even more rapidly.
 
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bitbydeath

Member
Fat shaming is such a funny term which was obviously made up by fat people hoping it sticks because they can’t face the truth and would rather keep their face buried in their food than do anything about it.

MenacingPoisedCaimanlizard-size_restricted.gif
 

Arbitrary

Neo Member
Bullying /shaming/abusing fat people is never helpful (although *encouraging* better diet/exercise is!)

Anybody who's seriously fat is acutely aware of their problem, they see and feel it every day. But they lack the willpower/motivation to deal with it. It's very easy to feel 'past the point of no return'.

Actively shaming/bullying/abusing them does *not* help. It's most likely to make a cycle of depression and comfort eating even worse.
 

black_13

Banned
He's not wrong. Especially if health care is publicly funded.

But you don't want to straight up call people fat. Better to encourage healthy lifestyle than forcing it.
 

Arbitrary

Neo Member
'Fat' or 'obese' is merely descriptive.

But it rarely ends there, there seem to be a lot of people who can't talk about a fat person without getting rather more abusive, 'fat f**k', 'landwhale', 'lazy slob' etc (The sort that feel so superior - or that are so bitter about the amount of time they've chosen to spend working out - that they don't just stop at a bit of verbal abuse, they create subreddits devoted to bullying fat people etc...)
 

Greedings

Member
Shaming doesn't work. If you shame a drug addict, they don't stop. If you shame an alcoholic, they don't stop. It's even worse when a lot of people have eating triggers like being sad or depressed.
Speaking as a past fatty, and someone who is 1 month of "fuck it" away from being overweight at all times, the only thing that works is a goal to be not fat. It's hard to find.

I think we're about 10-20 years away from a real fat loss pill, but we'll see...
 

cryptoadam

Banned
I agree people shouldn't be bullied, but we also cant promote obesity as normal or even healthy.

Especially in the west, being overweight is being normalized. The whole big is beautiful movement is harmful to society.
 

JimmyRustler

Gold Member
This whole obesity problem all over the place is just so bizarre for someone like me who has his nutrition fully in check. I just eat what my body needs and that's it. It's become so natural and effortless for me that I often can't even appreciate the whole thing. Hit me a couple of weeks back when a workmate of mine had tooth issues and I told him just to stop eating for a while so his nerve could calm and the guy just could not do it. When we went to the cinema that evening he was eating again. Naturally the toothache came back with a vengeance. Such an idiot.

Makes you realize just how close we humans are to animals. Everything's fine and dandy until it comes to our eating habbits, then most people loose all self control. Was faszinating for me when I noticed this with my dog. Nicest dog ever but you better not dare take away his food.
 

Greedings

Member
Makes you realize just how close we humans are to animals. Everything's fine and dandy until it comes to our eating habbits, then most people loose all self control.

Eating and hunger are determined by so many things, including genetics. I hate it when people say "Oh just eat less. Have self control!"

I do eat less, I have crazy amounts of self control. I'm hungry every single day. If I eat until I'm not hungry, I gain weight.
 

Fbh

Member
"Fat Shaming" is one of those terms that has been generalized so much that it has lost any validity IMO.

It went from being used to describe the act of bullying, teasing or making fun of people because of their weight to something used to criticize any negative statement regarding obesity.

You can't even tell people that obesity is unhealthy or that they should eat better and exercise more without getting backlash
 

Redneckerz

Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
About 1/6ths of my paycheck goes toward Medicaid/Medicare. An increasing number of health issues in the USA are either directly or tangentially related to being overweight.

It's not like we're talking about innocent children being teased in grade-school by their classmates. We're talking about grown adults who cannot control their impulses and are costing their neighbors hundreds of billions of dollars every year. Adults who coincidentally pass these same bad habits on to their children, by the way.

It seems smart that any modernized nation would take a strong stance against it. Teasing it is far better than resorting to "fat taxes" like they do in Europe.
I think a lot of this is also inherent to the fact that US food is larger than life by default. Your small burger is an XL here.

If anything, portion sizes could be significantly reduced, for one.

''Do you want fries with that?''
 

DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
Bullying /shaming/abusing fat people is never helpful (although *encouraging* better diet/exercise is!)

Anybody who's seriously fat is acutely aware of their problem, they see and feel it every day. But they lack the willpower/motivation to deal with it. It's very easy to feel 'past the point of no return'.

Actively shaming/bullying/abusing them does *not* help. It's most likely to make a cycle of depression and comfort eating even worse.
Conversely, we cannot expand the definition of shaming -- or invent new non-terms like "fat shaming" -- to encompass anything and everything that remotely resembles criticism of an unhealthy obese lifestyle.

The "cycle of depression and comfort eating" shouldn't be a burden on my paycheck
I think a lot of this is also inherent to the fact that US food is larger than life by default. Your small burger is an XL here.

If anything, portion sizes could be significantly reduced, for one.

''Do you want fries with that?''
That doesn't jive with our thrifty American mentality.

We want more for our money. More burger. More soda. More diabetes.
 

Redneckerz

Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
That doesn't jive with our thrifty American mentality.

We want more for our money. More burger. More soda. More diabetes.
Exactly. Combine that with a unhealthy Medicaid system and a significant portion of the US community not willing to overhauling not only that system but also the portion sizes and you get fatty people.

Its one of the few things we folks from across the sea can actually laugh at.
 

SKM1

Member
'Fat' or 'obese' is merely descriptive.

But it rarely ends there, there seem to be a lot of people who can't talk about a fat person without getting rather more abusive, 'fat f**k', 'landwhale', 'lazy slob' etc (The sort that feel so superior - or that are so bitter about the amount of time they've chosen to spend working out - that they don't just stop at a bit of verbal abuse, they create subreddits devoted to bullying fat people etc...)

Well, that's another thing. There's a difference between shaming and bullying. I have a friend who tends to get incredibly fat when we visits his family in the USA and I will always point it out and shame him for it in a friendly way.
 

bitbydeath

Member
Eating and hunger are determined by so many things, including genetics. I hate it when people say "Oh just eat less. Have self control!"

I do eat less, I have crazy amounts of self control. I'm hungry every single day. If I eat until I'm not hungry, I gain weight.

I find exercising for 30mins + 1/2 litres of water is a great way to supress hunger.
 

Papa

Banned
The simple rule I follow for what attributes I should not criticize a person for is whether or not they are immutable characteristics. These include race, sex, sexual orientation, height, age, IQ, and so on, but not weight. Quit complaining and hit the gym, lardos.
 

TrainedRage

Banned
Because "shaming" anyone is a really poor motivator.
That's anecdotal. Shaming can be a powerful motivator. Like if I keep calling you fat and not telling you, "oh honey its ok everyone is beautiful in their own way". Maybe you will get off your ass and stop eating all those cookies. Or maybe I will shame you into going to the gym. I would say shame is a powerful motivator.
 

Wag

Member
That's anecdotal. Shaming can be a powerful motivator. Like if I keep calling you fat and not telling you, "oh honey its ok everyone is beautiful in their own way". Maybe you will get off your ass and stop eating all those cookies. Or maybe I will shame you into going to the gym. I would say shame is a powerful motivator.
Maybe there are reasons someone is overweight other than laziness, slothfulness or any of the other million stereotypes for the overweight? You wouldn't know at first glance I had nephropathy and underlying illnesses which were preventing me from exercising.

Don't be so quick to judge- a little sympathy goes a long way.
 

TrainedRage

Banned
Maybe there are reasons someone is overweight other than laziness, slothfulness or any of the other million stereotypes for the overweight? You wouldn't know at first glance I had nephropathy and underlying illnesses which were preventing me from exercising.

Don't be so quick to judge- a little sympathy goes a long way.
Nah. I have the right to judge people. If there are underling conditions then fine, deal with them. Its not all about exercise either, you can lose weight by eating less or healthier. Get a nutritionist, do a fast. There are so many options to lose weight that saying 'but I have a condition' becomes another excuse.

Coddling people wont motivate them either. I can be sympathetic and tell you the truth too.
 

Wag

Member
Nah. I have the right to judge people. If there are underling conditions then fine, deal with them. Its not all about exercise either, you can lose weight by eating less or healthier. Get a nutritionist, do a fast. There are so many options to lose weight that saying 'but I have a condition' becomes another excuse.

Coddling people wont motivate them either. I can be sympathetic and tell you the truth too.
Encouragement is different from coddling, tough love is not shaming. There's a difference.

To the previous poster- I'm Jewish. I will tell you that my mother is in her mid 80's, has had life-long issues with anxiety and depression mostly from her upbringing. To this day she's obsessed with her weight, says she's "fat" even though she's not. Times have changed- if you think "shaming" people will accomplish anything, go right ahead- telling people something they already know won't accomplish anything.

You can encourage without being mean, without coddling, just being straightforward and honest. Maybe "fat shaming" is something totally different than what I think it is? Millenials. 🤣
 

TrainedRage

Banned
Encouragement is different from coddling, tough love is not shaming. There's a difference.

To the previous poster- I'm Jewish. I will tell you that my mother is in her mid 80's, has had life-long issues with anxiety and depression mostly from her upbringing. To this day she's obsessed with her weight, says she's "fat" even though she's not. Times have changed- if you think "shaming" people will accomplish anything, go right ahead- telling people something they already know won't accomplish anything.

You can encourage without being mean, without coddling, just being straightforward and honest. Maybe "fat shaming" is something totally different than what I think it is? Millenials. 🤣
What would you consider examples of 'fat shaming' vs 'tough love'? I don't really see a difference. It's also different online vs real life. I would never 'fat shame' someone to their face IRL. That's crass.
But If its a friend and they are putting on weight.... Yeah im gonna call you out...
 

waxer

Member
Modern internet Fat shaming is about attractiveness. It has nothing to do with health. I'm pretty sure just commenting that you think a fit person is hot in pressence of overweight would be contrued as fat shaming on the internet.

Personally I can't gain to much weight because I intervene if gain to much. While I do have to work harder at it as I get older I have always had a self goal to stay to a minimum fitness level and Max weight.
I just work at keeping myself how I want to look. It's much easier to stay that way than try to get it back later.


I have always hated the whole but health reasons. Yeah some people do. But why should we lie to everyone else and say being unhealthy is ok for the minority in case we hurt their feelings.

What if we can't say smoking's bad because Timmy got fiddled with as a kid if he didn't finish the pack by his uncle. It's a shitty argument that makes 0 sense.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Good on the Egyptian pres for calling it out. Hopefully, some of the citizens will take note. You can't convince everyone as some people are stubborn, but let's face it. Everyone knows if you are too fat, not only is it not attractive, but also leads to unhealthy lifestyles. Who the wants to walk up a flight of stairs and already be out of breath?

Some people will listen and have willpower to change. Some people won't give a shit until it's too late.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Because "shaming" anyone is a really poor motivator.
Depends how one interprets shaming.

If a parent tells their kids to do well in school, and don't be a high school flunky, is that shaming? Not every kid gets straight As.

Sounds like good advice to me. Not all advice can be sugarcoated on a silver platter.
 
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JimmyRustler

Gold Member
Eating and hunger are determined by so many things, including genetics. I hate it when people say "Oh just eat less. Have self control!"

I do eat less, I have crazy amounts of self control. I'm hungry every single day. If I eat until I'm not hungry, I gain weight.
Sorry but I‘ve heard this genetics excuse so often it comes out of my ears. There are maybe a handful of people who this applies to on the planet, for everyone else it‘s bad habits. You can get rid of it. It just takes a bit time and dedication on your part. The mistake most people make is to think that they change their eating habits and in a matter of a week or two your body will have adapted . That‘s not how it works. Make that 3-4 months and you will notice how much easier it gets.
 

Greedings

Member
Sorry but I‘ve heard this genetics excuse so often it comes out of my ears. There are maybe a handful of people who this applies to on the planet, for everyone else it‘s bad habits. You can get rid of it. It just takes a bit time and dedication on your part. The mistake most people make is to think that they change their eating habits and in a matter of a week or two your body will have adapted . That‘s not how it works. Make that 3-4 months and you will notice how much easier it gets.


A reason is not an excuse. How many people have you whole exome-sequenced? How could you possibly know the multiple variants people have?
Genetics have a huge effect on how we eat and how we metabolise food. Saying it has no impact is ignorant.

As I said, I've been struggling with weight my whole life. I made a change 10 years ago, and have been fit for 8 years. Unfortunately, I relapse occasionally. Not because I'm lazy, but because I am literally always hungry. If I take my eye off the prize for 2 weeks I've gained like 5Kg, no problem.

I'm not saying everyone has the same causes, but genetics are a major factor. There's mountains of data on it.
 
Yeah genetics are a factor. I've had it easy my entire life, and I have to massively overeat for a week to gain weight. I can lose weight super easily, and I'm in my low 30's.

I'm always hungry too, but that makes it easier for me to manage my weight, as opposed to someone who needs to put more effort into it.

Those kinds of differences make a big difference even though technically anyone can lose weight by eating right.
 

Greedings

Member
What kind of distance do you walk/ride your bike each day?

My phone's pedometer says I walk around 7km every day - but I think it's an overestimate. I have a job where I walk around a lot, from one side of the insitute to the other, to my office, to my bench, to my students office, etc.

I was cycling 6km every day (3 up hill to work, 3 down hill home) but it's now too icy for that. Once the weather warms up I'll get back to it.
I know how to lose weight. I know how to keep it off. Doesn't make it easy. It's a constant struggle for me.
 

JimmyRustler

Gold Member
A reason is not an excuse. How many people have you whole exome-sequenced? How could you possibly know the multiple variants people have?
Genetics have a huge effect on how we eat and how we metabolise food. Saying it has no impact is ignorant.

As I said, I've been struggling with weight my whole life. I made a change 10 years ago, and have been fit for 8 years. Unfortunately, I relapse occasionally. Not because I'm lazy, but because I am literally always hungry. If I take my eye off the prize for 2 weeks I've gained like 5Kg, no problem.

I'm not saying everyone has the same causes, but genetics are a major factor. There's mountains of data on it.
Yeah, probably paid studies by the food industry. Just keep searching for those so you have a clear conscience bro. You know, it's never your own fault, right? It's always something like genetics which just can't change, right? You just keep telling that yourself.

I've been overweight and constantly hungry myself you know. Guess what? Not any more. I won't even bother telling you what I have done because I know it's useless. If you really wanted to know, you would have found it. But nooooo, rather Google "genetics cause obesity"...
 

Greedings

Member
Yeah, probably paid studies by the food industry. Just keep searching for those so you have a clear conscience bro. You know, it's never your own fault, right? It's always something like genetics which just can't change, right? You just keep telling that yourself.

I've been overweight and constantly hungry myself you know. Guess what? Not any more. I won't even bother telling you what I have done because I know it's useless. If you really wanted to know, you would have found it. But nooooo, rather Google "genetics cause obesity"...

So because something doesn't conform with your preconceived ideas, it's shill research? I do the research into obesity and diabetes myself. I'm not funded by the nebulous "food industry." I'm funded by French and German research agencies. Tax payer money, not industry money.

Just look up leptin mutations. There a some very well characterised mutations in either leptin, or the receptor. They have HUGE effects. Now just imagine the mutations which have a very small effect - they're not characterised at all because they don't display a clear phenotype. Doesn't mean they don't exist. There's thousand of genes that affect food intake and metabolism, and we know barely anything about it.

The idea of "food industry" supporting various science frankly doesn't make sense - would salad vendors support science that says you can change, and McDonalds support data that you can't?

You also seem to be attacking someone who's not me. I said I was overweight, and haven't been for at least 8 years now. I didn't say one can't fight genetics, but that it's not as simple as "having self control" or "being lazy". I've never said that one should ignore health problems because they're genetic. My family has a ton of T2 diabetes. It's almost certainly genetic within my family. Doesn't mean I ignore it and eat sweets every day. I am careful about my carbohydrate intake.
Genetics doesn't mean you can't do anything about it. It a cause, but it's not set in stone. You can still fight a cause. Don't get so uppity because I'm disagreeing with you.
 

Super Mario

Banned
Being obese is disgusting, unhealthy, and bad for your self-esteem. No one should be ridiculed for it, but we've accepted it too much. While I don't condone shaming, I somewhat disagree with the opinion on its lack of effectiveness. I know more people who got fit because they were "shamed" rather than people who got fit because they were told they were big, beautiful, healthy, and completely normal. I don't mean to offend anyone, but I can stress enough the importance of a healthy lifestyle.

"Fat shaming" is just another political term introduced by the party of victims. The Democrats like to take every group that makes poor decisions and console them for votes. The amount of "true victims" is always overstated. Sure there are some who can't control it, but not an amount that is contributing to disproportionate growth.

For the US to have an effective health care system, there needs to be some sort of fitness requirement. Obese people are just walking hospital bills. Of course this will never happen because personal responsibility is too mean. Continue to tax others for the poor choices of a few.
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
If anything we need more people to fight this idea that being fat is okay. It’s not. You should feel bad, you should want to change.
 

Paracelsus

Member
Since it's become trendy to use Africa to counterargue social issues in the west: in Africa small kids smell glue and gasoline to get stoned and forget about starving, women do the same and go sell their bodies (if they're lucky they don't get raped and beat up for no money) because of the same reason and to try and feed their children. In the west, someone can lose their job if they dare calling out the obesity of someone who couldn't keep the hands out the fridge.
Don't get me wrong, genetics play a role, but they only play a role if you overeat. There's the classic "past the age of 30 if you keep eating the same as if you were 20 you'll gain 20 pounds in a year" and then there's 200 pounds. Coincidentally, the only countries with such magnificent genetics is where there's a billion fast food locations and where they waste several millions tons of food a year.
 
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D

Deleted member 77995

Unconfirmed Member
At what point does the food industry and various welfare programs share any sort of blame? It's not like humans are markedly different generation to generation, not to mention that obesity is a worldwide problem not just an individualized one. There is simply so much sugar in every sort of processed food you can eat. Food stamps can buy loads of carb heavy packaged foods but not any fruits or vegetables. Years of advertising being ingrained into people's brains from the time of infancy to drink Coke, eat sugary cereals and McDonalds being some sort of wholesome "be happy" food. Not to mention so many people are terribly misinformed behind the science of weight loss/gain. During my time in the Army I listened to all sorts of people in positions of power (drill sergeants, platoon sergeants, first sergeants) make factually incorrect statements about weight maintenance to their soldiers.

There is also this study that suggests obese people are cheaper to care for long-term than healthy people who live long full lives. The government has a monetary incentive to encourage you to be obese and die off younger than for you to grow old and continue to use taxpayer money.

I think the school system needs to be targeted for there to be any kind of wide-spread culture shift towards healthy eating. Have some kind of class introduced during elementary school on the dangers of lifelong obesity, teach kids about calories in/calories out, the difference between a carb, a fat and a protein. You should be able to read the back of a nutrition label and know exactly what you're consuming. Advertising should be targeted as well. Cancer-stick companies were banned from using cartoons to advertise to children. We should do the same for junk food. Food stamp programs need to be restructured so poor people can get lean meats, veggies and fruits instead of processed junk food #37. Get food companies out of politics. Once I found out how deeply infiltrated food execs were into politics I swear I was ready to go to war. Those people will do everything in their power to protect their profits, externalities be damned.

Individuals must always be blamed for their poor decisions but that doesn't mean the blame stops there.
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
At what point does the food industry and various welfare programs share any sort of blame? It's not like humans are markedly different generation to generation, not to mention that obesity is a worldwide problem not just an individualized one. There is simply so much sugar in every sort of processed food you can eat. Food stamps can buy loads of carb heavy packaged foods but not any fruits or vegetables. Years of advertising being ingrained into people's brains from the time of infancy to drink Coke, eat sugary cereals and McDonalds being some sort of wholesome "be happy" food. Not to mention so many people are terribly misinformed behind the science of weight loss/gain. During my time in the Army I listened to all sorts of people in positions of power (drill sergeants, platoon sergeants, first sergeants) make factually incorrect statements about weight maintenance to their soldiers.

There is also this study that suggests obese people are cheaper to care for long-term than healthy people who live long full lives. The government has a monetary incentive to encourage you to be obese and die off younger than for you to grow old and continue to use taxpayer money.

I think the school system needs to be targeted for there to be any kind of wide-spread culture shift towards healthy eating. Have some kind of class introduced during elementary school on the dangers of lifelong obesity, teach kids about calories in/calories out, the difference between a carb, a fat and a protein. You should be able to read the back of a nutrition label and know exactly what you're consuming. Advertising should be targeted as well. Cancer-stick companies were banned from using cartoons to advertise to children. We should do the same for junk food. Food stamp programs need to be restructured so poor people can get lean meats, veggies and fruits instead of processed junk food #37. Get food companies out of politics. Once I found out how deeply infiltrated food execs were into politics I swear I was ready to go to war. Those people will do everything in their power to protect their profits, externalities be damned.

Individuals must always be blamed for their poor decisions but that doesn't mean the blame stops there.

We for sure have a mass failing in the parenting and education systems regarding this. Individuals are always the first part of the problem, and can solve it on their own, but the education system really needs to kick into gear about truely teaching people why healthy lifestyles are important
 

Redneckerz

Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
Can someone give me a good reason why we shouldn't shame fat people? I don't mean slightly over weight. I mean fat.
For a variety of reasons listed below. Context is key.

And yes, there will be lazy folks that simply refuse to do the time or even rightfully admit that they don't give a shit that they look like what they are. I think that is the wrong attitude to have, but an attempt can be made to convince them over.

If not, then you don't have to invest the time in these people. They are happy with what they are, and if they are healthy, even better. The increased risk these people have is a risk they are willing to take.

The simple rule I follow for what attributes I should not criticize a person for is whether or not they are immutable characteristics. These include race, sex, sexual orientation, height, age, IQ, and so on, but not weight. Quit complaining and hit the gym, lardos.
I should start goldshaming people from Australia then.

Some people are born with a metabolism deficiency which will cause them to be overweight no matter the excercise. There are also various other diseases that cause this as a by-effect. Their immune system might get affected aswell, aswell as muscle strength, so that hitting the gym isn't even an option any longer, but fysiotherapy is the only way to retain mobility.

The opposite can also occur, that you get razor thin despite eating healthy a storm and excercising.

But i guess those people should just ''quit complaining and hit the gym, lardos''.

Bruh even for you this take is naive.
 

Punished Miku

Gold Member
I'll just copy my post from the other thread a few months back.

The government took drastic action against smoking when 45% of the US population smoked in 1965. Severe taxes on cigarettes that keep increasing. Banning all television advertisement, and any print advertisement that could even slightly be aimed at children. Giant warning labels on all packages explaining that it causes cancer and death. And in addition to that, millions of dollars in funding for advertisements on TV that demonize smoking, demonize smokers, actively try to make them look gross, and try to literally scare people into not smoking.

It worked.

Obesity in the US is currently at 39%. We're almost at the equivalent stage that smoking was at in its heyday, when doctors smoked in hospitals, when people smoked on planes, when almost everyone smoked all the time. We look back at that era wondering how they couldn't have known the cancer risks, and how so many people went along with it. That's us now.

The government knows what to do, it's just not clear yet if people will go along with it. When you are nearing half the population falling to the same trend, it's not a matter of individual responsibility or laziness, or bad decisions. It's a societal trend; one that is taking place all over the world as well. You need government to help correct societal trends this large.

1) Tax increases on bad foods. 2) Warning labels on bad foods in addition to the calorie count, stating that it causes coronary artery disease, diabetes, and death. 3) Start actively demonizing fat people on TV in government funded advertisements. Have commercials showing them in the ER with the EKG showing them flatline from a heart attack "this is your heart on saturated fat." Show diabetic people with amputated legs and start scaring people. Keep raising the taxes over time. 4) Ban all television fast food advertisement. Ban any fast food advertisement aimed at children.

It'll work in 40 years, same as smoking. It's at that point now. If you want to buy fast food or giant sodas, it should cost you a lot more than it currently does.
 
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