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Gaming peaked during 6th gen, change my mind

Drizzlehell

Banned
6th gen = PS2 + Xbox + GameCube

There are some solid arguments for this.

It was the generation that hit a sweet spot where games were yet to enter the always-online ecosystems, so the focus was still on single player experiences that had to move copies and publishers/developers couldn't rely on monetization schemes for extra revenue. The game had to stand on its own merits and you had to stand out of the crowd to attract the biggest audience. It was also a generation where technology was just about good enough to provide some true classics that could tell memorable stories and provide the player with truly epic and timeless gaming experiences.

Seventh generation was when things took a bad turn. Always-online functionality opened up opportunities for publishers to start monetizing the games, release cheap DLCs, online passes, and other things like that. It also allowed them to start releasing games before they could be truly finished because after all, with online support you could just patch them later. It was also a generation that was dominated by brown shooters and you could see more and more sequels and copycats that played it safe instead of trying to do something new and unique because creativity and experimentation kept getting riskier when production budgets kept getting higher.

Things only got worse over time, with the state of the industry today making me feel more and more cynical about the hobby with each passing year. Everything is monetized, everything is online, barely any game is released without sparking some retarded controversy or outrage, either due to some bullshit political reasons, or because it's buggy and unfinished, or just plain shitty. Every once in a blue moon we will get a game that's really great, while everything else gets inevitably dragged down by some stupid issues or publisher's greed, or it's just plain bad. You actually have to actively avoid the gaming press or become complacent with practices that would used to be unacceptable, otherwise you'll get bogged down in all the negativity and cynicism that surrounds the hobby.

There are also so many games that came out during that era that are still among the greatest games of all time. God of War, Silent Hill 2, Metal Gear Solid 2 and 3, Halo, Resident Evil 4, Metroid Prime, Final Fantasy 10, GTA Vice City and San Andreas, Rogue Squadron 2, Splinter Cell, Prince of Persia Sands of Time, Ratchet and Clank, Jak & Daxter, Devil May Cry, Fable, KOTOR, Shadow of The Colossus... I mean, there are so many it's hard to list all of them.
 
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ReBurn

Gold Member
I don't know if peaked is the term I would use. But it was pretty much the last generation where video games took risks. AAA became ultra-safe in the 7th gen and most indie games started moving toward being a personal tarke on an established idea or genre. I think video games have better production quality now, but they're not nearly as creative as they were back then.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
I don't know if peaked is the term I would use. But it was pretty much the last generation where video games took risks. AAA became ultra-safe in the 7th gen and most indie games started moving toward being a personal tarke on an established idea or genre. I think video games have better production quality now, but they're not nearly as creative as they were back then.
Yeah, they absolutely have better production values. But if it's between amazing graphics and huge open worlds vs creative and polished games with scaled back visuals, then I would choose the latter any day.
 
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Wildebeest

Member
Dreamcast and PS2 were trying to build on the "gaming is cool now" reputation of the original playstation. Gamecube was Nintendo but now finally moving past cartridge. XBox was a direct X PC in a box and shocked the gaming world by revealing that games like PC FPS and RPG not made in Japan existed. Dreamcast failed and the next generation, the stripped down PC gaming vision of the XBox took over more than people expected with consolised PC games like CoD and Skyrim really taking off. So the seeds of the loss of the traditional identity of console gaming and PC gaming were already planted in Gen 6.
 

RoboFu

One of the green rats
gaming peaked during the 16 bit era. If Nintendo and Sega would release real SNES and Genesis consoles today for $99 with real new support and new cart tech they would 100% dominate the market again. Todays AAA games are all based on "can't loose" gameplay and pretty cutscenes.
 
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feynoob

Banned
Who gave him the phone this time?
You guys know the rules. Don't allow him the phone and he won't post anything.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
gaming peaked during the 16 bit era. If Nintendo and Sega would release real SNES and Genesis consoles today for $99 with real new support and new cart tech they would 100% dominate the market again. Todays AAA games are all based on "can't loose" gameplay and pretty cutscenes.
Not if you care about interactive storytelling. The technology wasn't there during the 16 bit era to be able to engage the player with something more nuanced than text boxes and 2D sprites in terms of storytelling.
 

jcorb

Member
I do agree that the PS2/GameCube/Xbox gen was probably the best overall for gaming. They had the power to deliver more immersive and cinematic experiences, while also being approachable enough for smaller development studios.

I think that's an area the current market really struggles, is that there is this ENORMOUS rift between Triple-A titles (which are so big budget, they often have to make choices that are "safe"), and small "indie" studios that are basically a handful of passionate people without any real resources.

My two cents, obviously. But yeah, I'd love to see more games with teams in the 20-50 person range, that actually have adequate resources to make games with a cohesive vision, even if they're a bit off the beaten path.
 

hyperbertha

Member
Western Aaa gaming definitely. However, the indie + online revolution post 7th gen has given way to some stellar games like frostpunk, valheim, tarkov, divinity , hollow knight, dayz, bloodstained, Celeste, zomboid, outer wilds, hunt showdown , blasphemous, xenonauts, darkest dungeon, wasteland 3 and so on.

Gaming has overall maintained its quality, though some genres, like stealth, have declined.
 
I agree for the most part, however I was more mindblown by wireless controllers, downloadable games, online multiplayer, and hd tv. It is unfortunate that the leap into mainstream entertainment has made it subject to big business corruption and the gaming industrial complex. We experienced the golden era, and maybe after the decline of the gaming empire, a renaissance can occur.
 

Akuji

Member
Nah games today build of what the 6th gen did.
6th gen was a massive jump from the ps1/n64 which were 1st gen products for home consoles that did 3d.

So its natural that this big jump in game quality is remebered well but the truth is, ps3 games were more advanced and ps4 games were even more advanced. Ps5/xsx again is a 1st gen product with raytracing ( not that important for users but devs) and ssds ( very fucking important )

So the next step up will most likely be 10th gen. But then again, gaming has matured alot and this will be mean the jump will still be small compared to ps1 to ps2
 

YuLY

Member
It peaked in 7th gen, the best combination of good modern controls and graphics that for the most part still stand the test of time and forever will but also with innovation and taking risks with new francises. The best combo that will be hard to replicate in the HD era.

7th gen is also the generation the made most of the great francizes people associate with gaming these days: Mass Effect, Assassins Creed, Uncharted, Last of Us, Gear of War, Bioshock, Far Cry 3 - which became the pattern for most open world shooters even to this day, Modern Fallout 3/New Vegas, Oblivion + Skyrim the insane RPG combo that made fantasy RPGs mainstream, Dragon Age, Witcher, Batman Arkham games - which led to that type of combat of jumping sticky between enemies so popular. It was also the gen that gave us some decent GTA clones finally, like Saints Row 2/3, Sleeping Dogs, Crackdown 1 (its a dead genre now, everybody awaits GTA6).

Even gems that we dont get in the same genre anymore, stuff like Condemned or The Darkness.

It was also the gen of great no bs 6-8h games which arent made today, stuff like Prey (2006), TimeShift, Singularity, Legendary. Straight to the point games that can be finished over the weekend with no bloat.

The 7th gen is the best and theres no way anyone can tell me otherwise. I would take the grey/brown gritty shooters from the early days of the gen (which is considered by many the bad part of it) over the zoomer hip cartoonie activism shit like Hyenas, FairGame$, new Saints Row, Redfall etc.

PS360 is GOATED.
 
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Zug

Member
Best gaming period from my point of view is the 95-2005 decade, huge technical and gameplay innovations and diversity on both consoles and PCs.
Many many games today are still built on the foundations of this decade.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
It peaked in 7th gen, the best combination of good modern controls and graphics that for the most part still stand the test of time and forever will but also with innovation and taking risks with new francises. The best combo that will be hard to replicate in the HD era.

7th gen is also the generation the made most of the great francizes people associate with gaming these days: Mass Effect, Assassins Creed, Uncharted, Last of Us, Gear of War, Bioshock, Far Cry 3 - which became the pattern for most open world shooters even to this day, Modern Fallout 3/New Vegas, Oblivion + Skyrim the insane RPG combo that made fantasy RPGs mainstream, Dragon Age, Witcher, Batman Arkham games - which led to that type of combat of jumping sticky between enemies so popular. It was also the gen that gave us some decent GTA clones finally, like Saints Row 2/3, Sleeping Dogs, Crackdown 1 (its a dead genre now, everybody awaits GTA6).

Even gems that we dont get in the same genre anymore, stuff like Condemned or The Darkness.

It was also the gen of great no bs 6-8h games which arent made today, stuff like Prey (2006), TimeShift, Singularity, Legendary. Straight to the point games that can be finished over the weekend with no bloat.

The 7th gen is the best and theres no way anyone can tell me otherwise. I would take the grey/brown gritty shooters from the early days of the gen (which is considered by many the bad part of it) over the zoomer hip cartoonie activism shit like Hyenas, FairGame$, new Saints Row, Redfall etc.

PS360 is GOATED.
Well, you kinda hit the nail on the head there - games started following a pattern alright. A pattern that has continued for more than a decade now. All the creativity is gone and all that people seem to care about these days is better tech.
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
For most people, it's the one they grew up with. 6th gen doesn't come close to 4th gen.
That kinda sounds logical but in this case it's not the nostalgia speaking. I never even had any of those consoles as a kid. I had a shitty old PC that literally blew up one day when I was 14 and because I was raised in literal poverty, the next gaming system that I was able to buy was PS3 when I was old enough to work for my own money.

I only managed to catch up on all those 6th gen games when I was in my early twenties and I still think that these are some of the greatest video games of all time.
 
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Dynasty8

Member
PS2, Xbox, Gamecube era was legit game changers.

But if we're talking visually, I think it peaked during the last gen with the PS4/Xbox One era. Many games today still look kind of similar to games released last gen... the real issue comes down to performance.

I don't think we will ever see those big visual leaps from 16 bit to 64 or 64 to 128. Maybe once every few years we'll see something insane and revolutionary from Rockstar (GTA6), but those will be games that have been in development for 7-10 years.
 

YuLY

Member
Well, you kinda hit the nail on the head there - games started following a pattern alright. A pattern that has continued for more than a decade now. All the creativity is gone and all that people seem to care about these days is better tech.
Yep, but it shouldnt be that generation's fault (7th) that devs are risk averse now. For its time it was pretty innovative, we got stuff like Mirror's Edge, Bioshock, AC2, Batman Arkham, Oblivion/Skyrim, Gears/Uncharted etc, literally all of these games are different genres and/or styles. We have to give props to that gen for that.

I even forgot to mention Modern Warfare, yes its tired now and COD has be the same for over a decade, but again, the gen is the gen, for it's time MW was phenomenal and a huge change from all the WW2 shooters we got in the 6th genre. I mean i like MOHAA and RTCW like the next guy, but we needed a change.
 
For most people, it's the one they grew up with. 6th gen doesn't come close to 4th gen.
I think it also depends on the genres you tend to like. The 4th Gen was my first but I don’t really like most 2d games or turn-based rpgs (or anything turn-based really) so it’s definitely not my favorite. Similarly, I don’t tend to like open world games so most modern AAA stuff doesn’t appeal to me. Kinda leaves me with 6th/7th as my de facto favorites from a console perspective (pc gaming is different).
 

nial

Gold Member
That kinda sounds logical but in this case it's not the nostalgia speaking. I never even had any of those consoles as a kid. I had a shitty old PC that literally blew up one day when I was 14 and because I was raised in literal poverty, the next gaming system that I was able to buy was PS3 when I was old enough to work for my own money.

I only managed to catch up on all those 6th gen games when I was in my early twenties and I still think that these are some of the greatest video games of all time.
Fair enough, I think gens 4-8 have been all great overall, except for the Xbox 360/PS3/Wii era, although DS and PSP were good.
 
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Drizzlehell

Banned
Yep, but it shouldnt be that generation's fault (7th) that devs are risk averse now. For its time it was pretty innovative, we got stuff like Mirror's Edge, Bioshock, AC2, Batman Arkham, Oblivion/Skyrim, Gears/Uncharted etc, literally all of these games are different genres and/or styles. We have to give props to that gen for that.

I even forgot to mention Modern Warfare, yes its tired now and COD has be the same for over a decade, but again, the gen is the gen, for it's time MW was phenomenal and a huge change from all the WW2 shooters we got in the 6th genre. I mean i like MOHAA and RTCW like the next guy, but we needed a change.
Yeah, I mean, I'm not saying that there was no innovation or interesting games whatsoever during that era. I absolutely loved all those games and still do. But thinking back on those times, I feel like there were far fewer Bioshocks and Batmans, and far more Modern Warfare, Halo, and Gears wannabes.
 

RoboFu

One of the green rats
But we're not talking about today. We're talking about an era when storytelling complimented the gameplay and not the other way around.
umm you do know those consoles can do FMV. add the storage tech of today with some new cart technology and there is no reason they couldnt have long FMV if wanted.. I wouldnt want that though. 🤢
 

SmokedMeat

Gamer™
Not sure I’d say it peaked, but there certainly were less risks taken afterwards in the AAA industry. These days AAA is entirely risk free, and games take forever to release due to expectations being increasingly higher.

Overall the indie scene is still producing amazing content and VR is bringing about fresh experiences.
 
imo It's either peaking now with ps5+psvr2 games/experiences being so epic, or it peaked before we added storage to consoles, so the games had to have polish from the start.
 

Edder1

Member
I don't know if peaked is the term I would use. But it was pretty much the last generation where video games took risks. AAA became ultra-safe in the 7th gen and most indie games started moving toward being a personal tarke on an established idea or genre. I think video games have better production quality now, but they're not nearly as creative as they were back then.
Internet is mainly to blame for this.
 

NickFire

Member
As much fun as I had back then, I'll take this current generation all day long. Hardly perfect, but the graphics, gameplay, connectivity and short load times for the 3 TB of games on my SSD top everything that came before (beyond nostalgic memories).
 

Drizzlehell

Banned
umm you do know those consoles can do FMV. add the storage tech of today with some new cart technology and there is no reason they couldnt have long FMV if wanted.. I wouldnt want that though. 🤢
Yeah, and look at how "great" the FMV experiment panned out. :messenger_tears_of_joy:

Shitty sub-144p quality video with live action footage that was cheesy at best and absolutely terrible and cheap in most cases. Yeah, that stuff was totally on par with PS2-era in-engine cutscenes and environmental storytelling.
 

Puscifer

Member
When budgets and development time didn't balloon as much as now. Oh you want a sequel this generation? Here you go. Now I have to wait for the next generation to have a sequel.
I brought this this up in another thread

" How long is this sustainable though? It's really blowing my mind a Silent Hill 2 remake is taking as much time as it took to develop 2 - 4, 3 entire games over a 4 year period."


This industry needs to halt the breaks on this, this isn't sustainable.

EDIT: Just to add that 2 took 40 people to make and 3 and 4, after they learned the hardware only took 20 people and they'd pull in people as needed.

Crazy to think how much time and manpower is going into SH2 Remake
 
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Drizzlehell

Banned
I brought this this up in another thread

" How long is this sustainable though? It's really blowing my mind a Silent Hill 2 remake is taking as much time as it took to develop 2 - 4, 3 entire games over a 4 year period."


This industry needs to halt the breaks on this, this isn't sustainable.
AI generated assets may improve this some time in the future if that UE5 presentation is anything to go by. And I honestly wouldn't worry about using AI because it will never replace the human touch but it can certainly improve efficiency of game development across the board.

Although I wouldn't count on triple-A publishers actually making any consumer-friendly decisions and reducing prices of new games for example. If anything they're just gonna double down on that shit and pocket the extra money that was saved on development costs. But at the very least maybe the time it takes to develop a triple-A game will be reduced.
 
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Humanity peaked in 6th gen.
Nailed it
boom smile GIF
 
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