• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Canada passed a carbon tax that will give most Canadians more money

https://www.theguardian.com/environ...-tax-that-will-give-most-canadians-more-money

Last week, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau announced that under the Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act, Canada will implement a revenue-neutral carbon tax starting in 2019, fulfilling a campaign pledge he made in 2015.
Justin Trudeau(@JustinTrudeau)​
Starting next spring, it’ll no longer be free to pollute in Canada. We’re putting a price on pollution in provinces that don’t yet have a plan to fight climate change. More on our plan to cut pollution, grow the economy & create jobs: https://t.co/VjCNOOKLVB
The federal carbon pollution price will start low at $20 per ton in 2019, rising at $10 per ton per year until reaching $50 per ton in 2022. The carbon tax will stay at that level unless the legislation is revisited and revised.
This is a somewhat modest carbon tax – after all, the social cost of carbon is many times higher – but it’s a higher carbon price than has been implemented in most countries. Moreover, a carbon tax doesn’t necessarily have to reflect the social cost of carbon. The question is whether it will be sufficiently high to meet the country’s climate targets.
Paris was a key motivator behind the Canadian carbon tax


Read more
The Preamble in the Act is worth reading. It begins by noting “there is broad scientific consensus that anthropogenic greenhouse gas emissions contribute to global climate change” (this is somewhat understated – carbon pollution is the dominant factor). It also notes that Canada is already feeling the impacts of climate change through factors like “coastal erosion, thawing permafrost, increases in heat waves, droughts and flooding, and related risks to critical infrastructures and food security.”
The Preamble also notes that in 1992, Canada signed the UNFCCC whose objectives include “the stabilization of greenhouse gas concentrations in the atmosphere at a level that would prevent dangerous anthropogenic interference with the climate system,” and that Canada ratified the Paris Agreement, whose aims include limiting global warming to less than 2°C above pre-industrial temperatures.
Canada’s Paris commitment requires cutting its carbon pollution by 30% below 2005 levels by 2030. Prior to the implementation of the carbon tax, its policies were rated Highly Insufficient to meet that goal. Instead Canada’s emissions were on track to fall only about 4% below 2005 levels by 2030. So, the carbon tax is an important policy to close that gap.

Some provinces already have carbon pricing in place
Several Canadian provinces have already implemented or plan to implement carbon pricing systems. British Columbia, Alberta, and Quebec already have such systems in place; the Canadian government noted that these provinces were “among the top performers in GDP growth across Canada in 2017.”
Provinces whose carbon prices meet the federal standards are already in compliance, so the new law won’t apply to them. Several other provinces (Northwest Territories, Nova Scotia, Prince Edward Island, Newfoundland and Labrador) have planned or proposed carbon pricing systems that will meet the federal requirements. The federal carbon tax will be applied to the remaining provinces.

Last week, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau announced that under the Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act, Canada will implement a revenue-neutral carbon tax starting in 2019, fulfilling a campaign pledge he made in 2015.
Justin Trudeau(@JustinTrudeau)​
Starting next spring, it’ll no longer be free to pollute in Canada. We’re putting a price on pollution in provinces that don’t yet have a plan to fight climate change. More on our plan to cut pollution, grow the economy & create jobs: https://t.co/VjCNOOKLVB
The federal carbon pollution price will start low at $20 per ton in 2019, rising at $10 per ton per year until reaching $50 per ton in 2022. The carbon tax will stay at that level unless the legislation is revisited and revised.
This is a somewhat modest carbon tax – after all, the social cost of carbon is many times higher – but it’s a higher carbon price than has been implemented in most countries. Moreover, a carbon tax doesn’t necessarily have to reflect the social cost of carbon. The question is whether it will be sufficiently high to meet the country’s climate targets.

Energy prices will rise
A $20/ton carbon tax translates into a 16.6 cent per gallon surcharge on gasoline. So, in 2022, the $50/ton carbon tax will increase Canadian gasoline prices by about 42 cents per gallon (11 cents per liter). For comparison, the average price of gasoline in Canada is $1.43 per liter, so that would be about an 8% gasoline price increase in 2022.
The price of coal would more than double, with a carbon tax surcharge of about $100 per ton in 2022. Natural gas prices will rise by about 10 cents per cubic meter in 2022 compared to current prices of around 13 cents per cubic meter – about a 75% increase. This will increase demand for cheaper carbon-free electricity. However, Canada already supplies about 60% of its electricity through hydroelectric generation and 16% from nuclear – only about 20–25% comes from fossil fuels.
For that reason, only 11% of Canada’s carbon pollution comes from generating electricity. The industrial sector is responsible for the biggest chunk of Canadian carbon pollution (40%). It will not be subjected to the carbon tax, but rather to an Output-Based Allocations system (similar to cap and trade).
But rebates will more than offset higher fuel costs
One key component of the federal carbon tax is that it’s revenue-neutral, similar to the policy proposal from Citizens’ Climate Lobby. All the taxed money will be distributed back to the provinces from which they were generated. The provinces will in turn rebate about 90% the revenues back to individual taxpayers. The rebates are anticipated to exceed the increased energy costs for about 70% of Canadian households.
For example, a Manitoba family will receive a $336 rebate in 2019 compared to its increased costs of $232. A similar family in Saskatchewan will receive $598 compared to its higher costs of $403. In Ontario, families will receive $300 to offset its $244 in carbon taxes. And in New Brunswick a $248 rebate more than offsets the average household cost of $202. The rebates will more than double by 2022 as the carbon tax rises, and the net financial benefit to households will grow over time.

The remaining 10% of the tax revenue will provide support to particularly affected sectors like schools, hospitals, small businesses, colleges, and indigenous communities. Diesel-fired electricity generation in remote communities and aviation fuel in the territories will receive full exemption from the carbon tax.
Climate change is expensive
The Canadian government recognizes that climate change impacts are expensive:
Climate change has already had financial impacts on Canada, and these costs will only continue to grow. In 2016, it was estimated that larger and more intense weather events will cost the federal Disaster Financial Assistance Arrangements program around $902 million each year. The health costs of extreme weather are estimated to be over $1.6 billion a year. The cost of property damages from climate change averaged $405 million per year between 1983 and 2008, but have risen dramatically to $1.8 billion a year since 2009. That number is expected to grow as high as $43 billion by 2050.
It would be cheaper to reduce those costs by slowing global warming than to pay for increasingly extreme weather damages. With this carbon tax, Canada is recognizing that reality, and in fact is offsetting the financial impact on its taxpayers by returning the revenue to households. This is an approach that studies have shown can boost the economy because disposable income rises due to the rebate exceeding increased energy costs for 70% of Canadians.
Justin Trudeau has shown great climate leadership in following through with this carbon tax. Hopefully Canadians will reward him in next year’s elections.
Note: this will be our final entry on Climate Consensus - the 97%. The Guardian has decided to discontinue its Science and Environment blogging networks. We would like to thank this great paper for hosting us over the past five years, and to our readers for making it a worthwhile and rewarding endeavor.
 
Last edited:
More money they will spend on price hikes.

Happened here in Australia. Tax our energy providers, they passed on the costs to the consumer. Canada has Hydro so the base energy cost is low. Maybe this works there, but I doubt it.
 

WaterAstro

Member
Haha fuck Alberta and Ontario.

Sad thing is that climate change isn't that impactful for Canada compared to US. We'll get forest fires, but US just gets cities annihilated. Miami is going underwater and spends hundreds of millions trying to keep the water out.
More money they will spend on price hikes.

Happened here in Australia. Tax our energy providers, they passed on the costs to the consumer. Canada has Hydro so the base energy cost is low. Maybe this works there, but I doubt it.
That's the point though. If gas costs more, people will look at less polluting alternatives. I do wonder what other items are considered polluters because even shampoo is a polluter with how palm oil is handled.

I would love it if beef was carbon taxed too.
 
There are no viable (meaning economically sensible for most people) alternatives to energy markets and certainly not beef and other high demand meats such as chicken.

Because Australian energy is now the world's most expensive, I am a guy who's built his own solar setup, complete with batteries. But only because I can get cheap/smuggled in materials from China. Tariffs have made it impossible to legally take advantage of global renewable pathways for individuals and local companies, as solar panels and batteries have hiked up in price recently.

All of this is being passed on to local consumers putting them further and further away from affordable alternatives. Meanwhile global multinational giants get all the benefits of taking advantage of all markets simultaneously. Taxing them locally is not enough, not even close. They just pass on the costs to the higher earning markets.
 
Last edited:

WaterAstro

Member
There are no viable (meaning economically sensible for most people) alternatives to energy markets and certainly not beef and other high demand meats such as chicken.

Because Australian energy is now the world's most expensive, I am a guy who's built his own solar setup, complete with batteries. But only because I can get cheap/smuggled in materials from China. Tariffs have made it impossible to legally take advantage of global renewable pathways for individuals and local companies, as solar panels and batteries have hiked up in price recently.

All of this is being passed on to local consumers putting them further and further away from affordable alternatives. Meanwhile global multinational giants get all the benefits of taking advantage of all markets simultaneously. Taxing them locally is not enough, not even close. They just pass on the costs to the higher earning markets.
Chicken is 80% less wasteful than beef. It's only beef that is the problem. Feed a cow 5 times than we do to a chicken for the same amount of meat.

Well, I certainly don't know much about how it works in Australia. The idea is simple. Carbon tax makes people aware of the polluters, then they change their ways. There won't be any technology that will save us. Only lifestyle changes. Money doesn't matter if we screwed up the world so much that we go extinct from killing each other over what's left.
 
Chicken is 80% less wasteful than beef. It's only beef that is the problem. Feed a cow 5 times than we do to a chicken for the same amount of meat.

Well, I certainly don't know much about how it works in Australia. The idea is simple. Carbon tax makes people aware of the polluters, then they change their ways. There won't be any technology that will save us. Only lifestyle changes. Money doesn't matter if we screwed up the world so much that we go extinct from killing each other over what's left.

We can only speak from the context of our respective living conditions. For everyone its different.

I can say that yes, breeding and harvesting chicken meat is much more efficient than cows, BUT, there is no viable way to change people's minds on this, much less ban certain foodstuffs. Here in Australia we have a huge local industry specialized in building world class outdoor barbecue and kitchen areas. Guess what gets cooked there 90% of the time? Yep, beef. The BBQ area and the yard are the quintissential part of the Australian lifestyle, even in big cities, most people live in suburbs and these houses have covered areas for outdoor eating.

So to do away with these things, you'd have to do away with entire cultures and countries. It's not gonna happen outside of invasions or mass extinction events.
 
Last edited:

Kagey K

Banned
Chicken is 80% less wasteful than beef. It's only beef that is the problem. Feed a cow 5 times than we do to a chicken for the same amount of meat.

Well, I certainly don't know much about how it works in Australia. The idea is simple. Carbon tax makes people aware of the polluters, then they change their ways. There won't be any technology that will save us. Only lifestyle changes. Money doesn't matter if we screwed up the world so much that we go extinct from killing each other over what's left.
Unfortunately for me my work didn’t move closer to me, so I still have to drive the same distance. My food costs went up dramatically because companies are adding the Carbon Tax on their delivery bills to offset the cost for them. In the end these taxes hurt the bottom end consumer and not the companies delivering the goods.

There is no amount of reasonable steps the end consumer can take to avoid the extra costs passed on to them.
 

DunDunDunpachi

Patient MembeR
Nice. Now Canadian corporations can import even more energy and even more industrial products from the USA, especially from our northern states like Minnesota and Michigan in order to avoid the penalties of the tax. Sucks for Canada, but great for us.
 

Duellist

Member
There is no fucking way that this government will be giving us back more that what we are going to be paying for this obvious tax grab scam. I cant believe people are falling for thi.......oh wait yes I can. Bullshit
 

Sakura

Member
Unfortunately I don't believe it will do a whole lot for fighting climate change. BC has had a carbon tax since 2008. Emissions have barely moved since the baseline of 2007.
Canada’s Paris commitment requires cutting its carbon pollution by 30% below 2005 levels by 2030.
If they are truly serious about meeting this goal, then it is going to take a hell of a lot more than things like this carbon tax. But the government and every body else knows that this goal won't be met.
 
I can get behind the idea if consumers had any choice at all. Like I can't choose to drive an electric car because there are none and there is no where to recharge. I've been waiting 15 years to buy an electric car.

charge more for natural gas which is cheaper than other alternatives. ok. So you want me to switch a gas furnace to an electric one. What if I rent because the housing market is shit and it's completely out of my hands? I can't choose what provides my electricity either. Can I install solar panels and cut myself off from the grid?
 
Top Bottom