A new console isn't going to save Xbox. None of those things you suggest is going to do it. They probably need to embrace third party status and focus on ensuring quality of the games they do have. Do that and maybe in a few years they could think of new hardware.Interesting video, it’s like reading a forum discussion, just without console warriors trying to trigger people. But I like that DF do this since it might wake up MS. Because as it is the platform is dying. I said awhile back that 2026 is too late for a new generation console and I stand by that, in 2026 Xbox as a console will be dead, that’s just how it is. If it can be resurrected depends on how the next console is.
And regarding game purchases, I for one has bought in total 1 game on Xbox this generation. Indie or AAA doesn’t matter. I play through Gamepass, if a game isn’t there I buy on PC. And now that I don’t have a Gamepass sub I have outright moved over to PC and Steam instead.
How can this be fixed?
3 steps is needed…
1. Exclusives
Real console exclusives.
It’s annoying as hell if you want to play elsewhere but it does work if you want people to buy games. Look at Sony’s numbers.
2. Delayed Gamepass release
Doesn’t have to be years, a couple months is enough. Even 1 month can be enough if combined with the point below.
3. Lower price day 1 and include bonus content
Instead of selling an expensive premium edition 5 days earlier, lower the price during 1 month and include bonus content. That way you catch both those who’re looking for a cheap entry point and those who like bonus content.
Why do people buy Playstation consoles?A new console isn't going to save Xbox. None of those things you suggest is going to do it. They probably need to embrace third party status and focus on ensuring quality of the games they do have. Do that and maybe in a few years they could think of new hardware.
Gamepass is a lost cause but they are in too deep at this point to drop it.
They are saying for Xbox to survive they should drop hardware and Gamepass and go third party publisher/developer only. It's a valid option to be honest.Edit: Also, why would third party status help them selling new hardware???
Makes no sense. You think Sony will sell more hardware if they start releasing their games on Xbox and do day 1 PC releases?
And Nintendo, you think they’ll sell more consoles too if Zelda, Mario, Metroid goes to all platforms?
Exclusivity matters. It’s that one thing that could save a platform when everything else goes wrong. Or kill it when it’s not there.
I know it simply by looking at my own actions. I don’t play MS games on Xbox anymore. I don’t play Sony games on Playstation anymore. But I do play Nintendo games on Nintendo consoles. If I definitely need a specific platform to play a game I really want to play, then I’ll invest in that platform.
Why do people buy Playstation consoles?
Because of console exclusives.
Interesting video, it’s like reading a forum discussion, just without console warriors trying to trigger people. But I like that DF do this since it might wake up MS. Because as it is the platform is dying. I said awhile back that 2026 is too late for a new generation console and I stand by that, in 2026 Xbox as a console will be dead, that’s just how it is. If it can be resurrected depends on how the next console is.
And regarding game purchases, I for one has bought in total 1 game on Xbox this generation. Indie or AAA doesn’t matter. I play through Gamepass, if a game isn’t there I buy on PC. And now that I don’t have a Gamepass sub I have outright moved over to PC and Steam instead.
How can this be fixed?
3 steps is needed…
1. Exclusives
Real console exclusives.
It’s annoying as hell if you want to play elsewhere but it does work if you want people to buy games. Look at Sony’s numbers.
2. Delayed Gamepass release
Doesn’t have to be years, a couple months is enough. Even 1 month can be enough if combined with the point below.
3. Lower price day 1 and include bonus content
Instead of selling an expensive premium edition 5 days earlier, lower the price during 1 month and include bonus content. That way you catch both those who’re looking for a cheap entry point and those who like bonus content.
It's over. Why do this to yourself?Interesting video, it’s like reading a forum discussion, just without console warriors trying to trigger people. But I like that DF do this since it might wake up MS. Because as it is the platform is dying. I said awhile back that 2026 is too late for a new generation console and I stand by that, in 2026 Xbox as a console will be dead, that’s just how it is. If it can be resurrected depends on how the next console is.
And regarding game purchases, I for one has bought in total 1 game on Xbox this generation. Indie or AAA doesn’t matter. I play through Gamepass, if a game isn’t there I buy on PC. And now that I don’t have a Gamepass sub I have outright moved over to PC and Steam instead.
How can this be fixed?
3 steps is needed…
1. Exclusives
Real console exclusives.
It’s annoying as hell if you want to play elsewhere but it does work if you want people to buy games. Look at Sony’s numbers.
2. Delayed Gamepass release
Doesn’t have to be years, a couple months is enough. Even 1 month can be enough if combined with the point below.
3. Lower price day 1 and include bonus content
Instead of selling an expensive premium edition 5 days earlier, lower the price during 1 month and include bonus content. That way you catch both those who’re looking for a cheap entry point and those who like bonus content.
Well, listening to Gaf is arguably the dumbest thing a company or developer can do.The big issue with Xbox as a brand is that a fan likely won't be able to figure out what's the business plan needed to fix it, and Xbox execs aren't innovative enough to find ways to truly change the game to one where they are on top (and when they do try, they flop hard, see Gamepass).
It sounds weird as fuck, I know, but their biggest problem has been listening too much to the Timdogs and NeoGAF posters while not actually looking at what gamer actions have been telling them for over a decade at this point.
If you look at how Phil Spencer spoke and acted throughout his tenure, you will see that he is firmly rooted in that console warrior mindset.Well, listening to Gaf is arguably the dumbest thing a company or developer can do.
So what you say makes sense.
Xbox has only sold close to 27-30 million series consoles. Thats not good for them. I don’t think Xbox should die, there’s plenty of good reasons for them to sell consoles. But they need to go back to their roots and sell 1 SKU that’s amazing and does things no other console can do.
I think the PS5 has proven that this is not the biggest factor because the PS5 is selling well while having the weakest first-party lineup (still) in Playstation history.Why do people buy Playstation consoles?
Because of console exclusives.
Xbox has only sold close to 27-30 million series consoles. Thats not good for them. I don’t think Xbox should die, there’s plenty of good reasons for them to sell consoles. But they need to go back to their roots and sell 1 SKU that’s amazing and does things no other console can do.
Richard Leadbetter has been doing this sort of gaming analysis work and reporting for over 20 years.3 guys who never developed a game in their life nor worked as a game developer in a big studio talking about how difficult it is to develop games for xbox... LMAO cant make this shit up
I think they have way more expertise than 90% of the people that comment on this forum or twitter.3 guys who never developed a game in their life nor worked as a game developer in a big studio talking about how difficult it is to develop games for xbox... LMAO cant make this shit up
I think that cumulative damage to Xbox is done already (especially brand erosion outside of US and the digital library factor), so the only way to save face and earn money is to embrace 3rd part and stop posturing about hardware.
Xbox will get there eventually, but for corporate culture that Phil created it's very hard to admit defeats. Hence the silly words from Bond about biggest leap in hardware history.
There is also a fact that Dragon Ball: Sparking Zero by BamCo was delisted from Xbox Store 2 weeks ago without any word from the MS or the Bandai, so at least some publishers are already skipping the platform, I guess.
Or, it will be the biggest leap. Technically. Because they will transform Xbox to custom PC sticker. Just imagine Alienware Xbox with 5090.I guess the biggest leap comment will only look silly if it's not the biggest leap.
It’s not a valid option, it’ll kill Xbox as a platform. They could possibly do like Sony and keep releasing their exclusives later on other platforms. But even that is a risk, I don’t play on Playstation today because of the PC ports, my PS5 is a bluray player now.They are saying for Xbox to survive they should drop hardware and Gamepass and go third party publisher/developer only. It's a valid option to be honest.
As I said Gamepass needs to be reworked, it needs be worse there than buying, delayed releases, and as I said they can add content when you buy. They were on the right track with the early premium editions, I went in like that for Starfield (but on Steam but that’s the PC day 1 thing). Making games more expensive is dumb, they should have a lower price and bonus content 1st month when you purchase.This is definitely an element or a factor, but I think it's actually not true.
People generally buy PlayStation because of an ecosystem: The controller, PSN, their game library.
There isn't much Microsoft can do at this point to turn the tide on that.
- Would be difficult to replicate the PS controller without alienating core Xbox fans.
- You can't replicate PSN: Trophies, game saves, friends lists
- You can't import a game library
Even the part you mentioned about exclusives is difficult to impossible to replicate. Sony has spent decades building its 1st party studios, to the point where they've attempted the ability for these studios to be able to work on more than one project at a time and even that has seen struggles.
Microsoft can't put nearly as much into studios and projects because the returns aren't there and GamePass destroys that calculus as well. This is something Jim Ryan warned about but was largely mocked about.
If Microsoft were to put 200 million into a game, there is almost no way they get a return out of that game with the game being on GamePass. Especially if it is a single-player non-GaaS game. So that boat has sailed. This is particularly troublesome for original IP.
In the last generation Sony came out with Ghost of Tsushima, Bloodborne, Day's Gone, and you can even give them the nod for Detroit Become Human. Add Spider-Man to that list and it just gets a bit ridiculous.
Microsoft hasn't had a single success in this arena at even the level of Bloodborne or Detroit Become Human. They also rebooted God of War. Even if Microsoft partnered with Quantic Dream, their games wouldn't sell nearly as well without the backing of Sony.
Microsoft generally hasn't come out with a worthwhile single player franchise since Gears of War on the 360 and that was made by Epic. The franchise launched in 2006... That's nearly 20 years without a flagship IP.
DF continues to push the console war and reject the notion that it is over. You can see how sad puppy John Linneman is here. GamePass and PC GamePass destroyed Xbox.
Delayed Gamepass releases will be accepted when there is no alternative. People will moan for 2 weeks and then preorder the games on the store instead, especially if they add content you can’t get on Gamepass.I guess that depends on what you paid for gamepass. If you paid $15 for 3 years, plus the one game, that's equivelent to buying $600 in games. (9 games) Even if you paid half that, it's $300 on games (4.5 games) at the consoles half life which really isn't that bad. The ps4 for instance had a console attach rate of 9.6 per console sold. That would put it in the same ballpark.
I have had gamepass all along, but I still buy some games. Mostly a few months after they come out, but still a purchase.
As to your points, they really aren't wrong, except I'm not sure a delayed gamepass would be accepted at this point. If they lose 70% of thier subs, and one of the biggest selling points for this gen, would it still be worth it?
As to lower prices on games, I'm on board with that, same with no paid early release.
I don’t do anything to myself I already play everything on PC, this is about how to not bury Xbox as a platform like MS are currently doing with their crap decisions. I understand that they try to spread out to handhelds too now. That’ll likely fail too without the changes I listed.It's over. Why do this to yourself?
Third party games were there on Xbox as well and people still bought a Playstation instead. It’s because of the exclusives. And as said, now that the exclusives are on PC I jumped the ship just like I did with Xbox. But Sony still use delays to lure people in. For their sake, let’s hope they don’t change that.I think the PS5 has proven that this is not the biggest factor because the PS5 is selling well while having the weakest first-party lineup (still) in Playstation history.
People buy Playstation mostly because all of the third-parties will be there. And that has actually been one of the core business pillars of Playstation since day one.
And nowdays, also being locked into the Playstation ecosystem plays a significant role.
The biggest problem with this is: What if they make a 10/10 fully exclusive game and people still don't buy into their platform?Yeah, like play an exclusive game that can't be played anywhere else. I agree with all of Fredrik 's points about the steps MS would need to take to return to a healthy console ecosystem, but if anyone thinks or hopes they're actually going to do all that, it's delusional. They're on a different path now.
I think the PS5 has proven that this is not the biggest factor because the PS5 is selling well while having the weakest first-party lineup (still) in Playstation history.
People buy Playstation mostly because all of the third-parties will be there. And that has actually been one of the core business pillars of Playstation since day one.
And nowdays, also being locked into the Playstation ecosystem plays a significant role.
It's futile though. There is no coming back.I don’t do anything to myself I already play everything on PC, this is about how to not bury Xbox as a platform like MS are currently doing wity their crap decisions. I understand that they try to spread out to handhelds too now. That’ll likely too without the changes I listed.
Anecdotical, yes, but I personally know two people that are not gamers but bought PS5 just to play Genshin and Star Rail on a bigger screen with a controller.Those games are bigger than anything on the XBOX exclusive catalog.
The biggest problem with this is: What if they make a 10/10 fully exclusive game and people still don't buy into their platform?
At this stage it's clearly much better to just start off the process of gamemaking with 3P in mind.
Nintendo changed the game completely with a massive risk that paid off (Nintendo Switch).I disagree that it is so far gone to ever come back. Even Nintendo came back from Wii U. The problems can be sorted, they just lack the awareness or competence to do so. The only way left to solve the problem is to sidestep it by doing what they do best instead, being a third party software company.
Of course it's a valid option, yes, as a platform that wouldn't exist any more, but XBox is more than just a platform, they are a publisher and game developer. Sega still exists due to games rather than platform. And I still play on PS5 so I don't have to wait 1-2 (or more) years to play their big exclusives, it's been a bit of a drought from the heavy hitters but that's about to change second half of the gen.It’s not a valid option, it’ll kill Xbox as a platform. They could possibly do like Sony and keep releasing their exclusives later on other platforms. But even that is a risk, I don’t play on Playstation today because of the PC ports, my PS5 is a bluray player now.
1. They had 3ds along with Wii U to support the company. Even Nintendo came back from Wii U.
Xbox isn't Nintendo though.I disagree that it is so far gone to ever come back. Even Nintendo came back from Wii U. The problems can be sorted, they just lack the awareness or competence to do so. The only way left to solve the problem is to sidestep it by doing what they do best instead, being a third party software company.
Disagree with most of this.Nintendo changed the game completely with a massive risk that paid off (Nintendo Switch).
They also had a fuckton of brand equity because even during the Wii U days they didn't lose a step in game design.
Microsoft simply doesn't have the IP or brand equity that Nintendo has, and they barely take any real risks since the Xbox One failed.
What if Returnal sold like 500k? Oh wait, it did. Maybe it’s at a million now, haven’t seen numbers. But do you see Sony close the studio or stop doing exclusives? No. They know that exclusives is why you buy into their ecosystem. It doesn’t even matter that they haven’t released that many new 1st party games yet, people still invest because they know the games will come, eventually. Same thing with Nintendo.The biggest problem with this is: What if they make a 10/10 fully exclusive game and people still don't buy into their platform?
At this stage it's clearly much better to just start off the process of gamemaking with 3P in mind.
No, Xbox is a platform, nothing more or less, and that’ll die through a 3rd party publisher move.XBox is more than just a platform, they are a publisher and game developer.
They just literally spent SEVENTY BILLION DOLLARS on ONE game studio...Microsoft can't put nearly as much into studios and projects because the returns aren't there and GamePass destroys that calculus as well
There is some overlap with pc players buying consoles just for exclusives, but majority of console gamers don't give a shit about pc and only choose between ps and xbox.Third party games were there on Xbox as well and people still bought a Playstation instead. It’s because of the exclusives. And as said, now that the exclusives are on PC I jumped the ship just like I did with Xbox. But Sony still use delays to lure people in. For their sake, let’s hope they don’t change that.
Xbox is the same phase where PC was in 2006-2010, where many developers did not consider PC ports and skip PC release but now PC is the first priority.
Things changed due to multi reason for PC.
1) Steam going digital.
2) MS shifting from DX9 to DX11 in 2009
3) AMD and Nvidia drastically changed their GPU architecture.
4) Going to 64 bits.
5) Intel and AMD going multi core CPUs.
6) Slowly all the porting shifted on PC
7) AMD made all console architecture similar to PC.
My point is that were multi companies involved to chuck out PC from worse phase 2006-2010 to now Golden era but Xbox does not have that luxury unless developers shift their focus totally on Xbox.
And it was probably BamCo.“The phrase one major company who released a big game last year said [was], ‘I don’t know why we bothered supporting it’."