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[Zacfoldor]

I don't want this to sound harsh but make the women hot or we will find someone who will. Gamers have the buying power and we are organized and we have people who will make the games that we want.

It's not made up. It is real. It's not going away. It will not swing back in the other direction. Do it or someone else will. Devs and publishers need to accept this quicker.

 

[Bojji]

I'm just saying there is a huge difference between in game rendering and an AI generated/photo/CGI character

In fact, I bet if you ray/path traced those scenes with RT lighting/GI with Faye the character would look prettier (you even get better characters being rendered out in photo modes many times as they don't care about framerate and can cut out the animation etc)

Kojima with no RT:

 

[Mozza]

Going back too this, they act like every man looks at women like this...

When in reality, it's always the uggos that talk about "the male gaze."

They're just big mad they don't get any gaze at all.

That's not just a leer... It's a king Lear..

 

[Mozza]

If, according to the comments I'm reading here, the purpose of a video game is based on the attractiveness of the characters, both male and female, I'm seriously starting to doubt whether this is the right place for me.

What were you doing back in the SNES, Genesis, and PSX era?

There was no way to find anything attractive in those polygonally ugly characters.

But I thought we enjoyed games for their gameplay, their story, even their art design.

But I see people looking for something that eludes me, or at least my mind won't let me grasp it.

I can even understand people who are against agenda-setting and DEI policies, although most anti-DEI or woke users have played a ton of woke games.

But the idea of looking for attractive characters as the incentive to play I didn't expect that in the lore of this forum.

The arguments you present are so self defeating... I think this is the perfect place for you.

 

[Three]

PS4 Naughty Dog games (and many others) supported SSS (you have this option in every other game now). This is PS5/PS5 Pro exclusive, what are we talking about?

Ok? Naughty dog are one of the best technical studios out there, Uncharted 4 still looks better than a lot of current gen games. They have very good character models but they're not real people or face scans at all to compare.

The problem is that Gonzo tried to tip everything to make GoW look as bad as possible. HFW and especially DS2 are renown as having some of the best character models in games today. They're the pinnacle of it. That's their tech more than anything, GoW models have always looked waxy and you can already see it in GOW 2018 and Ragnarok too.

He went for best character models in games today and from a promotional poster for DS2, vs cherry picked screenshot with bitch face looking goofy up against an actress photo from a decade ago. in bad faith just about sums that up.

It's like me doing this

And then claiming Japanese devs alter their face scans to make them ugly/like a man. That's Ariana Damant btw.

Update your engine/change it to Decima/UE5 and don't serve us this crap. But I think engine is not the problem here

It absolutely is the problem especially the images he's sharing showing the lighting when Faye is flying through the air. It's a completely waxy look to the model. I imagine because it's the gameplay model and they don't switch to cutscene settings.

 

[Skeeter49]

Hope they make no changes to how she looks whatsoever. A. She looks fine. B. This idea that a character needs to meet a certain attractiveness whether they're male, female, or any of the many other ways people may identify as. Thankfully games like this and Witcher 4 will sell really well because most sane men don't care about this stuff and will gladly buy these types of games, we'll get more games like them, and the actual agenda pushing from the people who cry agenda pushing from the other side will never have their way.

 

[GermanZepp]

The hairline in the forehead looks off and weird. ( like it is a wig glued), and her skin could be nicer, it has too much ulgy pores. She is very beautiful in real life.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Why does every female have to be attractive?

Why does every female have to be an uggo the past 10-15 years in the west?

If you had a choice to spend money on a total dime and be rewarded or spend money on a total dog... 99% of the world would choose beauty at first glance. It's hardwired in our biology and DNA.

But this goes beyond just making a character ugly... they are purposely replacing well established beautiful characters (MJ with the feminist dev self-insert in SM2) or the tweaking the real life actresses themselves with an ugly filter (examples shown in this very thread).

That's a whole new level of sinister.

 

[Three]

China, Korea, and most Japanese devs have zero issue making attractive characters without developer plastic surgery.

Look at my post on DMC5. Most Japanese and Korean devs don't even use face scanned models.

 

[violence]

Yeah, it's one thing making a new game and doing this. They're injecting their ideology created by unsuccessful people into a successful product. This is commercial art.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Look at my post on DMC5. Most Japanese and Korean devs don't even use face scanned models.

Good. But when they do use face scanned, they don't uglify them in current year like the west does. Which as I said above, is sinister as fuck.

 

[realcool]

Why does Debra Wilson's character model always look like Debra Wilson?

 

[Kacho]

The arguments you present are so self defeating... I think this is the perfect place for you.

he won't last long at this rate. Reminds me of ecosse_011172.

 

[Giallo Corsa]

Man, this has to be a Toons alt/sock account at this point

 

[DeepEnigma]

Why does Debra Wilson's character model always look like Debra Wilson?

 

[bbeach123]

The youtube video Introducing Faye thumbnail, ew .

 

[Skeeter49]

Why does Debra Wilson's character model always look like Debra Wilson?

Until we see Debra Wilson double jumping, I don't support double jumping in this game.

 

[midnightAI]

Kojima with no RT:

And? That doesn't change anything I have said, if those scenes had better RT lighting/GI those characters would look prettier. Also some scenes are much easier to do fake lighting on than others, that's why on many games characters look better or worse depending on the scene.

(you also have some Devs who are just masters at character rendering, lighting etc., Kojima, Naughty Dog, Ninja Theory, Guerrilla (even though some say Aloy is ugly but I disagree) are the ones that come to mind, but I, unlike you, don't see Faye as a bad looking character at all)

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

If, according to the comments I'm reading here, the purpose of a video game is based on the attractiveness of the characters, both male and female, I'm seriously starting to doubt whether this is the right place for me.

What were you doing back in the SNES, Genesis, and PSX era?

There was no way to find anything attractive in those polygonally ugly characters.

But I thought we enjoyed games for their gameplay, their story, even their art design.

But I see people looking for something that eludes me, or at least my mind won't let me grasp it.

I can even understand people who are against agenda-setting and DEI policies, although most anti-DEI or woke users have played a ton of woke games.

But the idea of looking for attractive characters as the incentive to play I didn't expect that in the lore of this forum.

I've yet to see a single person say they are out because she's fugly. And you know what else we had back then in the 90s? The ability to have conversation and discussions with out people obviously bothered when folks have differing viewpoints. It's litrelly... A conversation.. Why can't people handle this anymore? What fucking world do I live in?

The whole dramatics of "oh I don't think this is the place for me" is so lame man like really, step back and realize we're talking about video games it isn't that dire

 

[mopspear]

 

[nemiroff]

99% of the world would choose beauty at first glance. It's hardwired in our biology and DNA.

Choosing someone to fuck vs being immersed in a particular story/universe for escapism is two different things in my opinion. But maybe that's just me.

I mean, tbf, if it's a dating sim, I'd choose a sexy bitch any time, that's true.

 

[reezoo]

Guys guys, Its just lighting and wierd angles that is making Faye look off. Trust our boy Kratos, he knocked up a good one!

 

[Saber]

I'm not offended at all; I enjoy the debate.

But I thought I was dealing with reasonable people.

After this stupid talk of thinking this place isn't for yah, I don't believe you at all.
Unless you clarify why you made that silly remark, you are preciselly what Giallo Corsa described. Incredibly shallow argument comparing pixel with advanced technology supposed to make visuals better.

Choosing someone to fuck vs being immersed in a particular story/universe for escapism is two different things in my opinion. But maybe that's just me.

I mean, tbf, if it's a dating sim, I'd choose a sexy bitch any time, that's true.

Once again beauty and sex are different things. One can find someone beauty without being sexually attracted to that person.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Choosing someone to fuck vs being immersed in a particular story/universe for escapism is two different things in my opinion. But maybe that's just me.

I mean, tbf, if it's a dating sim, I'd choose a sexy bitch any time, that's true.

I never said anything about fucking. People throwing that around is a them problem.

Most gamers play games for escapism, as they do with watching movies and shows. Fantasy, attractive characters to look at since we are all visual creatures, etc..

Staring at a constant stream of duff and mid "everyday Joe's" is an antithesis to that.

And I will say it again, intentionally making attractive actresses ugly is sinister.

 

[Three]

Good. But when they do use face scanned, they don't uglify them in current year like the west does. Which as I said above, is sinister as fuck.

Are you suggesting they uglified them in the past? No man, even today if you were to do what people are doing in the thread it would be the same.

You can take screenshots of games today like this:

and repeatedly say in threads "omg it's gollum, it's gollum, look at what Julia Pratt really looks like"

People don't do that though because they don't have any preconceived opinions or hate for "Japanese devs".

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

Choosing someone to fuck vs being immersed in a particular story/universe for escapism is two different things in my opinion. But maybe that's just me.

I mean, tbf, if it's a dating sim, I'd choose a sexy bitch any time, that's true.

I still say go back and find all female characters in moves and shows etc even games where if it was pixels they did have an art style drawn of the character somewhere and they all were what most would consider attractive in general.

Again the jokes aside it isn't about fucking them, like I've said I play the msnliest dude ever 100% if I can pick... I just prefer to see a female look like a female can, girls like to dull themselves up and there's nothing wrong with that so just seeing it translated in games is a no brainer to me.

Now I will say maybe she gets a slight pass given she was dead but that image I posted I think can still achieve both.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Are you suggesting they uglified them in the past? No man, even today if you were to do what people are doing in the thread it would be the same.

You can take screenshots of games today like this:

and repeatedly say in threads "omg it's gollum, it's gollum, look at what Julia Pratt really looks like"

People don't do that though because they don't have any preconceived opinions or hate for "Japanese devs".

You are diving into the intellectually dishonest territory and you know it.

You're better than this.

 

[Three]

You are diving into the intellectually dishonest territory and you know it.

You're better than this.

How so? The people who are intellectualy dishonest are those who do things like this in the first place. Which is what is happening here. Cherry picked ingame shots where the engine has not RT lighting so they pick those unflattering screenshots and claim they don't match the actor. It's a 1 for 1 example of what is happening.

 

[nemiroff]

Once again beauty and sex are different things. One can find someone beauty without being sexually attracted to that person.

Exactly. That was my implied point, hence why I put in an example with a dating, tongue-in-cheek. The irony here is that the devs used actual photogrammetry. If a real person doesn't fit someone's standard of "beauty", that's an issue with their expectations, not the game. I don't want to fuck her, but she still represents natural beauty. (disregarding graphical flaws and selective screenshots)

 

[Fbh]

Again: You are talking about profesional photographs and productions with makeup, hairdos, under specific lighting, etc. And most even are from years ago, not how she looks currently. Much less how her *character* would look like as a scandinavian woman in her 40's without makeup.

The character model is not the most realistic compared to other videogames, but neither is Kratos, who has a much weirder face and doesn't look like any of his actors. But that's ok because you don't feel the need to fantasize about fucking him.

Most people don't go to movies, TV and games for realism.
GOW is a series about gods, fantasy races with magical powers and greater than life characters. Why would I want the main character to look like a sacandinavian woman in her 40's without makeup? That's not even her character, she is a centuries old woman from a magical fantasy race.

An no, it doesn't just apply to women. Movies, TV and Games have always tended to presented an idealized and heightened version of reality, where aesthetics often take priority over realism. You think Russell Crowe in Gladiator didn't have a makeup team? They had him sleep on the floor and then just put him in costume as soon as he woke up? lol.

You think Hugh Jackman got his role in The Greatest Showman for his striking resemblance to P.T Barnum?

Are you upset the design of Kratos looks closer to the left than the right? That's not very realistic though!!!!

 

[laynelane]

Interesting. It's also illuminating to see that the researcher immediately disagreed with what women themselves were choosing, believing that women must have been brainwashed into making the wrong choice. It must be nurture, it really can't be, shouldn't be in their nature to want to be pretty and feel sexy!! Why can't these damn women conform to our 21st century liberal ideals of what a women should be!

Yeah, I noticed what the researcher was doing too. Certain activists have long made women into their battle ground and they're often the ones who care the least or not at all about what actual women think or feel. You see it in female video game characters stripped of feminine traits (physically, emotionally, etc.) and the explanation that it was done to appeal to women. The shitty part is that women, who have nothing to do with this ideological bullshit, get conflated with it and blamed for the deterioration it causes in games, movies, etc., as well.

 

[user friendly]

The hairline in the forehead looks off and weird. ( like it is a wig glued), and her skin could be nicer, it has too much ulgy pores. She is very beautiful in real life.

The hairline is definitely not helping the overall look.

 

[Three]

(you also have some Devs who are just masters at character rendering, lighting etc., Kojima, Naughty Dog, Ninja Theory, Guerrilla (even though some say Aloy is ugly but I disagree) are the ones that come to mind, but I, unlike you, don't see Faye as a bad looking character at all)

Ninja theory, Guerrilla and Kojima all use 3Lateral tech which just goes to show you how much of a difference it makes.

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

Exactly. That was my implied point, hence why I put in an example with a dating, tongue-in-cheek. The irony here is that the devs used actual photogrammetry. If a real person doesn't fit someone's standard of "beauty", that's an issue with their expectations, not the game. I don't want to fuck her, but she still represents natural beauty. (disregarding graphical flaws and selective screenshots)

But let me pose this question and again it's not like my wife is the be all end all but I'm curious of an opinion, she's not a gamer but she gets it and she's not bias one way or another but I did this before with Kay Vess asking my wife her opinion but for Faye here I explained and showed her the actress, and then the game rendition and her reply was "oh my god"... I mean from your stance why would that be the reaction? What does that tell someone? Is my main question.

 

[DeepEnigma]

How so? The people who are intellectualy dishonest are those who do things like this in the first place. Which is what is happening here. Cherry picked ingame shots where the engine has not RT lighting so they pick those unflattering screenshots and claim they don't match the actor. It's a 1 for 1 example of what is happening.

Compare both cinematic models.

Grace is a total dime in the game.

Vasty majority of the western AAA models scanned (outside of Deborah Wilson, I wonder why that is?) are altered in the uggo direction if the real life model is beautiful. Even their self-creations are hit with the ugly stick compared to the east the past 10 years.

 

[Clear]

Staring at a constant stream of duff and mid "everyday Joe's" is an antithesis to that.

Got to disagree with you. I loved the Original Nier (Gestalt), probably the single most impactful gaming experience of my life, and the main character in that is fucking hideous!

Not to say that ugly art-direction can't be a deal breaker, just that fixating on the looks of a lead character seems like a bit of a red herring.

And I will say it again, intentionally making attractive actresses ugly is sinister.

I think that depends on what you mean by uglification. If a character's face is animated, particularly if its been mo-capped, then being able to cherry-pick terrible shots is a gimme. On the other hand creating a static "pretty" face is much safer, as then its only lighting you need to worry about as its essentially just a mask.

I have zero issue with the way Debbie Woll is portrayed in Laufey. Its just a largely "natural" look for a woman of her age. Which again is appropriate for the story as she has an 11 year old kid!

De-aging her 20 years and lighting her like an instagram model I don't think would add any value, and objectively would add a ton of work.

Besides, where were the people bitching about this when Hellblade 2 came out ? Tone's a bit different, but the worlds are close enough, and I didn't see anyone moan about that actress being uglified despite being permanently caked in shit!

 

[Gonzito]

You are diving into the intellectually dishonest territory and you know it.

You're better than this.

He is extremely dishonest and mastermind manipulator

Are you suggesting they uglified them in the past? No man, even today if you were to do what people are doing in the thread it would be the same.

You can take screenshots of games today like this:

and repeatedly say in threads "omg it's gollum, it's gollum, look at what Julia Pratt really looks like"

People don't do that though because they don't have any preconceived opinions or hate for "Japanese devs".

This is a graphical issue. The character looks good 99% of the time especially during cutscenes unlike the God of War actress which looks terrible during cutscenes due to how bad they butchered the character model

This is a CUTSCENE, learn the difference

Nobody is falling for your weak ass arguments my man

 

[user friendly]

 

[DeepEnigma]

Got to disagree with you. I loved the Original Nier (Gestalt), probably the single most impactful gaming experience of my life, and the main character in that is fucking hideous!

Not to say that ugly art-direction can't be a deal breaker, just that fixating on the looks of a lead character seems like a bit of a red herring.



I think that depends on what you mean by uglification. If a character's face is animated, particularly if its been mo-capped, then being able to cherry-pick terrible shots is a gimme. On the other hand creating a static "pretty" face is much safer, as then its only lighting you need to worry about as its essentially just a mask.

I have zero issue with the way Debbie Woll is portrayed in Laufey. Its just a largely "natural" look for a woman of her age. Which again is appropriate for the story as she has an 11 year old kid!

De-aging her 20 years and lighting her like an instagram model I don't think would add any value, and objectively would add a ton of work.

Besides, where were the people bitching about this when Hellblade 2 came out ? Tone's a bit different, but the worlds are close enough, and I didn't see anyone moan about that actress being uglified despite being permanently caked in shit!

There are always exceptions to the norm. That is why they are outliers. I too have those very games as well, but also notice that almost every game now (in the west) has been ideologically driven and artificial.

This does not exist in a vacuum, from my understanding of this thread, we are talking about the industry at large the past decade or so and not so much this game, it's just the recent example in the entire western portfolio of them the past decade.

People are straight up lying if they say there's no pattern.

Best girl !!

 

[Bojji]

Ok? Naughty dog are one of the best technical studios out there, Uncharted 4 still looks better than a lot of current gen games. They have very good character models but they're not real people or face scans at all to compare.

The problem is that Gonzo tried to tip everything to make GoW look as bad as possible. HFW and especially DS2 are renown as having some of the best character models in games today. They're the pinnacle of it. That's their tech more than anything, GoW models have always looked waxy and you can already see it in GOW 2018 and Ragnarok too.

He went for best character models in games today and from a promotional poster for DS2, vs cherry picked screenshot with bitch face looking goofy up against an actress photo from a decade ago. in bad faith just about sums that up.

It's like me doing this

And then claiming Japanese devs alter their face scans to make them ugly/like a man. That's Ariana Damant btw.



It absolutely is the problem especially the images he's sharing showing the lighting when Faye is flying through the air. It's a completely waxy look to the model. I imagine because it's the gameplay model and they don't switch to cutscene settings.

I would say actress is not exactly a beauty with that weird face:

And DMC5 supports SSS:

And? That doesn't change anything I have said, if those scenes had better RT lighting/GI those characters would look prettier. Also some scenes are much easier to do fake lighting on than others, that's why on many games characters look better or worse depending on the scene.

(you also have some Devs who are just masters at character rendering, lighting etc., Kojima, Naughty Dog, Ninja Theory, Guerrilla (even though some say Aloy is ugly but I disagree) are the ones that come to mind, but I, unlike you, don't see Faye as a bad looking character at all)

Most of the shots of Faye are from the cutscenes or not controlled gameplay segments, they can fake the lighting how they want.

Are you suggesting they uglified them in the past? No man, even today if you were to do what people are doing in the thread it would be the same.

You can take screenshots of games today like this:

and repeatedly say in threads "omg it's gollum, it's gollum, look at what Julia Pratt really looks like"

People don't do that though because they don't have any preconceived opinions or hate for "Japanese devs".

PT:

This is example of technical limitation, in game model of her is EXELLENT (and in cutscenes with fake lighting she looks good even with raster):

RE9 character models:

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

Another butchering, I mean I can't remember if someone listed this one but we should take a count now of how many times this has been done.

Here's a question for someone, what's the last true western female protag that was just normal, attractive etc? I'm old I can't remember

 

[TintoConCasera]

Another butchering, I mean I can't remember if someone listed this one but we should take a count now of how many times this has been done.

Here's a question for someone, what's the last true western female protag that was just normal, attractive etc? I'm old I can't remember

Jawanna Dark, we didn't get to know you.

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

Jawanna Dark, we didn't get to know you.

Look at that fucking face, looks like the new and improved chud tassi

 

[DeepEnigma]

Another butchering, I mean I can't remember if someone listed this one but we should take a count now of how many times this has been done.

Here's a question for someone, what's the last true western female protag that was just normal, attractive etc? I'm old I can't remember

You so know that chick on the left is cracking lobsters with her bare hands.

 

[Three]

Compare both cinematic models.

Grace is a total dime in the game.

This is a graphical issue. The character looks good 99% of the time especially during cutscenes unlike the God of War actress which looks terrible during cutscenes due to how bad they butchered the character model

This is a CUTSCENE, learn the difference

There are no real cutscenes in GoW since GoW2018. It's a single cut throughout the entire game. You'd know that if you cared about the actual technical reasons behind it.

The camera never cuts to a different scene or goes to a loading screen in GoW. They cannot change anything that they cannot do on the fly and for that reason there are very little differences in gameplay and cutscene for GoW except some hero lighting and the like. They can change pretty much everything in the cinematics of RE9 and make everything look nicer. In game in 60fps mode the RE9 character model is uglier though would you not agree?

 

[TintoConCasera]

20+ pages and people are still trying to defend this, when the simple truth is that many people just don't want to pay +70$ for ugly character designs.

It's as simple as that really.

 

[DeepEnigma]

many people just don't want to pay +70$ for ugly character designs.

It's as simple as that really.

How dare you notice!!

 

[Bojji]

There are no real cutscenes in GoW since GoW2018. It's a single cut throughout the entire game. You'd know that if you cared about the actual technical reasons behind it.

The camera never cuts to a different scene or goes to a loading screen in GoW. They cannot change anything that they cannot do on the fly and for that reason there are very little differences in gameplay and cutscene for GoW except some hero lighting and the like. They can change pretty much everything in the cinematics of RE9 and make everything look nicer. In game in 60fps mode the RE9 character model os uglier though would you not agree?

Almost all the shots from GOW are from cutscenes, zero camera control from the player.

There is no reason why it should look worse than DS2 or RE9 with or without RT - they are using the same hardware in all those games. And this is top tier Sony developer and AAA budget, not some Jimmy creating games in mothers basement.

 

[TintoConCasera]

How dare you notice!!

My common sense was tingling lol.

 

[BennyBlanco]

I like Debrah Wilson from back in the Mad TV days. She's funny. Can't be mad at her for taking all these roles. But it's funny how they always nail her character model 100% and ugly up all the pretty girls.