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[Guilty_AI]

All you Marathon haters run away in fear. You've had your time. It's our time now!

Is this one of the blast havers?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

For a few days, people will check it out and move on

You could be right, depends on how much fun it is.

There's a ton of games that grow large player bases because developers figure out the fun formula.

I think Marathon has the best progression in PvP history, but it's hard to feel that when players with 2.5 KD are wiping your lobby.

 

[Roman Empire]

Just saw it now as I got up, but 34k peak is substantially lower than other days. Did Europe as whole left the game?

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Div2 6,900, Marathon 10,700. So close!

Hunt overtook marathons daily peak and bottom

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Just saw it now as I got up, but 34k peak is substantially lower than other days. Did Europe as whole left the game?

No.

Just a general and consistent down trend since launch. Each week the game loses about 10k CCU.

It looks worse on Mondays since it's going from a weekend to a Monday, but the general trend is about -20% when comparing week over week using the same day of the week.

For example yesterday vs last monday was again -23%. The trend hasn't improved since launch.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

One thing I'm worried about is why did Bungie ever think matching players based on season level rather than skill level was ever a good idea?

Ziegler comes from Valorant...a game with excellent SBMM. The industry has known the importance of SBMM for 25+ years.

What made them go "Nah, we don't need it here."

 

[Signalis]

You could be right, depends on how much fun it is.

There's a ton of games that grow large player bases because developers figure out the fun formula.

I think Marathon has the best progression in PvP history, but it's hard to feel that when players with 2.5 KD are wiping your lobby.

 

[Moridianae]

From the roadmap, it looks like the update for balance isn't until late April or May. I guess they could move it up to stem the bleeding, but I don't know.

This game is clearly in trouble. When only the sweats remain, hard to get new people to stick around or more casual players.

"Not made for them" doesn't pay the bills.

 

[Signalis]

All you Marathon haters run away in fear. You've had your time. It's our time now!

 

[StreetsofBeige]

One thing I'm worried about is why did Bungie ever think matching players based on season level rather than skill level was ever a good idea?

Ziegler comes from Valorant...a game with excellent SBMM. The industry has known the importance of SBMM for 25+ years.

What made them go "Nah, we don't need it here."

They can't do major sbmm. It would piss off all the vets with stacked gear killing and stealing from each other.

The game needs its hardcore gamers who can curb stomp bad players with bad loadouts.

But what will happen is the casuals leave, the curb stomps stop and the vets will leave too as they hate playing against each other in decked out lobbies.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

They can't do major sbmm. It would piss off all the vets with stacked gear killing and stealing from each other.

A statement with no backing.

Vets aren't going to quit because they can no longer get 12 kill games, only 6 kill games.

It's crazy how you guys can see a massive hole in a ship (-20% week to week drop) and say "We can't plug that hole because it'll open up a new hole at the front of the ship!"

 

[StreetsofBeige]

A statement with no backing.

Vets aren't going to quit because they can no longer get 12 kill games, only 6 kill games.

It's crazy how you guys can see a massive hole in a ship (-20% week to week drop) and say "We can't plug that hole because it'll open up a new hole at the front of the ship!"

Not true at all. People in various forums have suggested to boost up ccu to do f2p or sub plan or pve mode, solo ranked and cryo etc... there's lots they can do. Sbmm to help noobs out would work too to retain casuals.

It's not hard. Up to them if they want to do it or not.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Not true at all. People in various forums have suggested to boost up ccu to do f2p or sub plan or pve mode, solo ranked and cryo etc... there's lots they can do. Sbmm to help noobs out would work too to retain casuals.

It's not hard. Up to them if they want to do it or not.

F2P or sub plan isn't fixing the issue.

You don't put more people on a ship if there's a massive hole in it and it's sinking 20% every week.

You patch the hole, watch how the ship handles for a bit, and then go F2P if that's required later.

I'm open to a PvE mode later, but right now the AI aren't nearly as interesting to fight as the one's in ARC Raiders.

SBMM is common sense. I can't really fathom why the game didn't launch with it.

 

[Moridianae]

Isn't SBMM something that was extensively rallied against? Or rather just how ridiculous it was tuned in some games like CoD?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Isn't SBMM something that was extensively rallied against? Or rather just how ridiculous it was tuned in some games like CoD?

There's always chatter online from people who don't like how it's implemented but developers and publishers come out all the time and say "We shut it off for 4 hours and everyone at the studio almost lost their job as a result."

It's a solved issue in these types of games. The only way I could see its removal possible is if low skill players could identify high skill players from safe distances and non competitive solutions that are fun. That game hasn't been built yet.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Make note it's maintenance morning now.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Isn't SBMM something that was extensively rallied against? Or rather just how ridiculous it was tuned in some games like CoD?

Depends on the gamer. Curb Stompers hate it. Casuals will like it.

The problem with cod sbmm isn't just about that.

When they started it, the lobbies bog down loading new people every match.

Old games, same people, 60 second intermissions, you get to know gamertags by how good they are and their play style playing in the same lobby 3-4 matches in a row. So more likely to add people as a friend. Can't really do that playing against people for one match.

Another problem is they start you in easy lobbies to get you hooked in. Then if you get on a roll they throw you into hard matches like it's overdone. So what they do is similar to dating sites. It doesnt matter what your profile is. The first 10 girls you see each day you log in are all smoking hot. Then it changes and the next 100 are avg women.

So it shows the algorithm in both cases fudges the way they do it and not based truly what a granular match up system would even work.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Depends on the gamer. Curb Stompers hate it. Casuals will like it.

The problem with cod sbmm isn't just about that.

When they started it, the lobbies bog down loading new people every match.

Old games, same people, 60 second intermissions, you get to know gamertags by how good they are and their play style playing in the same lobby 3-4 matches in a row. So more likely to add people as a friend. Can't really do that playing against people for one match.

Another problem is they start you in easy lobbies to get you hooked in. Then if you get on a roll they throw you into hard matches like it's overdone. So what they do is similar to dating sites. It doesnt matter what your profile is. The first 10 girls you see each day you log in are all smoking hot. Then it changes and the next 100 are avg women.

So it shows the algorithm in both cases fudges the way they do it and not based truly what a granular match up system would even work.

You nailed it on COD SBMM, it swings too wildly

I know in COD if I get 3 or 4 good matches I am artificially going to be brought down to earth and fast, facing people I should never be in the same lobby with

When I played a lot of Rocket League I would dance between Champion and high level Diamond but it was much more gradual when I would see superior players

Another pitfall for CODs SBMM is the reverse boosting you would run into so people would get bot lobbies

I admit even when I started getting insane lobbies it was time for me to practice weapons that were crazy hard to do and I would go 3-15 say for 4 or 5 matches than back to easy lobbies

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

That's why they got to do that fast. Not wait for CCU to drop more.

Oh by the way, CCU is about 10,200. Probably won't drop under 10k as it should be rebounding by now. But should late night tonight.

Game will probably drop the usual -5% to about 32k peak today. The low should scrape around 9.5k to 10k.

Hey I was right. Said it'd hit 10-10.5k!

Remember that the issue with f2p is that the conversion rate is around 2%-5% between people who play it and those who spend on MTXs. (and Marathon cosmetics are garbage)

If they're already losing money, going f2p would only make it worse. Also the game (and Bungie) are not designed/build to support a f2p model....i mean, they can try it but it would be a truly desperate move with zero chances for success

 

[PeteBull]

F2P or sub plan isn't fixing the issue.

You don't put more people on a ship if there's a massive hole in it and it's sinking 20% every week.

You patch the hole, watch how the ship handles for a bit, and then go F2P if that's required later.

I'm open to a PvE mode later, but right now the AI aren't nearly as interesting to fight as the one's in ARC Raiders.

SBMM is common sense. I can't really fathom why the game didn't launch with it.

Just a sec, u h8r, how dare u claim our perfect marathon game(9/10 from ign and pc gamer, 5/5 from jeff gertsman etc) has any holes, especially big enough to sink 20% weekly?

Game is fricken perfect, and if u dont admit it right this second i will call u all possible names, and adding insult to injury i will dare u to touch grass this very second

 

[Darchaos]

Just a sec, u h8r, how dare u claim our perfect marathon game(9/10 from ign and pc gamer, 5/5 from jeff gertsman etc) has any holes, especially big enough to sink 20% weekly?

Game is fricken perfect, and if u dont admit it right this second i will call u all possible names, and adding insult to injury i will dare u to touch grass this very second

Go watch the Arc OT, now the Marathon mob is there spewing theire toxic shit about that game. No sane person on GAF that plays Arc will use that thread to discuss the game, meanwhile theire own OT is a protected sanctum.

 

[Bernardougf]

Go watch the Arc OT, now the Marathon mob is there spewing thire toxic shit about that game. No sane person on GAF that plays Arc will use that thread to discuss the game, meanwhile theire own OT is a protected sanctum.

Lol really ? Marathon will probably end up like a cult

P.s. better suicide watch for when this game closes...

 

[Arsic]

Not good.

Jim Carrey uh oh gif

 

[Tams]

 

[Arsic]

Go watch the Arc OT, now the Marathon mob is there spewing theire toxic shit about that game. No sane person on GAF that plays Arc will use that thread to discuss the game, meanwhile theire own OT is a protected sanctum.

Or, you know, we play both and are baffled by Embark studios direction.

It's possible that one game is successful yet still doing a shit job at user feedback. While the other is doing good at feedback but sucking dicks at player count.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

You will feel ashamed of these words and deeds.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

Go watch the Arc OT, now the Marathon mob is there spewing theire toxic shit about that game. No sane person on GAF that plays Arc will use that thread to discuss the game, meanwhile theire own OT is a protected sanctum.

Because they know that Marathon can't stand on its own merits. They've spent so much time stanning for Marathon only to see it decline at a consistent rate even to this day. So now, they're running on the sunken cost fallacy. The excuse of the week they've come up with, i.e. "Muh 87% positive reviews", "Muh targeted audience", etc, didn't change the discourse. Neither did attempting to OT'ify the non-OT Marathon threads.

And now, they're figuratively functioning as the hammer to nail the coffin by antagonizing other people for no good reason.

 

[Arsic]

Because they know that Marathon can't stand on its own merits. They've spent so much time stanning for Marathon only to see it decline at a consistent rate even to this day. So now, they're running on the sunken cost fallacy. The excuse of the week they've come up with, i.e. "Muh 87% positive reviews", "Muh targeted audience", etc, didn't change the discourse. Neither did attempting to OT'ify the non-OT Marathon threads.

And now, they're figuratively functioning as the hammer to nail the coffin by antagonizing other people for no good reason.

I hope I'm not being included in whoever is doing this. I imagine it's men in boxes who I have muted on here lol.

I'd like the game to succeed and I've had a lot of fun with it but it's no secret this shit could be dead in a few weeks unless Bungie performs a miracle to inject a mass flood of players.

 

[Bernardougf]

I hope I'm not being included in whoever is doing this. I imagine it's men in boxes who I have muted on here lol.

I'd like the game to succeed and I've had a lot of fun with it but it's no secret this shit could be dead in a few weeks unless Bungie performs a miracle to inject a mass flood of players.

People without the cult mentality are simply playing the game or doing other things, or like you eventually discussing in a normal matter.... the extremists probably spend more time here debating and fighting and cursing others like they attacked their own mothers and not some stupid video game ...than playing the "awsome" game .

Anyway we all know who they are.

 

[cormack12]

Go watch the Arc OT, now the Marathon mob is there spewing theire toxic shit about that game. No sane person on GAF that plays Arc will use that thread to discuss the game, meanwhile theire own OT is a protected sanctum.

That sucks if true

 

[Negotiator101]

The game needs a art overhaul and a PvE mode to run along side the regular mode, that would bring in more casuals which is what the game needs.

 

[MMaRsu]

Marathon:

 

[Zacfoldor]

I feel like the community has circled the wagons due to all the negativity which will hamper the devs ability to respond to valid criticism.

 

[Arsic]

I feel like the community has circled the wagons due to all the negativity which will hamper the devs ability to respond to valid criticism.

Yep. Some good ideas on here for a variety of changes to help newer players, some pve mode ideas, and long term additions but none of it matters.

The game IMO is doomed. I'll play until I've had my fill or the inevitable "GGs we closing it down" post.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I feel like the community has circled the wagons due to all the negativity which will hamper the devs ability to respond to valid criticism.

I don't think devs care about message board or Twitter opinions just like a plumber or electrician wouldn't care.

They're fixing things irrespective of the community.

 

[rkofan87]

Marathon was made by "just under 300" employees according to Ziegler. Destiny 2 made considerably more money than Santa Monica or Guerilla Games in 2022, 2023, 2024, and 2025.

You people who think S2 isn't a foregone conclusion don't know this industry.

Let me see that spreadsheet.

While true, this doesn't address my point.

@pepino suggested that Marathon was supposed to be supporting the 800+ person Bungie. The reality is that it was made by 3/8ths of Bungie and 5/8ths of Bungie is on Destiny 2/3.

And again, I do believe Destiny generated significantly more revenue than Santa Monica and Guerilla in 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025, and likely 2026. Context that is rarely added in the doomer talk.



I asked how many games get shut down with more than a 2k CCU average. You listed (a totally valid) one game.

So while it is extremely rare, it has happened.

That said, Back 4 Blood was supported with new content for 16 months before its studio pulled the plug. There are people here who think Marathon might not make it to S2. These are not serious people. They dishonor themselves with such foolishness.

~300 are on Marathon.
~500 are on Destiny.

Bungie is not a 1,000 person studio anymore.

The same logic can be used on Guerilla Games, Santa Monica, Team Asobi, Sucker Punch etc...

They generate a lot of money for 6 months - 1 year and then go 4 - 5 years in a drought.

Destiny 2 will generate another wave of revenue in June for Shadow and Order. Then they'll likely have another big update in the winter.

S2 for Marathon is a certainty. Bungie is collecting a ton of data right now and they'll attempt to course correct in June.

I bet you it generates considerably more revenue than the studios I listed.

Well, according to Steam Top Sellers Chart for 2025, only 25 - 50 games generated more revenue than Destiny 2. It probably performed similarly well on console too.

I think the drought studios I mentioned would love to generate grains of sand like that.

 

[Arsic]

This man is capital R, retarded.

All his ideas, analogies, and complaints are mentally deranged. Dudes a laughing stock in the OT because he sucks at the game and refuses to adapt to get better.

Truly baffled this was the sperm that won the race inside his moms snatch to be put onto this planet.

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

I feel like the community has circled the wagons due to all the negativity which will hamper the devs ability to respond to valid criticism.

I just think it all comes back to being way too niche, even if someone wants to fight the fight and say extraction is becoming popular it's still not a slam dunk argument but they made it even more with the art style, so to me it's literally niche on top of niche.

I get people like it but my time of 47 years has given me what I feel is decent knowledge and been gaming 44 of those years seeing every era, owning every console, building monster pcs, been everywhere and everywhere in between and that game is atrocious looking no matter those who say they like it they absolutely can, but that look and style... On TOP of being a niche genre, put this game in the hole it's in.

If this game looked more like destiny in its overall look and feel I guarantee people would give it the benefit of the doubt, I WOULD absolutely give it a go if it looked better but it's so ugly I can't even stand it, if this is the style games went with id quit gaming. But that's just me.

My point is I don't think any decision will bring in players because the core game is just not fun to look at whatsoever

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

My point is I don't think any decision will bring in players because the core game is just not fun to look at whatsoever

It looks like mature Fortnite.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

I hope I'm not being included in whoever is doing this. I imagine it's men in boxes who I have muted on here lol.

I'd like the game to succeed and I've had a lot of fun with it but it's no secret this shit could be dead in a few weeks unless Bungie performs a miracle to inject a mass flood of players.

You're definitely not among those people because you're respectful towards those who aren't into Marathon.

 

[Antwix]

lol if they add sbmm to a dying game, expect increased matchmaking times and worse ping

 

[Guilty_AI]

It looks like mature Fortnite.

It looks like cruelty squad without the edginess

 

[Arsic]

You're definitely not among those people because you're respectful towards those who aren't into Marathon.

My mind is baffled by those who get a chubby that want it to fail and Bungie be shut down.

I totally get not being into the art, or the genre, or feeling (me included) why Bungie didn't include a campaign and pve firefight like mode which is their bread and butter.

This game would've been a real winner with a full blown campaign added to flesh out this wonderful lore.

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

My mind is baffled by those who get a chubby that want it to fail and Bungie be shut down.

I totally get not being into the art, or the genre, or feeling (me included) why Bungie didn't include a campaign and pve firefight like mode which is their bread and butter.

This game would've been a real winner with a full blown campaign added to flesh out this wonderful lore.

I think it's because whether it succeeds or fails no one person can truly control that, like we are all gaming cheerleaders basically for the games we like and ribbing the ones we don't is truly just part of it but that's the same with all entertainment.

But let's look at for example the new star trek academy, not sure if it's anything you are in the know with or what not but basically the show is an abomination of star trek and it has been canceled, was horrible etc... People don't want to see it succeed to send a better message that nobody wants that crap. And thankfully it's indeed been canceled.

I want a d3 but I finally been away from destiny to where I don't need it, because I do feel bungie didn't need me any longer as paying customer, and marathon being their new baby just doesn't feel good as an alternative. I don't want this industry to become so copycat where we continue to get extraction.

Just keep in mind tho any shitting that I do isn't directed at you or anyone that enjoys it, but I do really dislike that game so it's just inevitable

 

[Bernardougf]

This man is capital R, retarded.

All his ideas, analogies, and complaints are mentally deranged. Dudes a laughing stock in the OT because he sucks at the game and refuses to adapt to get better.

Truly baffled this was the sperm that won the race inside his moms snatch to be put onto this planet.

Wait .. wait.. he sucks at the game ????? Looooooll you cant make this shit up.. the crazy gaas guy sucks at gaas

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

It looks like cruelty squad without the edginess

Nah, it's much more visually appealing than that.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

No we understand why Men_In_Boxes is so attached to marathon

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

Nah, it's much more visually appealing than that.

Nothing visually appealing not one thing about this game it is absolutely awful looking

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Nothing visually appealing not one thing about this game it is absolutely awful looking

Agree to disagree.

 

[Arsic]

Wait .. wait.. he sucks at the game ????? Looooooll you cant make this shit up.. the crazy gaas guy sucks at gaas

That's what I am seeing in the OT.

One day the game is ass, the other it's amazing. Another he is talking about uncooked veal.

It's high time he get on meds.