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[TheBomb]

How the fuck does Phil Spencer still have a job?

I’m being 100% serious….it’s insanity….

I’ve been saying that for a longtime unless this was always the plan. He then is okay.

 

[Arsic]

How the fuck does Phil Spencer still have a job?

I’m being 100% serious….it’s insanity….

Man gives the best dome world wide.

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

As an ex-tech journo I can say with confidence that MS PR just shot their dick, legs and other important bits.

First of all, if there’s anything to debunk, you debunk it outright to stop the speculations. Or you just ignore the microphone and wait until the official announcement.

Secondly, you never-ever want to announce a monumental pause in communications without debunking anything. Now MS has a glorious week of uncontrolled meltdowns and severe damage to brand’s reputation. Terrific.

The fact that Phil tweeted what he tweeted is another signal that he is the passenger in this story and his car is driving flat out into the proverbial abyss.

Xbox 3rd party is happening and nobody can stop it at this point.

 

[TheBomb]

I wonder if third party studios will pause releasing their future titles.

 

[Xion_Stellar]

I wonder if third party studios will pause releasing their future titles.

You speak like this hasn't happened already.

Microsoft has quite literally had to pay Japanese Publishers to port their games to Xbox before.

 

[TheBomb]

You speak like this hasn't happened already.

Microsoft has quite literally had to pay Japanese Publishers to port their games to Xbox before.

True, but the one that comes to mind is GTA.

 

[mylifedotcom]

So much for Hideo Kojima's XBox cloud horror game lmao.

 

[bitbydeath]

I wonder if third party studios will pause releasing their future titles.

Kojima said his next project after Death Stranding 2 was the new action-espionage game for Sony, did wonder what that meant for OD, the Xbox game that was previously announced… still wondering

 

[TheBomb]

Kojima said his next project after Death Stranding 2 was the new action-espionage game for Sony, did wonder what that meant for OD, the Xbox game that was previously announced… still wondering

Interesting, and for me is GTA. They announced it, but no platforms were announced.

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

Kojima said his next project after Death Stranding 2 was the new action-espionage game for Sony, did wonder what that meant for OD, the Xbox game that was previously announced… still wondering

It’s being made my a smaller second team. That being said it would be hilarious if OD will end up on PS5.

 

[Bernardougf]

Holy fook this is the definition of a meltdown... Topher finally the meltdowns promised after the ABK deal was sealed are coming!

 

[Topher]

Holy fook this is the definition of a meltdown... Topher finally the meltdowns promised after the ABK deal was sealed are coming!

 

[SneakersSO]

The fact that Phil tweeted what he tweeted is another signal that he is the passenger in this story and his car is driving flat out into the proverbial abyss.

Xbox 3rd party is happening and nobody can stop it at this point.

I wanna jump on your post to add to it - the idea that any of this is in a reversible position is nothing but wishful thinking at best. You have to be the most blinded, die-hard fan to believe that this can be reversed with enough fan outcry.

Games don't just magically come out on consoles because you want them to, especially if they are big games. Yes, Hi-Fi Rush is a big game in this context.

Each publisher signs a series of agreements to put a title out on a console in order to release it. These agreements are binding. Yes, you can do something like say, cancel your game, but if you're planning on releasing it on a platform, there are a myriad of terms you must agree to. Sony and Nintendo have known for a long time now that this was happening - the other 3rd parties did not (this is becoming a big deal for 3rd parties behind the scenes btw...).

MS did not adopt this position neither lightly, or with the notion of reversing course. This is a maneuver born from fiscal responsibility, not due to choice.

 

[Topher]

I wanna jump on your post to add to it - the idea that any of this is in a reversible position is nothing but wishful thinking at best. You have to be the most blinded, die-hard fan to believe that this can be reversed with enough fan outcry.

Games don't just magically come out on consoles because you want them to, especially if they are big games. Yes, Hi-Fi Rush is a big game in this context.

Each publisher signs a series of agreements to put a title out on a console in order to release it. These agreements are binding. Yes, you can do something like say, cancel your game, but if you're planning on releasing it on a platform, there are a myriad of terms you must agree to. Sony and Nintendo have known for a long time now that this was happening - the other 3rd parties did not (this is becoming a big deal for 3rd parties behind the scenes btw...).

MS did not adopt this position neither lightly, or with the notion of reversing course. This is a maneuver born from fiscal responsibility, not due to choice.

Guessing that's why all this is going to be revealed at a "business event".

 

[JohnnyFootball]

As an ex-tech journo I can say with confidence that MS PR just shot their dick, legs and other important bits.

First of all, if there’s anything to debunk, you debunk it outright to stop the speculations. Or you just ignore the microphone and wait until the official announcement.

Secondly, you never-ever want to announce a monumental pause in communications without debunking anything. Now MS has a glorious week of uncontrolled meltdowns and severe damage to brand’s reputation. Terrific.

The fact that Phil tweeted what he tweeted is another signal that he is the passenger in this story and his car is driving flat out into the proverbial abyss.

Xbox 3rd party is happening and nobody can stop it at this point.

Correct. Anybody holding out hope that this is all fake, is just being delusional. This was their opportunity to squash these rumors and this did the opposite.

 

[AtomicStarving]

He is listening

 

[ViciousAgenda]

Correct. Anybody holding out hope that this is all fake, is just being delusional. This was their opportunity to squash these rumors and this did the opposite.

It just doesn't seem possible that they'll release the likes of Gears and Halo on playstation.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Sony and Nintendo have known for a long time now that this was happening - the other 3rd parties did not (this is becoming a big deal for 3rd parties behind the scenes btw...).

What do you mean?

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

What do you mean?

It takes time to obtain devkits for PS5 and Switch 2. I bet for Sony and Nin this is hardly news since September.

 

[TransTrender]

Was this really the MS long play or did they totally fuck themselves with this ActiBlizz acquisition and are saddled with this albatross?

 

[LordCBH]

It takes time to obtain devkits for PS5 and Switch 2. I bet form Sony and Nin this is hardly news since September.

The game also has to be licensed right? So that’s yet another way they’d know, because they’d have to know to do that.

 

[LordCBH]

Was this really the MS long play or did they totally fuck themselves with this ActiBlizz acquisition and are saddled with this albatross?

Now that they’ve dropped $80 billion on the gaming division in just a few short years, the powers that be absolutely want more than what they’re getting.

 

[nick776]

Nope. The whole thing smacks of someone high up in the MS system who is unhappy with the strategy moving forward, and wanted to get it out to the press as truthfully as possible, before Phil was able to spin it with PR speak, the way he has with everything else.

And now he and the rest of them are scrambling to put together a coherent response that admits the truth of the leaks, while at the same time 'reassuring' the Xbox community that 'everything is actually fine - pay no attention to the man behind the curtain'. The fact a lot of them will buy the BS again is fairly depressing.

This is exactly why everyone should be DONE with xbox. I've been an Xbox fan since 360, but at the end of the day MSFT is nothing more than a corporation motivated by stock prices and market cap. I just do not think Nintendo (while it is a for-profit company itself) would have handled this in a remotely similar fashion. Xbox's nail in the coffin was the stupid ABK purchase.

 

[knguyen]

It's always "we are listening" and "we hear you".

Complete lies.

When it comes to communicating with Xbox fans, this guy has a whole list of lies, spins, empty promises...that he can pick from then post them depends on the situation. Needless to say, it is very unfortunate for Xbox fans when this guy was pick as Xbox boss.

 

[Oddvintagechap]

Why is everyone acting like this doesn’t mean Microsoft aren‘t gonna dominate the market? Like they are some small little player. Nadella doesn’t play.

That being said I have zero clue how Phil is still leads the division. Im pretty sure he failed in all internal projections.

Can we finally agree Gamepass, is the dumbest idea since Xbox Series S. (well I guess more of the day one releases) I fully expect Microsoft to profit more out of selling games on Playstation then on Xbox simply because Playstation gamers will pay full price.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

I wanna jump on your post to add to it - the idea that any of this is in a reversible position is nothing but wishful thinking at best. You have to be the most blinded, die-hard fan to believe that this can be reversed with enough fan outcry.

Games don't just magically come out on consoles because you want them to, especially if they are big games. Yes, Hi-Fi Rush is a big game in this context.

Each publisher signs a series of agreements to put a title out on a console in order to release it. These agreements are binding. Yes, you can do something like say, cancel your game, but if you're planning on releasing it on a platform, there are a myriad of terms you must agree to. Sony and Nintendo have known for a long time now that this was happening - the other 3rd parties did not (this is becoming a big deal for 3rd parties behind the scenes btw...).

MS did not adopt this position neither lightly, or with the notion of reversing course. This is a maneuver born from fiscal responsibility, not due to choice.

Yep, the wheels of business turn slowly (unless you've got a psychopath in charge, a la Musk).

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It takes time to obtain devkits for PS5 and Switch 2. I bet for Sony and Nin this is hardly news since September.

I mean about the third parties part

“becoming a big deal behind then scenes btw”

 

[LordCBH]

Can we finally agree Gamepass, is the dumbest idea

The idea of Gamepass in and of itself isn’t terrible, though their implementation of “all our games day one on GP!” absolutely is. But the big problem is MS will never have enough subscribers to make it actually work. They likely will never reach half the subs they’d really need.

 

[Topher]

Why is everyone acting like this doesn’t mean Microsoft aren‘t gonna dominate the market? Like they are some small little player. Nadella doesn’t play.

That being said I have zero clue how Phil is still leads the division. Im pretty sure he failed in all internal projections.

Can we finally agree Gamepass, is the dumbest idea since Xbox Series S. (well I guess more of the day one releases) I fully expect Microsoft to profit more out of selling games on Playstation then on Xbox simply because Playstation gamers will pay full price.

They ain't a small little player, but they are not going to dominate the market either. Microsoft is certainly a bigger player than they this time last year, but as a third party publisher there is really nothing to dominate. They will sell their games and so will Sony, Nintendo, Take Two, EA, Ubisoft and so on.

 

[SneakersSO]

What do you mean?

It takes time to obtain devkits for PS5 and Switch 2. I bet form Sony and Nin this is hardly news since September.

No, its not the dev kits im referring to here.

I'll explain whats happening with an analogy - back when EA was pushing Origin, did you see Ubisoft or Take-Two releasing titles into Origin? Ofc not. Those publishers are in direct competition with one another - why would they release their games on a rival Publisher's platform and give them a 30% cut, which would then be used against them.

Platform holders and 3rd party publishers enjoy a symbiotic fiscal relationship. What happens when a platform holder transitions into arguably one of the largest 3rd party publishers, while telling none of them about it?

In plain English, I am expecting 3rd party support to pull out somewhat quickly. Xbox is right now the most expensive console to develop for (2 dev workflows for 2 different consoles), with the lowest RoI potential unless you get a Game Pass deal, which will also become fewer and far between outside of the ones already signed.

I am even expecting some rather large upcoming games to have their Xbox versions potentially cancelled in light of this.

 

[LordCBH]

In plain English, I am expecting 3rd party support to pull out somewhat quickly.

A decent chunk of third party support likely would’ve pulled the plug a while ago if Microsoft wasn’t throwing around hundreds of millions to low billions to get content on their subscription. I can guarantee Sega and Square would’ve kept ignoring them completely if it wasn’t for the brinks truck of cash Microsoft could throw to get their games ported and onto GP.

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

Xbox's nail in the coffin was the stupid ABK purchase.

It is funny how things do change in retrospect, huh?

The deal was struck in 2022, on the height of COVID growth craze. Xbox was lax, PS5 was understocked and snatching CoD from Sony seemed like a good endgame. Since then both the deal and the market changed so much that it was just too late to cancel the
takeover.

Fast-forward to 2024 and: COVID growth was a fad and we're in the phase of mass layoffs, CoD-snubbing stratagem failed due to CMA with binding agreements, cloud growth basically dead due to sub-licesing to Ubisoft for 15 years, plus GamePass imploded due to meager growth even with Starfield day-one, so no CoD Day 1 there either.

And here we are, ABK is a huge $75b stone that is hanging on the neck of a hardware business that was drowning without the outside help.

 

[Topher]

No, its not the dev kits im referring to here.

I'll explain whats happening with an analogy - back when EA was pushing Origin, did you see Ubisoft or Take-Two releasing titles into Origin? Ofc not. Those publishers are in direct competition with one another - why would they release their games on a rival Publisher's platform and give them a 30% cut, which would then be used against them.

Platform holders and 3rd party publishers enjoy a symbiotic fiscal relationship. What happens when a platform holder transitions into arguably one of the largest 3rd party publishers, while telling none of them about it?

In plain English, I am expecting 3rd party support to pull out somewhat quickly. Xbox is right now the most expensive console to develop for (2 dev workflows for 2 different consoles), with the lowest RoI potential unless you get a Game Pass deal, which will also become fewer and far between outside of the ones already signed.

I am even expecting some rather large upcoming games to have their Xbox versions potentially cancelled in light of this.

You heard anything about this rumor that Microsoft will be resorting OEM versions of Xbox hardware in the future?

 

[semiconscious]

Now that they’ve dropped $80 billion on the gaming division in just a few short years, the powers that be absolutely want more than what they’re getting.

so you're saying that ms corporate's finally bitten the bullet & shifted into 'xboxer rebellion' mode?...

 

[XXL]

I wanna jump on your post to add to it - the idea that any of this is in a reversible position is nothing but wishful thinking at best. You have to be the most blinded, die-hard fan to believe that this can be reversed with enough fan outcry.

Games don't just magically come out on consoles because you want them to, especially if they are big games. Yes, Hi-Fi Rush is a big game in this context.

Each publisher signs a series of agreements to put a title out on a console in order to release it. These agreements are binding. Yes, you can do something like say, cancel your game, but if you're planning on releasing it on a platform, there are a myriad of terms you must agree to. Sony and Nintendo have known for a long time now that this was happening - the other 3rd parties did not (this is becoming a big deal for 3rd parties behind the scenes btw...).

MS did not adopt this position neither lightly, or with the notion of reversing course. This is a maneuver born from fiscal responsibility, not due to choice.

Add to all of this, in the original leak it said "they are not going to consider internet discourse" and they proved that part of the leak all fucking day if you ask me.

 

[Bernardougf]

It is funny how things do change in retrospect, huh?

The deal was struck in 2022, on the height of COVID growth craze. Xbox was lax, PS5 was understocked and snatching CoD from Sony seemed like a good endgame. Since then both the deal and the market changed so much that it was just to alte to chancel the
takeover.

Fast-forward to 2024 and: COVID growth was a fad and we're in the phase of mass layoffs, CoD-snubbing stratagem failed due to CMA with binding agreements, cloud growth basically dead due to sub-licesing ot Ubisoft for 15 years, plus GamePass imploded due to meager growth even with Starfield day-one, so no CoD Day 1 there either.

And here we are, ABK is a huge $75b stone that is hanging on the neck of a hrdware business that was drowning without the outside help.

I still think that the plan always was to make COD exclusive of Xbox/Gamepass and that the CMA fuck it all up .... add to that the fact that Starfield did jack shit to move xbox units ... well... bad strategy....can only think that the higher ups in MS decided enough was enough and pulled the plug "fuck xbox/gamepass show us the money bitch"

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

You heard anything about this rumor that Microsoft will be resorting OEM versions of Xbox hardware in the future?

From the dev standpoint I do think it will be just a decent PC with a sticker and, maybe, some Xbox app for dashboard and internal X360 emulator.

But it's just my 6AM thinking.

 

[LordCBH]

From the dev standpoint I do think it will be just a decent PC with a sticker and, maybe, some Xbox app for dashboard and internal X360 emulator.

But it's just my 6AM thinking.

If that (Xbox 360 emulator) was an app they’d drop on say the PC Xbox app or even the MS Store app, I’d be hella interested.

 

[Moridianae]

No, its not the dev kits im referring to here.

I'll explain whats happening with an analogy - back when EA was pushing Origin, did you see Ubisoft or Take-Two releasing titles into Origin? Ofc not. Those publishers are in direct competition with one another - why would they release their games on a rival Publisher's platform and give them a 30% cut, which would then be used against them.

Platform holders and 3rd party publishers enjoy a symbiotic fiscal relationship. What happens when a platform holder transitions into arguably one of the largest 3rd party publishers, while telling none of them about it?

In plain English, I am expecting 3rd party support to pull out somewhat quickly. Xbox is right now the most expensive console to develop for (2 dev workflows for 2 different consoles), with the lowest RoI potential unless you get a Game Pass deal, which will also become fewer and far between outside of the ones already signed.

I am even expecting some rather large upcoming games to have their Xbox versions potentially cancelled in light of this.

Speculation upon your part or have some friends in the industry? Perchance work in the industry yourself?

I admit I hadn't thought about third party developers getting spooked, probably very likely. I would wager retailers are watching this too.

 

[Cre8]

 

[SneakersSO]

Speculation upon your part or have some friends in the industry? Perchance work in the industry yourself?

Both have colleagues and am in it.

Not speculation that meetings at 3rd parties discussing support for the platform in light of this shift are happening now with urgency. Very highly educated/informed speculation on big titles cancelling their already announced Xbox SKUs in light of this.

 

[Topher]

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

In plain English, I am expecting 3rd party support to pull out somewhat quickly. Xbox is right now the most expensive console to develop for (2 dev workflows for 2 different consoles),

But how much do you suspect this actually costs? Wouldn’t it still be worth it even if the Xbox platform sales are lower?

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

If that (Xbox 360 emulator) was an app they’d drop on say the PC Xbox app or even the MS Store app, I’d be hella interested.

It would be an oversimplification, but Xbox Series is basically a PC with a very peculiar hypervisor. Nothnig thay Win 11 machine can't run with a few tweaks. Emulator can even support full DRM via the store to some extent.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Sounds like we are at the precipice of a cascade of retracted support, sort of how when Sega collapsed.

 

[SneakersSO]

But how much do you suspect this actually costs? Wouldn’t it still be worth it even if the Xbox platform sales are lower?

If you dig into software sales in the Xbox ecosystem, you can understand that outside of a GP deal, selling enough software in that ecosystem, enough so to break even, is very difficult, even for some of the bigger games.

As several publishers with extensive economic research have concluded, Game Pass irreversibly changed the purchasing habits of those users. There is no going back from that.

 

[Crm114]

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

Speculation upon your part or have some friends in the industry? Perchance work in the industry yourself?

I admit I hadn't thought about third party developers getting spooked, probably very likely. I would wager retailers are watching this too.

Retailers worldwide are already pulling from Xbox. No need to highlight a digital-only platform that doesn't sell a dime (esp outside the US). Even accessories are plummeting, so why waste the limited store space.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

It would be an oversimplification, but Xbox Series is basically a PC with a very peculiar hypervisor. Nothnig thay Win 11 machine can't run with a few tweaks. Emulator can even support full DRM via the store to some extent.

I can see homebrew on the XSX in a decade essentially just unlocking it as a PC.

 

[DR3AM]

5k more layoffs incoming if the hardware team is dead