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[Stuart360]

Did you not read the post you were replying to was talking about? Maybe I misread your original comment, I'm not sure.

And yes, all 3 moneyhat shit, they've been doing it years and won't be stopping any time soon.

I didnt reply to that post moose lol, look again.
I was wondering where the Monster Hunter thing was coming from lol.
This is the post i replied to -

Have they now? Post the contract so we can all have a look?
You sound a right hypocrite though as seeing as Nintendo did this practise well before Sony even entered the market.

 

[John Wick]

Based on what? Sony seem pretty ok with the status quo where neither they nor MS owns ABK.

I'm sorry but its not just about the money, its about how the money is used. MS could have used that huge cash-pile on building stuff of their own. Like where are there new IP's?

It strikes me that MS are mainly investing to control, not build the industry. Is that what you want from a potential market-leader?

It's funny how Xbox fanboys seem to know what Sony would do but yet always apply the thinking of the company they support which has a history of this anti competitive type of behaviour.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I'm not a fan of studios being snapped up at all. However, I really want this one to go through for the lols. The meltdowns will be incredible. Fingers crossed the Green Rats win this one I'll be super disappointed if they don't.

It's already a done deal. You would think people here would know not to doubt it, but they'll have to find out the way they did when they thought Microsoft would never make Starfield or Elder Scrolls 6 exclusive because they "needed to make their money back." They've been wrong this whole gen.

 

[Frank Horrigan]

People are missing the wood for the trees. As much talk as Sony and Microsoft want to do to win internet points, the Activision deal goes beyond gaming on either xbox or Playstation.

Microsoft, a leviathon of a company, would own a considerable share in the 'gambling' market of the gaming industry. Putting aside COD MTX or Diablo MTX, we have to remember that many mobile games also comes with the purchase of ACTI. Those gambling revenues - something which the EU and UK are looking at banning, specifically in the areas of MTX - being wielded by a massive company like Microsoft (Or Apple, Or Amazon...) could create a serious problem to and for gamers.

The UK has already recognised gaming as an addiction - With EU following suit, and both are cracking down hard on gambling in the gaming arena. Mainly because gambling is illegal if you're under 18 (ymmv). Even though COD and Diablo come with a mature 18+ rating, the mobile games do not.

Step outside of the console wars and you see why the purchase of Acti is causing some disconcernment

 

[Wohc]

Though I agree with you about the exclusivity deals situation, one thing to note.

Sony exclusivity deals are temporary, while Microsoft exclusivity deal is permanent.

Well, i doubt that Forspoken will ever hit Xbox. Deal says "At least 2 years". I mean it doesn't look that Xbox player will miss out a system seller, but still. Not to talk about FF.

 

[marjo]

Though I agree with you about the exclusivity deals situation, one thing to note.

Sony exclusivity deals are temporary, while Microsoft exclusivity deal is permanent.

Simple solution. Microsoft can agree to put out CoD on Sony patforms in perpetuity... 2 years after they release on Xbox. I'm sure that since timed exclusives are apparently ok, this wouldn't be a problem at all for Jim.

 

[Frank Horrigan]

It's already a done deal. You would think people here would know not to doubt it, but they'll have to find out the way they did when they thought Microsoft would never make Starfield or Elder Scrolls 6 exclusive because they "needed to make their money back." They've been wrong this whole gen.

ES6 isn't exclusive and Starfield is a timed exclusive.

 

[onesvenus]

I dont know. I dont know what Jimbo fears worse. Losing half of his revenue or sharing 30% of it with Microsoft while watching Phil undermine games like MLB The Show and CoD by offering them for free on gamepass on playstation.

I would personally let CoD go, and buy Take2. GTA Online was the second game on the list of most played online games at 40%. It wouldve been a great bargaining chip. You take cod? We take GTA away. But they idiotically spent $3.2 billion on Bungie who is only around 17% iirc. Maybe lower. Bungie makes games for the hardcore, casuals cant do those raids. Regardless, Take2 bought Zynga which added another $12 billion to their already high $18 billion price tag. But Sony shouldve pounced when they were under $20 billion. At $40 billion, they now simply have no shot unless they spinoff zynga immediately to another buyer like Tencent or Embracer group.

They couldve also bought Ubisoft and Capcom, but they might be waiting to see if this deal goes through. They need leverage right now and they have none. Bungie alone isnt enough. You need Destiny, Assassins Creed, Far Cry, Resident Evil, Street Fighter, and a lot more to negotiate for CoD. And this constant whining from Jimbo indicates that this option of acquiring publishers simply isnt available to him.

Do you really think the market leader would be able to buy those publishers though?

 

[.Pennywise]

Thanks Sony for protecting gamers from accessing all the ActiBlizz catalog at a low subsciption price and make them pay $70 for each game

this deal would have major negative implications for gamers and the future of the gaming industry

Yes, please don't let the deal go through. It would have really negative consequences. Like, you want to play that game on Xbox, Switch or PC? NOPE, I cockblocked it by moneyhatting the company and now go buy it only on PlayStation. NOW THAT IS FOR THE GAMERS!

 

[John Wick]

I'm not sure what you're getting at moose, are you saying Sony doesnt monayhat games or am i missreading you?.
My point was that they all have moneyhatted games, moneyhatted dlc, got exclusivity deals etc. Ninetndo was ridiculous with it in the Snes days.

Exactly Nintendo fans should be the last ones to cry about moneyhatting.

 

[Cyborg]

Jim just wants a better CoD deal...!

 

[Mr Moose]

ES6 isn't exclusive and Starfield is a timed exclusive.

Starfield is said to be exclusive and most likely so is Elder Scrolls.
Starfield being exclusive is fine IMO, it's a new IP.

 

[SoloKingRobert]

 

[Menzies]

Read what you wrote because you sound stupid. Sony don't own Square Enix. Nor do they own the FF IP. So it's not upto Sony to decide anything that's your first mistake. If your going to post a clever rebuttal at least get the right information and blame the owners of the IP.

You're right, all they did was...draft up contact terms and negotiate exclusivity (for the cheap), or if you believe, paid nothing at all because no one with an Xbox buys JRPG's.

All sounds like balanced and fair competition at the moment.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

From a user on the other site regarding the status of this whole thing.

Saudi Arabia (and probably United Arab Emirates) already approved it.

South Africa, Japan, South Korea, Turkey, US, Australia, New Zealand, Brazil and UK now are already in Phase 2 or close to a final decision.

Europe hasn't been notified yet, but they have been doing a very extensive "Phase 0" and should start Phase 1 in October.

Then there are countries that should be notified soon or already in the process but we don't know it because they don't share any public info (India, China, Canada, Argentina, Israel, maybe Russia, Taiwan or Colombia).

So, UK starting Phase 2 is just a formality, nothing unexpected.

Not sure of the accuracy.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Protecting from whom?

From Microsoft?

You know what I love about this is just how seriously Sony is taking this compared to some of the posters on this board who initially dismissed this as 'PS doesnt NEED CoD'. They will be fine they said. Clearly Sony themselves think this will destroy their business.

There was a stat posted in those acquisition threads that pointed out how 45% of the console online playerbase plays call of duty. Thats a huge chunk of players that Sony relies upon to keep their 46 milllion PS+ userbases going. Not to mention all the other revenue these players bring in as they invest in the PS ecosystem. Sony will simply be a different company without the cod userbase. They would have to completely trim down and become more like Nintendo because their revenues which rely heavily on PS+ subs and PSN digital sales will take a massive hit from losing the CoD userbase. That means fewer revenues, fewer profit, fewer first party games, cheaper and thus less powerful consoles just to stay competitive.

Nintendo pretty much had to merge their handheld and console business to reduce costs and stay relevant. Their industry leading devs forced to work on a 0.19 tflops hardware in 2022. But they dont have a choice and had to kill off either the handheld business or the console business and they basically chose to merge them the best they could. Sony can also cut down and be leaner business, but it will not be the same Sony AAA after AAA business as we know it today. Cost cuttings alone will result in fewer first party studios and fewer third party deals like FF7 and FF16. If you're a Sony studios fan like I am, people need to fucking worried about this deal going through. They will survive of course, but at what cost?

Yep.

I always find it funny how people claim it’s good that MS is buying Activision just so they can get CoD on GamePass.

Frankly the entire deal stinks and is extremely anti-consumer. You’re probably going to get worse CoD games, and the competition will suffer from less online revenue which also impacts their ability to invest in first party games.

The other thing is that most acquisitions make sense because these are smaller studios that can’t really thrive without a big publisher supporting them.

But Microsoft’s acquisitions of Zenimax and Activision is comical because neither of these companies needed MS to buy them out. They were operating just fine as an independent publisher. But daddy warbucks MS shows up with a vault of cash and the owners know they’ll never get a deal as good as that because, frankly, nobody but MS could afford them outside of other big tech names.

Let’s also not ignore the fact that MS has a terrible history of gaming acquisitions and stewardship of their of IP like Halo. I feel like after management cashed out, these studios really won’t have strong leadership in place to keep them motivated, and under Matt Booty these studios don’t have strong support from MS.

So ultimately you can see why Sony is pushing so hard for GaaS. Losing CoD is enormously harmful to them. Even if they keep CoD but people start getting it on GamePass instead, it’s very harmful.

Sony is trying to cultivate their own must have AAA GaaS games to keep the PS plus subs going. If they hit it big, it could be a huge boom to their business even if they lose CoD, but if none of them generate that viral appeal, losing CoD is catastrophic. It’s a huge risk

 

[modiz]

Yeah they're already planning on going 3rd party.

I would play their games on gamepass.

 

[Frank Horrigan]

Starfield is said to be exclusive and most likely so is Elder Scrolls.
Starfield being exclusive is fine IMO, it's a new IP.

FWIW i own both PS5 and XSX so exclusivity either way doesn't matter to me personally. But going from Microsoft's history and the direction they seem to want go in, especially with GamePass, then TES 6 being exclusive doesn't fit in to that strategy.

However, if we want to define what 'exclusive' to microsoft platforms means, then there's some wiggle room. Just like on PC where you need the EA app or Steam or Origin to play specific games, I can see Microsoft allowing their games on other platforms only if you launch said game in the Gamepass App (Though i don't believe it will be a gamepass app, i believe it will be a 3rd party app like Disney+)

 

[SLB1904]

ES6 isn't exclusive and Starfield is a timed exclusive.

Both of these are permanent exclusives. They will never come out on ps platform.

The irony in this thread is through the roof.
Only Sony is bad for having temporary exclusives but whistles about ms permanent exclusives.

 

[balls of snow]

Sony is really shook huh. Better to be silent and make plans behind the scenes. You bought fucking Bungie for god sake.

 

[Loxus]

Simple solution. Microsoft can agree to put out CoD on Sony patforms in perpetuity... 2 years after they release on Xbox. I'm sure that since timed exclusives are apparently ok, this wouldn't be a problem at all for Jim.

Except it had been said by both parties, COD will not be available on PlayStation platforms after a set time period.

This is what all this back and forth is about, keeping COD on PlayStation even if Xbox platforms get it 1-2 year before PlayStation.

 

[John Wick]

You're right, all they did was...draft up contact terms and negotiate exclusivity (for the cheap), or if you believe, paid nothing at all because no one with an Xbox buys JRPG's.

All sounds like balanced and fair competition at the moment.

The difference is no one forced SE to accept Sony's deal? They could have just turned it down. MS could have offered a better contract if they chose too. Why blame Sony when SE are looking out for their bottom line in accepting these deals. This goes for all other publishers/devs too.

 

[SLB1904]

Sony is really shook huh. Better to be silent and make plans behind the scenes. You bought fucking Bungie for god sake.

But bungie is pretty much independent as far as we know. They will keep releasing their games everywhere and Sony will get the profits. They didn't take bungie games of xbox.
No one would have a problem if Microsoft did the same. But obviously they are being shady about it

 

[Stuart360]

ES6 isn't exclusive and Starfield is a timed exclusive.

Does that suit you're wearing have time travel capabilities or something?

 

[John Wick]

Sony is really shook huh. Better to be silent and make plans behind the scenes. You bought fucking Bungie for god sake.

Why should they be silent? Were MS silent about Google search and ads?
Yes your right Bungie and AB are very similar in size/worth/IP and studios. You should definitely work in mergers and acquisitions

 

[StealthGoblin]

Translation : They're litterally shitting their pants right now

In all honesty, I think Microsoft need to be quite worried if their plan is to take COD off PlayStation. It feels like that is becoming less of a possibility for them.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Though I agree with you about the exclusivity deals situation, one thing to note.

Sony exclusivity deals are temporary, while Microsoft exclusivity deal is permanent.

Not true. Sony's big deals are facts. MS's deals so far havent shown that.

No Mojang or Bethesda games have been cut off yet. And none from ABK either. Even if some games are released on Xbox/PC only, they can always be timed exclusives back to Sony later which is no different than any timed exclusive deal anyone does.

Nobody ever said an MS owned game cant be timed. Just like Sony. Big purveyors of PS only mantra, yet years later they go PC porting. Insomniac in an old tweet even responded to a user if Spiderman would ever come PC. Their answer was a big bold "Never". Years later, Spiderman ports over and so does Miles Morales.

 

[SlimySnake]

Do you really think the market leader would be able to buy those publishers though?

Now that MS has bought Activision Blizzard, yes. Sony should easily be able to justify it to the regulators, especially if the same regulators have greenlit the Activision purchase.

The only problem is that SOny cant afford to buy Take2. Buying Ubisoft for $6-10 billion and capcom for $5 billion is a possibility but might not be enough.

 

[SLB1904]

Now that MS has bought Activision Blizzard, yes. Sony should easily be able to justify it to the regulators, especially if the same regulators have greenlit the Activision purchase.

The only problem is that SOny cant afford to buy Take2. Buying Ubisoft for $6-10 billion and capcom for $5 billion is a possibility but might not be enough.

Honestly waste of money. The same way with bungie. But that just me. I prefer new ips and new games

 

[CeeJay]

It strikes me that MS are mainly investing to control, not build the industry. Is that what you want from a potential market-leader?

It strikes me that Sony are mainly investing to control, not build the industry. Is that what you want from a potential market-leader?

 

[Three]

He was brought in for far more than gas and energy prices buddy. The point is a company that has rose their prices even when they are selling out of everything and making record profits has no leg to stand on in a detailed phase 2 where Microsoft and Activision and its lawyers can really get busy to detailing the ins and outs of the industry and how little impact Call of Duty will have on Sony's ability to compete.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/oth...eclared-on-rip-off-petrol-stations/ar-AAXVSsT



What Microsoft is doing with Game Pass is literally innovation in the market and it's quite literally ensuring the best deal for consumers. Meanwhile Sony has just increased prices on UK consumers when they were already basically market leader selling everything they can produce.

The only people delusional is anyone seriously believing this deal won't go through. The phase 2 deadline is March. If only there were a few things that were going to go so well for Sony between now and then to prove to CMA all is well. Can't imagine for the life of me what they could be.

Clearly you don't know what competition authorities are there to do. Their concerns aren't quarterly reports or RRPs. If they are selling out of everything and raising price the competition authority would actually look at that more favourably because they are not hindering new entrants or rivals. If anything they are making it easier.

What they go after are things that affect competition in a market. Things like predatory pricing (lowering price to take and sustain losses with the intent to remove/hurt competitors) or price fixing (where the big players in a given market collude to raise prices together).

Out of curiosity are you even from the UK? Do you know what's been going on in the fuel/energy sector recently?

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Except it had been said by both parties, COD will not be available on PlayStation platforms after a set time period.

Wrong, this has never been said. The deal would run out in 2027 or so, but it's not like they couldn't negotiate a new deal, at least in theory.

 

[Frank Horrigan]

Both of these are permanent exclusives. They will never come out on ps platform.

The irony in this thread is through the roof.
Only Sony is bad for having temporary exclusives but whistles about ms permanent exclusives.

Who's talking about Sony?
Apple, Amazon, Disney could enter the race within the next 18 months and lets not forget Nintendo.

Does that suit you're wearing have time travel capabilities or something?

Yes.

You wouldn't believe how often I have been mocked for guessing correctly the future of Microsoft. Most of the time it has happened on this very site

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

People are missing the wood for the trees. As much talk as Sony and Microsoft want to do to win internet points, the Activision deal goes beyond gaming on either xbox or Playstation.

Microsoft, a leviathon of a company, would own a considerable share in the 'gambling' market of the gaming industry. Putting aside COD MTX or Diablo MTX, we have to remember that many mobile games also comes with the purchase of ACTI. Those gambling revenues - something which the EU and UK are looking at banning, specifically in the areas of MTX - being wielded by a massive company like Microsoft (Or Apple, Or Amazon...) could create a serious problem to and for gamers.

The UK has already recognised gaming as an addiction - With EU following suit, and both are cracking down hard on gambling in the gaming arena. Mainly because gambling is illegal if you're under 18 (ymmv). Even though COD and Diablo come with a mature 18+ rating, the mobile games do not.

Step outside of the console wars and you see why the purchase of Acti is causing some disconcernment

People are missing the bigger picture here outside those console wars.

I said this in the other "inadequate" there but if this goes through what stops some other giant (I used Apple) from stepping in and buying up other major publishers and sticking their games exclusively on some shit piece of hardware that costs $1000?

Or making the next GTA exclusive to Stadia?

 

[SLB1904]

It strikes me that Sony are mainly investing to control, not build the industry. Is that what you want from a potential market-leader?

This makes no sense lol

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Honestly waste of money. The same way with bungie. But that just me. I prefer new ips and new games

Youre not going to get a ton of that anymore. Gamers contribute so much into certain game franchises with constant sales and mtx, the hey days of gaming 15+ years ago of tons of new random IPs is over. The last time we got lots of new IPs was the 360/PS3 gen.

 

[MikeM]

Does not matter which team you are on- any deal of this size should be scrutinized.

 

[TVexperto]

meanwhile sony raises prices for ps5

 

[Menzies]

The difference is no one forced SE to accept Sony's deal? They could have just turned it down. MS could have offered a better contract if they chose too. Why blame Sony when SE are looking out for their bottom line in accepting these deals. This goes for all other publishers/devs too.

It's leveraging their position to sit at the negotiating table with significantly less up-front cash than their competitor whilst still agreeing to terms.

You can be damn sure that Microsoft is paying a metric tonne more to pay for the same terms. And if you believe posters on a thread here yesterday, Sony don't even need to pay to keep JRPG's off Xbox.

 

[Loxus]

Wrong, this has never been said. The deal would run out in 2027 or so, but it's not like they couldn't negotiate a new deal, at least in theory.

Dude, you just proved my point when you said the deal would run out.

 

[Little Chicken]

Embarrassing. Microsoft should just revoke their 3-year offer.

 

[Iced Arcade]

Sony is working on a no year deal apparently.

 

[Kenshin775]

I think once the deal goes through Sony and MS will negotiate and Call of Duty will remain on Playstation for years to come. Sony is just scared of CoD coming to Game Pass.

MS has no reason to remove it from PS5 when consumers are switching to a subscription model for content anways. If they keep it on PS5 at $70 bucks they can look like the good guy and say look we didn't make it exclusive. when the reality is the vast majority will get a Game Pass subscription to play CoD because its "free" now.. MS just wants leverage to get CoD on Game Pass sooner.

 

[High Prophet of Regret]

 

[Loxus]

Not true. Sony's big deals are facts. MS's deals so far havent shown that.

No Mojang or Bethesda games have been cut off yet. And none from ABK either. Even if some games are released on Xbox/PC only, they can always be timed exclusives back to Sony later which is no different than any timed exclusive deal anyone does.

Nobody ever said an MS owned game cant be timed. Just like Sony. Big purveyors of PS only mantra, yet years later they go PC porting. Insomniac in an old tweet even responded to a user if Spiderman would ever come PC. Their answer was a big bold "Never". Years later, Spiderman ports over and so does Miles Morales.

Clearly you haven't been following this situation around COD.

 

[Neo_game]

You know what I love about this is just how seriously Sony is taking this compared to some of the posters on this board who initially dismissed this as 'PS doesnt NEED CoD'. They will be fine they said. Clearly Sony themselves think this will destroy their business.

There was a stat posted in those acquisition threads that pointed out how 45% of the console online playerbase plays call of duty. Thats a huge chunk of players that Sony relies upon to keep their 46 milllion PS+ userbases going. Not to mention all the other revenue these players bring in as they invest in the PS ecosystem. Sony will simply be a different company without the cod userbase. They would have to completely trim down and become more like Nintendo because their revenues which rely heavily on PS+ subs and PSN digital sales will take a massive hit from losing the CoD userbase. That means fewer revenues, fewer profit, fewer first party games, cheaper and thus less powerful consoles just to stay competitive.

Nintendo pretty much had to merge their handheld and console business to reduce costs and stay relevant. Their industry leading devs forced to work on a 0.19 tflops hardware in 2022. But they dont have a choice and had to kill off either the handheld business or the console business and they basically chose to merge them the best they could. Sony can also cut down and be leaner business, but it will not be the same Sony AAA after AAA business as we know it today. Cost cuttings alone will result in fewer first party studios and fewer third party deals like FF7 and FF16. If you're a Sony studios fan like I am, people need to fucking worried about this deal going through. They will survive of course, but at what cost?

The best selling COD is around 30 million. On average they sell around 20 million I guess. If Sony contributes 50% to that it comes to 10million on average. Not sure if COD is getting more popular or worse but who is to say that COD will be best selling games in next 10 years as well ? It will be an amazing achievement considering it is not going to be on PS5 and PS6 in future. But who knows ? May be BF will get better ? Probably Sony is going to partner with them once COD is no longer available and be hoping BF can start making good games again. lol

 

[xHunter]

Jim Ryan doing his gangsta shit.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

People are missing the bigger picture here outside those console wars.

I said this in the other "inadequate" there but if this goes through what stops some other giant (I used Apple) from stepping in and buying up other major publishers and sticking their games exclusively on some shit piece of hardware that costs $1000?

Or making the next GTA exclusive to Stadia?

The realization that the games market can’t be easily bought out

Stadia failed fast and Google quickly realized they hit off more than they could chew

 

[John Wick]

It's leveraging their position to sit at the negotiating table with significantly less up-front cash than their competitor whilst still agreeing to terms.

You can be damn sure that Microsoft is paying a metric tonne more to pay for the same terms. And if you believe posters on a thread here yesterday, Sony don't even need to pay to keep JRPG's off Xbox.

So we are agreed all 3 companies can bid for exclusives timed or not. So you should blame the companies who accept these deals and screw over their fans on other platforms.
It's funny how it's always Sony forced/made/took away but not the actual company who makes or owns the IP. It's never their fault.

 

[balls of snow]

Why should they be silent? Were MS silent about Google search and ads?
Yes your right Bungie and AB are very similar in size/worth/IP and studios. You should definitely work in mergers and acquisitions

And they already said their piece on it on official record. Everything else is backbitting starting with that Jim Ryan quote about cod. Looking at this from the outside, its a good thing im just a fanboy of games and devs, imagine defending any one of these mega corps lol.