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If Microsoft offered only Halo/GOW/Forza as exclusives, would Xbox still be viable?
- Thread starter maxcriden
- Start date
I do think GaaS is a good way to go (at least for some games. I also imagine we'll be seeing more games from Valve when Source 2 is finished) but you can't pretend Valve doesn't work on games when they work on three of the most popular games on Steam.
I only play one of those exclusive series (Halo) and I'm perfectly content as an XB owner with GwG and the other games on the system, so sure. Just like despite missing the vast majority of common games, people buy the Wii U for its small roster of exclusives.
I think at this point, it's also worth conceding that exclusives don't matter the way they once did. Xbox wouldn't be Xbox without Halo, but the XB1 fumbled its advantage this gen because of its death by a thousand cuts marketing, and not realizing that "hey this plays 90% of the same games slightly better" was a pretty strong argument for the PS4.
I think at this point, it's also worth conceding that exclusives don't matter the way they once did. Xbox wouldn't be Xbox without Halo, but the XB1 fumbled its advantage this gen because of its death by a thousand cuts marketing, and not realizing that "hey this plays 90% of the same games slightly better" was a pretty strong argument for the PS4.
Yeah, I can see someone not interested in any of those. Hell, I only see two or three at most for me.
Crayon
Member
Maybe I'm old, but I want to see Nintendo have a general console again where I can play my third party games. I have high hopes for switch.
Backlogger
Member
I know you are trying to frame a bigger discussion here but I'm guessing this thread was created in light of the Scalebound cancellation announcement.
I think there is a simpler question to ask.
Did you buy your Xbox One or were you going to buy an Xbox One for Scalebound?
I know sometimes on a gaming forum like this we live in a little bit of a bubble but I frankly don't know anyone who knew or cared about Sacalebound who bought an Xbox. They bought it for Halo, Minecraft and other Multiplats. I bought mine for BC, Halo, GOW and other reasons.
I don't think Scalebound is going to make or break them.
I actually think Sea of Theives is much more important game and will sell more copies than Scalebound would have
I think there is a simpler question to ask.
Did you buy your Xbox One or were you going to buy an Xbox One for Scalebound?
I know sometimes on a gaming forum like this we live in a little bit of a bubble but I frankly don't know anyone who knew or cared about Sacalebound who bought an Xbox. They bought it for Halo, Minecraft and other Multiplats. I bought mine for BC, Halo, GOW and other reasons.
I don't think Scalebound is going to make or break them.
I actually think Sea of Theives is much more important game and will sell more copies than Scalebound would have
hydrophilic attack
Member
i mean that has been basically it for over five years
so maybe?
so maybe?
Bought my Xbox for Halo 5 & Gears. The former ended up disappointing me and I've since lost all confidence in 343i. Gears on the other hand is now on PC so there's no reason for me to have any Xbox consoles hooked up (besides 4K blurays but I'm still waiting for them to reach this country)
To be fair you listed JRPGs, a baseball game, an open world single player and a single player action adventure with a MP component. No racers, no shooters, no multiplayer shooters, no heavily service based games, Mmos etc. so yeah, a lot of people aren't interested in those
What are the top 5 games likely to be played at any time. GTAv, NBA2k, Madden, COD, Battlefield etc. those genres aren't covered by Sony
LordRaptor
Member
People who want a red ocean competing Nintendo - as in making GC style consoles that are broadly in line with the competition in power terms and capable of receiving third party ports by default - inherently want an Xbox division competing and being profitable on its own merits, not competing on Papa Microsofts multi billion dollar bail out money safety nets.
Calibos
Member
The trouble with the argument is that MS doesn't care about exclusives like Sony anymore. They have chosen the path of the "ecosystem" and "Games as a service"instead.
Also, it's all past tense. I bought my OG Xbox for Halo alone. Then Xbox Live sealed me into the Xbox ecosystem for pretty much life even though I game on PS4 and PC to. They added Gears and Forza in the 360 era and locked in millions of fans and get way more of my money even now.
Franchises get long in the tooth though and gamers are more critical these days in my opinion so not having fresh IP's like Scalebound get released hurts them of course, but when you are behind in the great race to the top, you have to cut losses when you can and focus on what makes sense financially.
Games as a service is also a reality that Destiny and many others have been financially successful at and I think that factors heavily in MS's decisions and other publishers as well.
Also, it's all past tense. I bought my OG Xbox for Halo alone. Then Xbox Live sealed me into the Xbox ecosystem for pretty much life even though I game on PS4 and PC to. They added Gears and Forza in the 360 era and locked in millions of fans and get way more of my money even now.
Franchises get long in the tooth though and gamers are more critical these days in my opinion so not having fresh IP's like Scalebound get released hurts them of course, but when you are behind in the great race to the top, you have to cut losses when you can and focus on what makes sense financially.
Games as a service is also a reality that Destiny and many others have been financially successful at and I think that factors heavily in MS's decisions and other publishers as well.
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
Gears multiplayer is unlike anything else on any platform.
Yeah, I'd keep buying Xbox's for Halo and Gears and third party games no problem.
Yeah, I'd keep buying Xbox's for Halo and Gears and third party games no problem.
HBx2000
Member
Since when does Microsoft offer these as exclusives? Only Sony really knows how to do that. Because a few of them are also on PC,
in the past (Halo & Gears), present (Gears 4 & FH 3) and future (Halo 6). I know, Microsoft Windows only. But still playable without owning an Xbox.
Although I still think Xbox is viable, even without these exclusives, because their focus is more broader. Sony makes me feel that it's only about games, nothing more.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
Halo alone is definitely worth it and a big deal, so the answer is yes. That said, even if Xbox only offered those three as exclusives, the majority are buying 3rd party titles regardless. As long as xbox continues to be a popular target for pretty much all major 3rd party game releases, Xbox will always be viable regardless of what exclusives release for the platform.
Adding to this: Xbox as a brand has consistently secured its own exclusives outside of those 3 franchises for 15 years running now. So in light of that fact, please proceed with the doom and gloom campaign.
Adding to this: Xbox as a brand has consistently secured its own exclusives outside of those 3 franchises for 15 years running now. So in light of that fact, please proceed with the doom and gloom campaign.
They have shown they are not. Year to year that has been their regular output of releases. Sure there have been side titles like Sunset Overdrive and KI, but it's hardly enough. It's been interesting to watch them fall apart and stagnate. Forza is still the best racing game out there, meanwhile they have no Idea what to do with Halo. While Halo 5 was gorgeous it suffered with out single screen multiplayer of any kind. The recent Gears was just another one of those games, too afraid to try anything new.
To be clear, I'm definitely not denying that there is a subsection of people for whom Forza and maybe Halo (I doubt Gears is a decider) would be more important than PS4's exclusives (no argument that Forza is worlds better than any car game on PS4 right now), but the deck is definitely stacked to make this fairly unlikely.
Of course, console brand "choice" for a specific gen or overall is certainly multifaceted, and for the vast majority of people the most deciding factor is "what console my friends are playing multiplayer games on". And this is of course predicated on the idea that only one console is allowed, and other factors like whether or not PC versions are an acceptable option for games where they do the "one console brand + PC" thing like newer Xbox games with Windows 10, Street Fighter V, and a decent chunk of Square Enix's "PS4 exclusive" catalog.
Halo and Forza are enough to keep me on Xbox, but I can't say the same for others. I do hope MS takes more "risks" with exclusives, Sony is destroying them there.
I got the original Xbox for Halo 2 and Forza Motorsport, Xbox 360 for Halo 3 and Forza 2, and finally the Xbox One for Forza 5 and any future Halos. Gears is a nice bonus, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I've been slowly creeping more to my PS4 though. First party games in combination with voluntary Japanese third party exclusives are too good to miss.
I got the original Xbox for Halo 2 and Forza Motorsport, Xbox 360 for Halo 3 and Forza 2, and finally the Xbox One for Forza 5 and any future Halos. Gears is a nice bonus, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I've been slowly creeping more to my PS4 though. First party games in combination with voluntary Japanese third party exclusives are too good to miss.
Hibiki Kurosawa
Member
Aren't sales kinda dwindling on all these franchises? MS needs to keep things fresh with new big franchises here and there. So no, I don't think so.
Seth Enosh
Member
Halo is basically the only reason to have an Xbox at this point for me. Every other game I play with friends is available on PS4 (titanfall, destiny) although my friends all have Xbox and not PS4 because of halo.
therealbigrich
Member
If they could contantly maintain the better visual and performance for 3rd party game and continue to at least get those I think it will be fine honestly. Will it win a generation I doubt it but I can see people still buying to have the best console performance available. Plus MS would likely be happy with less risk of losing money on game investment .
The answer would definitely be no, and there's no question Microsoft needs to keep a focus on a multi-pronged approach of larger tent-pole studios, third-party contracting, purchasing stable production houses, and smaller-budget studio startups/investments. That's not cheap, and during any period of depressed sales, that's bound to make any bean-counter's eyes pop.
That being said, this premise of "only X, Y and Z, series" feels feels reductive to the point of ignoring the whole history of the division's output. What I'm going into here goes beyond the scope of the OP, but I think it's implicit in similar criticisms I've seen; the more I see this "the popular games don't count, and distinct one-offs also don't count because they're not popular" the more I realize what a loaded premise it is. If you applied that reasoning to most companies, you'd have the same conclusion.
Even this gen, which I'd characterize in terms of platform strategy for MS as a train-wreck, there are a lot of Microsoft-published titles I can point to. A lot of those have been released on PC as well, which I think is mostly a response to sales realities for publishers in general and the aforementioned platform strategy. I also think console and PC markets aren't interchangeable the way platform enthusiasts (and others, to be fair) assume. There's a reason both markets exist. For Microsoft Studios as a publisher, I think the console+pc releases for many titles is healthier for the division as a whole, in spite of platform enthusiasts maligning it for "taking away exclusives."
That being said, this premise of "only X, Y and Z, series" feels feels reductive to the point of ignoring the whole history of the division's output. What I'm going into here goes beyond the scope of the OP, but I think it's implicit in similar criticisms I've seen; the more I see this "the popular games don't count, and distinct one-offs also don't count because they're not popular" the more I realize what a loaded premise it is. If you applied that reasoning to most companies, you'd have the same conclusion.
Even this gen, which I'd characterize in terms of platform strategy for MS as a train-wreck, there are a lot of Microsoft-published titles I can point to. A lot of those have been released on PC as well, which I think is mostly a response to sales realities for publishers in general and the aforementioned platform strategy. I also think console and PC markets aren't interchangeable the way platform enthusiasts (and others, to be fair) assume. There's a reason both markets exist. For Microsoft Studios as a publisher, I think the console+pc releases for many titles is healthier for the division as a whole, in spite of platform enthusiasts maligning it for "taking away exclusives."
Sure but the dwindling sales are still relatively strong. Halo is not what it use to be but so far Halo 5 is still one of the 3 best selling exclusives this gen. A far fall from it heyday but certainly still a viable game.
I did say it wasn't exhaustive, but all right let's add in those genres:
Racers: Driveclub (not now, but it did mean something for a time), Gran Turismo Sport
MMO's: Final Fantasy XIV
Shooters is more limited, with the lone exclusive being the flawed-but-pretty launch title Killzone: Shadow Fall. Sony's probably shelved that franchise and Resistance for now. Not as if there's a shortage of multi-platform shooters, including the ones in your Top 5.
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by heavily service-based games.
As for your top 5 list (you forgot FIFA), to be fair those games aren't even really "this gen" games by and large (they only just started with COD and Battlefield). And they've all been console pack-ins at different stages so I think that's also a contributing factor there (but that's probably a chicken/egg thing, they were packed in BECAUSE they're popular).
Starfield
Member
As I see it right now....the Xbox is an unnesecary product and I used to be a huge xbox fanboy but damn, Microsoft really fucked up.
You buy a PS4 because of their exclusives and because it doesn't cost much to play the latest games and such. You don't need to know alot about PC stuff, just insert CD and thats it.
Xbox used to be a console like that too. You had choice, either you go with a Playstation or Xbox...depending on which exclusives you like more...it's kinda like choosing between a Pokemon game (do I want Moon or Sun?) but since all of their "exclusives" are coming to PC too I don't have a reason to ever EVER buy a console, or better said Microsoft console again.
You buy a PS4 because of their exclusives and because it doesn't cost much to play the latest games and such. You don't need to know alot about PC stuff, just insert CD and thats it.
Xbox used to be a console like that too. You had choice, either you go with a Playstation or Xbox...depending on which exclusives you like more...it's kinda like choosing between a Pokemon game (do I want Moon or Sun?) but since all of their "exclusives" are coming to PC too I don't have a reason to ever EVER buy a console, or better said Microsoft console again.
xviper
Member
nope
FH3 is the best racing game i have ever played and i played FH2&3 a lot for a racing game that i think about skipping FH4
don't enjoy that much GOW and see it as a above average generic shooter
Halo 5 MP is fucking amazing, i hope the upcoming Halo MP games will be like 5 , but i will not buy a console for just 1 game unless it's Zelda
FH3 is the best racing game i have ever played and i played FH2&3 a lot for a racing game that i think about skipping FH4
don't enjoy that much GOW and see it as a above average generic shooter
Halo 5 MP is fucking amazing, i hope the upcoming Halo MP games will be like 5 , but i will not buy a console for just 1 game unless it's Zelda
Maybe- the only way it could be viable is if it was sufficiently powerful to stomp PlayStation's hardware offering and it would become PC lite and the best place to play the multiplats.
People would buy Playstation as a secondary machine for the exclusives or would make a value decision, if they had limited resources and placed the exclusive offerings above the multiplats, and primarily adopt it.
I would say XBOX would grab the majority herd of multi platters in this case. The :bros,The Chad's". They would have to be noticeably and exploitable more powerful while somehow maintaining a similar price point PS4 showed that price+power kill brand loyalty with Xboners switching over en masse. If I only play COD i want to play it on the best system possible if the price isn't bananas.
If playstation is close in performance/price AND has exclusives - it is game over for Xbox brand. It is just Window's crappy little brother.
People would buy Playstation as a secondary machine for the exclusives or would make a value decision, if they had limited resources and placed the exclusive offerings above the multiplats, and primarily adopt it.
I would say XBOX would grab the majority herd of multi platters in this case. The :bros,The Chad's". They would have to be noticeably and exploitable more powerful while somehow maintaining a similar price point PS4 showed that price+power kill brand loyalty with Xboners switching over en masse. If I only play COD i want to play it on the best system possible if the price isn't bananas.
If playstation is close in performance/price AND has exclusives - it is game over for Xbox brand. It is just Window's crappy little brother.
Genghis Khan
Member
People are really freaking out about Scalebound huh?
I said in America. 360 still sold about twice as much as PS3 did in the US.
You have to realize people in America who game on Xbox have generally very limited tastes(not necessarily arguing that as a negative even though i dont agree), and don't need a wide variety of games to satisfy them.
All the third party deals last year pretty much bombed because nobody on Xbox cared about them beyond the core 3 franchises MS markets and the third party titles
TheRealTalker
Banned
it seems the same thing is happening to MS in terms of diversity as did for the 360
you'd assume they would learn their lesson
you'd assume they would learn their lesson
DOWN
Banned
I own an Xbox One and PS4. After the Scalebound news I looked at that Microsoft studio projects thread and was shocked at how there's only a handful of AAA games left confirmed in development by Microsoft. It's slim pickings compared to the Sony studio projects thread. I really hope that Microsoft cancelled Scalebound because of a bigger picture in their plans.
therealbigrich
Member
This is a good example of how they would lose some console sales but make it up on the PC sales side. Still think as long as you can walk into a store and pay less for a Xbox console than a PC I think console's sales will be OK
DOWN
Banned
Nah, theyre freaking out about how Microsoft has seemingly only three of their own AAA franchises being made in their studios now and their third party relationships have worn some. That first Microsoft exclusives thread in the OP has shrunk in notable ways compared to the competition.
Crayon
Member
It's true. I'd like to see Xbox operate as a business that makes money and differentiates itself while competing.
yongeandcollege
Member
If viable means it could sell between 30 to 50 million in a generation, then yes.
Not really. Scalebound was just it was the straw that broke the camel's back. It could have been anything else.
Head.spawn
Junior Member
Proof that if you say something enough times, people believe it.
Navidson REC
Member
I just don't get this sentiment. Yes, in some regards Halo 5 might be considered another step back (definitely with regard to storytelling), but the base gameplay and its MP is incredible and a marked improvement over Halo 4.
If they get their shit together with regard to SP, and build on Halo 5's MP foundation, Halo 6 could just be the best Halo ever.
Not for me.
Despite being a big Gears and Halo fan, both franchise's entries this gen have disappointed me. With Gears 4 being just okay at best, and Halo 5 being a massive disappointment (again, for me).
As for Forza, the only game I had previously bought was Forza 3 on the 360 and enjoyed it, but didn't consider Forza 4 5 and 6 to be doing anything special warranting a purchase, especially after GT5 excelled in some areas that Forza still hasn't caught up on (and GT Sport also skimping out on now, which is why I'm not getting that either). Horizon 1 & 2 didn't interest me enough from the demos that I played, but Forza Horizon 3 feels like something special.
Aside from that, I liked having the remastered campaigns in MCC but that's pretty much it.
So a remaster title and Forza Horizon 3. These are the only things I find worthwhile in over 3 years from these franchises. Absolutely not viable if these are the only things MS would offer.
Thankfully there's stuff like Sunset Overdrive, Killer Instinct and EA Access on the system that makes me keep it. But yeah, cancellation of Scalebound and a bleak future outlook in regards to exclusives that interest me have stopped me from even consider getting the Scorpio at this point in time (where as before, I had planned to).
Even if they showcase a ton of new titles this E3 that look great, I'll wait till they're out rather than take their word for it.
Despite being a big Gears and Halo fan, both franchise's entries this gen have disappointed me. With Gears 4 being just okay at best, and Halo 5 being a massive disappointment (again, for me).
As for Forza, the only game I had previously bought was Forza 3 on the 360 and enjoyed it, but didn't consider Forza 4 5 and 6 to be doing anything special warranting a purchase, especially after GT5 excelled in some areas that Forza still hasn't caught up on (and GT Sport also skimping out on now, which is why I'm not getting that either). Horizon 1 & 2 didn't interest me enough from the demos that I played, but Forza Horizon 3 feels like something special.
Aside from that, I liked having the remastered campaigns in MCC but that's pretty much it.
So a remaster title and Forza Horizon 3. These are the only things I find worthwhile in over 3 years from these franchises. Absolutely not viable if these are the only things MS would offer.
Thankfully there's stuff like Sunset Overdrive, Killer Instinct and EA Access on the system that makes me keep it. But yeah, cancellation of Scalebound and a bleak future outlook in regards to exclusives that interest me have stopped me from even consider getting the Scorpio at this point in time (where as before, I had planned to).
Even if they showcase a ton of new titles this E3 that look great, I'll wait till they're out rather than take their word for it.
As a gamer, it comes down to personal preference.
As a long term business strategy I don't think so. They're doing alright now but I don't see how the Xbox audience doesn't shrink unless it's always the most powerful console, which is unrealistic. Inevitably I believe MS's audience is going to shrink unless they find a way to diversify their lineup.
As a long term business strategy I don't think so. They're doing alright now but I don't see how the Xbox audience doesn't shrink unless it's always the most powerful console, which is unrealistic. Inevitably I believe MS's audience is going to shrink unless they find a way to diversify their lineup.
Kssio_Aug
Member
I thought I was the only one feeling that way about Forza Horizon. lol
FH2 was the best racing game I played, like ever... and because of that I played quite a lot. However, FH3 felt so much the same (which is not bad, since the game is awesome) that I honeslty lost interest almost immediatly. Will keep playing it here and there, but it didn't manage to keep me interested as FH2 first did.
That said, except if FH4 brings a different formula, I won't bother either. I'd like to see them adding a proper career mode, change a bit of the tone to something different than eletronic party event, and maybe even add more road races.
The game features awesome driving mechanics, but I think it needs to diversify itself a bit more.
Stallion Dan
Member
When I bought a 360 this is pretty much all they offered afterwards.
Played the exclusives already out and sold it.
They rely too much on those 3 IPs, they run into the ground at this point.
Played the exclusives already out and sold it.
They rely too much on those 3 IPs, they run into the ground at this point.
Katana_Strikes
Member
Along with strong third party offerings, arent these the franchises that made Xbox and have since made it viable to a strong core audience?
So yes they would be viable. But this gen has shown the franchises are looking tired and numbers are heavily down so they won't continue to be viable alone, going forward. They'd still play a decent part to that core audience, the same Mario and Zelda do for Nintendo. But like them, they can't completely carry a system alone.
Sony defo has the right idea in its robust, varied line up. They may not be all great sellers all the time i.e. Gravity Rush/Team ICO series/Wipeout etc. but they draw a wider audience and cater to pretty much everyone as opposed to just one side of the market. It's something MS should have been doing last gen, building a great first party offering. And by the looks MS doesn't seem to have done an awful lot to rectify that even this gen for the next round. It's again pretty much relying on the same game and same studios. And that aint going to cut it these days.
So yes they would be viable. But this gen has shown the franchises are looking tired and numbers are heavily down so they won't continue to be viable alone, going forward. They'd still play a decent part to that core audience, the same Mario and Zelda do for Nintendo. But like them, they can't completely carry a system alone.
Sony defo has the right idea in its robust, varied line up. They may not be all great sellers all the time i.e. Gravity Rush/Team ICO series/Wipeout etc. but they draw a wider audience and cater to pretty much everyone as opposed to just one side of the market. It's something MS should have been doing last gen, building a great first party offering. And by the looks MS doesn't seem to have done an awful lot to rectify that even this gen for the next round. It's again pretty much relying on the same game and same studios. And that aint going to cut it these days.