KappaFappa
Banned
I'll actually play vega now, I'm really liking old characters come in with new mechanics
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
Street Fighter V: Vega Reveal Trailer
- Thread starter Flying Wonkey
- Start date
Does charging makes you feel more manly?
Charging sucks, it forces to play your character in a weird way that you wouldn't need to play had the game no charge mechanics. It doesn't add anything, There's not a single thing that charge controls can do that normal motions can't, but there're lots of things that normal controls can do that charge can't.
You invested lots of time in learning the tricks of charge controls, I'll shed a tear for you, man.
Man at first I was kinda meh about Vega and his reveal, but after watching the video a few times i'm actually pretty excited for him.
Loving the little spin move he does when he changes stances (you can see this from the first combo he does in the video at 0:16, he starts the combo with the claw and in the middle does a little spin when he puts it away and finished without the claw).
He has a few interesting new moves, the backwards claw slash that he does in the next combo, that one he actually does at the end of the combo after the stance dance, he does a target combo (at least that's what it looks like) and then has a slash move without the claw.
the next combo also has the new special (at first i thought he did a stance change but it looks like the same target combo from the end of the first series).
The next section he does a wall dive which either A: he does low enough to combo or B: they've added enough hit stun (also taken away the knockdown, possible knockdown with claw?) to continue the combo into roll which looks like it ends in the flip kick (possibly when he doesn't have the claw? might be a slash with it).
His Izuna drop was started from the ground, I wonder if that will be a command grab now rather than being part of the wall jump (or possibly like running bear grab it has two versions depending on the proximity to the opponent?).
Okay scratch that, still watching the video it looks as though EX roll does not allow you to combo but without the claw he still does the flip at the end which results in a knock down. Following that Vega does an EX wall dive which hits twice and allows him to combo into the EX wall jump (which kinda negates my proximity theory from before on the Izuna drop) which looks like his old SF4 combo (just basic hit into ex wall jump) although after he ends with the swan dive he then uses V-trigger which looks as though Vega tosses a rose at his opponent (sorry Dudley) and when it hits, Vega has his dash through follow up.
This looks like it doesn't really matter where on screen he is because at the end of the video he is across the screen and hits with his V-trigger which still results in the follow up slash which results in a knockdown (opponent is spinning in the air, not sure if this means anything in relation to the type of knockdown, techable or otherwise).
and of course ends with his super. That is hard to tell if he cancels it off of his wall jump or if the first part hits just like it did at the end of SF4.
Kinda long write up but those are the things I could take away from Vega, I like that his V-trigger might be able to blow up someone trying to hard zone him (oh god if sim is in I hope i have something to deal with that) and lets him start his Oki game again.
He looks pretty awesome and someone I might have to mess around with.
Loving the little spin move he does when he changes stances (you can see this from the first combo he does in the video at 0:16, he starts the combo with the claw and in the middle does a little spin when he puts it away and finished without the claw).
He has a few interesting new moves, the backwards claw slash that he does in the next combo, that one he actually does at the end of the combo after the stance dance, he does a target combo (at least that's what it looks like) and then has a slash move without the claw.
the next combo also has the new special (at first i thought he did a stance change but it looks like the same target combo from the end of the first series).
The next section he does a wall dive which either A: he does low enough to combo or B: they've added enough hit stun (also taken away the knockdown, possible knockdown with claw?) to continue the combo into roll which looks like it ends in the flip kick (possibly when he doesn't have the claw? might be a slash with it).
His Izuna drop was started from the ground, I wonder if that will be a command grab now rather than being part of the wall jump (or possibly like running bear grab it has two versions depending on the proximity to the opponent?).
Okay scratch that, still watching the video it looks as though EX roll does not allow you to combo but without the claw he still does the flip at the end which results in a knock down. Following that Vega does an EX wall dive which hits twice and allows him to combo into the EX wall jump (which kinda negates my proximity theory from before on the Izuna drop) which looks like his old SF4 combo (just basic hit into ex wall jump) although after he ends with the swan dive he then uses V-trigger which looks as though Vega tosses a rose at his opponent (sorry Dudley) and when it hits, Vega has his dash through follow up.
This looks like it doesn't really matter where on screen he is because at the end of the video he is across the screen and hits with his V-trigger which still results in the follow up slash which results in a knockdown (opponent is spinning in the air, not sure if this means anything in relation to the type of knockdown, techable or otherwise).
and of course ends with his super. That is hard to tell if he cancels it off of his wall jump or if the first part hits just like it did at the end of SF4.
Kinda long write up but those are the things I could take away from Vega, I like that his V-trigger might be able to blow up someone trying to hard zone him (oh god if sim is in I hope i have something to deal with that) and lets him start his Oki game again.
He looks pretty awesome and someone I might have to mess around with.
jasminlovesyoux
Banned
using spanish flag colours
Oh that is awesome
Wished i liked Street Fighter cuz this game looks gorgeous
i wont play him if he's not a charge char lol
i see too much scrubby(?) crying about charge chars
Arc Christelle
Member
As a charge player I spit on you.
Charge characters have a unique mix of offense and defense. Being able to buffer your attacks in the midst of your rush down and being able to break out of their own defense when an opening is available makes them unique. Plus doing a psycho crusher or Buffalo with a HCB or QCF is fucking dumb.
sixteen-bit
Member
from the other thread
is link sick?
jasminlovesyoux
Banned
Personally I've played Vega since Street Fighter 2. But get this, I HATE charge moves. I've just had to put up with them for all these years. I love playing Vega for his speed and normals but the possibility of not every move being a charge is exciting me.
Oh no, charging makes me play different and we all know different is bad. Homogenous controls for the win.
Dark armpits for everyone!
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
Every time Ryu raises his arm in his round win pose it looks like he has a huge bruise
m_shortpants
Member
Weird? Forces you??
KnuckleDu's offensive Guile says hello.
Charging motions don't force you to do anything. Decapre and Urien are good examples of that.
how would you balance sonic booms if not to make them charge? you couldn't maintain the overall speed (recovery) and fundamental purpose of the move without coming up with some other kind of restriction (like requiring meter) to prevent abuse. being able to walk back and forth and instantly activate a scissor kick or headbutt would be ridiculous. removing charge doesn't work unless you fundamentally alter certain movesets--in other words, you're fixing what ain't broke and reducing gameplay variety to appease people who are too lazy/afraid/scrubby to spend a little time becoming acclimated to a different style.
Dreams-Visions
Member
looks amazing.
I don't like playing charge characters but I don't agree with this at all.
Hellshingu
Member
Well this was a nice surprise to come home to. I wasn't expecting Claw to make it into this game at all but I am excited to play him.
(PLS be better than USF4 Claw)
I've played my share of charge or partial characters over the years (including significant time using SFA Chun & Nash, Alex, Remy, Oro, Q, Decapre), and I'm certain that I prefer standard motions. I think charge motions provided a certain element that resulted in some unique playstyles, but I dislike the idea of a character having to crouch block (or standing block) while not on defense. I hate watching it, I hate doing it, I hate playing against it.
It wouldn't bug me if there were the standard amount of charge characters in SFV, but in looking at things from a "for the good of the franchise" perspective, I'm not going to shed a tear for them being phased out. Easier inputs, more fans, less elitism, I'm okay with that stuff. Charge motions kind of feel more 90's to me than anything. We'll see if they are missed. I'm sure Urien will be charge based.
Have you seen Nash? Also, chill with the scrub talk. It's not about laziness/fear/whatever other belittling term you are throwing out there, it's about mass appeal. Big picture.
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
I've not only seen Nash, but I've played Nash and his boom is nothing like Guile's from a gameplay standpoint. the differences in start-up and recovery basically make it a different move. do you need some explanation about the mechanics to understand better?
i'm not sure how having a few charge characters harms the game's mass appeal at all. there are far more important factors for that than staple mechanics.
try this:
honestly, I doubt anyone who's against charge moves will come up with any actual reasons that aren't bullshit like "it's tricky" or "it's unpopular"
Right, it's why guile would still fit and not be a clone. Charlie's booms are more like poison now.
It allows for faster special moves with less recovery, which wouldn't exist otherwise because of balance issues.
JrBaconCheeseburger
Member
YES!!!!!
Played him all through SF4-USF4.
Cannot wait.
Played him all through SF4-USF4.
Cannot wait.
Spinosaurus
Member
SF4 on the 3DS made me realize exactly how fucking stupid charge moves are without any charge requirements.
Omnistalgic
Member
Hmmm not sure what you are seeing there man. Looks like Ken with a new hairstyle in those shots. Also Ken looks ridiculous in SSF2
You asked how to balance sonic booms if they aren't charge anymore. I pointed out that it's been done already......
By changing its function entirely. The sonic boom archetype is now gone.
m_shortpants
Member
I know, I was just adding to your points.
Right...they aren't booms they are just kinda shitty fireballs now. The idea of a good fast recovering projectile in the way booms traditionally have been goes out the window when you have to balance everything around instant moves.
I dont wanna lose diversity because some people don't get the mechanics.
That's bullshit and you know it. There're plenty of ways to balance these other than their input method. I suggest you to try Rising Thunder (and anybody that thinks charge is good) and you'll understand why chars should be played on their moveset, not their input method.
Sonic boom is all you have, then explain me why Chun's shitty balls are charge? Awful recovery, awful damage, awful range. What are they balancing exactly? Charge motions are there to contempt charge fanatics. Not to balance anything out.
They still have fast recovery relative to other projectiles on Nash in SFV. They just have really bad startup relative to traditional ones. It lets him do the full-screen walk-behind with his slow Fireball that Guile's done forever.
Probably there to balance out her amazing mobility, awesome pokes, and combo potential. They allow her to control space, but not as well as better fireballs.
And you can keep your rising thunder. I'll continue to appreciate games that try their own thing and appreciate that they're not the same.
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
So now we're charge fanatics just because we like a little variety? I mean, I loved Guile precisely because he played so differently.
Apparently appreciating the gameplay differences and balances charge moves bring is a bad thing.
crap monkey
Member
Charge moves are there in order to control the frequency and method in which you can do specials in order to strike a balance between various sorts of gameplay styles that otherwise would not be limited due to charge. For example. if you gave Honda the ability to headbutt while walking forward it would completely change the balance of the character. They're there to regulate certain characters and without charge moves those characters would play completely differently. Honda would be borderline broken if he didn't have to make the sacrifice between moving forward and playing offensively without the defensive option of headbutt or buttslam. You gain the life lead with Honda first, and then make them come to you, sitting on the life lead with your great defensive options. If Decapre teleport mixup was done with a command her offensive game would be too strong. She could jump in, do a quick blockstring, teleport to the other side, then do another quick string and then teleport again. Her "auto mixup" would be even more pronounced without charging there to regulate the frequency of her ability to teleport. Without charging, she wouldn't play the same.
You can make the argument that those character should then be balanced differently in order to accommodate regular command inputs rather than charges, and I can see why you think it sucks, but I don't think eliminating charge moves from a game that is heavily based on footsies and controlling space would be beneficial. All it would do is just limit the type of variable gameplay from the roster. Guile without charge moves and no balance changes leads to the 3DS version of SSFIV, where he was an overpowered monster due to instant touchscreen sonic booms. Guile balanced to accommodate no charges looks like Nash, where he plays completely differently, is completely oriented towards offense, and fundamentally plays nothing like Guile does. The magic of charge moves is that characters like Guile and Nash can co-exist in the same game simply because charge moves fundamentally change how characters control. If you think charge moves suck, don't play the characters with charge moves. But don't use your disdain for them to dictate the loss of diversity and richness of Street Fighter v's potential gameplay.
No
They are fun to use and let you attack while you attack.
Just dont jump in on guile and you will be fine
direct_quote
Member
Today we are all charge fanatics.
I prefer charge inputs because I tend to mess up command inputs more. Why should they limit players like myself who prefer this method just to appeal to people like you?
<3avatar quote.
Anyway, I'm sure everyone would love it if Chun had QCF motions combined with her amazing footsies. Imagine if there was a game where you could walk back and forth waiting to hit crouch forward into super!
You can't talk about variety when half the cast in SF games are charge characters. I play chars because their moveset, not because their input method, unless the control method is limiting my playstyle, in which case I will go towards characters that are more versatile.
So charge is a hurdle that represents a balance factor, right? So how is a restrictive input method a good balancing tool? I could think of a million better ways to make a game more balanced than going for restrictive input methods.
You're missing a good game in Rising Thunder, a handful of nice ideas and some interesting conceptss that work quite well against what one can think based on theory alone. USFIV is the better game in most every way. That said, SFV NEEDS to use BO3 for ranked matches. BO1 Ranked feels so random in comparison. Shorter and less intruding Supers/Ultras would be welcome as well.