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What are some movements of brilliant game design that resonated with you?
- Thread starter levyjl1988
- Start date
DunDunDunpachi
Patient MembeR
I was bummed to see this thread so far down the list. I've loved reading the examples and watching the video clips. Here's my own contribution, perhaps not surprising.
First released in 2002. I began playing (and have not stopped) in early 2017. It kicked off my obsession w shmups, and my namesake.
Dodonpachi Daioujou
DOJ was the perfect intersection of all my gaming ley lines. It is short (23 minutes) but tough as nails. The mechanics of dodging bullets and improving my pattern recognition felt like Dance Dance Revolution pulled off the rails. I already loved puzzle games, and there is a puzzle-like aspect to plotting your routes and learning how to chain the level together in one long combo. I was also getting into deeper into games like Wonderful 101 and Bayonetta, learning how to chain moves and combos together for higher Platinum scores. Daioujou somehow brought so many different pieces together into a brief 23 minute experience.
- the mechanic of tapping A to Shoot and holding A to Laser + move slower. This strange toggle actually works really well within the confines of the game. Generally you are shooting out rapid-fire bullets to kill popcorn while leading their clouds of bullets off to the side, but you use your concentrated shot on bigger enemies to kill them quicker. Since those enemies usually throw out more complex bullet patterns, the slower movement allows you to tap-dodge through more easily.
- Chaining the level. I first started doing this in a sidescrolling skateboard series called OlliOlli. The second game in particular lets you chain the whole stage (using manuals on the flatland), and it was my favorite part of the game. I would replay a level over and over and over, even if it took a few days, and I would get that perfect full-stage trick. It was my favorite part. This is what really got me hooked on DOJ, especially since my copy includes a practice mode.
Chaining gives you about 1 second between hits before the chain drops. When there's a lot of popcorn, you're getting 10 hits per second, but if you kill that popcorn or that big enemy too quickly (before the next wave appears), then you will likely drop your chain. I've spent many hours patiently chaining a level, examining gaps in my chain, learning the best route, etc. Toggling between Shot and Laser is a huge part of chaining because if you kill popcorn or a bigger enemy too quickly, there may be enough of a gap to drop your chain. There's no turning back. That's it. You either full chained the level or you didn't.
- Hypers. Hypers crank up the speed of enemy bullets but also increase your damage and make it easier to chain. Hits go up, and more hits = higher score. The biggest chains are made by using Hyper at a specific portion of a level. As you build routes, you are trying to line up your hypers in such a way that you can use it when you need it. Doing so successfully allows you to earn insanely large scores. I wasn't trying to play for score, but I do love making long chains through the stages, so Hypers are very useful for that end. Score is a byproduct of this style of play. How are hypers earned? By chaining a lot of hits together and collecting bees (see below)
- What ties all of these together is the stage layout. I've come to think of shmups as the hidden EXTRA HARD mode for rhythm games. The whole game is one long symphony of specific enemy placements, specific bullet patterns, and multiple chaining paths through the whole thing. Every stage has a flow (in order to accommodate chaining) that is meticulously designed. Every stage is full of moments where I can see where the game designers are trying to push me, but where they've left clever gaps. Bees (a medallion your ship can pick up) are arranged on each stage at a specific place, and if you collect these with a high combo, your Hyper gauge jumps up considerably. So if you're chaining a level well, you get more Hypers, and if you're using Hypers well, then you're getting a higher chain, which means more Hypers. All the while you are cranking up the game difficulty/speed with every Hyper you use.
I could go on and on about the game. The brilliance is how these very simple pieces come together to challenge the player and teach the player how to overcome it. You can go for an easy 1cc and ignore most of these mechanics, but if going for higher scores / full-chains you really see how they all come together
Neff
what's that game?
I'm glad @Tschumi mentioned Tearaway and
levyjl1988
mentioned the DS because I think those broke the fourth wall better than any auteur *cough*Kojima*cough* attempts on the big-boy consoles. I first encountered that Trace Memory puzzles in Zelda: Phantom Hourglass, but otherwise yeah I was floored by puzzles that used the hardware in that way. Tearaway was similar.
First released in 2002. I began playing (and have not stopped) in early 2017. It kicked off my obsession w shmups, and my namesake.
Dodonpachi Daioujou
DOJ was the perfect intersection of all my gaming ley lines. It is short (23 minutes) but tough as nails. The mechanics of dodging bullets and improving my pattern recognition felt like Dance Dance Revolution pulled off the rails. I already loved puzzle games, and there is a puzzle-like aspect to plotting your routes and learning how to chain the level together in one long combo. I was also getting into deeper into games like Wonderful 101 and Bayonetta, learning how to chain moves and combos together for higher Platinum scores. Daioujou somehow brought so many different pieces together into a brief 23 minute experience.
- the mechanic of tapping A to Shoot and holding A to Laser + move slower. This strange toggle actually works really well within the confines of the game. Generally you are shooting out rapid-fire bullets to kill popcorn while leading their clouds of bullets off to the side, but you use your concentrated shot on bigger enemies to kill them quicker. Since those enemies usually throw out more complex bullet patterns, the slower movement allows you to tap-dodge through more easily.
- Chaining the level. I first started doing this in a sidescrolling skateboard series called OlliOlli. The second game in particular lets you chain the whole stage (using manuals on the flatland), and it was my favorite part of the game. I would replay a level over and over and over, even if it took a few days, and I would get that perfect full-stage trick. It was my favorite part. This is what really got me hooked on DOJ, especially since my copy includes a practice mode.
Chaining gives you about 1 second between hits before the chain drops. When there's a lot of popcorn, you're getting 10 hits per second, but if you kill that popcorn or that big enemy too quickly (before the next wave appears), then you will likely drop your chain. I've spent many hours patiently chaining a level, examining gaps in my chain, learning the best route, etc. Toggling between Shot and Laser is a huge part of chaining because if you kill popcorn or a bigger enemy too quickly, there may be enough of a gap to drop your chain. There's no turning back. That's it. You either full chained the level or you didn't.
- Hypers. Hypers crank up the speed of enemy bullets but also increase your damage and make it easier to chain. Hits go up, and more hits = higher score. The biggest chains are made by using Hyper at a specific portion of a level. As you build routes, you are trying to line up your hypers in such a way that you can use it when you need it. Doing so successfully allows you to earn insanely large scores. I wasn't trying to play for score, but I do love making long chains through the stages, so Hypers are very useful for that end. Score is a byproduct of this style of play. How are hypers earned? By chaining a lot of hits together and collecting bees (see below)
- What ties all of these together is the stage layout. I've come to think of shmups as the hidden EXTRA HARD mode for rhythm games. The whole game is one long symphony of specific enemy placements, specific bullet patterns, and multiple chaining paths through the whole thing. Every stage has a flow (in order to accommodate chaining) that is meticulously designed. Every stage is full of moments where I can see where the game designers are trying to push me, but where they've left clever gaps. Bees (a medallion your ship can pick up) are arranged on each stage at a specific place, and if you collect these with a high combo, your Hyper gauge jumps up considerably. So if you're chaining a level well, you get more Hypers, and if you're using Hypers well, then you're getting a higher chain, which means more Hypers. All the while you are cranking up the game difficulty/speed with every Hyper you use.
I could go on and on about the game. The brilliance is how these very simple pieces come together to challenge the player and teach the player how to overcome it. You can go for an easy 1cc and ignore most of these mechanics, but if going for higher scores / full-chains you really see how they all come together
Neff
what's that game?I'm glad @Tschumi mentioned Tearaway and
levyjl1988
mentioned the DS because I think those broke the fourth wall better than any auteur *cough*Kojima*cough* attempts on the big-boy consoles. I first encountered that Trace Memory puzzles in Zelda: Phantom Hourglass, but otherwise yeah I was floored by puzzles that used the hardware in that way. Tearaway was similar.
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Tschumi
Member
I gather that heaps of it was done at the last minute, even zooming in to first person.. more power to Bungie, jeesh!
That game reeked of next gen. I don't think any game in history has felt more next gen than OG Halo to me. MGS2 was next gen graphics but not so much the gameplay mechanics; Metroid Prime was next gen (higher poly count than Halo i hear, i played both and GameCube owners can certainly be proud of it) but it wasn't multiplayer or co-op enabled.
All of the visuals worked so well. Playing it today i get a strong feeling of the aspect ratio being different, but i actually believe that's because i barely ever played Halo without a split screen co-op going..
Neff
Member
A little game from 1998 called Ocarina of Time
DunDunDunpachi
Patient MembeR
Oh, it looked like an X-COM knockoff to me. I never got far in OoT.
Another contribution! Sin & Punishment: Star Successor was brilliant. I grew up loving all kinds of lightgun games, Star Fox series, Galaxy Force II, Space Harrier, Star Wars: Rebel Assault, Contra, etc. I always wished I could control my character in the lightgun games -- even if it was still on rails -- but also point and shoot with the gun. A game like Space Harrier let you dodge enemies, but you could only aim forward. I wanted to move and aim!
That childhood wish is pretty much Star Successor. Not much else needs to be said about it. You move around, dodge, and slash, but you can shoot at any target from any position on the screen. If my previous rant didn't make it evident, I tend to find brilliance in simple mechanics / combinations honed to a razor edge.
Neff
Member
I highly recommend doing so. Not only is it a killer game (even now), but that dungeon in particular is imo the best in the series and one of the greatest pieces of level design of all time.
DunDunDunpachi
Patient MembeR
I'll have to pick up the 3DS copy someday, but I admit I'm a Zelda tourist. I've given up on most of them. I know OoT is revered but I've never felt the pull to try it again. I was playing PC and arcade during that era so I've never had a strong connection to most Ps1 / N64 games.
levyjl1988
Banned
These moments...
supernova8
Banned
BOTW has already been mentioned multiple (for good reason) but I'll give my two pennies:
For me it's the first time that anyone has really pulled off the "See that mountain? You can go there" concept. Of course we've semi had it in MMOs for quite a while but the climbing mechanic really gives you freedom to go pretty much wherever you are.
Another thing is that BOTW really rewards curiosity. If you see a strange rock formation on top of a mountain, you know there's a good chance there might be a treasure chest or a Korok waiting for you, so you opt to check it out. On your way, you're thinking about what it could possibly be so you don't think so much about the 1-5 minute run towards the mountain.
Once you get to the bottom and you need to start climbing, you realise your stamina might not carry you all the way up, so you initially survey the mountain for flat mini plateaus you can use to regain stamina before continuing. The addition of stamina is absolutely genius and makes a lot of climbing tasks an actual challenge. It's not a given that you'll definitely make it up the mountain and if you run out of energy, you can't use your glider because you need stamina for that too. It gives you a real sense of risk going up a mountain and that's how it should be.
Also, I now understand why they gave weapons and shields durability. It forces you to try weapons you wouldn't usually try and it's that much more satisfying when you get the Master Sword. You appreciate it much more than if you were just given it near the start.
The feeling of progression/growth is also fantastic. Particularly in the context of the Guardians. Early on when the music changes and a Guardian locks onto you, you're like "Oh fuck" and then later on when you have the ancient tech sword, shield, bow and arrows the Guardians become more of a minor nuisance than a real threat. It has a similar feel to what we usually encounter in MMOs where you can enter a high-level zone but you'll get one-hit-killed if you're not extra careful. I remember heading straight to Hyrule Castle with only 5 hearts to see what would happen. Of course I didn't last long. It gives you something to aim for.
Giving you a choice between increasing heart vials or stamina is a brilliant idea. It makes you actually value the Spirit Orbs because you know you need to beat 4 shrines to even get that choice.
I could go on and on but in a nutshell, it's game of the generation for me. Forget all the fancy graphics. This is Ubisoft Towers as they were supposed to be.
For me it's the first time that anyone has really pulled off the "See that mountain? You can go there" concept. Of course we've semi had it in MMOs for quite a while but the climbing mechanic really gives you freedom to go pretty much wherever you are.
Another thing is that BOTW really rewards curiosity. If you see a strange rock formation on top of a mountain, you know there's a good chance there might be a treasure chest or a Korok waiting for you, so you opt to check it out. On your way, you're thinking about what it could possibly be so you don't think so much about the 1-5 minute run towards the mountain.
Once you get to the bottom and you need to start climbing, you realise your stamina might not carry you all the way up, so you initially survey the mountain for flat mini plateaus you can use to regain stamina before continuing. The addition of stamina is absolutely genius and makes a lot of climbing tasks an actual challenge. It's not a given that you'll definitely make it up the mountain and if you run out of energy, you can't use your glider because you need stamina for that too. It gives you a real sense of risk going up a mountain and that's how it should be.
Also, I now understand why they gave weapons and shields durability. It forces you to try weapons you wouldn't usually try and it's that much more satisfying when you get the Master Sword. You appreciate it much more than if you were just given it near the start.
The feeling of progression/growth is also fantastic. Particularly in the context of the Guardians. Early on when the music changes and a Guardian locks onto you, you're like "Oh fuck" and then later on when you have the ancient tech sword, shield, bow and arrows the Guardians become more of a minor nuisance than a real threat. It has a similar feel to what we usually encounter in MMOs where you can enter a high-level zone but you'll get one-hit-killed if you're not extra careful. I remember heading straight to Hyrule Castle with only 5 hearts to see what would happen. Of course I didn't last long. It gives you something to aim for.
Giving you a choice between increasing heart vials or stamina is a brilliant idea. It makes you actually value the Spirit Orbs because you know you need to beat 4 shrines to even get that choice.
I could go on and on but in a nutshell, it's game of the generation for me. Forget all the fancy graphics. This is Ubisoft Towers as they were supposed to be.
levyjl1988
Banned
I like how areas in BotW incite curiosity and exploration. Fucking brilliant. Paint by number video games just litter POI on a map rather than incite curiosity.
Bournetobewild
Neo Member
The original Animal Crossing when it came out like the whole seasons changing and the time element blew me away. Getting a gift on your birthday etc just broke that 4th wall for me.
Deadly Premonition with its unique humor such as your car only going like 25 mph was one of the best slap you in the face moments in gaming.
Deadly Premonition with its unique humor such as your car only going like 25 mph was one of the best slap you in the face moments in gaming.
kyliethicc
Member
For me its how Knack can get bigger and smaller. Truly incredible and innovative design.
Because that means Knack is not always the same size. He changes size, so he's not the same size anymore. He can get bigger, and thats bigger than when he's small.
Because that means Knack is not always the same size. He changes size, so he's not the same size anymore. He can get bigger, and thats bigger than when he's small.
kyussman
Member
The final third of Death Stranding when you reach the really high mountains and you think,fuck this is going to be a slog...and then the game presents you with zip lines.....I spent hours setting up networks of zip lines so I could get around with ease....fantastic mechanic.
In fact I'd say all the mechanics of Death Stranding were brilliantly designed.
In fact I'd say all the mechanics of Death Stranding were brilliantly designed.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Essentially, everything in MGSV and Death Stranding.
KojiPro games in general are some of the most sublimely designed games mechanically speaking.
Equally, I would argue that Lost Planet 2 is one of the most incredibly well designed games. Everything from the grappling hooks, to the weapons, vehicles and mechs. Only KojiPro games are of similar level of mechanical depth to the gameplay.
KojiPro games in general are some of the most sublimely designed games mechanically speaking.
Equally, I would argue that Lost Planet 2 is one of the most incredibly well designed games. Everything from the grappling hooks, to the weapons, vehicles and mechs. Only KojiPro games are of similar level of mechanical depth to the gameplay.
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april6e
Member
The Mr. Freeze boss fight in Arkham Origins. For those who still haven't played that game, everytime you take Mr. Freeze down during the encounter, he becomes immune to being hurt in that way again and will mess you up if you attempt the same move again.
This results in the tension being ramped up to 11 by the end of the boss fight, where you are locked out of most of your options and cleverly must get Mr. Freeze to fall for one of your more unconventional gadgets to clean things up. It makes you use every possible trick in your arsenal and it's a master class in encounter design.
This results in the tension being ramped up to 11 by the end of the boss fight, where you are locked out of most of your options and cleverly must get Mr. Freeze to fall for one of your more unconventional gadgets to clean things up. It makes you use every possible trick in your arsenal and it's a master class in encounter design.
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ColonialRaptor
Member
The best moments in games for me is when you figure out how to do something in a way that was not intended. The best games have physics and systems that allow for manipulation to be used in strange and creative ways that devs perhaps never intended.
I can't wait for a magic system in a game to work in weird and wonderful ways via a physics system so that players can end up doing things devs didn't intend. I really cannot wait for games to have more stuff like this.
I can't wait for a magic system in a game to work in weird and wonderful ways via a physics system so that players can end up doing things devs didn't intend. I really cannot wait for games to have more stuff like this.
Deputy Moonman
Member
Fixed. Everything else is great.
EruditeHobo
Member
Ocarina of Time: Lock on z-targeting.
Super Mario 64: Analog stick controls.
Super Mario Kart: Split-screen.
Doom II: Dial-up deathmatch with friend across town.
PES/Winning 11: Modifying strikes -- button taps & trigger holds in combination give multiple ways to alter passes & shots. Excellent design, so much so FIFA ripped it right off.
God of War: QTE -- not the first to use them, but among the most satisfying and was truly what took them mainstream & inevitably made them tiresome.
Unreal Tournament: Shock rifle & Translocator -- Sheer genius. The shock rifle is probably the best weapon in the history of video games... super versatile, incredible design with the interaction between primary and secondary fire culminating with the epic shock combo (inspired by Face/Off). The translocator enabled an insanely frantic gameplay experience. It's a game that is completely out of control, all weapons do insane damage, yet that is somehow perfectly reigned in by the fact that all weapons are (mostly) very situational. The result is one of the most fun/satisfying games I've ever played or will ever play.
BF1942: Conquest mode -- At the time felt like a real revelation, sort of the main AAA precursor to the modern battle royale gametype.
Super Metroid: "Metroidvania" mapping/item-based progress -- speaks for itself, this is the first time I experienced it and it remains basically perfect today. Feels like it could have been designed and developed last year, just with a retro aesthetic.
WOW: MMO world-building -- first time I really truly understood how epically great and unique this kind of game could be. Unlike anything I'd ever played to that point, despite a number which had existed.
Those are the first handful that spring immediately to my mind.
Super Mario 64: Analog stick controls.
Super Mario Kart: Split-screen.
Doom II: Dial-up deathmatch with friend across town.
PES/Winning 11: Modifying strikes -- button taps & trigger holds in combination give multiple ways to alter passes & shots. Excellent design, so much so FIFA ripped it right off.
God of War: QTE -- not the first to use them, but among the most satisfying and was truly what took them mainstream & inevitably made them tiresome.
Unreal Tournament: Shock rifle & Translocator -- Sheer genius. The shock rifle is probably the best weapon in the history of video games... super versatile, incredible design with the interaction between primary and secondary fire culminating with the epic shock combo (inspired by Face/Off). The translocator enabled an insanely frantic gameplay experience. It's a game that is completely out of control, all weapons do insane damage, yet that is somehow perfectly reigned in by the fact that all weapons are (mostly) very situational. The result is one of the most fun/satisfying games I've ever played or will ever play.
BF1942: Conquest mode -- At the time felt like a real revelation, sort of the main AAA precursor to the modern battle royale gametype.
Super Metroid: "Metroidvania" mapping/item-based progress -- speaks for itself, this is the first time I experienced it and it remains basically perfect today. Feels like it could have been designed and developed last year, just with a retro aesthetic.
WOW: MMO world-building -- first time I really truly understood how epically great and unique this kind of game could be. Unlike anything I'd ever played to that point, despite a number which had existed.
Those are the first handful that spring immediately to my mind.
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