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[XtremeRampage]

do you think it's the Islam that's bothering the powers that be? Not the common folk on the ground, I mean the ones that have power.

It's not about US needing oil, it's about U.S. investors making a profit.

Curious - What US/Western oil companies that emerged in Iraq after the US invasion in 2003? How much profits did they gain?

Even better question: How much are the "allocation of profits" between the international companies and Iraqi

Spoiler

"puppet government"

?

As for Iran - No, I don't think it'll be cakewalk should US become crazy enough to attack Iran. Unlike Iraq which was ruled by Sunni-minority under Saddam and had a large numbers of disaffected Shia and Kurds or Afghanistan where there were numerous factions vying for power, Iran has a much larger population, largely homogenous, more difficult terrain, and stronger ties to great powers. Any "adventure" by Western powers into Iran would make Iraq and Afghanistan looked like an exercise.

 

[iamaustrian]

So Iran isn't allowed to have "hidden" facilities etc while the USA maintance at least a dozen of "top secret" bunkers, facilities(all with those infamous "trespassers will be shot"-signs) etc, each as big a town, built deeply into mountains or super hidden in deserts plus an entire torture camp (Guantanamo Bay) where human rights are non-existent and trampled on?

yeah double standards

 

[Jburton]

So Iran isn't allowed to have "hidden" facilities etc while the USA maintance at least a dozen of "top secret" bunkers, facilities(all with those infamous "trespassers will be shot"-signs) etc, each as big a town, built deeply into mountains or super hidden in deserts plus an entire torture camp (Guantanamo Bay) where human rights are non-existent and trampled on?

yeah double standards

Well the supposedly good guys choose who the bad guys are!

The bad guys kill innocent people and hold weapons of mass destruction....... they also deny people basic human rights, operate concentration camps and perform acts of torture around the world.

Who is this ' bad ' guy?

USA.

Iran has inflicted less death than the US and holds significantly less (if any) WMD's.

Secret weapons and installations? The US has a load of them.

 

[el retorno]

There is no conclusive evidence Iran is pursuing a bomb.

Yes. I agree that here is no conclusive evidence that Iran is building a nuke. I think there is plenty that they are playing games and not being forth right and complying with UNSC demands. And that they have built nukes in the past and they have a desire for them. And their actions are worrying.

Entire torture camp (Guantanamo Bay) where human rights are non-existent and trampled on?

yeah double standards

Guantanamo isn´t a "torture" camp. And the US hasn´t commited tourture since at least 2008. Things change.

 

[Wazzim]

Guantanamo isn´t a "torture" camp. And the US hasn´t commited tourture since at least 2008. Things change.

If you say so.

 

[el retorno]

If you say so.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XM5FKawx1No

 

[Gaborn]

Guantanamo isn´t a "torture" camp. And the US hasn´t commited tourture since at least 2008. Things change.

No, it isn't a torture camp. It's a place where we hold people indefinitely without trial or possibility of release.

 

[el retorno]

No, it isn't a torture camp. It's a place where we hold people indefinitely without trial or possibility of release.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamdan_v._Rumsfeld there have been some progress on that front.

I hate it and think its a blemish on our record but its prone to exageration as well.
And most guantanamo prisoners have been released. And our president wants to change this but his hands have been tied.

 

[F#A#Oo]

Obama and Netanayu's Push for Attack on Iran

 

[Gaborn]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamdan_v._Rumsfeld there have been some progress on that front.

I hate it and think its a blemish on our record but its prone to exageration as well.
And most guantanamo prisoners have been released. And our president wants to change this but his hands have been tied.

I'm not disputing most of that, although Obama hasn't been pushing it I agree he has consistently said (when asked) that he's against gitmo. Although signing the NDAA was sort of a mixed message. In any case I stand by my point - Gitmo is unacceptable and we should either try the prisoners in a civilian court or release them.

 

[hukasmokincaterpillar]

I'm not disputing most of that, although Obama hasn't been pushing it I agree he has consistently said (when asked) that he's against gitmo. Although signing the NDAA was sort of a mixed message. In any case I stand by my point - Gitmo is unacceptable and we should either try the prisoners in a civilian court or release them.

Obama's proposal was to move Gitmo to Illinois, where indefinite detention would remain the policy. 'Gitmo North'. But the policy is the problem, not the location. The administration seems more concerned with closing the 'brand name' of Gitmo, while keeping the radical power of detention.

 

[Subitai]

So bottom line, is $5 a gallon coming soon?

 

[Rocket Scientist]

So bottom line, is $5 a gallon coming soon?

I still can't get used to how cheap American gas is. Wish I could take some with me.

 

[Insane Metal]

Is ANY of this true?

USA in Defcom 4 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkwwAKemUk0&feature=player_embedded

'US deploys troops in Israel for Iran war'

Iran crosses another nuclear red line. Fordo soon on stream

US commander visits Israel to finalize missile drill

Report: Iran begins uranium enrichment at new site

Russian TV http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgn04hW2i44&feature=player_embedded

 

[Alpha-Bromega]

RUSSIA TODAY is basically Fox News, don't trust it in one thousand years

 

[Ushojax]

One of those links is Press TV, which if I recall correctly, is a propaganda channel backed by the Iranian government.

 

[Insane Metal]

Oh, thanks.

 

[jorma]

One of those links is Press TV, which if I recall correctly, is a propaganda channel backed by the Iranian government.

they are quoting a jpost article that is also included. Is jerusalem post also a propaganda channel backed by the Iranian government?

 

[Steelrain]

they are quoting a jpost article that is also included. Is jerusalem post also a propaganda channel backed by the Iranian government?

Incorrectly quoting the article, by the way, seeing as how the source article doesn't have the General saying anything about this "not being a exercise but a deployment". In fact, the General wasn't interviewed at all. The Jerusalem Post didn't even claim that he said anything. That alone is enough to dismiss this shitty article and recommend that others not consider them a credible source.

http://www.jpost.com/Defense/Article.aspx?id=250249

 

[Synth_floyd]

Speaking of Gitmo, what a fucking embarrassment. It's land we basically stole from Cuba after the Spanish-American war and then put a prison there where we torture people. No wonder Cuba hates us. We should abandon it completely and return it to Cuba.

 

[jorma]

Incorrectly quoting the article, by the way, seeing as how the source article doesn't have the General saying anything about this "not being a exercise but a deployment". In fact, the General wasn't interviewed at all. The Jerusalem Post didn't even claim that he said anything. That alone is enough to dismiss this shitty article and recommend that others not consider them a credible source.

http://www.jpost.com/Defense/Article.aspx?id=250249

They probably changed it, because you get a million hits if you search for that quote in google, and they all attribute the quote to jpost.

 

[Valnen]

So Iran is going to execute an American citizen just for visiting their country. They accused him of being a spy, which is probably a load of bullshit. If they go through with this, they are officially idiots and deserve to be invaded.

 

[poisonelf]

History of U.S. Intervention in Iran - 1953 Until Present:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WVtpao0KSM&feature=youtu.be

 

[kitch9]

So Iran is going to execute an American citizen just for visiting their country. They accused him of being a spy, which is probably a load of bullshit. If they go through with this, they are officially idiots and deserve to be invaded.

He is ex special forces..... It will be interesting to see what the US does about this, maybe another stealth chopper will be getting a run out if they have nay idea where he is.

 

[poisonelf]

So Iran is going to execute an American citizen just for visiting their country. They accused him of being a spy, which is probably a load of bullshit. If they go through with this, they are officially idiots and deserve to be invaded.

So, according to your "logic", following a country's laws about spying, however harsh, and killing someone you presume to be innocent (we can't know at this point), justifies killing tens of thousands of innocents, wiping entire villages, and all the usual that follow American democratizations/liberations/invasions.

So, again going by your logic, Iraq would be justified to kill millions of innocent Americans, hey, you "deserve" to be invaded, how many innocent tens of thousands died during bombings or target practice? I repeat, that is according to Valnen's logic, not my opinion.

It's attitudes like these that make me wish that gods and divine justice were more than fairy tales so that all war mongering trash of humanity who are 'excited' about all the action they are about to watch on TV could experience all the horrors of war for themselves.

 

[Binabik15]

So Iran is going to execute an American citizen just for visiting their country. They accused him of being a spy, which is probably a load of bullshit. If they go through with this, they are officially idiots and deserve to be invaded.

Maybe he is a spy, then what?

I doubt Iran would execute him, they have to know that they'd get bitchslapped around. Lots of threats and posturing to avoid embargos, possible, executing an American spy in this climate? That'd send a message that IRan is not to be messed with, sure, but it'd also give Israel the public outrage in the US that'd allow them to get widespread bombing runs going.

And any conflict with Iran should be solved by capturing or killing their hardline leadership, not bombing their people into following said leaders instead of entertaining the idea of another uprising.

 

[el retorno]

He is ex special forces..... It will be interesting to see what the US does about this, maybe another stealth chopper will be getting a run out if they have nay idea where he is.

Don't think so,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw

I don't think Obama really wants to right to run with the Carter comparisions

 

[Steelrain]

They probably changed it, because you get a million hits if you search for that quote in google, and they all attribute the quote to jpost.

That's because they are taking the quote from Press TV. Which is why the hits are from stories published a few days ago, "coincidentally" like the PTV article, instead of the original article from Dec. 20th. The quote doesn't even make sense considering any movement of troops into a new region is a deployment with or without an exercise. I highly doubt a General would say something like that. Successful shitbag media organization is successful though I guess.

 

[Meus Renaissance]

As if tensions between the United States and Iran weren't high enough, here's PBS NewsHour anchor Margaret Warner (1/9/12):

The Iranian government insists that its nuclear activities are for peaceful energy purposes only, an assertion disputed by the U.S. and its allies. On CBS yesterday, Secretary of Defense Leon Panetta repeated international demands that Iran stop enriching uranium.

SECRETARY OF DEFENSE LEON PANETTA: But we know that they're trying to develop a nuclear capability, and that's what concerns us. And our red line to Iran is, do not develop a nuclear weapon. That's a red line for us. They need to know that, if they take that step, that they're going to get stopped.​

The way that's presented you'd think that the United States has evidence that Iran is pursuing a weapon. Leon Panetta's soundbite is from his appearance on Face The Nation on Sunday. But the NewsHour removed one key phrase; right before Panetta says, "But we know," he said this:

Are they trying to develop a nuclear weapon? No.
​

So Panetta's statement--that Iran is not building a nuclear weapon--is being used to argue that the United States disputes Iran's long-standing contention that it not building a nuclear weapon.

http://www.fair.org/blog/2012/01/10/pbss-dishonest-iran-edit/

 

[Valnen]

Maybe he is a spy, then what?

He isn't. He was just visiting family. They need to pay for this.

 

[Gustav]

Iranian nuclear scientist killed by car bomb in Teheran. Iran accuses Isreal of attack.

Source: http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/0,1518,808414,00.html

 

[Al-ibn Kermit]

It's in German so I have no idea what the article says but who the hell else would kill him? It makes sense that Israel did it.

I believe a couple other nuclear scientists have been killed the same way over the last year or two. Of course any proof that Israel did this gives Iran much more justification to escalate this standoff, that may even be the reason that scientist was killed at this moment in time so that full blown war breaks out before attempts at diplomacy are made.

 

[Gustav]

It's in German so I have no idea what the article says but who the hell else would kill him? It makes sense that Israel did it.

I believe a couple other nuclear scientists have been killed the same way over the last year or two. Of course any proof that Israel did this gives Iran much more justification to escalate this standoff, that may even be the reason that scientist was killed at this moment in time so that full blown war breaks out before attempts at diplomacy are made.

It doesn't say much, other than a motorcyclist delivered the bomb and that according to Iranian officials the attack was similar to the killings of 3 nuclear scientists in 2010 and 2011. Oddly enough the 2010 attack was on January 11th 2010.

 

[theignoramus]

Have any of these attacks on Iranian scientists ever been described as "terror" in the western press? I cant think of many examples. Presumably, the same courtesy wouldnt be extended to attacks on israeli nuclear scientists.

 

[Gustav]

Have any of these attacks on Iranian scientists ever been described as "terror" in the western press? I cant think of many examples. Presumably, the same courtesy wouldnt be extended to attacks on israeli nuclear scientists.

They have been described as assassinations in the german press. I think it's the correct term.

 

[Alpha-Bromega]

So Iran is going to execute an American citizen just for visiting their country. They accused him of being a spy, which is probably a load of bullshit. If they go through with this, they are officially idiots and deserve to be invaded.

a country deserves to be invaded because they caught a spy?

listen dude, if an ex Iranian military man came back to visit his family, i'd be pretty suspicious.

you're not ok in the head mr. warhawk

They have been described as assassinations in the german press. I think it's the correct term.

yep that's crazy to me to see that type of honesty.

 

[theignoramus]

They have been described as assassinations in the german press. I think it's the correct term.

you're probably right. There is a lengthy AP article in the Washington Post about this incident. It repeatedly uses the word "killing" rather than assassination.

 

[mavs]

you're probably right. There is a lengthy AP article in the Washington Post about this incident. It repeatedly uses the word "killing" rather than assassination.

It does. However...

The killing of Roshan was similar to previous assassinations of Iranian nuclear scientists that Tehran has blamed on Israel’s Mossad and the United States. Both countries have denied the accusations.

Also...

The revelations about Iran's apparent electronic prowess come as the US, Israel, and some European nations appear to be engaged in an ever-widening covert war with Iran, which has seen assassinations of Iranian nuclear scientists, explosions at Iran's missile and industrial facilities, and the Stuxnet computer virus that set back Iran's nuclear program.

Demonstrators in Tehran last year protested the assassination of an Iranian nuclear scientist. [caption]

 

[Steeven]

The killing of scientists associated with the nuclear program is obviously the work of intelligence agencies.

 

[Gustav]

The killing of scientists associated with the nuclear program is obviously the work of intelligence agencies.

State sanctioned murder.

 

[Steeven]

State sanctioned murder.

Thats one way to look at it.

 

[Casp0r]

Have any of these attacks on Iranian scientists ever been described as "terror" in the western press? I cant think of many examples. Presumably, the same courtesy wouldnt be extended to attacks on israeli nuclear scientists.

A terror attack is an indiscriminate attack on innocent civilians.

Not targeted assassination of people of working within an illegal weapons program.

 

[Jburton]

A terror attack is an indiscriminate attack on innocent civilians.

Not targeted assassination of people of working within an illegal weapons program.

It's not illegal, the Iranian government are entitled to do what ever they like on their own soil within their own laws.

US build and hold more WMD's than any other country, illegal weapon program is it?

Hypocrites.


Also it is a civilian scientist working their government.

 

[Jburton]

Thats one way to look at it.

It's the only correct way.

 

[Meadows]

I'm sorry but my position is that these killings/stallings are vastly preferable to ANOTHER invasion, war.

Still wish it didn't have to be this way, but its as much the fault of Iran as it is of the USA and Israel that it happened like this.

 

[Lerozz]

I'm sorry but my position is that these killings/stallings are vastly preferable to ANOTHER invasion, war.

The problem is though that such actions don't result in anything which makes the current situation better. Rather the other way around and it is hot enough already as it is. Stupid move by Israel's government if Mossad was behind the car bomb.

Stay safe, citizens of Israel and Iran.

 

[Al-ibn Kermit]

I'm sorry but my position is that these killings/stallings are vastly preferable to ANOTHER invasion, war.

Still wish it didn't have to be this way, but its as much the fault of Iran as it is of the USA and Israel that it happened like this.

How did you assume that this prevents war? If anything, it would make diplomacy less successful.

 

[Meadows]

How did you assume that this prevents war? If anything, it would make diplomacy less successful.

because it lessens the likelihood that Iran gets the bomb, or at least stalls it. Iran aren't going to provoke a war, it'd have to be the US/Israel that made the 1st move.

Again, in an ideal world:

1) The west would just leave the ME be
2) Israel wouldn't have nukes
3) Iran wouldn't be pursuing nukes

but the current assassination scheme is killing less 'civilians', i.e. people selling rugs on a street or something, than an invasion would.

Who knows, maybe this is Saudi Arabia doing this?

 

[Lerozz]

because it lessens the likelihood that Iran gets the bomb, or at least stalls it. Who knows, maybe this is Saudi Arabia doing this?

I think this chance is long gone already. Iran is apparently moving facilities underground. So either they start to finally cooperate fully with the IAEA and hopefully only have goals for civil use of nuclear power or will continue that tactic of going back and forth until they can say "We did it" and then the situation will change (for the worse) in that whole region anyways.

Scare tactics with sabotage and single killings won't do anything good here.

 

[kitch9]

Don't think so,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Eagle_Claw

I don't think Obama really wants to right to run with the Carter comparisions

That was 20 years ago, and its fair to say they will now have choppers capable of flying through sand by now if you look where the US is currently operating.