BlueXImpulse
Banned
Sony are working on improving the efficiency of their ray tracing calculations. I think as the generation goes on we're going to see a lot of advancements in ray tracing on the software side.
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Get a bidet.The TP shortage caught me off guard and I refused to pay the scalpers for Toilet paper. I ended up using that horrible scratchy brown paper for a while.
zaitsu
Banned
RT saves development times, what mean more games, what mean more income. They may have disadvantage on GPU side, but they are not abandoning RT in any case scenario.
Moridianae
Member
You'll see a lot to that effect. I mean, look at what they've pulled out of all the PlayStation systems throughout history. The Last of Us II and Final Fantasy VII: Remake, for example.
We marvel at Ratchet and Clank, but it'll look a bit basic 3 or 4 years down the line once developers learn how to pull the power out and new tricks.
Both of those aforementioned games my old college buddy and I were convinced they were secretly showing versions running on a PS5 until we actually got them in our systems.
The PS3 was a misstep, but the fact remains I think I read somewhere it was never utilized to its full power some time ago.
Nikana
Go Go Neo Rangers!
If you don't think Sony takes MS seriously, you are greatly mistaken. Honestly, if Sony was extremely confident, we would not be going through this price war. Sony would have pushed forward announcing price and release date without a care in the world. They understand that their competition isn't resting, and they are going to do everything to capture the market share without resting. The moneyhatting is also proof Sony understands how MS is competitive to them if they become complacent.
BlueXImpulse
Banned
What this shows is that the early RT we're seeing with Ratchet and Clank is nowhere near where it's going to be in a few years. They are still building these data structures. Denoising techniques are extremely important. If you can cast fewer rays, and fill in the gaps you save on performance a lot.
KURDISTAN YPG
Member
So with ps5 being blutooth 5.1
thas this mean i can use my sony blutooth 1000xm3 blutooth
this pne of the things i hate it about the ps4 no unversal support—
happy now
thas this mean i can use my sony blutooth 1000xm3 blutooth
this pne of the things i hate it about the ps4 no unversal support—
happy now
mejin
Member
From what I saw if I can surmise it's all about their approach.
It is literally the opposite of Microsoft.
1. All their strategy is focused on "to be the best place to play". They want people to chose playstation is their platform of choice unlike "play anywhere".
2. They know how huge and important WWS became and they want to continue the investment. They will grow bigger. Not just their own studios, but acquisitions as well.
3. They also know the importance of 3rd party, from indies to the big publishers. "Sony offers various forms of assistance, such as sharing its libraries and providing technical support to creators, including independent studios, to facilitate the best game-development environment possible."
4. To anyone who think they are doing nothing. They understand they need to push further: "Competition from online PC games and players from other industries is expected to continue to intensify. The fundamental growth strategy will be to innovate and evolve the PlayStation Platform. To this end, SIE intends to make proactive investments to reinforce content IP, and work to raise brand value, foster communities and user engagement, while enhancing DTC services that get closer to users. "
5. Also they don't hide. They really believe in generations and their aggressive approach is to make a smooth transition from ps4 to ps5. "Games for the PS5 that deliver this new gaming experience are being made by 1st, 2nd and 3rd party developers, and we plan to introduce a compelling line-up of titles to our users."
Like I said It is literally the opposite of Microsoft.
They know what they want and know what they have to do to achieve it.
This approach is just too much and it is like MS won't have time to breath cause they won't wait they are ready.
So you got nothing else to say in your defense?
You do realize if what you posted is true, then it is the ONLY feedback we've had from any dev about the XSX be it good or bad, what's the likelihood of that!
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SSfox
Member
Speaking about Kojima, hopefully Sony will continue partnership with the legend, or if it's not the case to see some news from Koji Prod a little soon.
Snowdonhoffen
Member
Unless Hermen Hulst went full Phil Spencer and lied about not bringing every exclusive game to PC, then we can expect only some selected titles to come to PC. Get ready for... certain people calling Sony anticonsumer for not bringing every single title on day and date to PC.
Red_Driver85
Member
I'm surprised by the fact that VFXVeteran downright exudes confidence that TLoUP2 is in the process of being ported to a PC right now. It sounds like the ravings of a madman.
bitbydeath
Gold Member
zaitsu
Banned
Thats true, i forget to mention that sony i going for : THE ONLY PLATFORM YOU WANT TO PLAY ON.
They wont port any game if they think it would lower PS5 consoles count. Would people buy PS5 to play GOW 1 or they would buy secondhanded PS4 with game if they had already good PC. In second solution there is no money for Sony. So they could release GOW on PC full price and make that lost money.
But on the other hand they would never release GOW2 on PC , cannibalizing PS5 sells.
Because they want primarily more people on PS5, not on PC.
FunkMiller
Gold Member
Well, I’ve just dropped waaaaaay too much cash on a new LG CX 4k TV for the next gen.... so I fully expect the Ps5 to be delayed in the next few days.
Sorry about that gang
Sorry about that gang
Nikana
Go Go Neo Rangers!
There's nothing to defend.
You're trying to say a tweet from Randy Pitchford.....Randy.....Pitchford....the man who has made a complete fool of himself publically many times that has nothing to do with development kits proves a vetted posting about dev kits has been discredited?
That is not the only feedback we have gotten from devs. Dirt 5 comes to mind.
And lastly....never once said it was Gearbox. Just because it's Borderlands does not equal it's a Gearbox developer.
So like I said...keep trying chief.
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zaitsu
Banned
Its just confirmation he dont know what he is talking about.
Releasing second part of the game with continuous plot, when in comparison to first part it has been heavily criticized.
There is no TLOU2 on PC , if there is no TLOU1 on PC. I would say even GOT would be sooner released on PC than TLOU2.
MasterCornholio
Member
I always assumed it was someone that Gearbox hired to take care of the "next gen versions". Kind of like how Guerilla were not the ones to handle the PC port of HZD.
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Dave_at_Home
Member
Are we thinking a drop to 1800P for 60fps, but still keep same levels of ray-tracing? They may have to turn some of that stuff down a bit but I dunno.
Nikana
Go Go Neo Rangers!
Borderlands 3 also wasn't solely developed by Gearbox.
Theres some truth in that, it's one of many more other problems they have with their hardware designYeah, I know...I'm reaching. It does seem very odd. Ok, while I'm reaching...let me throw this out there. I generally hate doing this kind of thing and this kind of speculation but hell, this IS a speculation thread. So here's my imagination at work.
So MS has a very powerful piece of hardware in the XSX. The GPU is very powerful. However, they used a split memory bank which they have had performance issues from in the past. WHAT IF:
They cannot get the full use out of the GPU because with their memory design, any access of the "slow" memory, relegates the whole system to that speed? What if the only way to get the higher speed out of the memory is to NOT use ANY of the slow RAM. This means that not even parts of the OS could be in the slow RAM area which is what it's designed for, and you can access NONE of the OS features if you want that high speed bandwidth and performance? So memory has to be flushed in order to load your game code and run fast. Then, to access OS features, the whole system slows down again and the OS portions have to be loaded? So they are working on BIOS and software solutions to make these transitions much easier for developers because all of the current game code just utilizes the slower speeds and so isn't really showing what the box can do?
Ok, I'm sure there's holes in that speculation and I'm not really serious about it. I mean, I won't be surprised to learn that there ARE performance restrictions due to the split memory banks, but I WOULD be surprised if they were to this extent!
Like I said before...we know there's nothing first party to show because those studios aren't far enough along yet. Fine. The lack of third party showings IS weird though. Could it be that for whatever reason, the third party games actually have deficiencies in comparison to the PS5 versions for some reason and MS wants to hold off on showing that as long as possible so that they can have SOMETHING that is XSX native to show and that would offset those deficiencies? Like being able to show a Halo demo that looked like their initial CGI trailer would go a long way towards balancing things even if games like Assassins Creed look worse on XSX than on PS5?
Well, that ends my rampant, pulled out of my ass, speculation on all this. Again, maybe it's just Covid and we'll start to see tons of cross platform demos and games getting into late September and into October.
Dave_at_Home
Member
This is why I believe in order for Sony to prevent migration to PC in the future is to release a PS5 Pro.
zaitsu
Banned
only if 8k tvs will become mainstream in next 5 years. And I dont see it happening.
Most pc players, around 95% still plays in FHD xD
Insane Metal
Member
New Intel Tiger Lake (10nm) Material leaked
wccftech.com
Intel Tiger Lake 4.8 GHz Launch Promotional Videos And New Xe Brand Logos Leak Out
A massive amount of marketing material for Intel's upcoming CORE rebranding and Tiger Lake launch has leaked out on twitter (@h0x0d via Videocardz). The marketing materials show everything from the technological achievements of the Tiger Lake platform to new branding for the Core series (and Xe...
wccftech.com
Red_Driver85
Member
I think the same way, but his confidence confuses and amuses me. How can a sequel to be released if there is no original part of the game? The dude is definitely delusional, he has already completely hithead with his PC.
zaitsu
Banned
I dont belive any word he says.
Spidersense is telling me that most of his posts are bullshit.
BattleScar
Member
Its not gonna be on desktop so its not really relevant, unless you're talking notebook gaming.New Intel Tiger Lake (10nm) Material leaked
Intel Tiger Lake 4.8 GHz Launch Promotional Videos And New Xe Brand Logos Leak Out
A massive amount of marketing material for Intel's upcoming CORE rebranding and Tiger Lake launch has leaked out on twitter (@h0x0d via Videocardz). The marketing materials show everything from the technological achievements of the Tiger Lake platform to new branding for the Core series (and Xe...
Dave_at_Home
Member
Manufactures will move to 8K in the high-end TV space, but 8K outside of VR is a waste. The real benefits of a PS5 Pro is 4K 120/60 versus standard PS5 60/30. Possibly optional improved effects like ray-tracing too.
SSfox
Member
It always amuse me to see people go by a plateform, then beg for other games plateform. Never understood this nonsens.
zaitsu
Banned
Mark my words - PS5 pro/ PS6 still will favour 30 fps with best graphic possible.
Moridianae
Member
I haven't followed. I'm assuming 8K TVs are still astronomically expensive.
Not to mention the processing power to make 8k gaming even a remote possibility on a consistent basis is probably the generation after this, if that?
Not even a PS5 Pro could probably do it, but I'm no real techie.
Not to mention the processing power to make 8k gaming even a remote possibility on a consistent basis is probably the generation after this, if that?
Not even a PS5 Pro could probably do it, but I'm no real techie.
onesvenus
Member
What's the source on this?
Why do you expect Sony to be able to improve a method that has been studied since 1980s?
BlueXImpulse
Banned
"we are building data structures essential to faster ray tracing". Because improvements in denoinising techniques are still being worked on and improved on to this day? Your comment is weird.
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Red_Driver85
Member
Can't be rejected. Yeah, that’s true.
onesvenus
Member
"To draw the best of the hardware"
Sorry but I don't believe Sony will do anything that other researchers haven't done before in the field of raytracing.
I'm sure they'll do some smart things to improve raytracing in their hardware but that's another thing entirely.
Take a few deep breaths and calm down. I only linked his posts and mentioned his name once, he who also happens to be personally co-developing Borderlands 3. Digging dirt on his background doesn't alter facts
There has been nothing mentioned that Borderlands is being developed by anyone else other than Gearbox. So you're saying you have this statement from a mystery developer that nobody knows of, very convincing!
Even whatever you're saying is true about the mystery developer. There is a massive discrepancy in what he is saying and what's been reported about the XSX devkits, its not possible for him to claim the same loading times on both PS5 & XSX devkits when it's already known that the 'velocity architecture' is broken on the XSX kits, hence the delays in development. You need to do more research on the BS before you spread it
I'm not gonna bother commenting on the Lockhart stuff, nothing has been said of its existence by MS but that could change. So I'll give you that
I remember the Dirt5 developer talk yeah, exactly the same one used for both consoles!
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BlueXImpulse
Banned
Why did you quote "To draw the best of the hardware"? That's the purpose of every piece of software. You want to get the best out of the hardware you're given to work with. And if anyone is great at doing that as we've seen time and time again it's Playstation first party.
Their ray tracing hardware is what it is. They can only cast so many rays and that's limited by the hardware itself. However, like I mentioned, algorithms/software can be worked on to get the best out of what you have. You can remain skeptical, that's fair, but the implication from the excerpt is that they are working towards speeding it up by improving on existing procedure.
Killer Sakoman
Member
My assumption is that the game capped at 30 fps means that it is already averaging at 40 fps unlocked. This means a little drop of resolution could push that average to 60 fps. The CPU is strong and the Geometry Engine is making it much easier for it. Fps may scale well with resolution in the ps5 and xsx.
RT reflections maybe replaced with SSR but if their temporal injection works very well in replacing noise by filling in-between pixels , then we may still have RT reflections.
mejin
Member
it is more like MS could be in trouble as consequence of the solid estrategy Sony has, but even if MS abandon "console market" they won't abandon games.
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onesvenus
Member
You made it sound like it they were going to suddenly improve a field that has been studied since 1980s. That makes no sense and implies that somehow they are better than all the scientists that have looked at that problem before.
For me the key point of that text is that they are working to improve the performance on their hardware, that's why I quoted that part.
Elysion
Banned
Looking back, it's interesting to see how expectations have shifted since 2013. Back then it really seemed as if single-player gaming was on the way out. Almost all the big next-gen announcements were multiplayer or gaas focused (see Destiny), and Sony and Nintendo with their single-player focus looked like dinosaurs. Basically every Ubisoft game trailer ended with the camera zooming out to show a large number of online players (anyone remember that, lol?). Despite Microsoft's 180 in regard to their online policies, most people were convinced that always online, gaas, and cloud gaming would dominate the console space in the near future.
This time things look quite different. The most hyped next-gen announcements so far have all been single player focused (with the exception of Suicide Squad, much to the consternation of many fans), while 'the cloud' and streaming-based gaming are still very niche. Even the new CoD's campaign seems to be much meatier than in the past. And it doesn't look as if that's going to change anytime soon; everyone agrees that Sony's catalogue of single player IPs will give them a huge advantage.
For my part, I'm quite happy with how things have turned out.
This time things look quite different. The most hyped next-gen announcements so far have all been single player focused (with the exception of Suicide Squad, much to the consternation of many fans), while 'the cloud' and streaming-based gaming are still very niche. Even the new CoD's campaign seems to be much meatier than in the past. And it doesn't look as if that's going to change anytime soon; everyone agrees that Sony's catalogue of single player IPs will give them a huge advantage.
For my part, I'm quite happy with how things have turned out.
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Killer Sakoman
Member
I don't think they are recreating the concept of Ray tracing, they are just implementing it in the best way posdible ( they call this engineering).
For example, Ray tracing takes a hit on PS4 Pro performance, but smart engineers at Cryteck were able to run with Crysis remaster. Cryengine didn't bring anything new to the concept of ray tracing but they innovated from engineering side.
devilNprada
Member
Interesting sounds fun....
Killer Sakoman
Member
Do they have games to abandon?
Chun Swae
Banned
I don't know if this has been answered yet but Insomniac uses their own temporal injection technique which is better than checkerboard. https://blog.playstation.com/2018/09/06/insomniac-interview-the-tech-behind-marvels-spider-man/
Native 4k is a waste so I'll probably go with this mode instead of the 30fps one.
jimbojim
Banned
I think some of you knows member on ERA - ArmGunar which makes awesome threads regarding Sonys quarterly and yearly financial reports. So, some tidbits from him about today Sony's financials :
To add some context for Sony acquisition
That's just what they have planned to allocate in May 2018 for the next 3 years (FY18-FY20)
www.resetera.com
Also, Matt said that Sony was in talk with some studios.
To add some context for Sony acquisition
- For their 3-year plan, Sony allocated ¥1400bn ($13B) for strategic investments
- In FY18/19, they already spent ¥700bn for EMI and to repurchase shares
- In FY20, they want to spent ¥300bn (in addition to ¥400bn spent for SFH)
- Among these ¥300bn :
- they plan to repurchase ¥100bn of shares
- they already spent ¥70bn in Bilibili + Epic Games
- There are ¥130bn ($1.2B) left to spend in FY20
That's just what they have planned to allocate in May 2018 for the next 3 years (FY18-FY20)
PlayStation Studios |OT12| Timed Exclusive until |OT13| OT
Yeah, I would say BluePoint They talked about Spider-Man in the Wired article, months later Insomniac purchased They talked about the amazing BluePoint PS5 project in another Wired article... No IP owned = cheap to acquire, talented devs which can work on different genres, they probably...
www.resetera.com
Also, Matt said that Sony was in talk with some studios.
Killer Sakoman
Member
Even some big developers decided to leave the multiplayer market and focus on single player games.
However, Gaas did definitely become big, but I think it already reached its peak. Actually, you can see it's already saturated when most of the new gaas games fail and shutdown their servers. What makes it worse is that when you decide to develop a new gaas game, you have to steal market share from other establlished games or you are doomed.
When you develop single player game, on the other hand, you don't need to compete with anyone as long as you release your game in a period far from another big game in your genre. All you need is to make sure the game you are making is good and fun. Single player games are now way less risky investment than gaas games.
Dave_at_Home
Member
By your own words you say mainstream 8K won't happen, so why keep a PS5 Pro at the same frame rate as PS5? I'm betting developers may give gamers the option to play at 8K 30fps, but have the standard being a doubled frame rate at 4K. Again, to prevent migration to PC, Sony needs to offer something that is a staple of PC gaming, which is 120hz (minimum).
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