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Does FF need to go open-world to break in with the big boys?
- Thread starter Gaiff
- Start date
AJUMP23
Gold Member
redo ff6 change all the names but do the same story and update the graphics to modern standards.
Arsic
Loves his juicy stink trail scent
Let’s use the ps1 games as a jump off point. 7,8, and 9 were all revered as top shelf games at their time.
What did they have:
*Good stories
*Good pacing
*Combat that challenged you
*Interesting bosses
*Sweeping musical scores
*Interesting characters
*Some legit good side content
*Grand sense of adventure
*Varied and interesting locales
*Wide variety of enemies to fight start to finish that could make you switch up tactics to overcome
*Top end visuals and performance
——
Take the above and modernize it. If it was all about nostalgia and turn based then octopath games would be far more successful than they are.
I think 7 Remake combat is better than 16. Really though I and many others would like to see just an evolution of active time battle system. This was never close to being tapped out.
Like others have said though the pacing of recent titles is just abysmal. Overcome that first and foremost.
What did they have:
*Good stories
*Good pacing
*Combat that challenged you
*Interesting bosses
*Sweeping musical scores
*Interesting characters
*Some legit good side content
*Grand sense of adventure
*Varied and interesting locales
*Wide variety of enemies to fight start to finish that could make you switch up tactics to overcome
*Top end visuals and performance
——
Take the above and modernize it. If it was all about nostalgia and turn based then octopath games would be far more successful than they are.
I think 7 Remake combat is better than 16. Really though I and many others would like to see just an evolution of active time battle system. This was never close to being tapped out.
Like others have said though the pacing of recent titles is just abysmal. Overcome that first and foremost.
Kumomeme
Member
i like to see that. if they manage to do it right, FF would tremendously benefit from it. but better not risked it if they aware they cant pull it of or it would be end up like FFXV.
just multiple big open area where player can roam from location to location is enough. each area is big enough to the point player can ride flying mount like Chocobo and even dive underwater. Witcher 3 and Monster Hunter World also utilize this multiple big open world area. the world structure and quest based progression also similliar to game like Xenoblade Chronicles where it is linear progression in big open area, travel foward from other region to another region which is similliar to older 2D FF is. over half of Heavensward basically linear in simillar fashion. they no need to look far. just look at FFXIV. put away the online element, it is not much different from single player RPG like Xenoblade or even Skyrim.
when i know CBU3 gonna develop FFXVI i excited due to this. im expected even if it not open world, but tons of big open area connected where player can roam, full of monster and there is big cities available but however, what we get with FFXVI is opposite of that. totally not what i expected at first place. what they carried from FFXIV is only the quest based progression and side quest system THATS ALL. there rest, they chose to take from Sony's linear cinematic approach instead. not say it is bad, it has it charm and i can see why they did this but the cons devalue lot of aspect for ambitious RPG on big worldwide continent like FFXVI. FFVII Remake is fine since Midgar just small location.
not just that, its like the devs copied MGSV's motherbase system where Hideway end up as main hub. so instead of the progression is about roam journey from another location and discover another location directly, it end up become majority strictly centered one click pray return to mainhub>fast travel location>fast travel main hub instead. this is similliar issue that held back MGSV here the big world end up feels narrow, just like quick fetch mission location. there is no urge or need to explore by ourself at first place. it is all about quick arrive and return back and the location also feels boring perhaps due to it is designed with this purpose in mind from very beginning. FFXIV also has Rising Stone or House of Fortemps but it didnt handled that aggresively. the two location existed and reachable within one big area however the Hideway and the motherbase is disconnected from the world in closed space instead.
no need to go open world. the structure they choose with FFXVI might be right all along but the MGSV-esque motherbase structure with Hideway>location>Hideway instead of world map exploration location>location>location ruined everything.
just multiple big open area where player can roam from location to location is enough. each area is big enough to the point player can ride flying mount like Chocobo and even dive underwater. Witcher 3 and Monster Hunter World also utilize this multiple big open world area. the world structure and quest based progression also similliar to game like Xenoblade Chronicles where it is linear progression in big open area, travel foward from other region to another region which is similliar to older 2D FF is. over half of Heavensward basically linear in simillar fashion. they no need to look far. just look at FFXIV. put away the online element, it is not much different from single player RPG like Xenoblade or even Skyrim.
when i know CBU3 gonna develop FFXVI i excited due to this. im expected even if it not open world, but tons of big open area connected where player can roam, full of monster and there is big cities available but however, what we get with FFXVI is opposite of that. totally not what i expected at first place. what they carried from FFXIV is only the quest based progression and side quest system THATS ALL. there rest, they chose to take from Sony's linear cinematic approach instead. not say it is bad, it has it charm and i can see why they did this but the cons devalue lot of aspect for ambitious RPG on big worldwide continent like FFXVI. FFVII Remake is fine since Midgar just small location.
not just that, its like the devs copied MGSV's motherbase system where Hideway end up as main hub. so instead of the progression is about roam journey from another location and discover another location directly, it end up become majority strictly centered one click pray return to mainhub>fast travel location>fast travel main hub instead. this is similliar issue that held back MGSV here the big world end up feels narrow, just like quick fetch mission location. there is no urge or need to explore by ourself at first place. it is all about quick arrive and return back and the location also feels boring perhaps due to it is designed with this purpose in mind from very beginning. FFXIV also has Rising Stone or House of Fortemps but it didnt handled that aggresively. the two location existed and reachable within one big area however the Hideway and the motherbase is disconnected from the world in closed space instead.
no need to go open world. the structure they choose with FFXVI might be right all along but the MGSV-esque motherbase structure with Hideway>location>Hideway instead of world map exploration location>location>location ruined everything.
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Melfice7
Member
When it comes to Final fantasy, my thoughts are...
...to FF6-9 - great characters, top tier music, good-to-okay story. The stories weren't ever ground breaking, but it was the scenarios and character moments that made it.
I'll take 10's battle system too.
100 times this, this western trend chase that most japanese developers did and some still do is nonsense, should stick to what you do well
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
No.
They just need to continue pushing quality writing and stories, which thankfully they've returned to form with FF16.
The lackluster sales of FF16 are simply a result of damn near a 4-straight string of mediocre mainline FF games. If I'm to be really honest, they really lost their ability to tell coherent stories after FF8. Thankfully with FF16 they've found their mojo again.
Sure, FF16 has some minor issues. But the core of the game is sold and they can build upon it. They should continue switching things up, however. With FF17 going back to turn-based combat.
They just need to continue pushing quality writing and stories, which thankfully they've returned to form with FF16.
The lackluster sales of FF16 are simply a result of damn near a 4-straight string of mediocre mainline FF games. If I'm to be really honest, they really lost their ability to tell coherent stories after FF8. Thankfully with FF16 they've found their mojo again.
Sure, FF16 has some minor issues. But the core of the game is sold and they can build upon it. They should continue switching things up, however. With FF17 going back to turn-based combat.
ByWatterson
Member
16 is the foundation. More of that but with bigger environments, more customization more stats.
But it's absurd we're doing doomerism for a game that reviewed and sold very well.
But it's absurd we're doing doomerism for a game that reviewed and sold very well.
Myths
Member
“Discard western ideas” whoever said that shouldn’t be playing games from a different region by that logic. That type of close-minded, traditionally bounded behavior only limits people in society seeking progression and improvement. I’m certainly glad they don’t adopt this philosophy in their games development.
Anyone who wants turn based, go play the smaller budget 2D games they drop once in a while. They aren’t going back. Sampling and/or suggesting the first batch or series of something as inherently “correct” or “ideal” itself is flawed. Just an argument from tradition basically.
Exactly. Seeing a bunch of characters standing around practically forever to attack is jarring to me with how far we’ve come now.
Anyone who wants turn based, go play the smaller budget 2D games they drop once in a while. They aren’t going back. Sampling and/or suggesting the first batch or series of something as inherently “correct” or “ideal” itself is flawed. Just an argument from tradition basically.
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I'm not saying go back to when you needed strategy guides to figure all the secrets out. But the open ended or open world exploration, typically found when you get your air ship is important.
FF16 allowed some freedom to return to areas, but for what? Bounty board and some side quests written by a 5-year-old? Make the quests meaningful with great story and impact the game somehow or alter the game. Don't kill the pacing of the game.
No point allowing freedom to explore areas, if there is nothing worthwhile to find or engaging content or you kill the flow of the game entirely.
FF16 allowed some freedom to return to areas, but for what? Bounty board and some side quests written by a 5-year-old? Make the quests meaningful with great story and impact the game somehow or alter the game. Don't kill the pacing of the game.
No point allowing freedom to explore areas, if there is nothing worthwhile to find or engaging content or you kill the flow of the game entirely.
KimDongHwan
Member
I think the opposite, they need to scale down, create a better combat system where there are mechanics involved (FFX), add a good love story (FFX) and dynamic maps like jungle, ice, beach, desert, water, city, ruins, etc (FFX)
Yes. Imo, they have to make it open world and bring back the sense of exploration and getting lost in wanderment.
I don’t mind action games. I enjoyed FFXVI. But it would also do Final fantasy are big favor to return to (or least try) turn-based combat again.
It will have the added bonus of having the best graphics in an open world. The gameplay systems will not work in the open world but will only be loaded in a second (thanks PS5 SSD), thus the open world can be as detailed as it can be - think Death Stranding level of graphics.
Imagine Death Stranding level of graphics in a Final Fantasy open world. Explore detailed towns and cities. Explore the barren desert, jungle, or misty territories.
But don’t compromise on the story and lore. They were able to do it in FF7-FF9.
EDIT: I’m sure open world is a lot of work. But one thing they can make a development time savings is on voicing every NPC. I think reading dialogues has its charm specific to jrpgs. Keep the voice dialogues in the main story and scenarios.
I don’t mind action games. I enjoyed FFXVI. But it would also do Final fantasy are big favor to return to (or least try) turn-based combat again.
It will have the added bonus of having the best graphics in an open world. The gameplay systems will not work in the open world but will only be loaded in a second (thanks PS5 SSD), thus the open world can be as detailed as it can be - think Death Stranding level of graphics.
Imagine Death Stranding level of graphics in a Final Fantasy open world. Explore detailed towns and cities. Explore the barren desert, jungle, or misty territories.
But don’t compromise on the story and lore. They were able to do it in FF7-FF9.
EDIT: I’m sure open world is a lot of work. But one thing they can make a development time savings is on voicing every NPC. I think reading dialogues has its charm specific to jrpgs. Keep the voice dialogues in the main story and scenarios.
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