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[Chindogg]

Doesn't sound particularly upset about it.

You realize that AAA budgets for games have gotten out of control to be able to compete against each other right? I doubt he likes the idea of getting witty comments like this in every review for all his future games because he cannot afford to give people the experiences they want without finding alternative revenue streams.

As much as shitty publishers are to blame for these models, a lot of the blame also goes to the consumers. I'm reading a bunch of comments in this thread about Nintendo not giving you the experiences you want. Well the experiences you want cost over $150mil to make now. So unless you want to buy four or five copies get used to enduring this kind of crap.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. It sucks but developers have to make some kind of profit or they'll all be poorer than us.

 

[jaundicejuice]

Free-to-play micro-transactions and free-to-play-game design in a 60$ retail title is largely a natural extension/regressionevolution of the previous generations DLC model. We've been going down the road of greater exploitation for a while now and it will go further still, cos even if there are people who are vocally dissatisfied with these business practices, there are more people who willingly shell out for it.

The last generation it started with horse armor and now look at where we're at with Forza 5, one of the versions of Bravely Default and Jojo's All-star Battle. This is only the beginning.

 

[Scoot2005]

I love my Wii U.

 

[LTWheels]

Why do you think publishers have removed the online pass so suddenly?

 

["D"]

Seriously thinking about making a Twitter account and tweeting this to Shu. May not stop other 3rd parties from doing it but if its not happening from the console manufacturer itself then hopefully that would deter anyone from trying. A man can dream, though

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

You realize that AAA budgets for games have gotten out of control to be able to compete against each other right? I doubt he likes the idea of getting witty comments like this in every review for all his future games because he cannot afford to give people the experiences they want without finding alternative revenue streams.

As much as shitty publishers are to blame for these models, a lot of the blame also goes to the consumers. I'm reading a bunch of comments in this thread about Nintendo not giving you the experiences you want. Well the experiences you want cost over $150mil to make now. So unless you want to buy four or five copies get used to enduring this kind of crap.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. It sucks but developers have to make some kind of profit or they'll all be poorer than us.

I love how you changed you narrative...

 

[zenosparadox]

I will be fair in my assessment to say that some games can work with or benefit from the F2P design... but why does anyone think all games should go that way? I picture small games going this way and most likely succeeding.

What about The Last of Us which many are touting as GOTY or GOTG? How would that work as a F2P title? Super Mario Galaxy? Halo? Final Fantasy VII? The next Starcraft? A sequel to Banjo-Kazooie?

This is definitely my personal opinion, but I dislike the F2P model for bigger-in-scope games because they are not offering a complete artistic vision from start to finish(except if you spend $$$ that maybe never caps out). I know video games are unique because interaction is the key difference, but I cannot fathom enjoying other forms of art where you get a fraction of the experience until you pay up... and I have not even begun to talk about hunting for whales. This makes me upset.

 

[Omegasquash]

I think I understand his opinion, but I don't necessarily agree. And I have to say, his suggestion of changing the name from F2P to something else to break association is pretty slimeball.

"Let's call it something else, charge for it and hopefully they won't notice." Fuck off with that nonsense.

 

[Blair]

New genre 'f2plikes'

 

[Kosma]

Why do you think publishers have removed the online pass so suddenly?

Just what I was thinking.

This is much worse though

 

[Riki]

Fuck that noise.

 

[SomedayTheFire]

If Sony first party picks up on these practices... I'll be quite upset.

All future Killzone DLC will be FREE, so for now it seems they are not thinking in that way.

Not exactly true. MP map packs are free, everything else isn't.

 

[ScaryMovies]

Why is this the way next-gen is headed? The consumers certainly aren't asking for it.

 

[SummitAve]

Welp, not gonna like next-gen much then. Such arrogance.

Arrogance? Some games are taking longer and costing 10s to 100s of millions of dollars to develope, and now it's arrogance that they expirement with new revenue streams? Gamers constantly demand the next titles of their favorite franchies to be bigger and better than they were before with no thought to real world consequences. That's arrogance.

 

[RM8]

I'm glad the stuff I play isn't uber expensive to make, or made by greedy jerk companies. Mostly Again, I refuse to support this crap.

 

[Kosma]

Why is this the way next-gen is headed? The consumers certainly aren't asking for it.

Its the way next gen is headed, just like ms thought their drm would fly.

 

[dragonbane]

Count me out.

 

[marrec]

Arrogance? Some games are taking longer and costing 10s to 100s of millions of dollars to develope, and now it's arrogance that they expirement with new revenue streams? Gamers constantly demand the next titles of their favorite franchies to be bigger and better than they were before with no thought to real world consequences. That's arrogance.

That's right, blame it on the gamers.

 

[Nev]

Then I'll stay in the "old-gen" of user generated content, no online paywall and reasonable pricing.

I won't miss your shitty games.

 

[OldAsUrSock]

Except on Nintendo.

Spoiler

But people will support the microtransactions and subscriptions even while complaining about them rather than buy Nintendo

Why would you support a company that cant get an online stores working or accounts? Why would you support a company that milks its franchises better than any other company and does a lot of copy and pasting? You shouldn't so don't buy Nintendo.

 

[Phades]

Has anyone seen any actual economic analysis of microtransactions, in terms of how much potential cash is actually there to be grabbed? There cannot be an infinite amount of whales floating around to support every future game. I wonder how far this trend will go before companies are simply cannabilising each others profits.

An easy parrallel is drawn with MMO games. Extend that into the console market in general and inflate with scale. Watch as many are soon riddled with failure and shut down promptly.

What it will come down to, is if it isn't X market leader title, it will fall of the cliff shortly after release instead of flying into the sunset. The actual trajectory into the ground will remain up for debate, with the occasional few learning to find water at the bottom and float instead of crashing headlong into the ground.

Then will come the next wave of gaming articles that "Gaming is dead", "Piracy is rampant", "Development costs are too high for all games", etc. circle jerk of stupidity that keeps happening almost annually.

A lot of people complain about this, but you know what... I would be perfectly ok if the industry followed the Tribes: Ascend model

i.e. At least 1 free weapon/class/character slot to unlock (of the users choice would be my preference) and then the ability to grind your way through the game for free and unlock everything eventually, or have a handful of tiers to purchase that unlock various levels of content. Say 20 unlocks half the game, 40, 75%, and then 60 (the cost of a full retail game) unlock the majority of content available. I think the KI model could be a successful test. The max amount you spend is less than a retail game + the potential of DLC of course.

No, just no. Also, hell no.

While initially the model wasn't overtly offensive, it bloated out to where the boosters or using real cash to keep up becomes a real consideration and that was by design. Then, when combined with the failure to introduce good and balanced mechancis that stemmed from free formed setup and use while splaying machine guns, machine guns everywhere and needing to rebuy/learn them for every new kit is dumb and insulting, never mind balance altering. This is before getting into Disc launcher A is better than disc launcher B (because reasons related to when it was released and what kit it was attached to), but both are worse than disc launcher C (since it was released later than A&B). I mean come on, really?

 

[RM8]

Why would you support a company that cant get an online stores working or accounts? Why would you support a company that milks its franchises better than any other company and does a lot of copy and pasting? You shouldn't so don't buy Nintendo.

Because you like their games? If you don't, feel free to not buy them.

 

[trixx]

Never purchased a single oiece of dlc in my entire life. Didn't even purchase NSLU even though it's sort of a new game. Won't be changing my stance on dlc.

 

[LAA]

It is pretty shitty yeah, but...
Is it just me or I just never feel a need to bother with micro-transactions anyway? They havent affected me yet anyway. I think Dead Space 3 was pretty shitty with it thinking about it, but wasn't too impressed with the game anyhow.

As for subscriptions... depends what they mean. If its something like... COD Elite? (Which I don't know much about admittedly), not bothered so much about it either.

Season passes though.. I've actually been fine with them so far, it just seems like pre-ordering dlc at a discount to me, I only pretty much get season passes for games I know I'll definitely be getting the dlc for anyway. Bioshock Infinite has probably been the worse because of the silence really, but I think it'll be made up to me when the burial at sea dlc's are you. They're like £12 each, and I paid like £15/6? for the season pass I think?, totally worth it in this case. I know the idea of season passes can sound stupid at times as you're paying for something you have no idea what it is (In some cases anyway), but it depends on the game for me mostly. What I don't appreciate though is putting in some sort of... special weapon skin, even simply a new weapon or etc. It just feels like they're trying to bring over people who like to have all of everything in a game (Which can be me sometimes)

These models just don't really seem to affect me so far, but I totally agree its shitty. I miss the days you had to EARN these things by doing some hard task or just beating the game.

 

[Turin Turambar]

Again, pc got in the nextgen 5 years before consoles!

 

[Caronte]

Just to play devil's advocate here, that's easy to say when you're talking about "games" in an abstract sense, but when it's a particular game that is maybe part of a series that you really love or that people are raving about in the OT, will it be so easy to say no to it?

For me it will, for most people probably not. But I don't care, there's plenty of games to play on PC or from smaller Japanese studios on handhelds. This 'AAA game' industry can crash and burn for all I care.

 

[Croyles]

I think we all know that.

They'll still be blaming used game sales when their crappy, bloated games fail and their mismanaged studios get closed tho, so, I guess there's that too.

Yep. They always have a scapegoat rather than looking at their own mismanagement.

 

[KORNdoggy]

I guess this reason to avoid mad max then?

 

[Chindogg]

I love how you changed you narrative...

What changed? You're actively shitting on a guy who's flat out admitting that this is going to happen. We all agree that it fucking blows. I merely addressed what happened.

That's right, blame it on the gamers.

It's not really blaming gamers as its making them realize that things cost more yet games have been nearly the same price for 20 years now.

 

[Kosma]

There are so many games nowadays that I don't have to buy any of these crapfests with microtransactions.

What changed? You're actively shitting on a guy who's flat out admitting that this is going to happen. We all agree that it fucking blows. I merely addressed what happened.

You cannot admit to something that is onlu his opinion. The consumer will vote and he will have to listen.

Just like MS backtracking on DRM.

 

[crozier]

Shame, because I can no longer be arsed about achievements. Looks like I'll also be renting most console games next gen too...will not be forced to purchase "season packs" and such to stay relevant online.

 

[ElectricBanquet]

Why is this the way next-gen is headed? The consumers certainly aren't asking for it.

Because most publishers aren't interested in figuring out what consumers want so much as figuring out what consumers will spend the most money on.

 

[Cynar]

I'm good at not buying those games. This is just another developer to avoid.

It's not really blaming gamers as its making them realize that things cost more yet games have been nearly the same price for 20 years now.

Perhaps they should make more realistic budgets then. Gamers aren't asking for this crap.

 

[marrec]

It's not really blaming gamers as its making them realize that things cost more yet games have been nearly the same price for 20 years now.

Some of the best games I played in the last 12 months were 20 dollars or less.

 

[mrklaw]

I was going to say something about not buying new games, only buying used, to compensate for any additional costs.

But then I realised that the entire structure of the game would be fucked over to cram micro transaction-friendly progression in, you'd probably have to sign up for Uplay/origin/whatever, and basically the whole experience would be fundamentally compromised.

If that happens, then I hope the publishers get completely screwed over in their desperate attempts to chase dollars, and hopefully I'll still be able to find some games to enjoy

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

What changed? You're actively shitting on a guy who's flat out admitting that this is going to happen. We all agree that it fucking blows. I merely addressed what happened.

>At least Nintendo is doing nicely and not as scummy....

to

>Shut Up, is your fault for expecting much and not buying Nintendo. They need to make money...

 

[Chindogg]

You cannot admit to something that is onlu his opinion. The consumer will vote and he will have to listen.

Just like MS backtracking on DRM.

When I see people stop buying FIFA and CoD maybe I'll agree with you.

 

[Appollowexx]

I'm out when this becomes a standard. So far Sony and many 3rd party studios aren't going this route but the way MS / EA seems to have incorporated it into the majority of their bigger franchises is pretty discouraging.

My personal opinion is that asking for a customer to pay £50 for a game and THEN pay for extras on top day 1 is reprehensible. It pretty much should be illegal under the Trades Description Act to do this kind of thing.

 

[Omegasquash]

Because most publishers aren't interested in figuring out what consumers want so much as figuring out what consumers will spend the most money on.

This shit right here is truth. They like money, they want money and some of them are testing the shit out of the market for the next year or two to see what's most profitable. Then they're going to beat the ever loving shit out of it.

If people pay, they'll keep doing it. If people don't, then they won't. It's pretty easy.

 

[Donny]

So.... Mad Max with microtransactions? I am disappoint.

 

[Jal]

Im out.

 

[equippedwithtowel]

It's not really blaming gamers as its making them realize that things cost more yet games have been nearly the same price for 20 years now.

Not my problem, that's on game publishers to sort out to my approval.

 

[Samir Sedlar]

FUCK THAT SHIT.


I guess I'll buy the games that don't have those awful things, while only borrowing/renting the game that may adapt such strategies, I'll never support such developers, EVER.

 

[Chindogg]

>At least Nintendo is doing nicely and not as scummy....

to

>Shut Up, is your fault for expecting much and not buying Nintendo. They need to make money...

I'm pretty sure you just took two completely unrelated concepts and decided to tie Nintendo into both of them. You basically created this narrative for yourself.

 

[Atilac]

I am even more happy with my decision to go wii u

 

[Feorax]

Fucking EA and fucking FIFA utimate team. I knew it would only be a matter of time...

 

[Unknown One]

Not getting an extra dime from me or at all.

 

[BlockheadBrown]

Basically, #dealwithit

Ouch.

 

[Minions]

You realize that AAA budgets for games have gotten out of control to be able to compete against each other right? I doubt he likes the idea of getting witty comments like this in every review for all his future games because he cannot afford to give people the experiences they want without finding alternative revenue streams.

The issue is that the developers have complete control over the budgets and costs. Everyone wants to go "open world!!!". This is not a requirement by any means other than the way they want to design the game. There are plenty of games that are amazing and didn't have huge development costs. (Xenoblade chronicles) and before you say it had shitty graphics, it looks amazing with dolphin (but could still do with better textures).

If making huge blockbuster titles is not viable.... then don't. No one is going to start paying $60.... +$50 DLC/Microtransactions. Essentially you are telling me that the jump from PS3->PS4 has doubled the cost of games.

Not every game has to be open world. Not every game has to last 40 hours. Not every game has to spend 300 million in production.

 

[EMT0]

Bye Avalanche, my copy of JC2 sitting in my Steam backlog will never get played then.