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[Lootlord]

New shot of Vice City in GTA VI:

My first reaction was this has to be fake cause it looks downgraded as fuck with the shitty reflections. Maybe this is base PS5. Whatever... gonna play it in 2 years maxed out on PC then i guess

 

[GudOlRub]

Water was already one of the weakest elements in Trailer 2

Spoiler: Trailer 2

And it looks kinda on par with some of the screenshots Rockstar released last year as well but better eyes than mine will argue against and for it

Spoiler: Screenshots

And here's a similar shot from Trailer 1 for comparison

Spoiler: Trailer 1

 

[sncvsrtoip]

My first reaction was this has to be fake cause it looks downgraded as fuck with the shitty reflections. Maybe this is base PS5. Whatever... gonna play it in 2 years maxed out on PC then i guess

I'm waiting with popcorn to read this thread once the real gameplay is revealed

 

[Vick]

We can also catch them SSR thingies on the surface of the water on the far left of the screen. Maybe it uses some sort of RT reflections for water & SSR plopped on top of it? Or maybe straight up SSR on water...

Sorry for the trash quality GIF, best I could do in a hasty manner.

But even SSR only (which would be a massive downgrade compared to every Rockstar game made since they started developing on 360/PS3 hardware) wouldn't explain the complete lack of the wheel reflection.

You could see the Los Santos Ferris Whale reflection (high quality reflections, real-time dynamic cubemaps updated per frame) from miles away on PS3/360.
Also kind of underwhelmed by the short foam trail (and lack of 3D waves) behind boats.

This little clip if by far the lowest quality material they've officially released so far.

Edit:

Foam trails were longer here, plus very noticeable displacement:

 

[Lootlord]

I'm waiting with popcorn to read this thread once the real gameplay is revealed

Not that i care. I don't even own a console. Also GTA V was really disappointing story wise, had some good moments sure, but overall too short and abrupt ending and gameplay mechanics were really dated.

 

[Jack Howitzer]

My first reaction was this has to be fake cause it looks downgraded as fuck with the shitty reflections. Maybe this is base PS5. Whatever... gonna play it in 2 years maxed out on PC then i guess

Yeah large body water reflections are always dogshit even in trailer 2 with lots of unstable noises, I think this is on par with most of other games (mostly before new fsr becomes a thing)on base console from my limited impression ? The hardware capabilities are just too damn weak

 

[Jack Howitzer]

I'm waiting with popcorn to read this thread once the real gameplay is revealed

I bet it's gonna be a bloodpath until the pc version comes to light

But even SSR only (which would be a massive downgrade compared to every Rockstar game made since they started developing on 360/PS3 hardware) wouldn't explain the complete lack of the wheel reflection.

You could see the Los Santos Ferris Whale reflection (high quality reflections, real-time dynamic cubemaps updated per frame) from miles away on PS3/360.
Also kind of underwhelmed by the short foam trail (and lack of 3D waves) behind boats.

Maybe it's some kind of sweet old lod limitation spoil the view once again, and I'm ready to "nitpickin" the hell out of these shit once they finally gave up hiding the majority of game world from us. (what they have showed so far are just tiny proportion of the map and they intentionally using lots of stuff to block the view and hide the detail, like lots of depth of field, fog, not so clear weather conditions and dark nights instead of broad daylight and such) it's a big ass map so there must be tons of disappointment/not so good optimization tricks along the way already , very happy to be wrong of course

 

[SlimySnake]

PS5 Pro might have full RT reflections on bodies of water like Spiderman 2 does. I think the pro has proven itself quite capable when it comes to RT. i wouldnt be surprised if it runs the game at 60 fps with full RT. especially now that PSSR lets them have great IQ even at a low 1080p internal resolution.

 

[Gonzito]

PS5 Pro might have full RT reflections on bodies of water like Spiderman 2 does. I think the pro has proven itself quite capable when it comes to RT. i wouldnt be surprised if it runs the game at 60 fps with full RT.

Papi Slimy, you are a smart man. What should I do, should I get a ps5 pro for GTA6? Give me your unreal engine wisdom

 

[GymWolf]

PS5 Pro might have full RT reflections on bodies of water like Spiderman 2 does. I think the pro has proven itself quite capable when it comes to RT. i wouldnt be surprised if it runs the game at 60 fps with full RT. especially now that PSSR lets them have great IQ even at a low 1080p internal resolution.

No chance in hell this thing run at anything more than 30 on any console unless they didnt pushed as much as they could, resolution is only one factor, the game can be super heavy for a thousands of other reasons.

We have to hope for unstable 30 with lows in the 10s...

If they announce 60 frames my balls are gonna drop hard, and i'm a pro owner...

 

[Bitstream]

Papi Slimy, you are a smart man. What should I do, should I get a ps5 pro for GTA6? Give me your unreal engine wisdom

I think many of us picked up the PS5 Pro specifically for GTA6 in the first place, I know I did.

That said, its like $200 more than it used to be. At the new price I'm not sure I would have grabbed it for one game, graphics or not.

 

[Jack Howitzer]

If they announce 60 frames my balls are gonna drop hard.

Yup, made with "60 fps on console" in mind with a huge map like this, the graphics quality is just gonna be dogshit. Not to mention gameplay and world detail potentials

 

[GymWolf]

I think many of us picked up the PS5 Pro specifically for GTA6 in the first place, I know I did.

That said, its like $200 more than it used to be. At the new price I'm not sure I would have grabbed it for one game, graphics or not.

Yep, ps5 pro is pretty much a gta6 machine for many.

 

[coachmcguirk91]

No chance in hell this thing run at anything more than 30 on any console unless they didnt pushed as much as they could, resolution is only one factor, the game can be super heavy for a thousands of other reasons.

We have to hope for unstable 30 with lows in the 10s...

If they announce 60 frames my balls are gonna drop hard.

I don't even think Rockstar wants to get the game running 60fps on consoles. 10's of millions of players will upgrade in 2-4 years when new hardware is released. Rockstar loves having its players double dip. At best, I could see a 40fps version on PS5 Pro.

 

[GymWolf]

Yup, made with "60 fps on console" in mind with a huge map like this, the graphics quality is just gonna be dogshit. Not to mention gameplay and world detail potentials

I dont want them to scale back city simulation, physics and ai to get 60 frames.

I'm not worried much about the graphic, i never expected gta to look as good as hb2.

 

[Bojji]

Returning to that clown Threads Int.

I actually downloaded that CE Noir demo:

CRYENGINE | Neon Noir Ray Tracing Benchmark

Note: This product comes with a custom EULA. You will find it in your download folder. We are delighted to share ‘Neon Noir,’ a free ray tracing benchmark based on the ray tracing demo of the same name, which was made available as a video during GDC 2019. Neon Noir was developed on a bespoke...

www.cryengine.com

And performance isn't mindblowing in native 4K, 60-90FPS and this is only for RT reflections:

Not that much different than first gen games with hybrid RT.

 

[GymWolf]

I don't even think Rockstar wants to get the game running 60fps on consoles. 10's of millions of players will upgrade in 2-4 years when new hardware is released. Rockstar loves having its players double dip. At best, I could see a 40fps version on PS5 Pro.

Yeah, i didnt even thought about that.

Way less double dippers if you can already play at 60 frames on its first release.

 

[Vick]

If they announce 60 frames my balls are gonna drop hard, and i'm a pro owner...

I'd say prepare your balls then.

I don't even think Rockstar wants to get the game running 60fps on consoles. 10's of millions of players will upgrade in 2-4 years when new hardware is released. Rockstar loves having its players double dip. At best, I could see a 40fps version on PS5 Pro.

Not this Generation. Players will upgrade to a Next-Gen version regardless of 60fps, but shipping at 30fps right now only means losing players who play at 60fps only at this point, which aren't few actually.

Also, forcing all the GTA Online people from 60fps to 30fps? No way.

GTA VI is also a Series S game.

 

[GymWolf]

I'd say prepare your balls then.


Not this Generation. Players will upgrade regardless of 60fps, but shipping at 30fps only would mean losing players who only play at 60fps at this point, which aren't few actually.

Also, forcing all the GTA Online people from 60fps to 30fps? No way.

GTA VI is also a Series S game.

People are gonna eat their 60 fps elitism for freakin gta6.

Everyone is good at saying that they are not gonna buy the game if it is at 30 fps but we know reality is far from forum bubbles.

Also, majority of people has an hobo ps5, not a pro, so majority of people are gonna play at 30 no matter what.

Unless you are insinuating that an hobo ps5 can achieve 60 frames in what should be the heaviest game of the generation on paper, which would be a fucking tragedy.

I hope you are 100% wrong because my hype would go severely down after a 60 fps announcement, i'm not even joking.

 

[SlimySnake]

Papi Slimy, you are a smart man. What should I do, should I get a ps5 pro for GTA6? Give me your unreal engine wisdom

I think many of us picked up the PS5 Pro specifically for GTA6 in the first place, I know I did.

That said, its like $200 more than it used to be. At the new price I'm not sure I would have grabbed it for one game, graphics or not.

yep. i thought it was already too expensive at $700 but figured id buy it for death stranding 2, ghost of yotei, intergallactic and gta6. at $900? fuck no. especially since the pc release is probably only a few months away after the two delays. my guess is that the pc development is still on track since all they are currently doing is polish.

 

[GymWolf]

yep. i thought it was already too expensive at $700 but figured id buy it for death stranding 2, ghost of yotei, intergallactic and gta6. at $900? fuck no. especially since the pc release is probably only a few months away after the two delays. my guess is that the pc development is still on track since all they are currently doing is polish.

Usually the pc release is one year away, it's not like previous rockstar titles never had delays.

 

[Vick]

Also, majority of people has an hobo ps5, not a pro, so majority of people are gonna play at 30 no matter what.

Unless you are insinuatimg that an hobo ps5 can achieve 60 frames in what should be the heaviest game of the generation on paper, which would be a fucking tragedy.

It's not something I am insinuating, the day before the Reveal Trailer was uploaded we had leaked gameplay footage clearly showing 'Performance Mode' targeting 60fps on PS5. A leak which was confirmed legit.
I'm sure we're going to have a lot of flabbergasted people when the game releases. It would be smart to save the news (and nuclear explosion it would provoke after so much 30fps talk) right before PO, or even later around launch.

And it's not like the game running in Performance Mode looked like shit, the clip had shown impressive distant detail and shadows rendered for miles:

Footage was much higher quality originally as you could clearly read all text, including resolution, but while I'm sure a much better quality copy of it survived compared to these screens above I couldn't find it.

The BIG draw to PC version, and next gen, would be Path Tracing/much better RT and the sort of density upgrades we've seen in the PS3 to PS4 GTA V.

 

[GymWolf]

It's not something I am insinuating, the day before the Reveal Trailer was uploaded we had leaked gameplay footage clearly showing 'Performance Mode' targeting 60fps on PS5. A leak which was confirmed legit.
I'm sure we're going to have a lot of flabbergasted people when the game releases. It would be smart to save the news (and nuclear explosion it would provoke after so much 30fps talk) right before PO, or even later around launch.

And it's not like the game running in Performance Mode looked like shit, the clip had shown impressive distant detail and shadows rendered for miles:

Footage was much higher quality originally as you could clearly read all text, including resolution, but while I'm sure a much better quality copy of it survived compared to these screens above I couldn't find it.

The BIG draw to PC version, and next gen, would be Path Tracing/much better RT and the sort of density upgrades we've seen in the PS3 to PS4 GTA V.

Nah fuck this shit, hype deflated, there is absolutely no way they havent cut anything to make the game run at 60 fps on a 5 years old shitty hardware...this is a disaster.

I still hope you are wrong, things can change during development if the game became heavier than they expected.

The 60 fps crowd ruining things for everyone as usual...

 

[viveks86]

Because the light source is on the near side.

Sure. But that doesn't explain why it looks flat. Let's break this down. There are 3 surfaces (from top to bottom) - cushion parallel to floor, face perpendicular to floor and the floor itself.

Starting from the top, the cushion surface is not lit correctly due to inaccurate/non-existent bounce lighting or AO. The inside of the cushion surface towards the back and arm rest (pointed arrow) is lit almost exactly the same as the outside of the cushion, which makes no sense. The arm rest in completely in self shadow, which kinda makes sense as none of the direct lights in the scene reach it, but there is no gradual fall off on the horizontal cushion surface. There is no angle where you can place a light that would evenly light only the horizontal cushion surface, but not the vertical arm rest. You see light fall off on the back and arm rest, but not the cushion.

If we come to the perpendicular surface (vertical line), by its nature of being in the way of the incoming light, it should be catching more light than the floor. Not same or less. This would cause more light scattering on leather and dust, causing brightening closer to the light source and some specularity as well. Instead it's all even and flat the entire length. You can see this specularity in the carvings/trim of the couch, but not on the leather itself. So only 3d geometry is reacting to light. Not textures/materials. Even if it's caked in dust to remove any specularity, the dust itself should react to direct light hitting it. These look like very simple materials with a very simple response to light.

What we are seeing is correct direct lighting with megalights, but incorrect GI, AO, SSS and material response. What I don't understand is HW lumen would address the indirect lighting and shadowing at least, as seen in most games with HW lumen on, but it doesn't. But nothing can be done about SSS and complex material response, if the assets don't have it to begin with.

I don't understand exactly what you're talking about.

There are likely 3 light sources contributing to the shadowing in front of the TV. Megalights can cast unlimited shadows, but I can't say for sure if all 3 are shadow casting or not. But regardless, the direction of the final "aggregate" shadow is falling more or less right in front of the TV stand. This is accurate per the scene lighting. What looks strange though, are the exact spots pointed by the arrows. If the right most light source is positioned higher than the TV, then the TV stand will partially occlude the light hitting the floor under it. Yet the rug is lit evenly under the stand vs outside the stand, when it should be obviously darker from light falling off more rapidly as it moves towards the leg and casts shadows. This, again, indicates a lack of AO and indirect lighting. It's too evenly lit. This doesn't need path tracing to be accurate. It's a large enough object in the way of light for HW lumen to do it right.

The only thing that stands out there is the soda can, because its shadow comes from a different source.

It's not a different source. It's 2 sources (middle and right), each cancelling out the other's shadow, leaving just a small inverted shadow triangle that neither can reach. The shadow itself is actually accurate. What make it look weird and floaty is the lack of any reflection of the soda can on a surface that seems sufficiently reflective. If the soda can had a slightly stronger reflection extending towards the camera, the floating problem would go away and it would look grounded. Reflections in this game are all over the place. We have accurate HW lumen reflections on some surfaces for some objects, while also having SSR, cubemaps and totally missing reflections on others throughout the footage. It's very inconsistent and confusing. The soda can is one of many casualties.

So as not to disrupt the dark, oppressive atmosphere? They said outright that the very first trailer for GeoW was their source of inspiration

The first trailer was certainly the benchmark for tone. But the shot in question is not an oppressive atmosphere imo. It's just badly lit. You can create an oppressive atmosphere just with a single TV light glow and no other lights. The TV screen in the shot above is far too bright to not cast a stronger glow. It should be easily leaving specular highlights on the leather, bald head, ears, hands, exposed ankle, shoe tip etc facing the TV.

They nailed this in both tone and technical accuracy in their own announcement trailer already:

Now THAT is how you convey oppressive lighting. In fact, this is my bigger issue with the game reveal. Both the older mad world trailer and the previous e-day announcement trailer absolutely NAIL the bleak atmosphere. The gameplay reveal and dev direct seem to miss the tone entirely. Even if they keep talking about their source of inspiration, the end result should show it. It falls woefully short imo. I get fun theme park/video game arcade vibes from the lighting, gameplay and even voice acting. Not desperation and hopelessness.

This is a promotional video for a game that will be released at an unspecified date.

Fair point. Both are promotional videos though. One just happens to be coming out sooner. My point isn't whether No Law as an end product will actually deliver on its promise. We don't know that for either game. My point is, based on what was shown, only one is nailing the tone that the other is aspiring to have.

 

[Jack Howitzer]

And it's not like the game running in Performance Mode looked like shit, the clip had shown impressive distant detail and shadows rendered for miles:

When you actually play the thing it's gonna be another story, maybe the lighting can still be somewhat decent at glances, but what about other stuff? And what about the actual rendering resolution and image stability? A slightly better reskined pc version rdr2 ? Maybe that's enough for some crowds. And we know a blurry youtube video can actually hide lots of uglinesss of many ps4 era games as well if the said game does have very pleasing art directions for first impressions, and games like rdr2 do benefits from this a lot

 

[Represent.]

If GTA 6 is 60fps only on ps5 pro I will legitimately just wait for the PC version.

Mother fuck that shit. They better do 30fps and go BALLS TO WALL on pushing the console.

If framerate warriors get fucking gta6 downgraded. Im done

 

[SlimySnake]

Nah fuck this shit, hype deflated, there is absolutely no way they havent cut anything to make the game run at 60 fps on a 5 years old shitty hardware...

I still hope you are wrong, things can change during development if the game became heavier than they expected.

The 60 fps crowd ruining things for everyone as usual...

you do realize that the jump from jaguar CPUs to the zen 2 CPus in these consoles is massive?

We went from 1.6 ghz to 3.2 ghz
We went from 1 thread per cpu core to 2 threads per cpu core
Thats 16 threads running at 3.2 Ghz.

And then there are the massive IPC gains going from jaguar to zen 2. rich measured the cpu improvements and came at a 7-8x leap in CPU performance alone.

The biggest issue with modern games or game engines is that they were not properly multithreaded. it took Epic until 2024 to fix the single threaded bottlenecks in UE5. CD Project helped them multithread NPC and physics logic even more. Good devs will figure out a way to utilize these CPUs. Just run any game on your PC and you will see how your CPU is barely even hitting 40%. devs just dont multithread cpu tasks because most if not all of them need to run sequentially and getting them to run parallel might cause race conditions they want to avoid.

Rockstar devs are different. im sure they have figured it out. the cpu power is there if the devs want to utilize it.

When we talk about 60 fps holding back this generation, we talk about the impact it has on the GPU. Sony games use 1440p for their 60 fps modes which holds back their usage of ray tracing, higher quality assets, and other next gen effects we've seen in gta6 already. we've seen them in gta6 because rockstar is targetting 1440p internal resolutions for their 30 fps mode. if the base ps5 drops to 720p in the 60 fps mode and still features the fancy hair physics, water waves, and NPC detail, then we can safely say that the game wasnt held back by the CPU.

 

[viveks86]

If GTA 6 is 60fps only on ps5 pro I will legitimately just wait for the PC version.

Mother fuck that shit. They better do 30fps and go BALLS TO WALL on pushing the console.

If framerate warriors get fucking gta6 downgraded. Im done

Why not go balls to the wall on both 30 and 60? GymWolf 's balls are dropping anyway, so they can use one for 30 and one for 60.

 

[GymWolf]

If my balls have to be sacrificed for the greater good, so be it...

Always thought about doing a vasectomy anyway

 

[Msamy]

New clip from the website

https://www.rockstargames.com/VI/_next/static/media/3840.0.3c7d3ekv5.b.mp4

This looks amazing , are we expecting trailer 3 before pre-orders?

 

[SupremeJ]

Fatekeeper

 

[Gonzito]

If my balls have to be sacrificed for the greater good, so be it...

Always thought about doing a vasectomy anyway

 

[GudOlRub]

This looks amazing , are we expecting trailer 3 before pre-orders?

I'm expecting a new trailer and social media shorts to spread the typical "Pre-order Now" message everywhere but VI's marketing cycle has been different from previous R* games so I wouldn't bet money on it tbh.

 

[geary]

If the pre-order is later this month, does that mean there will a price drop, or are they expecting people to pre-order without knowing the price?

 

[viveks86]

New clip from the website

https://www.rockstargames.com/VI/_next/static/media/3840.0.3c7d3ekv5.b.mp4

Bruh WTF. If this is realtime, then R* must have implemented megalights/ReSTIR DI in their engine too. Not just RTGI. So direct, indirect and reflections are ray traced? On base consoles?

 

[viveks86]

We can also catch them SSR thingies on the surface of the water on the far left of the screen. Maybe it uses some sort of RT reflections for water & SSR plopped on top of it? Or maybe straight up SSR on water...

Sorry for the trash quality GIF, best I could do in a hasty manner.

Yeah large water body is clearly just getting some SSR for moving objects + cubemaps. No RT there. Something has to give, I guess. But now that's proof that this shit is realtime after all. Which means they have some megalights-style solution in place for direct lighting. Too many light sources accurately lighting and shadowing things on screen.

 

[Gonzito]

A bit off topic but man I love how Deus Ex Mankind Divided looks on pc, its a bit dated in some aspects but the art style and level design is so good man. Its a great example that great art design is timeless even if the technical aspect is not as modern

 

[Hugare]

Don't know if posted but running on Series X at 60fps, amazing.





Nanite, hardware Lumen and mega lights (thousands of shadow casting lights in any scene) all confirmed.

It's crazy how despite having hundreds of light sources it still looks so flat

Like, we have games using baked lighting that looks more impressive than what is on display here

It might have hundreds of light sources but it really doesn't look like it

 

[BlownUpRich]

Yeah large water body is clearly just getting some SSR for moving objects + cubemaps. No RT there. Something has to give, I guess. But now that's proof that this shit is realtime after all. Which means they have some megalights-style solution in place for direct lighting. Too many light sources accurately lighting and shadowing things on screen.

OMG yes it looks like it! Mega lights is such an amazing feature, wouldn't be surprised if Rockstar got something similar to it in there. You're correct pointing that out.

 

[Msamy]

John from DF on the lack of RT and next-gen features on GOW : Laufey : "it is what it is"

What a pathetic response, probably already preparing for his glaze puff piece once they get early access review codes.

I think the game won't drop rt hardware cubemaps which used on Ragnarok ps5 version also viveks86 proved that game have some fourm of RTGI on previous pages , it seems John didn't even know what he is talking about.

 

[The_Observer]

If GTA 6 is 60fps only on ps5 pro I will legitimately just wait for the PC version.

Mother fuck that shit. They better do 30fps and go BALLS TO WALL on pushing the console.

If framerate warriors get fucking gta6 downgraded. Im done

The only positive in all of this is that I found people who are thinking about this as me. I'm so tired of the 60 fps cult that prevented the technical jump this gen in many games. I hope gta 6 will not disappoint… But if it will have a 60 fps mode I will always be disappointed because of the missed potential they could have achieved by designing everything around 30 fps.

 

[Msamy]

The only positive in all of this is that I found people who are thinking about this as me. I'm so tired of the 60 fps cult that prevented the technical jump this gen in many games. I hope gta 6 will not disappoint… But if it will have a 60 fps mode I will always be disappointed because of the missed potential they could have achieved by designing everything around 30 fps.

Yes fuck 60 fps and everyone who supported it over good graphics, GTA VI will be the savior for this whole gaming industry from current bullshit position, it will drove those new generations (who support gass titles) into single player again and it will prove to those companies who don't leave ps4 that they are just lazzy cunts, also ones more fuck 60fps, fuck gaas titles

 

[March Climber]

I will always be disappointed because of the missed potential they could have achieved by designing everything around 30 fps.

Yes fuck 60 fps and everyone who supported it over good graphics

Mother fuck that shit. They better do 30fps and go BALLS TO WALL on pushing the console.

60fps on console forever. No matter what.

 

[viveks86]

I'm so tired of the 60 fps cult

Though it's a worthy debate to keep having for all of eternity, I think it would serve your argument better to not be calling the majority a "cult". Like it or not, people still wanting 30 fps at this stage, are a minority. Does that make you the "cult" that refuses to get with the times?

It's just a preference and neither needs to be judged harshly. And we have reached a point where the compromises to go from 30 to 60 are not fundamental to the game engine or design. Both modes can be tailored to quite easily with engine scaling features. It will be even less of an issue next gen when the CPU dependencies are mostly removed.

 

[dgrdsv]

Where's the ferris wheel reflection?

All reflections on the water there are simplified.
We'll see if that's just the difference in shading or if the BVH scene is also simplified (or SDFed even) once the game will launch.

Maybe it uses some sort of RT reflections for water & SSR plopped on top of it? Or maybe straight up SSR on water...

SSR would render all the lighting in reflections. The fact that it's not there is a clear sign of RT.

 

[TheRedRiders]

Though it's a worthy debate to keep having for all of eternity, I think it would serve your argument better to not be calling the majority a "cult". Like it or not, people still wanting 30 fps at this stage, are a minority. Does that make you the "cult" that refuses to get with the times?

It's just a preference and neither needs to be judged harshly. And we have reached a point where the compromises to go from 30 to 60 are not fundamental to the game engine or design. Both modes can be tailored to quite easily with engine scaling features. It will be even less of an issue next gen when the CPU dependencies are mostly removed.

I agree with you, I left the laugh emoji because that GIF always makes me chuckle.

Just in case you think I'm trolling.

 

[viveks86]

SSR would render all the lighting in reflections. The fact that it's not there is a clear sign of RT.

Given how simple they are, they could be cube maps too, generated for different times of day.

See the building reflections on the bottom left fading in as the camera is pulled back. That's classic SSR, layered on top of a base cube map. If those were newer objects being added to the BVH, they would pop-in, instead of swipe-in.

It's possible they are using a combination of all 3 techniques. Simplified proxy for RT reflection + SSR + cubemap.

 

[GudOlRub]

Though it's a worthy debate to keep having for all of eternity, I think it would serve your argument better to not be calling the majority a "cult". Like it or not, people still wanting 30 fps at this stage, are a minority. Does that make you the "cult" that refuses to get with the times?

It's just a preference and neither needs to be judged harshly. And we have reached a point where the compromises to go from 30 to 60 are not fundamental to the game engine or design. Both modes can be tailored to quite easily with engine scaling features. It will be even less of an issue next gen when the CPU dependencies are mostly removed.

Yep, if the majority of people did not use 60fps modes devs would not insist so much on having them in their games.
The truth is if you show most normies Ghost of Yotei or Cyberpunk running at quality and performance modes, most of them won't notice the difference and will obviously choose to play in the most responsive mode of the two.

I'll honestly be disappointed if VI has a 60fps mode as well not because of graphics tbh but simply because I know that the CPU cost of that will most likely impact the simulation side of things even if just a tiny little bit but it is what it is...

 

[viveks86]

Yep, if the majority of people did not use 60fps modes devs would not insist so much on having them in their games.
The truth is if you show most normies Ghost of Yotei or Cyberpunk running at quality and performance modes, most of them won't notice the difference and will obviously choose to play in the most responsive mode of the two.

I'll honestly be disappointed if VI has a 60fps mode as well not because of graphics tbh but simply because I know that the CPU cost of that will most likely impact the simulation side of things even if just a tiny little bit but it is what it is...

Given the sheer scale here, I'm not even sure most of the simulations are running on CPU anymore. It's highly likely collision detection and physics are all GPU bound in this game and the CPU is merely orchestrating things. Plenty of CPU grunt on current gen consoles to pull that off at 60 if done right, imo.

 

[Negotiator101]

It's crazy how despite having hundreds of light sources it still looks so flat

Like, we have games using baked lighting that looks more impressive than what is on display here

It might have hundreds of light sources but it really doesn't look like it

Disagree completely obviously opinions and everything but I don't know what you think looks better than this?