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Sony to double down on Marathon
- Thread starter Dr. Samuel Hayden
- Start date
Unfortunatecookie
Member
Precisely.
Sony says they'll keep supporting it. But as evidenced by 12 zillion live-service games being shutdown, the key is not in what the publisher/developer says; it's what they do.
It's clear that Sony figured out (late) that they messed up going all-in on live-service. It's what happens when you listen to and or are surrounded by people who think they know everything, e.g., execs with no background in gaming, loud podcast hosts, consultants who just want a quick buck. I think we'll know how 'committed' Sony are to GaaS with what happens to both Fairgame$ and baby's first Horizon game.
If I were at Bungie, I'd start doing the math on how a failing game can be supported by a company with a documented history of killing a failing game within weeks of its release
Generic
Member
Because the game is great.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Not really.
Different games, different audience. Not every SP gamer plays the same games as every other SP gamer.
I can't believe this even has to be stated.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Who are you responding to?
Where in my post did I make anything even remotely similar to the claim you're citing?
I think you're the one who's fucking high, buddy. You're not even paying attention to who you're replying to.
clarky
Gold Member
Of course it would. You add a campaign and PVE modes to the game and you'd have a very similar game to Destiny
Nintendo's Witch
Member
It's a marathon not a sprint
Shubh_C63
Member
It's a failure, not a Marathon
Mengy
wishes it were bannable to say mean things about Marvel
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KyoZz
Tag, you're it.
Yep I agree. What I don't get is why Bungie though it would be a good idea to skip the campaign.
The game has potential, even if I don't like the artstyle you can't deny they have a vision and what seems like a solid lore, why not launch your universe (not counting the 1994 games) with a campaign of around 10 hours? It's Bungie FFS... Maybe make it so you unlock more maps for the PvP as you progress the main story, giving more context/world building as the player progress. Then at a certain point, your character could pick a faction and participate in an all-out war on a massive map. Idk I just think it would've been way more interesting like that. They made great cinematics pre launch too, they should've doubled down on this.
Problem is content and I still don't understand how there is so few maps, no excuses for that.
fixed
Yep I agree. What I don't get is why Bungie though it would be a good idea to skip the campaign.
The game has potential, even if I don't like the artstyle you can't deny they have a vision and what seems like a solid lore, why not launch your universe (not counting the 1994 games) with a campaign of around 10 hours? It's Bungie FFS... Maybe make it so you unlock more maps for the PvP as you progress the main story, giving more context/world building as the player progress. Then at a certain point, your character could pick a faction and participate in an all-out war on a massive map. Idk I just think it would've been way more interesting like that. They made great cinematics pre launch too, they should've doubled down on this.
Problem is content and I still don't understand how there is so few maps, no excuses for that.
Pejo
Member
If the character and weapon designs weren't dogshit divisive, I'd say it could be easily saved with a robust season 2 with a PVE component, maybe some hype abilities or classes added. But they're trying to build on a shaky foundation, and it just seems like such an uphill battle. If it were me, I'd look at sunsetting Marathon and just add a very similar extraction mode to Destiny 3 when it comes out. Maybe give a % discount for Destiny 3 if you own Marathon.
clarky
Gold Member
Lack of content is the least of this games problems , adding more maps would not address any of the issues. People are not bouncing off this game because they are bored. Look at the Steam achievements half of the folks who bought the game left before they killed 14 people, in a PVP game. 40% didn't even exfil 7 times. These folks are not coming back for season 2 without some significant changes to the early game.
Yep I agree. What I don't get is why Bungie though it would be a good idea to skip the campaign.
The game has potential, even if I don't like the artstyle you can't deny they have a vision and what seems like a solid lore, why not launch your universe (not counting the 1994 games) with a campaign of around 10 hours? It's Bungie FFS... Maybe make it so you unlock more maps for the PvP as you progress the main story, giving more context/world building as the player progress. Then at a certain point, your character could pick a faction and participate in an all-out war on a massive map. Idk I just think it would've been way more interesting like that. They made great cinematics pre launch too, they should've doubled down on this.
Problem is content and I still don't understand how there is so few maps, no excuses for that.
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KyoZz
Tag, you're it.
Damn that's brutal indeed, haven't seen that.Lack of content is the least of this games problems , adding more maps would not address any of the issues. People are not bouncing off this game because they are bored. Look at the Steam achievements half of the folks who bought the game left before they killed 14 people, in a PVP game. 40% didn't even exfil 7 times. These folks are not coming back for season 2 without some significant changes to the early game.
Welp R.I.P.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Where does that say or even imply that 12,000 players is good?
Reading comprehension is dead, apparently.
Radical_3d
Member
So much for failing "early and cheaply".
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
winjer
Gold Member
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
winjer
Gold Member
I believe it. Just because any change, as minor as it can be, even if it's just changing an icon or logo, would be considered " some sort of change to the game"
That is such a broad, non specific, non descriptive statement, that it could mean anything.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
I guess my attempt at being sarcastic didn't land
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
It landed with some of us.I guess my attempt at being sarcastic didn't land
Zamana
Gold Member
Bungie could turn Marathon into Destiny-3 kinda world in a few years.
Obviously not lore or gameplay wise but they have got a new story and mechanics to build a world. The current Marathon can be an intense Crucible like mode with better balance than D2 Crucible ( I mean, let's be real, Destiny 2 PvP is not balanced lol). They could build a story, world and activities around this, the foundation is exceptionally good. I would jump to play a something like this, a Destiny-lite extraction shooter with many modes for casual players to hardcore and a world to grind.
One can only wish lol.
Obviously not lore or gameplay wise but they have got a new story and mechanics to build a world. The current Marathon can be an intense Crucible like mode with better balance than D2 Crucible ( I mean, let's be real, Destiny 2 PvP is not balanced lol). They could build a story, world and activities around this, the foundation is exceptionally good. I would jump to play a something like this, a Destiny-lite extraction shooter with many modes for casual players to hardcore and a world to grind.
One can only wish lol.
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diffusionx
Gold Member
This is what it always should have been but they needed to spend $200 million over five or six years to make an extraction mode with four maps.
Hypereides
Member
Sony, and when I say that I mean Hulst, has a lot of money riding on this. That acquisition wasn't cheap. They have to prove it was worth it.
Not surprising they're doubling down.
Not surprising they're doubling down.
NastyPasty
Member
They could well be there now. The thing is, Sony may well take the view that the costs of abandoning it (effectively reputational damage) outweigh the costs of continued support. Who's going to buy Fairgames and the Horizon game if their pull the plug on this after the Concord fiasco? They'll be out of the live service business for good. Maybe that's a good thing, but I'm sure Sony will have put a price on that, and will have an idea how much they are willing to lose supporting the game. Forget sunk costs, they're gone.
My guess is there will be a years support regardless of whether things turn around. Changes informed by the launch will come season 3 and there will be some sort of relaunch, price drop, free week, marketing, PS Plus or whatever. I don't see a substantial single player campaign but wouldn't be surprised to see a short one as part of the onboarding tutorial process, something that clearly needs improving.
cormack12
Gold Member
Sometimes I'm genuinely baffled by how official channels can say things like "player retention remains high" when the statistics are literally flashing bright red behind them for everyone to see. The disconnect between PR talk and reality is honestly astounding.
Yeah I think that's really naughty and very close to misleading shareholders imo.
We sold 10,000 and lost 9,995 players. Of the 5 people that play, they play it lots and we retain their time.
Luipadre
Member
The truth is, bungie is super bad at making their games welcoming to new players. This is why im sceptical about turning this game around. I would love to play Destiny for example, but that game for newcomers like me is a fucking nightmare and they havent been able to fix that issue so they dont get new players at all, same goes to Marathon
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
If Joe Ziegler is the big boss man (Creative Director), why do you think Bungies reputation supersedes what the leader of Marathon thinks? Dude made Valorant which is very beginner friendly.
I collect VHS tapes
Member
This is whats so baffling
How did they spend so much time and money to have this bare bone experience as the end product
Feels like a scam game almost
cormack12
Gold Member
reezoo
Member
This changes everything... well may be not everything.
Arsic
Loves his juicy stink trail scent
I'd argue the best time to onboard a Bungie game is release. Destiny on launch was barebones and easy to understand. As layers get added onto D1, then D2, jumping on later is a nightmare.
But I'd argue that for any longtime running game. It really is up to the player. Like learning age of empires 2 today is brutal but if you really want a competitive RTS with higher player counts and dev support then that's the one. Or DOTA 2 for a moba. You commit to learn because you want to and the game excites you in some way.
Marathon is best to learn now not because of it getting more complex with time but because it simply will stop existing.
Zacfoldor
Gold Member
That's right. Most games that fix themselves and win back audiences start broken.Lack of content is the least of this games problems , adding more maps would not address any of the issues. People are not bouncing off this game because they are bored. Look at the Steam achievements half of the folks who bought the game left before they killed 14 people, in a PVP game. 40% didn't even exfil 7 times. These folks are not coming back for season 2 without some significant changes to the early game.
Marathon isn't broken.
If you add say, 10 more maps, all that will do is hurt the game by spreading out the queues and playerbases. If you add 10 more runners that just confuses the current game to the point where most people won't be able to identify who they are fighting with silhouettes and would also kinda ruin the game.
New content, then, needs to come in the form of game theory and itemization. It's so much harder to "fix" a game that isn't broken because you aren't really fixing, you are either changing the game or changing the perception of the game to the audience.
It's hard to relay that kinda detail to the audience too. The best thing Marathon has going for it is the hate crowd now. They will keep the game in the public eye. Right now without the hate campaign the game would have fallen to complete irrelevancy.
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Plague Doctor
Member
Hollywood Hitman
Gold Member
Hopefully the update will be as good as their "renewed focus on pvp".... That never happened
clarky
Gold Member
Marathon is absolutely broken. Sure the actual core arguably isn't but everything around it is or is missing. Little to no onboarding, lack of social features, an endgame so difficult hardly anyone engages with it, Ranked mode that misses the mark, Cheaters, no gear refunds etc etc. Lots of work to be done in areas that are very easy to identify if they want this game to succeed.
coffinbirth
Member
Make the game F2P.
Give the people that paid for the game exclusive Legendary equipment and skins and/or free season passes.
Make MTX skins that give the game a better personality and charge a premium for them.
See your numbers go waaaaaay up. Potentially turn a profit in the long run.
As it stands now, they are burning cash with no incentive to bring in fence-sitters and casuals, which any and all liveservice games need to survive.
You can clearly see the end of the runway for this game if they don't dramatically shift gears.
Give the people that paid for the game exclusive Legendary equipment and skins and/or free season passes.
Make MTX skins that give the game a better personality and charge a premium for them.
See your numbers go waaaaaay up. Potentially turn a profit in the long run.
As it stands now, they are burning cash with no incentive to bring in fence-sitters and casuals, which any and all liveservice games need to survive.
You can clearly see the end of the runway for this game if they don't dramatically shift gears.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
Sony would never be dumping more resources into it if they thought it wasn't broken.
The conversation around this genre will improve dramatically in 5 years once people begin to understand it. You really need to play it deeply before you can truly see it.
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Hari Seldon
Member
They are not just bad at it, they are the worst in the industry at this. Bungies management is so terrible I don't know how any of them are employed. They are a dogshit studio run by pure clowns. The only way marathon can be saved is if Sony gives it to a better studio. And by better I mean literally any other studio.
How about a solo mode that plays on larger maps but instead of picking one of the runners, you design your own runner with two skills picked from all the current runners skills. You can then customise your personal runner with different helmets, outfits, boots and gloves?
coffinbirth
Member
Extraction shooters?
What is there to understand? You loot, you shoot, and then you scoot.
This isn't quantum mechanics. It's not that deep.
Arc Raiders is six months old and people are already sick of it, myself included.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
It's by far the most complex and ambitious PvP genre outside of maybe survival. Overwatch needed 5 - 6 years before it became Overwatch. This genre needs closer to 10. The PvP RPG.
ARC Raiders is still an infant.
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