twilo99
Member
The pandemic, mainly.
I see it as a blow off top for the whole sector.
What Microsoft have here is unsustainable growth, just like most other tech companies, so I actually expect more layoffs later this year.
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"Microsoft is laying off 10,000 people today, including in its gaming divisions such as Xbox and Bethesda."
- Thread starter The Cockatrice
- Start date
The pandemic, mainly.
I see it as a blow off top for the whole sector.
What Microsoft have here is unsustainable growth, just like most other tech companies, so I actually expect more layoffs later this year.
Solarstrike
Gold Member
onnextflix5
Member
Wow ms are giving this gen to sony on a sliver platter. They should be expanding the teams they have, not laying people off,
Companies tend not to announce massive layoffs when things are going great.
Pelta88
Member
You must have missed Phil Spencer's comments and Microsoft's legally binding submissions to the regulators and courts. They paint a very different picture to GP and cloud than we've been led to believe.
Basically PR VS Reality.
It’s called real life. When the economy slows down company’s slim down. When it booms they hire.
jakinov
Member
It's obviously sad for the people who lost their jobs but this isn't too crazy of news nowadays even with the large raw number of layoffs.
Lots of tech companies are laying off right now. Companies are taking less risk, slowing down with risky projects, cutting projects, looking at other ways to save money. Debt is expenisve now. People are spending less on the things that Microsoft sells/offers. Microsoft has been on a massive hiring spree in the last few years, since around the start of the pandemic they've added around 77,000 new jobs. Many of those jobs where Microsoft paid very lucratively for employees because people were fighting for talent the last few years. But now they are cutting back a bit because now is not the good time to be taking the kind of risk as the time when everyone was at an all time high, debt was cheap and everyone was growing like crazy and people were spending like crazy.
Microsoft is like 200 companies in one, they acquire multiple companies a year beyond gaming. They have over a thousand projects/products/services all around the company. The impact on the day to day will likely be minimal.
Lots of tech companies are laying off right now. Companies are taking less risk, slowing down with risky projects, cutting projects, looking at other ways to save money. Debt is expenisve now. People are spending less on the things that Microsoft sells/offers. Microsoft has been on a massive hiring spree in the last few years, since around the start of the pandemic they've added around 77,000 new jobs. Many of those jobs where Microsoft paid very lucratively for employees because people were fighting for talent the last few years. But now they are cutting back a bit because now is not the good time to be taking the kind of risk as the time when everyone was at an all time high, debt was cheap and everyone was growing like crazy and people were spending like crazy.
Microsoft is like 200 companies in one, they acquire multiple companies a year beyond gaming. They have over a thousand projects/products/services all around the company. The impact on the day to day will likely be minimal.
reinking
Gold Member
Thoughts to those who are losing their jobs. I have never been fired but I have been laid off. It really sucks to lose your job through no fault of your own. I understand that business is business but it doesn't make it suck any less.
There is no reason for either side to turn this into a console/company war.
There is no reason for either side to turn this into a console/company war.
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nikolino840
Member
Microsoft is evil that use 69B to buy Activision instead to pay the workers or solve the problems in the third world
Some of the jobs are from their Edinburgh office apparently. I think I read somewhere that there is a $1.2 charge partially related to "changes to their hardware portfolio". Any guesses what this could mean?
This current economy sucks and I fear we will be seeing this across a lot of companies in the future. Hope those affected land on their feet.
This current economy sucks and I fear we will be seeing this across a lot of companies in the future. Hope those affected land on their feet.
gothmog
Gold Member
The new measure of success is profit margin. It's not enough now to make 5-10%. You have to make 30+% year over year. Pure fucking greed.Their profits have gone up too. This is just a classic case of corporate greed. They make tens billions in profits EVERY quarter. They made $72 billion in profits last year alone which should pay off the Activision purchase by itself.
But hey lets layoff tens of thousands of people anyway.
Profits have not dropped though. The tech sector benefitted from the pandemic but I'm not sure post pandemic the soaring profits from Cloud would necessarily fall. Gaming I can see with less people stuck indoors but that was never a big profit driver for MS anyway.
TLZ
Banned
In favour of more indian cheap Labor? I hate that crap.Making room
ResilientBanana
Member
Microsoft employs over 221,000 people. Only some of the 10,000 that are getting layed off are in the gaming division. Getting layed off is also not getting fired, they could come back eventually.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
No idea. Pandemic era was very profitable for tech companies. Doesnt matter though. They got rich off the backs of these workers, but are throwing them away like used condoms to maximize profits. Their CEO literally said we need to do more with less. GTFO.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Microsoft is a whole lot bigger than Xbox or Game pass. Those things have nothing in common. Let's also not forget Since 2019, Microsoft has hired about 75,000 workers. While no one likes layoffs let's not pretend that MS hasn't hired far more than laid off. But don't let a reality get in the way of a narrative.
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
I'm not sure it is that normal - but only owing to the scale - but corporate restructures in corporations are part of the calendar year at some places. At my old job it was annual, my boss said they survived 26 of them when their job went.
In answer to the question: because it's Microsoft.
Edit: https://www.verdict.co.uk/15-tech-firms-that-announced-layoffs-in-november/
Less concern for tech forms firing staff a couple of months ago.
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ResilientBanana
Member
Most of the layoffs are in Engineering and HR.
iHaunter
Member
A teeny tiny portion of that is the gaming division.
Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
Fuck posts like this. Enough of the Sony/MS rhetoric.
MS hired 75,000 since 2019 because all tech companies did this hiring spree to keep pace with record online demand due to Covid. It's actually surprising the layoffs aren't far larger as that has naturally diminished as the world opens up again.
What's 75,000 minus 10,000? I think they're doing fine and looking after their games, company, shareholders and employees. Stop taking clickbait at face value and turning this forum into Sony vs Xbox bullshit.
BadBurger
Is 'That Pure Potato'
Since the pandemic started, Microsoft's profits surged so much that ended up hiring 75k people over these part three years. So while this is a contraction ahead of rising interest rates and economic uncertainty, it's not a huge loss all things considered. They're still going to be roughly 65k employees larger than they were in 2019.
It just sucks that it's being done to squeeze every red cent out of every possible dollar for the shareholders. While it's probably fiscally responsible to do this, Microsoft doesn't really have to. They're still going to be making money hand over fist in this post-pandemic world, recession or no.
It just sucks that it's being done to squeeze every red cent out of every possible dollar for the shareholders. While it's probably fiscally responsible to do this, Microsoft doesn't really have to. They're still going to be making money hand over fist in this post-pandemic world, recession or no.
MarkMe2525
Member
Yeah, this has been making the rounds for the past couple of weeks. All of big tech has downsized this year. Apple, Google, Amazon, MS, many more. Course correction for all the hiring they did during the pandemic
IFireflyl
Gold Member
Exactly. The console warring is ridiculous. Almost 5% of their workforce is newsworthy for sure, but their gaming division isn't the majority of their workforce. And this doesn't somehow equate to Microsoft going belly-up in the gaming sector.
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Warablo
Member
That's horrible
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
Sucks but inevitable
Many jobs are about to be replaced by AI/robotics
Smarter, more experienced, more efficient
Humanity are in the brink of extinction
Some jobs will be replaced by robots, but new jobs open up to program, fix, maintain, and help operate the robots.
Not to mention, many careers can't be done with robots in general. People need to grow and adapt to the changing times, not be stuck in the past, whining about having lost a job that can be done by a robot who can't even think.
Clintizzle
Lord of Edge.
Um I think 343i might be finished.....
Jinzo Prime
Member
That's some ass-backwards shit right there. How is firing the best guy, the one with the most tenure "sharing the pain"? He is the only one in pain!
Airbus Jr
Banned
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Easy to always blame management. But management isn't the ones doing the nuts and bolts.
I dont see how management can be blamed for a game that had a 6 year gap from Halo 5, didn't make the Slipspace engine, and surely didn't do the artwork and textures for the Craig video year ago.
Someone can say it's their fault for showing Craig and releasing the game as it is. But it gets to a point you got to ship a game out unless a company wants to do a Duke Nukem and make it a 10 year project.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
Yeah, it's good to see some staff giving some no-nonsense answers and insights. I can't picture layoffs from 343i being done, if MS are going to continue more layoffs going into March.
The studio won't get shut down, but I definitely can see them being shifted down to a support-only studio to provide technical assistance for other MS studios. And maybe for the next Halo (Halo Infinite is more or less finished, they're not committing 10 full years to that damn game except to keep the servers running and get Forge mode out) they have Certain Affinity take the creative lead.
It's probably for the best TBH.
You learn something new everyday.
Well what hardware does MS make? Azure server racks, Surface devices, HoloLens, Xbox.
Which one is on record as being subsidized by $100 - $200 dollars only a few months ago? Which one is part of a division that has been mentioned as never being profitable on the hardware, from court documents no less?
If I were to guess, they might actually scale back on Series S production and push more Series X units, do a soft price increase with Series X, but probably have slightly lower overall Xbox shipments because they can't make as many Xs' as they can S units.
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ChorizoPicozo
Member
the next Xbox Two Podcast should be very entertaining 
ChorizoPicozo
Member
this was supposed to be enlightening?.
Cheezewizz
Banned
No more damage controlling than you're over emphasizing of it.
Microsoft hired more than 50k workers over the pandemic, and hired more than 40k people in 2022 alone. Where were you applauding that when it was announced? Where were you when it was announced that Amazon was laying off 18k people? What about Meta and Google laying off over 10k apiece?
But here you are front and center making sure nobody states the obvious.
ChorizoPicozo
Member
the gaming division far smaller right?.
meaning the gaming layoffs are more significant.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
To be fair, accusations are often one sided. Its not too often management or VPs will call out their employees for doing a shit job. They are above that kind of shit calling out people publicly. But guys like Patrick Wren who worked at 343 for 8 years from 2013 - 2021 (according his Linked In I just checked) as some kind of MP and Level Designer role are the types of people (video game + non-management) who will use social media and criticize bosses.
IMO working at companies and seeing products (and entire product lines) succeed or fail it's typically a team effort. You win and lose as a company. Not saying the janitor or accounts payable clerk roles have any influence (so they can be excluded from the equation), but it's a combined effort of R&D, marketing, sales and logistics that make products succeed. In gaming, you can probably exclude sales team and logistics as games sell themselves digitally and there isn't a logistics kind of thing to gaming that has shit loads of warehouses and shipping lead time or stock outs.
People can blame top management for green lighting something, but if the product is shit they are put in a tough place to decide what to do with it. Gaming studios should be lucky because even when games are kind of shit they still might go through the entire process, have a job and see it to final release. 343 had a 6 year gap from Halo 5 and they were bragging about their new Slipspace Engine. I highly doubt management are the ones coding all night. There's only so much leash you can give a team to develop the right product.
Dr. Claus
Vincit qui se vincit
Management is the ones who get final say. A dev can state that something is unfinished, broken, or not ready - none of that matters if the management demands they show the product as it is. A dev can also say that something is working well, but if Management wants to move in a new direction and scrap what was done, management again has the final say.
ZoukGalaxy
Member
What an unfair and so sad story.
You have to work to live, but don't live to work. This is what I tell always to people.
Also big corporate doesn't give a shit about you, you're just a ressource.
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March Climber
Member
The funny thing here is that it wasn’t even Jason’s words, he linked to a Bloomberg article.
Some of you are so intent on making sure he ‘loses’ that you aren’t even reading further into the OP.