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[EviLore]

Hyundai stops engine development and reassigns engineers to EVs

Yet more proof that the internal combustion engine is on borrowed time.

arstechnica.com

"
Last year was challenging for many reasons, but 2021 wasn't entirely bad. Despite the pandemic and the chip shortage, it was a great year for new battery electric vehicles. So much so that more than half of our top 10 drives of the year were BEVs. That's good for consumers looking for a new car—assuming they can find one in stock.

End-of-year top 10 lists are extremely subjective, and no one should read too much into them. But if you want proof of the impending extinction of the internal combustion engine, consider this: On December 23, Hyundai Motor Group (parent company of Hyundai, Kia, and Genesis) shuttered its internal combustion engine research and development division, according to The Korea Economic Daily.

Park Chung-kook, the new head of Hyundai's R&D efforts, explained in an email to Hyundai Motor Group employees that "our own engine development is a great achievement, but we must change the system to create future innovation based on the great asset from the past."

Instead of developing new gasoline- or diesel-powered engines, the researchers and engineers will work on electric powertrains—an area where Hyundai is already extremely competitive.

Previously, Volvo announced that it would also end its internal combustion engine development, but the company appears to be having its cake while still eating it. In 2021, it spun off its entire engine operation—including future R&D and production—to a new joint venture with its parent company, Geely.

I'm not the only one who sees the writing on the wall. Bloomberg envisions a potential crash in the residual value of more expensive gasoline cars, warning that, "while there might still be a robust market for used Honda Accords in 2028, it will probably be a more tenuous market for used gasoline-powered $40,000 sedans and sport utility vehicles as people in that segment switch over to EVs."
"

 

[Pagusas]

I wonder if we’re close to seeing the peek of ICE engineering then, or if advancements will still be made in the racing areas

 

[haxan7]

It’s not like they can achieve much more with ICEs.

 

[Great Hair]

That´s a suicide then. They´re still making 90% of their revenue with ICEs.

65+ million sold cars in total or more, of which 5ish are BEVs.

Topic: Automotive industry worldwide

Global light vehicle sales declined by around four percent between 2018 and 2019. This trend is expected to exacerbate throughout 2020 due to the coronavirus pandemic.

www.statista.com

How Many Cars Are There In The World? Statistics by Country.

We look at global automotive stats on the 1.475 billion cars in the world, cars per capita and other automotive industry world stats.

hedgescompany.com

 

[Coolwhhip]

Yeah ICE will die a very quick death now. Hyundai still has a weird thing going on with hydrogen though, together with the SK government.

 

[Thaedolus]

I wonder if we’re close to seeing the peek of ICE engineering then, or if advancements will still be made in the racing areas

Or EV racing will cannibalize the racing markets.

 

[poppabk]

How much R&D do they really need to do on ICE's? It's not like they will be stopping regular cars anytime soon. I'm still concerned about whether we have the resources to actually go all electric, they are struggling to put the infotainment systems in cars at the moment imagine if the entire world was building electric cars.

 

[Dr.Guru of Peru]

That´s a suicide then. They´re still making 90% of their revenue with ICEs.

65+ million sold cars in total or more, of which 5ish are BEVs.

Topic: Automotive industry worldwide

Global light vehicle sales declined by around four percent between 2018 and 2019. This trend is expected to exacerbate throughout 2020 due to the coronavirus pandemic.

www.statista.com

How Many Cars Are There In The World? Statistics by Country.

We look at global automotive stats on the 1.475 billion cars in the world, cars per capita and other automotive industry world stats.

hedgescompany.com

R+D is generally future oriented. I'm guessing they're just reuse their current ICE engines in whatever new ICE cars they introduce until they full transition to BEV by 2030 or so.

 

[Ownage]

I've heard rumors the GV90 will be EV, and the next GV80 and 60 will too. I'll be honest: Tiger's crash made me look closer at the GV80 and I really like it.

 

[Great Hair]

R+D is generally future oriented. I'm guessing they're just reuse their current ICE engines in whatever new ICE cars they introduce until they full transition to BEV by 2030 or so.

Until then, every car manufacture will keep collecting, acquiring CO2 certificates given by Tesla. With it they will fake their green gas house reports, keep selling PHEVs because they´re considered green ...

And they will make them for few more years while making some cosmetic changes. This is mostly about no new development for ICE cars, which is no surprise given that in the next couple of decades there will be more and more regulation and more strict conditions regarding ICEs e.g. already in Paris many older car models cannot drive into the city.

The ICEngine cars build now will last 10 to 20 years and exxon, petronas will keep on selling black gold beyond 2030. What else are they going to do?

Waiting til 2030 wont fix anything. We need every gov. to push EVs harder. Give even bigger incentives. Copying norway for a 5 years and make ICE stupidly expensive would be a great starter.

Most EU states have a joke infracstructure compared to Norway, Germany. 50kWh charge-station should be banned, a complete waste of money.

 

[JayK47]

I for one am not looking forward to the EV future. I love ICE cars. I'd sooner deal with horse shit than EVs.

 

[TheKingSalami]

 

[ParaSeoul]

EVs are the future and if everything goes well will take over in couple years but it will probably take longer for developing countries to catch up so are all the big car makers just going to not sell any cars in developing countries that are still mainly using ICE vehicles after they stop manufacturing them? I know 2035 is when most manufacturers are planning to stop ICE production and when the EU want ICE vehicles to stop being sold completely.

 

[sankt-Antonio]

They stop developing new engines, not production of them.

Likewise Volvo etc. they will all continue to make and sell ICE for years to come.

I guess they have their Euro7 capable ICE ready. Euro8 will be the Tine where EVs get cheaper to make and sell then ICE, so there is no need to further develop new engines.

But it’s always nice to put out such statements for the stock crowd.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

That´s a suicide then. They´re still making 90% of their revenue with ICEs.

And they will make them for few more years while making some cosmetic changes. This is mostly about no new development for ICE cars, which is no surprise given that in the next couple of decades there will be more and more regulation and more strict conditions regarding ICEs e.g. already in Paris many older car models cannot drive into the city.

 

[Reallink]

EU emission standards are already nearly impossible for new engines to hit, no one's going to be developing new ICE beyond the next year or two.

 

[Coolwhhip]

ICE will probably completely crash in 2-3 years when people find out the resale value of their new ICE car will be low, like the article says. In Norway that already happened. Since they have 90% EV market share there.

 

[Lanrutcon]

EVs are the future and if everything goes well will take over in couple years but it will probably take longer for developing countries to catch up so are all the big car makers just going to not sell any cars in developing countries that are still mainly using ICE vehicles after they stop manufacturing them? I know 2035 is when most manufacturers are planning to stop ICE production and when the EU want ICE vehicles to stop being sold completely.

Africa will be running ICE long after 2035.

 

[Coolwhhip]

Africa will be running ICE long after 2035.

Doubt it, super cheap 2 seater EVs are already coming to Africa. And they got enough sun at least.

 

[Lanrutcon]

Doubt it, super cheap 2 seater EVs are already coming to Africa. And they got enough sun at least.

Speaking as someone who lives in South Africa, a country with a conservative 40% unemployment rate where every petrol station needs armed guards and the majority of the populace can't afford a third-hand piece of crap that barely runs and people that do have cars need to drive looooong distances because they can't afford to live in the cities they work in, I can absolutely promise you that you are completely wrong.

 

[Coolwhhip]

Speaking as someone who lives in South Africa, a country with a conservative 40% unemployment rate where every petrol station needs armed guards and the majority of the populace can't afford a third-hand piece of crap that barely runs and people that do have cars need to drive looooong distances because they can't afford to live in the cities they work in, I can absolutely promise you that you are completely wrong.

Maybe. I wonder what happens if prices of gas go up a lot though, for poor countries like yours.

 

[Lanrutcon]

Maybe. I wonder what happens if prices of gas go up a lot though, for poor countries like yours.

They always do. Our currency has been crap since like, 2000. Our fuel costs are silly. Everyone rents cause nobody can buy a house. Our crime stats are nuts. Our cities are filled with walled off residential zones with private security where the upper middle class bunker themselves off from the rest of the country. Every street corner has multiple beggars. Every intersection has a sign saying watch out for carjackings. Regular blackouts are a thing here. We call it "loadshedding" because the power companies are so corrupt they can barely keep the plants going. Our government regularly "loses" millions of our currency, our municipalities drown in debt, our roads don't get maintained, our infrastructure is ancient and nothing will get better because democracy doesn't mean shit when the majority of the voters are ignorant and uneducated.

So advancements like EVs? We're probably not the ideal audience.

 

[Coolwhhip]

They always do. Our currency has been crap since like, 2000. Our fuel costs are silly. Everyone rents cause nobody can buy a house. Our crime stats are nuts. Our cities are filled with walled off residential zones with private security where the upper middle class bunker themselves off from the rest of the country. Every street corner has multiple beggars. Every intersection has a sign saying watch out for carjackings. Regular blackouts are a thing here. We call it "loadshedding" because the power companies are so corrupt they can barely keep the plants going. Our government regularly "loses" millions of our currency, our municipalities drown in debt, our roads don't get maintained, our infrastructure is ancient and nothing will get better because democracy doesn't mean shit when the majority of the voters are ignorant and uneducated.

So advancements like EVs? We're probably not the ideal audience.

That doesn't sound great. But EVs will become the cheaper option very soon though, so you wouldn't drive EVs to save the planet. But because they're cheaper. In Europe the gas prices will go up partly because of all the climate change agreements though, you probably don't have those in Africa.

 

[Lanrutcon]

That doesn't sound great. But EVs will become the cheaper option very soon though, so you wouldn't drive EVs to save the planet. But because they're cheaper. In Europe the gas prices will go up partly because of all the climate change agreements though, you probably don't have those in Africa.

Yeah, but in a country where you need to drive long distances, have regular loss of electricity to large areas and a super high rate of crime (including regular pillaging of the infrastructure, such as stealing power and phone cables) I don't think the vehicles will fare well even for those that can afford them (I think: someone who owns one can probably chime in. If you can't reliably charge your vehicle...how does that impact your usage?).

 

[mekes]

Government and local council policy are definitely leading the charge in London. The rules have definitely ramped up some in the past 18 months.

£800 to park your range rover outside of your own home for a year. Zero if you have an EV.

The only thing I'm concerned about is the inability to move an EV vehicle if it has broken down. Have to wait for a recovery vehicle. I've been caught out 2 or 3 times by this issue already. I hope the issue finds a workaround soon otherwise it will be bad news for inner city driving in the near future.

 

[Coolwhhip]

Government and local council policy are definitely leading the charge in London. The rules have definitely ramped up some in the past 18 months.

£800 to park your range rover outside of your own home for a year. Zero if you have an EV.

The only thing I'm concerned about is the inability to move an EV vehicle if it has broken down. Have to wait for a recovery vehicle. I've been caught out 2 or 3 times by this issue already. I hope the issue finds a workaround soon otherwise it will be bad news for inner city driving in the near future.

What do you mean broken down exactly?

 

[TylerD]

Africa will be running ICE long after 2035.

So will the United States. The "death" of ICE, whatever that means, will be a lengthy process for the most part seeing how the average age of vehicles on US roads is 12.1 years and has been growing, and there are a number of older cars that get sent to poorer countries where they could live for possibly 10-20 years or longer.

Cars on American roads keep getting older

The average age of vehicles on U.S. roads has been rising for decades as cars grow ever more durable — and expensive.

www.cnbc.com

 

[Coolwhhip]

So will the United States. The "death" of ICE, whatever that means, will be a lengthy process for the most part seeing how the average age of vehicles on US roads is 12.1 years and has been growing, and there are a number of older cars that get sent to poorer countries where they could live for possibly 10-20 years or longer.

Cars on American roads keep getting older

The average age of vehicles on U.S. roads has been rising for decades as cars grow ever more durable — and expensive.

www.cnbc.com

You have to take into consideration how much cheaper it is to own an EV compared to ICE and that gap is increasing fast.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

You have to take into consideration how much cheaper it is to own an EV compared to ICE and that gap is increasing fast.

True, but as someone that saw how the government over few short years had reached price parity for diesel and petrol (diesel started at 50% of the price) most likely scenario with EVs being more popular is charging more tax on charging stations in the cities. Might not be the thing for the US (don't know, does state tax apply there?), but in Europe this is absolutely what is going to happen.

 

[ParaSeoul]

Africa will be running ICE long after 2035.

I doubt all of Africa will be but most of it. Very different economic conditions across the continent.

 

[Lanrutcon]

I doubt all of Africa will be but most of it. Very different economic conditions across the continent.

Yeah, definitely. I should have specified: Africa is huge and diverse. I think a more accurate statement would be that I believe the overwhelming majority of the continent will still be making use of ICE after 2035.

 

[DarkestHour]

ICE will be around for a long time. EV adoption won't happen overnight. Even if every manufacturer had a full lineup of EVs right now the issue is the charging infrastructure is nowhere near ready. Just because they're not developing *new* engines doesn't mean the internal combustion engine is dead.

 

[theclaw135]

Civilian ICE R&D should've ended the day cars were able to reliably accelerate to, and maintain, 60 miles per hour.

 

[Portugeezer]

I mean, the tech is here alresry, the problem remains implementing mass infrastructure for charging.

 

[chromhound]

They had too many problem with those engines. Incoming lawsuit lol

Hyundai Denies It's Abandoning Combustion Engine Development

Contacted by Motor1.com, a Hyundai representative has refuted rumors from South Korea about ending the development of internal combustion engines.

www.motor1.com

Edit: Nevermind

 

[Kenpachii]

That doesn't sound great. But EVs will become the cheaper option very soon though, so you wouldn't drive EVs to save the planet. But because they're cheaper. In Europe the gas prices will go up partly because of all the climate change agreements though, you probably don't have those in Africa.

Prices in europe are cheaper with electric cars simple because governments don't tax them that much on everything and even subsidizes them. Petrol for your car isn't something that costs a lot of money, its the tax on it that costs a lot of money. U can bet we will see decrease in electric cars the moment it get taxed in the same way which it will the more adoption will take place. As they will want to have the same income either way.

That's the only reason we have people buying electric cars to start with, The same way why everybody bought a hybrid but never used the hybrid part because tax.

The cost depends on the government, not on the technology.

U can already see this happening currently with solar panels. I would make 11 euro's a month simple by having them on my roof so ordered a whole bunch of them because why not. However now delivering back with laws changing as more people get them on there roof which results in energy company's probably saw a massive reduction in energy consumption to the point they actually ahve to pay you, and lobby there way to the goverment that decide that rates are going down massively to the point its no longer worth it.

So what really changed here?, goverment. We got currently a 45-46% tax on petrol. U can bet when electric cars become the norm subsidizing is gone + 50% tax gets put on everything electricity.

Cheaper is only a thing when u are a niche, not when u are the majority.

And then about powering those things and there anti nuclear stance, have fun with your new skyline

 

[Rentahamster]

We're reaching peak ICE!

 

[JayK47]

Exploding batteries will be fun. How many houses will burn to the ground from batteries and chargers?

https://hardware.slashdot.org/story...hows-the-challenges-of-building-electric-cars

 

[Kenpachii]

Exploding batteries will be fun. How many houses will burn to the ground from batteries and chargers?

https://hardware.slashdot.org/story...hows-the-challenges-of-building-electric-cars

Jup in the city here lots of parking places under houses ban them straight out.

 

[Coolwhhip]

Exploding batteries will be fun. How many houses will burn to the ground from batteries and chargers?

https://hardware.slashdot.org/story...hows-the-challenges-of-building-electric-cars

Car batteries don't explode.

 

[Coolwhhip]

Prices in europe are cheaper with electric cars simple because governments don't tax them that much on everything and even subsidizes them. Petrol for your car isn't something that costs a lot of money, its the tax on it that costs a lot of money. U can bet we will see decrease in electric cars the moment it get taxed in the same way which it will the more adoption will take place. As they will want to have the same income either way.

That's the only reason we have people buying electric cars to start with, The same way why everybody bought a hybrid but never used the hybrid part because tax.

The cost depends on the government, not on the technology.

U can already see this happening currently with solar panels. I would make 11 euro's a month simple by having them on my roof so ordered a whole bunch of them because why not. However now delivering back with laws changing as more people get them on there roof which results in energy company's probably saw a massive reduction in energy consumption to the point they actually ahve to pay you, and lobby there way to the goverment that decide that rates are going down massively to the point its no longer worth it.

So what really changed here?, goverment. We got currently a 45-46% tax on petrol. U can bet when electric cars become the norm subsidizing is gone + 50% tax gets put on everything electricity.

Cheaper is only a thing when u are a niche, not when u are the majority.

And then about powering those things and there anti nuclear stance, have fun with your new skyline

I don't see taxes on electricity increasing a lot really. Most people will charge their car at home. And if you have solar panels you could even charge it fully from the sun.

You can even get a solar car and you could drive without connecting to the grid.

Aptera Motors

Aptera is the world’s first Solar Electric Vehicle that requires no charging for most daily use - giving you the freedom to do more with less impact on the planet.

www.aptera.us

 

[Nobody_Important]

I for one am not looking forward to the EV future. I love ICE cars. I'd sooner deal with horse shit than EVs.

Well grab your snow shovel and a bucket Jethro because electric vehicles are not going anywhere. And the ICEs are definitely on the way out. It's not going to be a quick death by any means, but you can already see the signs.


For me though I can't freaking wait till they become as affordable and reliable as a regular car is right now. The instant acceleration that an EV grants you is insane.

 

[chromhound]

I for one am not looking forward to the EV future. I love ICE cars. I'd sooner deal with horse shit than EVs.

The only solution for ICE is Efuel or Hydrogen.

Hyundai denied they were getting rid of ICE

 

[haxan7]

For me though I can't freaking wait till they become as affordable and reliable as a regular car is right now. The instant acceleration that an EV grants you is insane.

I hope that gets coupled with the proliferation of self driving sooner rather than later, because half the drivers on the road in the US are already psychotic, homicidal, PMS maniacs, etc. We will definitely see an increase in accidents when every incompetent moron can go from 0 to 60 in 3 seconds.

 

[Hawking Radiation]

They always do. Our currency has been crap since like, 2000. Our fuel costs are silly. Everyone rents cause nobody can buy a house. Our crime stats are nuts. Our cities are filled with walled off residential zones with private security where the upper middle class bunker themselves off from the rest of the country. Every street corner has multiple beggars. Every intersection has a sign saying watch out for carjackings. Regular blackouts are a thing here. We call it "loadshedding" because the power companies are so corrupt they can barely keep the plants going. Our government regularly "loses" millions of our currency, our municipalities drown in debt, our roads don't get maintained, our infrastructure is ancient and nothing will get better because democracy doesn't mean shit when the majority of the voters are ignorant and uneducated.

So advancements like EVs? We're probably not the ideal audience.

Don't talk shit dude.

Your post reeks of hyperbole

 

[Tams]

I'd rather more R&D went into hydrogen fuel cells. At least Toyota are going that direction.

And really, if we could make more synthetic hydrocarbons while at the same time using more CO2 scrubbers, we could use ICE vehicles as well. Most pollution, especially carbon emissions isn't from ICE vehicles anyway.

 

[Dr.Guru of Peru]

Exploding batteries will be fun. How many houses will burn to the ground from batteries and chargers?

https://hardware.slashdot.org/story...hows-the-challenges-of-building-electric-cars

Ahem....

Hyundai recalls over 390,000 vehicles for engine fire risks due to pair of defects

Older Santa Fe Sport SUVs and newer Elantra, Kona, and Veloster cars affected by issues

driving.ca

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/hyundai-kia-engine-fires-nhtsa/

 

[MadAnon]

Africans can't wait until more and more people become responsible and go "green".

 

[Hawking Radiation]

We're reaching peak ICE!

EVs have potential. Lower centre of mass and almost instant power on tap can make for some fun performance cars.

 

[Lanrutcon]

Don't talk shit dude.

Your post reeks of hyperbole

So, how long have you lived in South Africa?