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A huge purchase is imminent within 1 month from now

M

MonarchJT

Banned
you mean the Sony
Zones said:
Sony
Nintendo
Microsoft
Tencent

The weird part is Sony and Nintendo aren’t really part of this whole so called consolidation movement happening right now. The recent game studio purchases made by them were all defense acquisitions, but some people just love to lump them together with Microsoft in order not to make Microsoft look bad or evil.
Click to expand...
you mean the same Sony who still pay left and right to keep games, not gaming ips and characters out from gamers who doesn't want to buy their consoles? or the same Sony that didn't accept crossplay for an entire generation ? no they are angels

Sony just doesn't have the money of tencent and Ms or you would have seen Sony cut the legs of anyone trying to take marketshare like it always has done
 
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Sosokrates

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
What a load of bulloni.
4 companies? What....so Nintendo, sony,ms, or a big pub is going to buy all the other pubs and devs between them?

I dont think do.
 
sainraja

sainraja

Member
MonarchJT said:
you mean the Sony
you mean the same Sony who still pay left and right to keep games, not gaming ips and characters out from gamers who doesn't want to buy their consoles? or the same Sony that didn't accept crossplay for an entire generation ? no they are angels

Sony just doesn't have the money of tencent and Ms or you would have seen Sony cut the legs of anyone trying to take marketshare like it always has done
Click to expand...
It's pointless to play the Sony does this or Microsoft does that game. They are both businesses first and sometimes being a business aligns well with their customers while other times it doesn't. During the Xbox 360 era, Microsoft didn't play nice with PC and cross play. It took a whole generation but both are nicer with cross play than they used to be. Sony as far as I know has always been OK with cross play on PC, they were just not OK with cross play with their immediate competitor — yes it doesn't justify it but you get the point.

As for exclusivity, that's pretty much part of each console generation. They both need to give people reasons to choose them over the other. Microsoft was notorious for it during X360 and Sony went all-in with the PS4. They did it during the PS2 generation as well. The point is, it's pretty normal and doesn't make one company better than the other for choosing to do it or choosing not to do it.
 
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Bryank75

Bryank75

Banned
MonarchJT said:
you mean the Sony
you mean the same Sony who still pay left and right to keep games, not gaming ips and characters out from gamers who doesn't want to buy their consoles? or the same Sony that didn't accept crossplay for an entire generation ? no they are angels

Sony just doesn't have the money of tencent and Ms or you would have seen Sony cut the legs of anyone trying to take marketshare like it always has done
Click to expand...

Sony have very comparable capability to Tencent. Maybe even more...
 
Bryank75

Bryank75

Banned
Andodalf Andodalf

Dunno why you'd laugh.... Tencent have over 40 Billion in longterm debt and about 30 billion in cash.

Sony have 19 Billion in cash but only 10 billion in debt.

So Tencent may have more cash but Sony could raise much more debt if needed.

Sony also have 34% of the stock of M3 inc and that is in their longterm assets... valued at 18 Billion just for their stake. If they sold their shares there they would obviously have close to 40 billion.

I don't know why people perpetuate this narrative of Sony not having money.... maybe it makes you feel better?
 
Bryank75

Bryank75

Banned
Badlucktroll said:
How much would Konami cost Sony?
Click to expand...

Waste of money...they own gyms and sell water and are into pachinko.

The ip's wouldn't be sold cause they use for their pachinko, anime, films and game licenses.

they would lease or partner to make a game for each IP though.

Konami I've heard has some ties to the Yakuza too... so that might be a thing to consider.
 
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Men_in_Boxes

Men_in_Boxes

Snake Oil Salesman
Bryank75 said:
Yeah.... meh. We know nothing about them really. Just that they are ex Sony Liverpool people, many of them.
Click to expand...

We know they're 250+ and growing (40 new job listings) which would make them Sonys 3rd largest developer.

We know they're in the later stages of production on a big multiplayer shooter. I personally think this is a bigger deal than people realize as The Persistence came out in 2018, which means Firesprite began development of their big multiplayer game after witnessing the success of PUBG and Fortnite. Those two titles likely created a paradigm shift in the industry.

We know they're working on a darker narrative style single player game.

You could also make the argument the Tweets suggestion that "4 companies own everything" is a reference to Sony.
 
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Bryank75

Bryank75

Banned
Men_in_Boxes said:
We know they're 250+ and growing (40 new job listings) which would make them Sonys 3rd largest developer.

We know they're in the later stages of production on a big multiplayer shooter. I personally think this is a bigger deal than people realize as The Persistence came out in 2018, which means Firesprite began development of their big multiplayer game after witnessing the success of PUBG and Fortnite.

We know they're working on a darker narrative style single player game.

You could also make the argument the Tweets suggestion that "4 companies own everything" is a reference to Sony.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know about that stuff.... my problem is that their past output hasn't been that incredible.

I'm of course going to wait and see what they do. Maybe they just didn't have the freedom to make what they wanted before cause they were too small and working on contracts.

I'm sure there is some promise in the stuff they are doing or they probably wouldn't have been bought.

That said, I don't know why they don't go after something with bigger IP's.... something like Kadokawa or Square that are in Anime too and gel very well with Sony's overall strategy.
 
Badlucktroll

Badlucktroll

Member
Bryank75 said:
Waste of money...they own gyms and sell water and are into pachinko.

The ip's wouldn't be sold cause they use for their pachinko, anime, films and game licenses.

they would lease or partner to make a game for each IP though.

Konami I've heard has some ties to the Yakuza too... so that might be a thing to consider.
Click to expand...
I looked it up. About 7 billion dollars. Could Sony afford?
 
SenjutsuSage

SenjutsuSage

Banned
Damn, I want to say something..

Jim Carrey Shut Up GIF
 
Men_in_Boxes

Men_in_Boxes

Snake Oil Salesman
Bryank75 said:
That said, I don't know why they don't go after something with bigger IP's.... something like Kadokawa or Square that are in Anime too and gel very well with Sony's overall strategy.
Click to expand...

My assumption is that Sony doesn't value big IPs (relative to their market value) and instead wants to create the next big IP with studios like this. Firesprite pre hit, is waaaay cheaper than Fitesprite post hit.

I also think there's a good chance Sony saw the game they're nearing completion on and liked it so much, they bought the entire studio. Similar to how Microsoft bought Bungie a year before Combat Evolved launched on the first XBox.

It'll be interesting when the game is finally revealed.
 
L

Larlight

Member
Bryank75 said:
Andodalf Andodalf

Dunno why you'd laugh.... Tencent have over 40 Billion in longterm debt and about 30 billion in cash.

Sony have 19 Billion in cash but only 10 billion in debt.

So Tencent may have more cash but Sony could raise much more debt if needed.

Sony also have 34% of the stock of M3 inc and that is in their longterm assets... valued at 18 Billion just for their stake. If they sold their shares there they would obviously have close to 40 billion.

I don't know why people perpetuate this narrative of Sony not having money.... maybe it makes you feel better?
Click to expand...
Actually Sony has about 44 billion in cash as of 2021.

Sony Cash on Hand 2010-2023 | SONY

Sony cash on hand from 2010 to 2023. Cash on hand can be defined as cash deposits at financial institutions that can immediately be withdrawn at any time, and investments maturing in one year or less that are highly liquid and therefore regarded as cash equivalents and reported with or near cash...
www.macrotrends.net www.macrotrends.net
 
M

MonarchJT

Banned
Bryank75 said:
I gave you the figures....

If you want to provide something to where you are getting this idea?
Click to expand...
2020 net income
tencent 23b
Sony 10b

marketcap
tencent 572b
Sony 139b

and above all of this tencent play mostly on software / movie production unlike Sony which has other markets to manage and invest in (TV / audio / video / sensors / etc. etc.)

(also their tot assets valued by the banks should be ahead of Sony as right now)

maybe I'm missing something
 
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MrFunSocks

MrFunSocks

Banned
sainraja said:
During the Xbox 360 era, Microsoft didn't play nice with PC and cross play. It took a whole generation but both are nicer with cross play than they used to be. Sony as far as I know has always been OK with cross play on PC, they were just not OK with cross play with their immediate competitor — yes it doesn't justify it but you get the point.
Click to expand...
This "MS didn't allow cross play" thing is just FUD. They absolutely allowed cross-play with PC, but they had rules on it which developers just did not want to follow. The main example is always that Final Fantasy game I think it was, and the sticking point was that MS required the xbox version of all cross play enabled games to have a "only play against 360 players" option. The developers didn't want to add this, they always wanted everyone to play together at the same time. It wasn't a bad rule because even now people don't want to play some games against PC players due to PC cheats and mouse/keyboard giving them an advantage.
 
Bryank75

Bryank75

Banned
MonarchJT said:
2020 net income
tencent 23b
Sony 10b

marketcap
tencent 572b
Sony 139b

and above all of this tencent play mostly on software / movie production unlike Sony which has other markets to manage and invest in (TV / audio / video / sensors / etc. etc.)

(also their tot assets valued by the banks should be ahead of Sony as right now)

maybe I'm missing something
Click to expand...

Market cap doesn't have much bearing on anything tbh.

23 billion is 10 billion more than 2019, 2020 was an odd year.... hard to judge based on one year.

Income-wise Tencent is generally a bit ahead of Sony but they are also far more aggressive on acquisitions and expansion....you can see that from their debt burden, which is over 40 billion.

All in all, I would personally put Tencent and Sony in the same ballpark of power potential in terms of acquisitions. Tencent are much more likely to pull the trigger on things than Sony...who are conservative.

MSFT has a large debt load too but have so much cash on hand and annual income.... it really doesn't matter for them. The issue with MSFT in gaming acquisitions are things outside finance....

Things like regulatory oversight, they have been very aggressive in the last 2 years and may come under the microscope as to their intentions. Also relations with studios and potentially limiting access to certain audiences after an acquisition.... we see how smaller games have not done too well, like Psychonauts 2. We must see how the bigger games fare and if it actually increases the subscriber numbers enough to justify taking it off other platforms.
 
purvispisgah

purvispisgah

Member
Bryank75 said:
Things like regulatory oversight, they have been very aggressive in the last 2 years and may come under the microscope as to their intentions. Also relations with studios and potentially limiting access to certain audiences after an acquisition.... we see how smaller games have not done too well, like Psychonauts 2. We must see how the bigger games fare and if it actually increases the subscriber numbers enough to justify taking it off other platforms.
Click to expand...
Have they released a statement about this or numbers that I haven't seen? I imagine it's difficult to evaluate a game's performance when it launches on Gamepass.

Also, I love Psychonauts 2, so I am especially interested in it.
 
Bryank75

Bryank75

Banned
purvispisgah said:
Have they released a statement about this or numbers that I haven't seen? I imagine it's difficult to evaluate a game's performance when it launches on Gamepass.

Also, I love Psychonauts 2, so I am especially interested in it.
Click to expand...

Last official numbers were 18 million.... there was unofficial numbers of 23 million but if it's not official I tend to not fully be on board with it.
I think Jeff Grubb was the source on the second number. None since then or recently.
 
I

itsjustJEFF

Member
Bryank75 said:
Andodalf Andodalf

Dunno why you'd laugh.... Tencent have over 40 Billion in longterm debt and about 30 billion in cash.

Sony have 19 Billion in cash but only 10 billion in debt.

So Tencent may have more cash but Sony could raise much more debt if needed.

Sony also have 34% of the stock of M3 inc and that is in their longterm assets... valued at 18 Billion just for their stake. If they sold their shares there they would obviously have close to 40 billion.

I don't know why people perpetuate this narrative of Sony not having money.... maybe it makes you feel better?
Click to expand...
It's being too lazy to do research. They just know this... Xbox is owned by Microsoft. Microsoft is a much richer entity than Sony. No need for any more research beyond that, basically "my dad can beat up your dad" :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
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Bryank75

Bryank75

Banned
itsjustJEFF said:
It's being too lazy to do research. They just know this... Xbox is owned by Microsoft. Microsoft is much richer entity than Sony. No need for any more research beyond that, basically "my dad can beat up your dad" :messenger_tears_of_joy:
Click to expand...

mmm... I even said in my last post MSFT has tons of cash and income each year... they just have different issues they face.

Anyway, I guess it's pointless for me to put in the effort I did.
 
I

itsjustJEFF

Member
Bryank75 said:
mmm... I even said in my last post MSFT has tons of cash and income each year... they just have different issues they face.

Anyway, I guess it's pointless for me to put in the effort I did.
Click to expand...
That they definitely do. What they also don't understand is that Xbox is not the bread winner of MSFT... they do not have free reign on the "War Chest." They have to make/pay that money back. It would be EXTREMELY interesting to see what Xbox's goals and milestones are, especially now. It would be fascinating to see the quarterly/yearly sub goals, DLC goals, purchase conversion goals etc.
 
Bryank75

Bryank75

Banned
itsjustJEFF said:
That they definitely do. What they also don't understand is that Xbox is not the bread winner of MSFT... they do not have free reign on the "War Chest." They have to make/pay that money back. It would be EXTREMELY interesting to see what Xbox's goals and milestones are, especially now. It would be fascinating to see the quarterly/yearly sub goals, DLC goals, purchase conversion goals etc.
Click to expand...

Those are the important questions... I believe their quarterly is around October 27th, so we may learn something them!
 
Topher

Topher

Gold Member
MrFunSocks said:
This "MS didn't allow cross play" thing is just FUD. They absolutely allowed cross-play with PC, but they had rules on it which developers just did not want to follow. The main example is always that Final Fantasy game I think it was, and the sticking point was that MS required the xbox version of all cross play enabled games to have a "only play against 360 players" option. The developers didn't want to add this, they always wanted everyone to play together at the same time. It wasn't a bad rule because even now people don't want to play some games against PC players due to PC cheats and mouse/keyboard giving them an advantage.
Click to expand...

"only play against 360 players option"? Document that then. It sounds made up. The only documented instance of cross play we have between 360 and PS3 is here:

kotaku.com

I Saw the PlayStation 3 Wired to Play Against an Xbox 360, but You Won't

I'm supposed to be telling you about a new video game called Defiance, but... I have to tell you something else: I saw one guy controlling the game on an Xbox 360. Another was playing in on a PlayStation 3
kotaku.com kotaku.com

And Microsoft was clearly against it.

Oh wait......sorry.....you are ignoring me because I ask questions. I'm so stupid.

Randy Orton Reaction GIF by WWE
 
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