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[Memory]

Fair enough. I loved the two Shadowrun games, haven't played Massive Chalice.

Wait for the full release and a few impression which should be really soon, its a fun game but there are some bugs and rng elements that need to be refined. There are also a few annoying design decisions I dislike like the fact there is no custom faction creator due to custom factions being sold as KS rewards. I don't think I've seen a KS game yet that has eliminated the possibility of a feature just to keep higher tier backers happy.

 

[Bl@de]

*sigh*

No, what ... How... just...

 

[Anoregon]

Awesome! Now...Monk or Rogue...

Monk with mechanics skills to find traps

 

[MotherFan]

What is the combat going to be like in this game? Is it going to be more like Neverwinter Nights or Divinity OS?

 

[QuantumZebra]

I expect this and Bloodborne to be my GOTY contenders. Bring it on, baby.

 

[QuantumZebra]

Will get this after I've finished Bloodborne - if it's not buggy that is. Always have my doubts when it comes to an Obsidian product. Don't understand how anyone can preorder their games given their history...

They really hit it out of the park with the South Park RPG (pun intended), I think their track record for good games (while buggy) along with the quality of their most recent release is definitely worthwhile. Doesn't this game have some of the Black Isle Studios crew too??

 

[Shake Appeal]

What is the combat going to be like in this game? Is it going to be more like Neverwinter Nights or Divinity OS?

The former.

 

[Shepard]

What is the combat going to be like in this game? Is it going to be more like Neverwinter Nights or Divinity OS?

Real time, like Neverwinter nights, Baldur's gate, Dragon age...

 

[ChosenPredator]

so much games coming out in march my head hurts

 

[Anoregon]

so much games coming out in march my head hurts

You know ChosenPredator, we really are the Bloodborne.

 

[Finalow]

goddamn why did this have to be so near the release date of Bloodborne.

I won't be able to play it for some time. looks great

 

[Ourobolus]

Monk with mechanics skills to find traps

Would that be good? I didn't get a chance to play the beta, so I haven't really experimented. I was assuming at some point I'd get someone else to worry about traps.

 

[Anoregon]

Would that be good? I didn't get a chance to play the beta, so I haven't really experimented. I was assuming at some point I'd get someone else to worry about traps.

It's my understanding that any character can focus on any skill. Rogues get some sort of bonus to trap findey stuff, but making a non-rogue your main trapper won't like gimp your party or anything, afaik.

 

[epmode]

*sigh*

This thread happens in every Steam forum for independent games over $20 or so. Probably trolling but it always works.

 

[MotherFan]

Real time, like Neverwinter nights, Baldur's gate, Dragon age...

Good, I am going to have to pick this up.

 

[Kinthalis]

I should have the Game Guide today after work. Will post impressions along with outline of the contents. Will spoiler anythign even remotely spoilerish so no worries for those of you going in blind.

 

[decoyplatypus]

I should have the Game Guide today after work. Will post impressions along with outline of the contents. Will spoiler anythign even remotely spoilerish so no worries for those of you going in blind.

Looking forward to your impressions. I may pick the guide up just so I can learn more about the game world before picking my character's background.

 

[lukeskymac]

I'm really conflicted about character creation.

I really like playing fragile, single-target nuke-based spellcasters in RPGs. In PoE's case this seems to point to Ciphers, since Wizards are more AoE + Utility focused. But since Might governs all damage, it would be better to focus on Might over Intellect (the usual suspect for spell damage, alongside the absent Wisdom) to get dat damage.

This leaves me with the unfortunate side effects of leaving my character both stronger and less intelligent than I'd like too (for roleplaying purposes mostly). Am I missing something or is that just the way things are and I'm going to have to deal with it?

 

[Danny Dudekisser]

I'm so fucking in.

 

[Durante]

I'm really conflicted about character creation.

I really like playing fragile, single-target nuke-based spellcasters in RPGs. In PoE's case this seems to point to Ciphers, since Wizards are more AoE + Utility focused. But since Might governs all damage, it would be better to focus on Might over Intellect (the usual suspect for spell damage, alongside the absent Wisdom) to get dat damage.

This leaves me with the unfortunate side effects of leaving my character both stronger and less intelligent than I'd like too (for roleplaying purposes mostly). Am I missing something or is that just the way things are and I'm going to have to deal with it?

You have to deal with it, since Josh Sawyer believes that people are too stupid to understand dustinct types of damage being based on distinct attributes.

 

[Cute Dragon Here]

I just realized that I am a Kickstarter backer a long, long time ago. Man, time flies.

 

[SerRodrik]

You have to deal with it, since Josh Sawyer believes that people are too stupid to understand dustinct types of damage being based on distinct attributes.

I'll deal with that if it means intelligence might be useful for characters other than mages.

 

[TrueMenace]

I'm really conflicted about character creation.

I really like playing fragile, single-target nuke-based spellcasters in RPGs. In PoE's case this seems to point to Ciphers, since Wizards are more AoE + Utility focused. But since Might governs all damage, it would be better to focus on Might over Intellect (the usual suspect for spell damage, alongside the absent Wisdom) to get dat damage.

This leaves me with the unfortunate side effects of leaving my character both stronger and less intelligent than I'd like too (for roleplaying purposes mostly). Am I missing something or is that just the way things are and I'm going to have to deal with it?

You should be maxing both might and intellect if you want to play a cipher.

 

[AntiFacebook]

Is there a reason not to make your character godlike? I understand characters of any race can be godlike.

 

[lukeskymac]

Is there a reason not to make your character godlike? I understand characters of any race can be godlike.

1) Roleplaying
2) The Godlike stat bonuses override those of the original race.

 

[Enduin]

You have to deal with it, since Josh Sawyer believes that people are too stupid to understand dustinct types of damage being based on distinct attributes.

This is the one big drawback I've seen with the current Attribute system which I otherwise really like. I love the core premise of it and how it allows you to be very imaginative with builds, but the current way some of them function mechanically can put your desires for how you want your character to function in combat and out of combat at odds depending on the class and role.

I wouldn't mind having a smart, witty rogue in dialogue but the combat style I want to utilize basically leaves Intellect as all but useless and Might is one of the top, if not the top, Attribute needed. At least Perception is potentially useful so those dialogue options will likely work well with a witty rogue. More insightful than learned though.

I still find that my favorite Attribute/Skill system in an RPG is the SPECIAL system from FO. It always felt like best and most flexible system and I loved the way you could utilize the various active skills in unique and inventive ways with the game world.

Is there a reason not to make your character godlike? I understand characters of any race can be godlike.

No Racial bonuses or Attribute bonuses. You just take on their shape which I'm not sure will matter a whole lot next to the fact that you're on fire or have plants growing out of your head when interacting with the world.

 

[Shinjica]

You have to deal with it, since Josh Sawyer believes that people are too stupid to understand dustinct types of damage being based on distinct attributes.

Wow, this is really sad to hear

 

[Alric]

Can't wait to spend my free time at the Goose and Fox Inn.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

Wow, this is really sad to hear

Is it really that he thinks people are too stupid, and not just that he thinks it is a better, more clear design that lends itself to better gameplay?

 

[Shinjica]

Is it really that he thinks people are too stupid, and not just that he thinks it is a better, more clear design that lends itself to better gameplay?

We'll see when the game come out.

 

[Kinthalis]

This is the one big drawback I've seen with the current Attribute system which I otherwise really like. I love the core premise of it and how it allows you to be very imaginative with builds, but the current way some of them function mechanically can put your desires for how you want your character to function in combat and out of combat at odds depending on the class and role.

But, how's this different from the traditional setup?

If it wasn't might that had to be maxed out, it would have had to be dexterity, and intelligence for a rogue would still be useless.

The typical systems attempt to compensate for this by including class based bonuses from other stats, like bonus to damage from dexterity for rogues, so you don't have to invest in strength as well.

Meh, I think this works equally as well, certainly not worse. Might is important, but intellect will open up role-playing options in dialogue and will also increase the duration of your rogue abilities (IIRC), which is nice! You cna keep people blinded or dazed for longer, allowign you to get in more sneka attacks.

 

[Gothos]

You have to deal with it, since Josh Sawyer believes that people are too stupid to understand dustinct types of damage being based on distinct attributes.

I think it would be fine if they changed the name of Might atribute to something else. I mean I can understand that casting spells requires mental fortitude/strength and the hihger it is, the bigger damage AND that it can be something entirely different than intelligence, but calling it Might is just stupid. It is obviously asociated with physical strength.

In fact, I think their stance towards Might might be even more confusing than applying different atributes to different damage types. RPG players are not used to it. The whole thing just feels WRONG on so many levels and simply lacks common sense.

 

[lukeskymac]

Is it really that he thinks people are too stupid, and not just that he thinks it is a better, more clear design that lends itself to better gameplay?

How is it objectively better, and how does it lead to better gameplay?

 

[Cute Dragon Here]

Zoinks!

I have a backer's credits survey to complete...

Guess I really have forgotten a lot of things, including how I plopped down $165 to back the project!

(Dang, now I wish I had a good name to put it in...)

 

[lukeskymac]

Meh, I think this works equally as well, certainly not worse. Might is important, but intellect will open up role-playing options in dialogue and will also increase the duration of your rogue abilities (IIRC), which is nice! You cna keep people blinded or dazed for longer, allowign you to get in more sneka attacks.

It does feel weird that a high-damage spellcaster would also turn out to do tons of physical damage. This binding of physical and spiritual strength (since Intellect is now apparently a side thing for mentally intense classes such as priests, ciphers and wizards) is what irks me.

 

[Infinite_Daremo]

*sigh*

Why no freemium iOS release either?

 

[SerRodrik]

How is it objectively better, and how does it lead to better gameplay?

The idea is that you have more choices than just "I'm a fighter, so I put points into strength and constitution. If I put points into intelligence, I get nothing out of it so I'm just being dumb." All of the stats theoretically have some effect on your character, so you have more choices about how to actually build your fighter.

No one said it was objectively better, because that would be silly. Personal taste applies, as always. Still, I've always been annoyed by being limited to one or two classes if I want access to stat based dialogue options like intelligence, so I'm happy.

Edit: And yes, Might is where the system is at its weirdest/least intuitive. It'll remain to be seen how well it works once the game is released. I really like the idea behind it though.

 

[Arulan]

The anticipation!

 

[patapuf]

I think it would be fine if they changed the name of Might atribute to something else. I mean I can understand that casting spells requires mental fortitude/strength and the hihger it is, the bigger damage AND that it can be something entirely different than intelligence, but calling it Might is just stupid. It is obviously asociated with physical strength.

In fact, I think their stance towards Might might be even more confusing than applying different atributes to different damage types. RPG players are not used to it. The whole thing just feels WRONG on so many levels and simply lacks common sense.

It depends a bit on how combat focused the game is.

I've been on media blackout so i don't know how much stuff you kill and how many ways there are to get around it.

If combat is the most common solution i'm not sure i like it. Having a stat you have to level up because it's so much better than all others is always a bit of a bummer.

 

[Enduin]

But, how's this different from the traditional setup?

If it wasn't might that had to be maxed out, it would have had to be dexterity, and intelligence for a rogue would still be useless.

The typical systems attempt to compensate for this by including class based bonuses from other stats, like bonus to damage from dexterity for rogues, so you don't have to invest in strength as well.

Meh, I think this works equally as well, certainly not worse. Might is important, but intellect will open up role-playing options in dialogue and will also increase your AOE abilities (IIRC).

We'll see. I'm not trying to be down on it, just that this is a potential flaw or rough spot in the system. Same as any other other, possibly even less so though if we're lucky. Other systems often are a bit too fixed when it comes to dump stats and required stats. PoE opens up a lot of avenues most games don't allow for which is really refreshing, but it's not perfect and there are still some limitations.

I think the good will outweigh the bad in the end. A lot of this is probably due to most of us being used to older systems that generally all followed the same kinds of conventions and PoE kind of throws that out. It's simply different, not necessarily worse and the potential advantages most likely will make it all worthwhile.

But it's not like there won't be room for improvement in the future. Attributes had to be tweaked a good deal during the Beta and once people get their hands on the full game I'm sure all that feedback will result in either the expansion or PoE2 introducing further refinement of exactly what stats the Attributes affect and how they work to smooth out those rough edges. As well as expand upon them and bring more depth and complexity to the game.

This is a brand new system so we can't expect perfection. It's a great foundation but it's likely far from finished.

 

[Labadal]

I just want to cause mayhem with my hobo monk.

 

[Kinthalis]

We'll see. I'm not trying to be down on it, just that this is a potential flaw or rough spot in the system. Same as any other other, possibly even less so though if we're lucky. Other systems often are a bit too fixed when it comes to dump stats and required stats. PoE opens up a lot of avenues most games don't allow for which is really refreshing, but it's not perfect and there are still some limitations.

I think the good will outweigh the bad in the end. A lot of this is probably due to most of us being used to older systems that generally all followed the same kinds of conventions and PoE kind of throws that out. It's simply different, not necessarily worse and the potential advantages most likely will make it all worthwhile.

But it's not like there won't be room for improvement in the future. Attributes had to be tweaked a good deal during the Beta and once people get their hands on the full game I'm sure all that feedback will result in either the expansion or PoE2 introducing further refinement of exactly what stats the Attributes affect and how they work to smooth out those rough edges. As well as expand upon them and bring more depth and complexity to the game.

This is a brand new system so we can't expect perfection. It's a great foundation but it's likely far from finished.

Agree. And I do think it's might that needs the most tweaking. It's just an important attribute for everyone pretty much.

 

[Shake Appeal]

Edit: And yes, Might is where the system is at its weirdest/least intuitive. It'll remain to be seen how well it works once the game is released. I really like the idea behind it though.

I think it works if the lore of the world reinforces that your magical prowess is improved by being physically strong and capable. It is a little quirky, but if it makes for more interesting mechanical decisions, I'll allow it. Also, you could argue carting those grimoires around keeps Wizards bulked up. But it'll be weird when the character your pictured as a frail little Wizard is able to pass MIG checks for, e.g. shouldering aside a boulder.

I guess they could have tailored it a little so Might is a consideration for Wizards but not a vital stat for damage, but eh. We'll see. I think that class is more AoE-focused anyway (which is governed by INT?).

My preference would have been for Might and Constitution to be folded into one another and purely represent physical strength, conditioning and resistance, then tweak spellcasting so it's a drain on your Endurance or something, so Wizards benefit from having more of it. But I don't write the rules.

 

[Labadal]

They should have called Might something else. Considering the lore, I am thinking Soul.

 

[Shake Appeal]

They should have called Might something else. Considering the lore, I am thinking Soul.

If I'm a Fighter and I'm putting points in "Soul" to deal more damage, I think I'm even more confused than a Wizard stacking points in "Might."

 

[Vincent Grayson]

How is it objectively better, and how does it lead to better gameplay?

I can't speak to this game specifically, having only played with the beta for about 30 seconds before deciding to wait on the final game.

That said, D&D (tabletop) has had this issue for a long time, where different attributes do different things for different classes, and it's a huge mess when trying to teach people how to play, and it tends to result in one or two attributes being better than the others.

 

[Kinthalis]

Also, you could argue carting those grimoires around keeps Wizards bulked up.

I friggin loved it when, in the playthrough they did for the PAX panel, the party wizard smacked a baddie with his grimoire!

Josh: "In case you're wondering, yes we just hit that guy with a book".

 

[Altazor]

I friggin loved it when, in the playthrough they did for the PAX panel, the party wizard smacked a baddie with his grimoire!

Josh: "In case you're wondering, yes we just hit that guy with a book".

Grimoire Slam FTW!

 

[Gaz_RB]

I thought I'd be more excited for Bloodborne, but I honestly can't stop thinking of PoE. The idea of creating a character and roleplaying the hell out of him is just something we haven't really had in awhile.

 

[SerRodrik]

Grimoire Slam FTW!

I still don't believe people were arguing against that when it was first mentioned in an update.