Have these new Bungie stans even played Halo Reach? Halo Reach split the community because of Armor lock and bloom. It was so hated back then. Thankfully Armor Lock never returned to Halo. Halo Reach has many fans only due to the campaign (it's my personal best Halo campaign) but it had questionable changes to gameplay.
which is odd with him being usually being a good poster.
Halo: Reach is not my favorite Halo in terms of gunplay/controls, but game mechanics =/= controls.
Thank you. A mouse is easy mode. Console players are aiming with our fucking thumb. There's no challenge in using your whole hand. You never hear ab0ut anybody trying to click on a link and missing.
I never made a post about this, but I've had a conversation about it in another thread - where I also proved my point.
So you tried very little because you can find several sites claiming it is the best gunplay they played.
www.windowscentral.com
www.resetera.com
Proof it's bad:So you tried very little because you can find several sites claiming it is the best gunplay they played.
Including Xbox centric sites like....
Is Destiny 2 worth playing in 2022?
Destiny 2 is one of the most popular shooter games from the last several years, but is it really worth playing in 2021? What's the new player experience like, and how is the state of ...
"Destiny 2 also features the best gunplay I've ever experienced in a shooter, and no other games have even come close to beating it."
I won't even search for you... Game Informer said Destiny's gunplay is not from Earth or something like that.
Even the most hated ERA...
Real talk: Is there a developer that does FPS gunplay better than Bungie?
I honestly don't know... and I doubt it.
Universal praise for the gunplay.
Well we are talking about controls and not game mechanics.
www.thegamer.com
Never said anything about apex, as I can't stand battle royale.
www.gamesradar.com
www.pushsquare.com
www.forbes.com
Proof it is perfection.
"We'll give an in-depth look at every weapon stat in Destiny 2 and explain what makes Destiny's gunplay the best in the business."
Destiny 2: An In-Depth Look At Weapon Stats
Ranging from accuracy cones to recoil direction, this guide will cover every weapon stat in Destiny 2.
Proof it is perfection.
"But one thing never changes. One thing is always constant – and constantly spectacular: the gunplay."
Why you should play Destiny 2 in 2022
Big in 2022: With Destiny 2: The Witch Queen on the near horizon, Bungie's FPS is an undeniable good time
Proof it is perfection.
Hands On: Destiny 2 Is Destiny's Superb Gunplay Encased in a Much Better Game
It's even got a proper story
Proof it is perfection.
"Say what you want about Destiny, but Bungie absolutely nailed the feeling of impactful, reactive gunplay. It just feels perfect. Bethesda wanted to capture that for Fallout 4."
'Destiny' Directly Inspired The Gunplay And Weapons In 'Fallout 4'
For Fallout 4, Bethesda is wisely sourcing inspiration from one of the best shooters in the business.
No, you can't... and that is the point just like your theories lolYou can literally see how bad the controls are in that clip
I have over 5000 hours between Destiny and Destiny 2. I know the controls are shit, lol.
They are perfection... so good.
If you've never tried any (newer) FPS games, probably
Nah… it is still exception compared with these newer FPS games.If you've never tried any (newer) FPS games, probably
You do know they compensate large deadzone with higher aim-assist, right? It's because the player shouldn't have to worry about aiming, when they can just lock-on to a target and the game does the aiming for them. I'm sure it feels great for a lot of people, but it's not worthy to be called top tier among far better controller games.
Destiny 2 is often mentioned as one of the best FPS' on console, because of the tight controls. - In todays standards, this is unfactual.
I came across this post on reddit:
Posted by
u/EternalDahaka
Deadzone | Dotgraph
Acceleration Curve
Interactive graph with requested options and relative sensitivity change(note curve used is different from Destiny's default)
As a broad note, unsurprisingly, Destiny's controls are nearly identical to the Halo titles from Reach onward, so players might be familiar with some of the options Halo 5, MCC and Infinite currently have.
Deadzone Options
Destiny uses an ~23% rounded square deadzone for it's deadzone. 23% is within a pretty common deadzone range, but it is very large, and notably larger than some of the default deadzone used in other games(Overwatch uses 15%, Call of Duty 7%). Larger deadzone can make precise adjustments more difficult, and generally make the controls feel less responsive.
The shape is actually from a circular deadzone being built on top of a square/axial one. The axial portion of the deadzone is responsible for the restricted diagonal movement around the axes, which makes diagonal cursor movements inaccurate to the stick angles. It can make it easier to make perfectly horizontal and vertical movement, but makes it much difficult and clunky to make diagonal movement. Warping the deadzone like that also requires more diagonal movement to see the same acceleration as cardinal movements.
Recent Halo games have offered separate radial and axial options, and that would address things here. Players that want to use circular deadzones with no restricted diagonal movement could set that up, and players who wanted to use exclusive axial deadzones could do that too, along with anything in-between. The slider for both the radial and axial deadzones could range from 0 to 0.30 so that players could play at the defaults with either exclusive deadzone if they preferred. Movement is less important but should get these options as well.
Acceleration curve and turn acceleration options
Destiny 2 seems to use the same curve as Halo Reach, but with a more drastic jump in acceleration, but not quite as large as the jump in Halo Infinite. The sensitivity cap has been increased recently, but previous that would have meant that the 'general' acceleration speeds before that jump would have been slower than in Reach, even if the max turn rate was the same at 10 sensitivity(a current issue with Infinite).
Now there's nothing inherently wrong with the curve itself, but players have any range of preference on what curve they'd like to use. Some might like the default, others might prefer a linear curve, and others might prefer something in-between. I'm not sure if the curve they're using specifically plays well with customization, but some level of granular customization would be requested. Players finding their preferred curve would help with small adjustments and general tracking.
Players have differing preferences on turn acceleration as well, and some feel like it can make aiming feel inconsistent. Just passing the threshold almost doubles your turn speed. Some players might like to completely disable it so acceleration feels smooth all the way up to max stick movement, and others might like to increase the multiplier to turn even faster.
With options for both, this would allow players to really fine-tune their acceleration. Players who like slower sensitivities might like using linear curves with decent turn accel to turn fast, while others might like playing at higher sensitivities with more exponential curves with no turn accel.
Separate horizontal and vertical sensitivity sliders.
It's not at all uncommon for console games to keep the vertical sensitivity lower than the horizontal, but this can come with a few issues. The first is simply that it can make aiming feel awkward for some players who want them to be the same.
The second is that it affects diagonal movement, skewing the angles towards the more sensitive axis. Your cursor angles are simply made up of horizontal and vertical movement, and if you change one, you get a different angle than the correct one. Because the horizontal is faster, all your diagonal angles are shifted horizontally. Ignoring the incorrect diagonal movement caused by the axial deadzone, this means if you correctly move the stick in the correct direction to track a target, the crosshair can fall off target because the angle was altered.
A separate vertical sensitivity slider is requested to address this. Plenty of players are used to this kind of angle warping because of how common it is in console games, but this would allow players who want the same X/Y sensitivity and correct diagonals to access it.
It would also be important that the slider values are correct. Many games that offer separate options have them incorrect, so even if they're set the same the vertical is still lower(i.e. recent DOOMs, Halos, Splitgate, Shadow Warrior, Call of Duty etc.).
Unified acceleration threshold
The dotgraph shows this better, but the threshold for the acceleration jump is broken into separate threshold for vertical and horizontal acceleration, and these thresholds overlap slightly. When passing the horizontal threshold, you only additional horizontal acceleration and when passing the vertical threshold, you get only vertical acceleration.
This is a problem because, like with differing axis sensitivities, this also affects diagonal movement in the same way. If only horizontal turn acceleration is triggered, then your cursor angle becomes more horizontally bias. If only the vertical acceleration is triggering, then your cursor movement more vertically than expected. Many other games have the turn acceleration trigger affect both the horizontal and vertical axes evenly, and that would be the fix to address that here.
Aim assist options
Many might think playing without aim assist isn't possible, but it definitely is, and options for it should always be offered. Bullet magnetism is tied with weapon balance, but slowdown and magnetism could be offered.
Ideally separate sliders for each could be offered, so players could customize what they want. Some players dislike being pulled off target, and could reduce the magnetism while keeping the slowdown. Some might think the slowdown is awkward, and could control that while keeping the magnetism.
Of course, a simple toggle can work too. As a minor thing, it'd be nice to have this option toggle the menu aim assist too when disabled.
Conclusion
This is a lot to ask, given how long it took just to get ADS and higher sensitivity options, but these are important options for thumbstick aiming, and something that would help Destiny 2 play much better.
A "simple" solution would be to add custom controls, like Apex Legends did from the get-go 3 years ago:
As a former Destiny player with over 5000 hours clocked in on both games, from 2014-2019 and 3 years with Apex Legends (2019-2022), I would love to try Destiny again with updated controls, but as it is now - it feels really bad - extremely unresponsive.
the only reason Halo and Destiny are playable at all is due to their ridiculously generous aim assist systems.
if they had normal aim assist like most other shooters noone would play them.
sadly now both Bungie and 343i seem to think they can't change the formula because people are used to it and wouldn't like the change.
look at Halo Infinite, dozens of threads with thousands of upvotes on their official subreddit ahead of launch telling them how absolutely atrocious the aiming in the game is. did they fix it for launch? NOPE... do they even acknowledge that people think it sucks? NOPE... is there any word on fixes or additional controller settings? HEEEEELLL NO!
and you can tell how shit their aiming is by the fact that everyone hates the Commando, a gun that has less aim assist and barely any bullet magnetism. so this gun takes away most of what helps Halo play well and people hate it because the gun exposes how shit the controls are.
during the beta I used a modified Right Stick to Mouse controller mapping someone uploaded to the Steam Controller community configs. and even tho I had no aim assist anymore because it emulated a mouse and doesn't trigger the assist, I still was top fragging in most matches and had no issue hitting targets, even with the Commando.
basically meaning, the aiming in Halo Infinite is so shit, that taking away the aim assist and replacing it with actually good stick aiming is a viable option to keep up with normal controller players.
UHHHM....
Bloom is part of the gunplay.
It all comes down to I would like to play Destiny again, but other games I've played (mainly Apex Legends) for the past 3 years, have superior controls and Destiny still feels exactly like the old Halo games.
It's like driving a Porsche 911 Carrera 4S for the past 3 years and trying to enjoy driving a Volvo 240
Please check if they added some form of custom controls with deadzone adjustments
"The more people that disagree with what I say, just further proves only I am right."
"The evidence is already there"
Apex has good gunplay.the only reason Halo and Destiny are playable at all is due to their ridiculously generous aim assist systems.
if they had normal aim assist like most other shooters noone would play them.
sadly now both Bungie and 343i seem to think they can't change the formula because people are used to it and wouldn't like the change.
look at Halo Infinite, dozens of threads with thousands of upvotes on their official subreddit ahead of launch telling them how absolutely atrocious the aiming in the game is. did they fix it for launch? NOPE... do they even acknowledge that people think it sucks? NOPE... is there any word on fixes or additional controller settings? HEEEEELLL NO!
and you can tell how shit their aiming is by the fact that everyone hates the Commando, a gun that has less aim assist and barely any bullet magnetism. so this gun takes away most of what helps Halo play well and people hate it because the gun exposes how shit the controls are.
during the beta I used a modified Right Stick to Mouse controller mapping someone uploaded to the Steam Controller community configs. and even tho I had no aim assist anymore because it emulated a mouse and doesn't trigger the assist, I still was top fragging in most matches and had no issue hitting targets, even with the Commando.
basically meaning, the aiming in Halo Infinite is so shit, that taking away the aim assist and replacing it with actually good stick aiming is a viable option to keep up with normal controller players.
UHHHM....
