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Why Can't We Have Other Minorities In Media?

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taizuke

Member
First off I want to start by saying I'm puertorican and while I've never needed a puertorican character to feel represented I've noticed that for the last couple of years every time they introduced a new character, they're almost always black. Whether it's a race swap, gender swap, ect.

I'm all for representation. I enjoyed Invincible a lot even though Amber was originally white. I can't wait to play God of War Ragnarok and I think Angrboda looks awesome. And, I love Zendaya as MJ. Giving a few examples.

But, if you're going to do it... is it too much to ask if that character be changed to Asian or Latino?

I'm not asking to do it to any character just because. A character like Black Panter is African American. I would never ask for the character to be changed to another minority.

The other day I saw the trailer for Nightbooks on Netflix and the first thing that I asked myself was "why did the girl had to be black"? Take in mind I know nothing about this property and yet I wasn't bothered by the white kid alongside her. I realized that was crazy of me. For all I know that is a race swapped character but that doesn't matter. What matters i was too quick to react to something I know absolutely nothing about. I think we're all guilty of that sometimes. I certainly am.

But, sometimes it feels like entertainment media is an Oprah meme. You get a black character, you get a black character, and you get a black character! And that's why I ask if the person doing this are even aware of other minorities.

At the end of the day what matters is the character. If he or she happens to be black I'm all for it. I'm just asking to see a little more variety.

Does that make me racist?
 

jason10mm

Member
I don't know why hispanics are not a much more sought after (in lieu of the more derogatory term "pandering") demographic over blacks, just given the higher demographics percentage. Even then you get into the "just how dark are they?" fiasco like with Into the Heights.

But I'm sure it is a combination of A. money on the table, blacks do have a lot of capital to spend, B. immediate recognition, lots of hispanics visually look white unless they really lay into an accent, and C.white guilt/reparations for slavery/institutionalized racism/blah blah blah. A side helping of D. moving a lot of hollywood to the South where access to black talent might be better?

It's all surface stuff, IMHO the actor is the least important part of enriching media with black voices/experience. If the writers, directors, marketing, and settings/stories being told are all white, is this really progress?
 
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wants to fuck an Asian grill.
The cities in which the entertainment industry occupies (Los Angeles, New York, Atlanta) have significant black populations where at least 1 in 10 people you meet on the street are black so its genuinely representative of the writer's own experience. Its not that weird or forced. India & China, with their billion+ populations, already produce their own ethnic films outside Hollywood.

If you're a non-Indian brown person, then yeah I agree you're generally underrepresented in proportion to how many brown folks are actually out there.
 

jason10mm

Member
Georgia for sure required a lot of projects to use local talent. A bud of mine used my local address to get calls for Atlanta area stuff, then just drove down for the shoot. No one cared, they just needed to check the box.
 

Ballthyrm

Member
While Black Panter (I'm assuming this is from a porn parody) may be African American, Black Panther is just African.

Black Panther the character as a back story asan African.
Black Panther the franchise , movie, writing is very much American.

I don't think many Africans see themselves in Black Panther.
He was made for an American audience with American taste.
 

IDKFA

Gold Member
Are you asking why there isn't Asian/Hispanic representation in western media? Simple way to solve that problem.

Why not create films/TV shows/comics/games that are based on Hispanic/Asian history, culture and folklore? That way the whole cast will either be Hispanic or Asian.

People say it wouldn't work because it wouldn't be successful, but I call BS on that. Look me in the eye and tell me you wouldn't want to see a historical TV series based on the rise of Genghis Khan, or an adaptation of One Hundred Years of Solitude (the Netflix version appears dead, but we're we really convinced that Netflix could do it justice anyway??).
 

jason10mm

Member
Why not create films/TV shows/comics/games that are based on Hispanic/Asian history, culture and folklore? That way the whole cast will either be Hispanic or Asian.

People say it wouldn't work because it wouldn't be successful, but I call BS on that. Look me in the eye and tell me you wouldn't want to see a historical TV series based on the rise of Genghis Khan, or an adaptation of One Hundred Years of Solitude (the Netflix version appears dead, but we're we really convinced that Netflix could do it justice anyway??).
This is my point. Instead of having black people as british royalty, tell a different story! I'm watching Warrior now (chinese tongs in 1880's San Francisco) and it is like 70% asians with a handful of whites and irish (who were basically the equivalent of blacks during that period of time). There was a Golden Horde show on netflix, they used Marco Polo as an entry point. 95% asian and just a few white folks. It was awesome.

It is the way.
 

DanteFox

Member
You're not wrong to notice this. I watched tv recently and no fewer than four out of the five commercials in one break had black people as the main characters. This is because Hollywood is making a concerted effort to alleviate their crippling racial guilt in the most hamfisted way imaginable. Pretty much every tv show has to star a black woman, because they tick off two of the most celebrated boxes for Hollywood, black people and women. Nevermind that historically, and by statistics today, black men have it significantly harder as a group than black women.
 

strange headache

Fluctuat nec mergitur
Maybe stop identifying with ethnicity and race and start identifying with character and human traits. You're not awesome for merely being a certain skin color and you're certainly not amazing for merely belonging to a minority. What makes you great are the things you do and say. How about we finally start identifying with that again?
 

T8SC

Member
Because it's a tick box exercise.

There's more to a person than the colour of their skin. The more we focus on this aspect, the more we constantly highlight "racism", the more the problem will continue to exist. Take the focus off racism, stop putting it front & centre in the media, let things be more natural, cast someone for their ability, not their ethnicity.
 

UnNamed

18+ Member
I think Hollywood, and media in general, shows they really don't care about minorities, oppression, etc, they just want to fill the schedule on TV and cinema to show how cool and respectful they are. 2020/2021 is the year of black people. Asians/hispanics? Oh well, listen, maybe next time, TV shows are full now.
 

zeorhymer

Member
Funny how Japan have Japanese things, Korea have Korean things, France have French things. Americans have to be different and have black, white, Asian, Latinx, trans, gay, things....
 

mortal

Gold Member
Whatever happened to prioritizing making interesting characters?
Contrary to what they want you to believe, a character isn't made any more interesting because of their skin tone.

Also why is there only legitimacy when hollywood is doing this? What is this asking /begging for nonsense?
If you want it bad enough, create your own instead of waiting for someone to do it for you.
Alternatively, you can find obscure, independent creators that are already telling original stories focusing on characters from unconventional backgrounds and support them financially and promote their work.

It's the same mentality that leads to lazy pandering race/gender swap trends. Only seeing legitimacy in the established, often historically white, characters.

Make your characters. Tell your own stories. Stop waiting for others to come and do it for you.
Stop being so consumer minded and become more creative minded.
 
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///PATRIOT

Banned

Why Can't We Have Other Minorities In Media?​

Because people are individuals and not their race and nationality.

Imaging watching a movie and running a diversity checklist in your head counting who is black or who is mexican. how sad.
 

Fbh

Gold Member
Because unless the creator of the show/movie is from that specific nationality or ethnicity, diversity is basically just marketing tool and they'll only include what they think their target demographic wants to see.

Funny how Japan have Japanese things, Korea have Korean things, France have French things. Americans have to be different and have black, white, Asian, Latinx, trans, gay, things....

Well to be fair America is way more racially diverse than Japan or Korea so it makes sense for the casts of american shows to be more diverse.
But even so, it's stupid that every show needs to have people from a bunch of races and sexual orientations, it's like the casting and writing is done following a checklist.

I've mostly been focusing on foreign shows as of late because they can still escape all the woke crap and forced diversity.
 
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taizuke

Member
I don't know why hispanics are not a much more sought after (in lieu of the more derogatory term "pandering") demographic over blacks, just given the higher demographics percentage. Even then you get into the "just how dark are they?" fiasco like with Into the Heights.

But I'm sure it is a combination of A. money on the table, blacks do have a lot of capital to spend, B. immediate recognition, lots of hispanics visually look white unless they really lay into an accent, and C.white guilt/reparations for slavery/institutionalized racism/blah blah blah. A side helping of D. moving a lot of hollywood to the South where access to black talent might be better?

It's all surface stuff, IMHO the actor is the least important part of enriching media with black voices/experience. If the writers, directors, marketing, and settings/stories being told are all white, is this really progress?

It bothers me when someone says that person is not latino enough or black enough. Everyone should be on the same side but we create subcategories within our categories and it's a shame.

Also, hadn't considered the many reasons you pointed out. I kinda figured money was always a reason but the idea that Latinos could be mistaken for whites never crossed my mind.

As for the last thing you said, I'm kinda with you but I still feel we need representation. I think we can have both.

I've noticed that as a brown man that when Hollywood talks about diversity that only just mean casting Black and White actors. They're not talking about diversity from other than those two blocks.

Well said.

The cities in which the entertainment industry occupies (Los Angeles, New York, Atlanta) have significant black populations where at least 1 in 10 people you meet on the street are black so its genuinely representative of the writer's own experience. Its not that weird or forced.

Hadn't also taken this into account. Gives me perspective.

While Black Panter (I'm assuming this is from a porn parody)

LMAO

1) Goddamn typo.
2) My bad. You're right. I should've just said African. I'm so used to the term African American I think that's why I typed it.
 
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Reallink

Member
The cities in which the entertainment industry occupies (Los Angeles, New York, Atlanta) have significant black populations where at least 1 in 10 people you meet on the street are black so its genuinely representative of the writer's own experience. Its not that weird or forced. India & China, with their billion+ populations, already produce their own ethnic films outside Hollywood.

If you're a non-Indian brown person, then yeah I agree you're generally underrepresented in proportion to how many brown folks are actually out there.

Hadn't also taken this into account. Gives me perspective.

Blacks are probably the smallest minority in LA, and are certainly well behind Hispanics everywhere but Atlanta (where I believe even whites are a minority).
 
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Funny how Japan have Japanese things, Korea have Korean things, France have French things. Americans have to be different and have black, white, Asian, Latinx, trans, gay, things....

Black, White, Asian, Latino, etc. are American things. What else do you associate America having American things as?

The cities in which the entertainment industry occupies (Los Angeles, New York, Atlanta) have significant black populations where at least 1 in 10 people you meet on the street are black so its genuinely representative of the writer's own experience. Its not that weird or forced. India & China, with their billion+ populations, already produce their own ethnic films outside Hollywood.

If you're a non-Indian brown person, then yeah I agree you're generally underrepresented in proportion to how many brown folks are actually out there.

India having its own film industry has nothing do with Indian American representation. Same with Chinese American. I don’t associate myself with India other than for heritage. It’s nice that I have those movies, and I watch them occasionally with subtitles, but I barely even understand Hindi or any other Indian language spoken. Nothing shown in movies made in India resonate with me culturally. Representation isn’t only about people looking like yourself/myself. My culture is American, and I associate myself with the USA mostly with India mixed in. This would be similar to asking why should white people have representation when countries in Europe already have their own film industries.

Also, there are actually more asian’s in LA than black people. NYC is 14% Asian, which would mean that at least 1 in 10 people you meet in the street would be Asian as well. Atlanta, you are right about. Not a particularly high Asian population.
 
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thefool

Member
You mean in the us, right? I suppose the us black community was able to pressure for more representation in entertainment-arts while other communities lack that power and/or haven't yet shown a strong interest to protest against the lack of representation. Why you see a black character and not a latino? Because the entertainment industry is probably not worried about representation and diversity beyond optics.
 

sol_bad

Member
First off I want to start by saying I'm puertorican and while I've never needed a puertorican character to feel represented I've noticed that for the last couple of years every time they introduced a new character, they're almost always black. Whether it's a race swap, gender swap, ect.

I'm all for representation. I enjoyed Invincible a lot even though Amber was originally white. I can't wait to play God of War Ragnarok and I think Angrboda looks awesome. And, I love Zendaya as MJ. Giving a few examples.

But, if you're going to do it... is it too much to ask if that character be changed to Asian or Latino?

I'm not asking to do it to any character just because. A character like Black Panter is African American. I would never ask for the character to be changed to another minority.

The other day I saw the trailer for Nightbooks on Netflix and the first thing that I asked myself was "why did the girl had to be black"? Take in mind I know nothing about this property and yet I wasn't bothered by the white kid alongside her. I realized that was crazy of me. For all I know that is a race swapped character but that doesn't matter. What matters i was too quick to react to something I know absolutely nothing about. I think we're all guilty of that sometimes. I certainly am.

But, sometimes it feels like entertainment media is an Oprah meme. You get a black character, you get a black character, and you get a black character! And that's why I ask if the person doing this are even aware of other minorities.

At the end of the day what matters is the character. If he or she happens to be black I'm all for it. I'm just asking to see a little more variety.

Does that make me racist?

Things are still changing in Hollywood.
Check out the trailer for the Apple+ Invasion series.

There are more movies and shows that do have good representation but they aren't brought up much.
 
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8bitpill

Member
Coming into this topic with my white privilege card




Honestly, right now in any media, it's what sells.

Diversity is good but since the "great pandering" it all feels pushed.
 

Atrus

Gold Member
It’s to appease the egos of White people of predominantly English ancestry. They feel guilty and so EVERYONE has to view the world through their lens.

That’s how we get racist terms like BIPOC based on their hierarchy of white guilt. Blacks for slavery, Indigenous for theft of land and genocide and POC for “ people we don’t give a shit about.”

You’ll get nonsensical claims of how they want the rising tide to lift all boats but in practice they are specifically targeting groups out of white guilt and deepening racial division.

As an example, in Canada we can see this in our Prime Minister’s specific outreach for Black Canadians through special grants for entrepreneurs but not Asians or Hispanics as if they too don’t face challenges.

Wouldn’t such grants be better tailored based on need rather than ones skin colour?

 
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Scotty W

Gold Member
The problem is not other races. The problem is that movie studios ran out of good ideas in 1999. So all they can do is reboot, and pollute the classics with Marxism.

Have people forgotten the 90’s? I used to watch stuff all the time that had minorities in it, IF IT WAS GOOD.
 

Tschumi

Member
I think you can only be blinkered in saying this, Spanish and Asian characters have had huge representation across media for decades. Maybe if you go to some place like New Mexico or something you'll see a huge prevalence of Hispanic culture on tv, in wider media, and in general local culture.

I'm sorry but considering how willfully you seem to be ignoring the reality of Hispanic representation this comes across more as some conspiracy theory about creeping black presence in media than anything genuinely thoughtful.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
You're not wrong to notice this. I watched tv recently and no fewer than four out of the five commercials in one break had black people as the main characters. This is because Hollywood is making a concerted effort to alleviate their crippling racial guilt in the most hamfisted way imaginable. Pretty much every tv show has to star a black woman, because they tick off two of the most celebrated boxes for Hollywood, black people and women. Nevermind that historically, and by statistics today, black men have it significantly harder as a group than black women.
Not doubt. In Canada, every other TV ad has Black people in it. I'd say this came about the past couple years. And the number of people in Canada that are Black is even lower than the US at only about 4% of the population while the US is about 13%. You'd think with the way ads are lately, they are 40% of the population.

On the other hand, you hardly see any Indian people (both Natives and from Asia), Asians, and Latinos. Indians and Asians are probably are probably 5x the Black community. Although to be fair, there's hardly any Latinos here.

Another thing you notice about the ads too is that almost every minority in them is cherry picked to be a very "born and raised in Canada english speaking minority" kind of person. You'd be very hard pressed to find any that represent immigrants with foreign culture or accents in any way, even though a shit load of minorities here are immigrants.

Government's and corporation's method of minority representation is to pick a minority born in Toronto or Montreal as if they represent someone actually from Africa, Brazil or the Phillippines.
 
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sol_bad

Member
The problem is not other races. The problem is that movie studios ran out of good ideas in 1999. So all they can do is reboot, and pollute the classics with Marxism.

Have people forgotten the 90’s? I used to watch stuff all the time that had minorities in it, IF IT WAS GOOD.

They didn't run out of ideas, audiences stopped supporting new ideas or new adaptations of literature.

Annihilation - budget 55 million - box office - 43.1 million
Midway - budget 100 million - box office 126.7 million
Underwater - 80 million - box office 40.9 million
Splice - budget 30 million - box office 27.1 million
Children of Men - budget 76 million - box office 70.5 million (lucky Alfonso Cuaron has street cred)
John Carter - budget 300 million - box office 284.1 million
Alita Battle Angel - budget 200 million - box office 404 million
Ford vs Ferrari - budget 97.6 million - box office 225.5 million
Ex Machina - budget 15 million 0 box office 36.9 million
Jupiter Ascending - budget 200 million - box office 183.9 million
Valerian - budget 205 million - box office 226 million
Tomorrowland - budget 190 million - box office 209 million
Ender's Game - budget 115 million - box office 125.5 million
Mortal Engines - budget 150 million - box office 83.7 million
The Island - budget 126 million - box office 162.9 million
Gemini Man - budget 138 million - box office 173.5 million
Dredd - budget 45 million - box office 41.5 million
Cloud Atlas - budget 146.7 million - box office 130.5 million

The list goes on and on.

*EDIT*
Some more.

Ad Astra - budget 100 million - box office 135.4 million
Missing Link - budget 102 million - box office 26.2 million
Doctor Sleep - budget 55 million - box office 72.3 million
Long Shot - budget 40 million - box office 53.9 million
Jennifer's Body - budget 16 million - box office 31.6 million
Assassination of Jesse James - budget 30 million - box office 15 million
The Fountain - budget 35 million - box office 16 million
Mother! - budget 30 million - box office 44.5 million
Hugo - budget 170 million - box office 185.8 million
Silence - budget 50 million - box office 23.8 million
The Master - budget 32 million - box office 28.3 million
Inherent Vice - budget 20 million - box office 14.7 million
The Lost City of Z - budget 30 million - box office 19.3 million
Scott Pilgrim vs the World - budget 85 million - box office 49.3 million
Sunshine - budget 40 million - box office 32 million
Under the Skin - budget 13.3 million - box office 7.3 million
Warrior - budget 25 million - box office 23.3 million
 
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Scotty W

Gold Member
sol_bad sol_bad the fact that your list has Jupiter Ascending on it renders the whole list suspicious.

My personal experience is I stopped enjoying new films in the early zeros. I might also add that this is also my cut off point for heavy metal as well.

Everything is so well executed, but feels totally fake. For movies, everything from the beats to the messages is so carefully tuned now that everything has lost its individuality.

So I would say I was not completely accurate in saying they ran out of good ideas.
 

sol_bad

Member
sol_bad sol_bad the fact that your list has Jupiter Ascending on it renders the whole list suspicious.

My personal experience is I stopped enjoying new films in the early zeros. I might also add that this is also my cut off point for heavy metal as well.

Everything is so well executed, but feels totally fake. For movies, everything from the beats to the messages is so carefully tuned now that everything has lost its individuality.

So I would say I was not completely accurate in saying they ran out of good ideas.

I put Jupiter Ascending in there because it's a big budget high sci fi idea. It's quality is irrelevant. If it was called Star Wars: Jupiter Ascending it would have made 800 million+.
Point is, if Jupiter Ascending made huge amounts at the box office, studios would be more inclined to take risks on other big budget new idea sci fi films. This is an example of why they don't take chances. It doesn't mean they'll make more average sci fi epics, it means they'd make more in general, some good and some bad. It's audiences that are stifling originality, not the studios.

My list of films are all varying qualities, you should check some or all of them out. You might hate some and might like some.
 

jason10mm

Member
Well, if Matrix 4 is as bad as Jupiter Ascending yet makes 3x as much, I guess you have a point.

I think TV has robbed cinema of everything but kids cartoons and pg-13 blockbusters. Drama, comedy, and romance are all but gone.
 

Romulus

Member
It’s to appease the egos of White people of predominantly English ancestry. They feel guilty and so EVERYONE has to view the world through their lens.

That’s how we get racist terms like BIPOC based on their hierarchy of white guilt. Blacks for slavery, Indigenous for theft of land and genocide and POC for “ people we don’t give a shit about.”

You’ll get nonsensical claims of how they want the rising tide to lift all boats but in practice they are specifically targeting groups out of white guilt and deepening racial division.

As an example, in Canada we can see this in our Prime Minister’s specific outreach for Black Canadians through special grants for entrepreneurs but not Asians or Hispanics as if they too don’t face challenges.

Wouldn’t such grants be better tailored based on need rather than ones skin colour?



The sad part is there no reason to feel guilty at all. People get conquered and enslaved, it's the human way no matter which shade come out.
 
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