• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!

Status
Not open for further replies.

Timu

Member
Sep 8, 2013
20,072
4
0
Saint Leonard, MD
The USB3HDCAP is the same as the Micomsoft Xcapture-1 with no passthrough but at only half the price. I read here you don't need to use a syncstrike with it.
If that is the case how do you do direct connection of capturing RGB?

Aw, I just ordered one. Oh well, I'll use it anyways.
Oh the bright side it makes capturing RGB a lot easier and straightforward.
 

Shadow Hog

Member
Jan 20, 2012
12,617
1
0
33
www.srb2.org
The passthrough's pretty much the only thing about the USB3HDCAP that bothers me, honestly... Dunno if that's worth spending an extra couple hundred dollars on fixing, though.
 

Timu

Member
Sep 8, 2013
20,072
4
0
Saint Leonard, MD
The passthrough's pretty much the only thing about the USB3HDCAP that bothers me, honestly... Dunno if that's worth spending an extra couple hundred dollars on fixing, though.
I don't see an issue with that when you can just play and record on your monitor unless you need it or use USB 2.0, but USB 2.0 is not so great for quality plus lag.

Speaking of capture devices, anyone have a recommended bps (bitrate?) to record at?
For youtube?
 

TeaJay

Member
Jun 7, 2014
562
1
0
The North
I would personally use the setup for live streaming, so I guess I would just use a scart splitter to use one for my PVM to play the game and the connect the other to the capture card.
 

Timu

Member
Sep 8, 2013
20,072
4
0
Saint Leonard, MD
Yeah recording then uploading to youtube.
Listen carefully, I know about youtube bitrates and what they use for each res, I'll list what youtube accepts so you don't have to record much higher than needed.

Forget about anything 480p and under

720p=3000 kbps
1080p=6000 kbps
1440p=9000 kbps
4k=20000 kbps

I normally use 4k now since it gives the best quality for everything. This applies to even 240p games as well as they look sharper than at 720p and such.
 

Mega

Banned
Oct 31, 2007
3,689
2
0
If that is the case how do you do direct connection of capturing RGB?

Oh the bright side it makes capturing RGB a lot easier and straightforward.

If you have an Extron switch... BNC to VGA cable.

Scart switch? Male scart to VGA cable

Direct from a console with RGB Scart cable?
Female to male Scart passthrough with audio out
Female Scart coupler
Male Scart to VGA cable


That last one may seem like a lot but it's all really cheap stuff. Unfortunately there are no female scart to male VGA cables with audio breakout to streamline the setup. There is a male VGA to male Scart with audio on eBay (arcadian8bits) but I don't think it works the other way around.
 

Timu

Member
Sep 8, 2013
20,072
4
0
Saint Leonard, MD
If you have an Extron switch... BNC to VGA cable.

Scart switch? Male scart to VGA cable

Direct from a console with RGB Scart cable?
Female to male Scart passthrough with audio out
Female Scart coupler
Male Scart to VGA cable


That last one may seem like a lot but it's all really cheap stuff. Unfortunately there are no female scart to male VGA cables with audio breakout to streamline the setup. There is a male VGA to male Scart with audio on eBay (arcadian8bits) but I don't think it works the other way around.
Damn, that's crazy man. Didn't think of some of this. I still find Sync Strike and scart to vga box on ebay to be simpler since it's straightforward but your method for the last one works perfectly and is cheaper so that's the way to go.
 

Ashby

Member
Oct 3, 2015
5,111
1
0
PVM Got! It's a Sony PVM-14N6U



Had to drive into Midtown Manhattan to get it but only cost me $100! Feel pretty fortunate that I've only known these things exist for about a week and I already got my hands on one at a good price.
 

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
Oct 13, 2008
21,089
8,613
1,610
So what's the subtitle gonna be for OT2? I really think we should use this as a vehicle to disparage other people.
 

Teknoman

Member
Nov 7, 2007
61,370
0
0
Houston, Texas
www.youtube.com
One more thing about the Startech USB3 capture device:

Someone else on GAF sent me a pm about his not working via HDMI (just showing a blank screen with no signal), and not just with PS3 but any system via HDMI. I decided to try with my 360 since i'd only recording retro consoles under HD resolutions so far. I'm having the same issue, and the only thing I can think is that maybe its because i'm using it with USB 2.0 ports?

Im guessing it will only support SD resolutions when using a USB 2.0 port?
 

Timu

Member
Sep 8, 2013
20,072
4
0
Saint Leonard, MD
One more thing about the Startech USB3 capture device:

Someone else on GAF sent me a pm about his not working via HDMI (just showing a blank screen with no signal), and not just with PS3 but any system via HDMI. I decided to try with my 360 since i'd only recording retro consoles under HD resolutions so far. I'm having the same issue, and the only thing I can think is that maybe its because i'm using it with USB 2.0 ports?

Im guessing it will only support SD resolutions when using a USB 2.0 port?
Try USB 3.0.
 

Ashby

Member
Oct 3, 2015
5,111
1
0
So now that I've got a PVM what's the best way to make sure all my settings are optimal? 240p Test Suite, right?
 

Ramune

Member
Oct 22, 2006
1,902
1
0
40
All this talk on 240p capture is great! Closing this thread with even more juicy nuggets of info! That would be my next step after making a nice setup for my PVMs and VGA monitor!
 

Timu

Member
Sep 8, 2013
20,072
4
0
Saint Leonard, MD
All this talk on 240p capture is great! Closing this thread with even more juicy nuggets of info! That would be my next step after making a nice setup for my PVMs and VGA monitor!
Yes, we welcome those who capture 240p games in all their glory!!! I've been doing it for years.
 

Kiddy Dong

Member
Jun 23, 2015
516
0
0
Reading through old posts, found this interesting. Dark10x had this figured out over a year ago.





For some background, Wii U vWii is indeed worse. Visibly nasty as seen in direct captures.

This is really interesting, I'm surprised this hasn't been a bigger topic whenever the Wii U's backwards compatibility is brought up. Most people just assume the HDMI out will result in a better picture by default, but of course it's not that simple. I suppose this thread stands as a testament to that notion.
 

Mega

Banned
Oct 31, 2007
3,689
2
0
I like Retro AV Club. It's a nice catch-all phrase for everything this thread is about.

Somebody actually complained today in a NES Mini thread about no 16:9.

I saw that. Gaffers in the NES Mini threads are basically happy just because it's not complete trash. It's okay but I'm not super impressed... but I'm coming from using higher end HDMI solutions.

One more thing about the Startech USB3 capture device:

Someone else on GAF sent me a pm about his not working via HDMI (just showing a blank screen with no signal), and not just with PS3 but any system via HDMI. I decided to try with my 360 since i'd only recording retro consoles under HD resolutions so far. I'm having the same issue, and the only thing I can think is that maybe its because i'm using it with USB 2.0 ports?

Im guessing it will only support SD resolutions when using a USB 2.0 port?

USB3HDCAP only works with USB 3.0
 

Teknoman

Member
Nov 7, 2007
61,370
0
0
Houston, Texas
www.youtube.com
I like Retro AV Club. It's a nice catch-all phrase for everything this thread is about.



I saw that. Gaffers in the NES Mini threads are basically happy just because it's not complete trash. It's okay but I'm not super impressed... but I'm coming from using higher end HDMI solutions.



USB3HDCAP only works with USB 3.0

Well technically it seems you can use it with 2.0, just not with HD resolutions. I know I dont have 3.0, yet i've captured SNES, Saturn, Genesis, and NES games at 240p just fine. But yeah that was probably pushing it still. At any rate, I need to get a pci-e USB 3.0 card if I want to record 360, PS3, WiiU stuff (which eventually I will want to).
 

Timu

Member
Sep 8, 2013
20,072
4
0
Saint Leonard, MD
Well technically it seems you can use it with 2.0, just not with HD resolutions. I know I dont have 3.0, yet i've captured SNES, Saturn, Genesis, and NES games at 240p just fine. But yeah that was probably pushing it still. At any rate, I need to get a pci-e USB 3.0 card if I want to record 360, PS3, WiiU stuff (which eventually I will want to).
Here's one that's recommended.
 

Mega

Banned
Oct 31, 2007
3,689
2
0
Well technically it seems you can use it with 2.0, just not with HD resolutions. I know I dont have 3.0, yet i've captured SNES, Saturn, Genesis, and NES games at 240p just fine. But yeah that was probably pushing it still. At any rate, I need to get a pci-e USB 3.0 card if I want to record 360, PS3, WiiU stuff (which eventually I will want to).

That's weird because I couldn't get it to record 240p Composite or S-Video over USB 2.0 but it worked with 3.0... but maybe that had something to do with using my quirky Mame PC (normal PC isn't in range of my retro consoles).
 

Teknoman

Member
Nov 7, 2007
61,370
0
0
Houston, Texas
www.youtube.com
Here's one that's recommended.

That's weird because I couldn't get it to record 240p Composite or S-Video over USB 2.0 but it worked with 3.0... but maybe that had something to do with using my quirky Mame PC (normal PC isn't in range of my retro consoles).

Yeah im just going to go ahead and grab one of those USB cards. Its probably not working at optimal levels the way I have it set anyway lol.
 

televator

Member
Sep 21, 2011
10,849
1
0
This is really interesting, I'm surprised this hasn't been a bigger topic whenever the Wii U's backwards compatibility is brought up. Most people just assume the HDMI out will result in a better picture by default, but of course it's not that simple. I suppose this thread stands as a testament to that notion.

There has been some repeated discussion on it in the past. Some screens submited by Mega and Beer Monkey to corroborate it. Not everyone, myself included, understood what the problem was. The issue seems worse when on the vWii home menu where all the channels are laid out.

I like the direction of some of the conversation going forward focusing on scaling techniques. I hope enough people get into it to where everyone starts to care and pay closer attention to the kind of scaling methods that more closely preserve the original look of games. There's more to learn going forward, and that's why I love this goddamn thread.
 

Mega

Banned
Oct 31, 2007
3,689
2
0
This is really interesting, I'm surprised this hasn't been a bigger topic whenever the Wii U's backwards compatibility is brought up. Most people just assume the HDMI out will result in a better picture by default, but of course it's not that simple. I suppose this thread stands as a testament to that notion.

A while back I posted a comparison of vWii 480p to 1080p, among other things, to show how bad the former was. Not that vWii 1080p is much better... it also sucks. I forgot to do a comparison to the Hi-Def I got in August. This speaks for itself.

vWii 480p (scaled to 960p to draw an even comparison)


vWii 1080p


Hi-Def NES 1080p
 

televator

Member
Sep 21, 2011
10,849
1
0
You'd think a company with billions of dollars would know that nearest neighbor would cover their scaling needs best or at least better than what they implemented. Guess they just don't care.
 

NormalFish

Banned
Aug 14, 2014
11,920
0
0
Florida, USA
You'd think a company with billions of dollars would know that nearest neighbor would cover their scaling needs best or at least better than what they implemented. Guess they just don't care.

More like they know that the average consumer doesn't know enough to care. There's more misinformation and general lack of insight on the topic of video game image quality than I like to think about.

Oh damn last page???
 

TeaJay

Member
Jun 7, 2014
562
1
0
The North
I'm not ready to go yet!

You can livestream with just OBS.

Not sure if I understand - I mean, currently I have my consoles connected to my scart switchbox. From there I run a scart to my PVM.

For streaming purposes, I need the console signal to my PC. Should I run a second BNC-scart cable from my PVM output to the sync strike rather than use a simple scart splitter?
 

Timu

Member
Sep 8, 2013
20,072
4
0
Saint Leonard, MD
I'm not ready to go yet!



Not sure if I understand - I mean, currently I have my consoles connected to my scart switchbox. From there I run a scart to my PVM.

For streaming purposes, I need the console signal to my PC. Should I run a second BNC-scart cable from my PVM output to the sync strike rather than use a simple scart splitter?
You need a program like OBS to be able to live stream. As for the question, I think the latter might work better since the sync strike needs scart in and vga out.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.