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News VR [UploadVR] Next-Gen PlayStation VR Is 4K With Foveated Rendering And Vibration Feature

Excited for PSVR2?


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skit_data

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I agree with Zuckerberg: “some other folks might try to ship something that they claim is higher quality but has a wire, and I just don’t think that consumers are going to want to go for that.”

Every single spec listed for this PSVR2 sound amazing, and yet the knowledge that it'll be tethered with a USB cable has deflated my interest considerably. Once you go wireless it's a bummer to go back, especially when playing 360 degree VR games. I hope Sony can figure out a solution or accessory to allow for wireless display like Quest 2 does with PC.
Maybe its wired... to a dongle?

 
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Tygeezy

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I agree with Zuckerberg: “some other folks might try to ship something that they claim is higher quality but has a wire, and I just don’t think that consumers are going to want to go for that.”

Every single spec listed for this PSVR2 sound amazing, and yet the knowledge that it'll be tethered with a USB cable has deflated my interest considerably. Once you go wireless it's a bummer to go back, especially when playing 360 degree VR games. I hope Sony can figure out a solution or accessory to allow for wireless display like Quest 2 does with PC.
And since we know the USB cable at 10 GBPS is not sufficient for high resolution plus high refresh rate display we know they have to use compression to send it through USB which means it can easily be capable of wireless.

If sony was smart they would make this a hybrid headset like the quest. It could play standalone games that are ports from the quest library, but also play big boy ps5 vr rendered games. Sony has never had much success in the mobility or handheld market, but they could easily breakthrough here.
 
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Tygeezy

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Eye tracking would be nuts, games would look better in VR than on a standard display due to being able to throw most of the GPU power are a very small subset of pixels.
It's already done with current headsets. The big deal here is it would be eyed tracked. Current headsets use "fixed foveated rendering" so there is a sweet spot right in the middle of the lenses. With eye tracking anywhere you look with your eyes it will be tracked and have full resolution.
 

RoadHazard

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It not being wireless honestly cuts my hype in half. I just can't imagine going back to wired VR in 2022 or whenever it's coming out. If Oculus can do wireless VR on a $299 headset released in 2020, why can't Sony on what will most likely be a more expensive headset released 2+ years later? Just throw a decent WiFi chip in there.

Hopefully there will be a Pro version for those of us willing to pay a little more for a much better experience.
 
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McCheese

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Oh a thread about it. I'll ask here then.

What's foveated rendering mean?

It's when you lower the resolution away from the focal point, in headsets without eye tracking it means pixelated graphics when you are not looking straight ahead. But with the tracking it means you won't even notice it, literally free gpu power real-estate. Imagine something like a 20x graphics increase in VR
 

HawarMiran

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Gaming in VR is weird to me. I feel nauseated. But I'd like VR for other stuff,like watching sports with it or being in a virtual cinema. As long I am stationary all is good
 
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Hendrick's

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I agree with Zuckerberg: “some other folks might try to ship something that they claim is higher quality but has a wire, and I just don’t think that consumers are going to want to go for that.”

Every single spec listed for this PSVR2 sound amazing, and yet the knowledge that it'll be tethered with a USB cable has deflated my interest considerably. Once you go wireless it's a bummer to go back, especially when playing 360 degree VR games. I hope Sony can figure out a solution or accessory to allow for wireless display like Quest 2 does with PC.
Exactly. Wired VR is too big a compromise. Once you play a Quest, it's impossible to go back to wired. The one exception would be for cockpit like scenarios.
 
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kyliethicc

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The wire being a USB C cable opens the door for wireless VR because the bandwidth is not great enough to use USB C without compression.
It will not be wireless.

A Type-C connector can support up to 40 Gb/s (for now) and thats the basically the same as HDMI 2.1, so there's no issue there. (PS5 HDMI port is capped at only 32 Gb/s for now, and can still do 4K@120 HDR 422.)

Thunderbolt 3 uses Type-C connector and can even pass through up to 100 W of power and 40 Gb/s bw.
 
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TLZ

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It's when you lower the resolution away from the focal point, in headsets without eye tracking it means pixelated graphics when you are not looking straight ahead. But with the tracking it means you won't even notice it, literally free gpu power real-estate. Imagine something like a 20x graphics increase in VR
As long as it's not noticeable, that's super!
 
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Tygeezy

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So maybe the dynamic foveated rendering will enable the HMD to work via Type-C whitout needing compression.
10 gbps of usb is still much lower than even last generation hdmi of 18 gbps. The DisplayPort on the hp reverb 2 which will be slightly higher resolution than the psvr 2 is at 32 gbps and it has fixed foveated rendering.

100 % it will be hevc or h.264 compression with a high enough bitrate that it would be difficult to distinguish a native signal.
 

Tygeezy

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It will not be wireless.

A Type-C connector can support up to 40 Gb/s (for now) and thats the basically the same as HDMI 2.1, so there's no issue there. (PS5 HDMI port is capped at only 32 Gb/s for now, and can still do 4K@120 HDR 422.)

Thunderbolt 3 uses Type-C connector and can even pass through up to 100 W of power and 40 Gb/s bw.
The type c on the ps5 is quoted as 10 gbps.

 
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CS Lurker

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10 gbps of usb is still much lower than even last generation hdmi of 18 gbps. The DisplayPort on the hp reverb 2 which will be slightly higher resolution than the psvr 2 is at 32 gbps and it has fixed foveated rendering.

100 % it will be hevc or h.264 compression with a high enough bitrate that it would be difficult to distinguish a native signal.

It all depends on how precise the eye-tracking can be, I believe. The gain with foveated rendering can be huge.
 

ZehDon

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Sounds like quite a step up from the PSVR. Foveated rendering will be a requirement to try and reach 4K while maintaining 60FPS to implement frame interpolation (same as PSVR), so hearing they've gone all in with an eye tracking solution makes me smile. Can't wait to see what they've got.
 

kyliethicc

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The type c on the ps5 is quoted as 10 gbps.

For data transfer sure. They could be keeping some secrets tho.

It is technically only 10 Gb/s for its function as a USB-C 3.2 Gen2x1 data transfer port. But it could have a higher bandwidth just for its use as a VR out port. Some people who looked at the PS5's SoC said the USB controllers appeared modified to support video out functionality.

Sony could be using something similar to VirtualLink:

"The available bandwidth is estimated to be equivalent to DisplayPort 1.4 (32.4 Gbit/s, up to 4K @ 120 Hz with 8 bpc color) for video and 10 Gbit/s of USB 3.1 Gen 2 data."


Notice how the PS5 uses 32 Gb/s for A/V and 10 Gb/s for data? Same as VirtualLink. Maybe not a coincidence?
 
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WalterSobchak

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I bought psvr day 1 , but not sure on this one. Resi 7 was amazing and I also enjoyed the Walking Dead saints and sinners as well. Other than those 2 games it didn't really do much for me for hardcore gaming purposes . Actually Farpoint was pretty cool as well come to think of it.

Unpopular opinion on this site, but I'll never understand the praise that Astros playroom game gets. I bought that on gafs reccomendation and was very underwhelmed after about 5 levels and dropped it. Vr didn't seem to add much to it since it wasn't in 1st person. I like platformers but vr 3rd person or side viewing angles like Astro seem pointless for vr imo.

Might buy eventually but probably a year or 2 after it's out, or not at all. Being tethered again isn't really appealing either. Maybe if it hits $300 or less eventually.
 
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This is amazing news. It's everything I could have hoped for excluding wireless.

Forveated rendering, eye tracking and 4K will really make it a game changer. This is beyond whatever we have now as far as I'm concerned.

Forveated rendering and eye tracking especially will open up new doors into what's possible in VR. I cannot wait!
 

Tygeezy

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For data transfer sure. They could be keeping some secrets tho.

It is technically only 10 Gb/s for its function as a USB-C 3.2 Gen2x1 data transfer port. But it could have a higher bandwidth just for its use as a VR out port. Some people who looked at the PS5's SoC said the USB controllers appeared modified to support video out functionality.

Sony could be using something similar to VirtualLink:

"The available bandwidth is estimated to be equivalent to DisplayPort 1.4 (32.4 Gbit/s, up to 4K @ 120 Hz with 8 bpc color) for video and 10 Gbit/s of USB 3.1 Gen 2 data."


Notice how the PS5 uses 32 Gb/s for A/V and 10 Gb/s for data? Same as VirtualLink. Maybe not a coincidence?
It would be speculation to suggest it’s capable of anything outside of the official specs. Virtual link also never caught on due to reliability issues.
 
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Rudius

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4K res but not really.. probably to bring costs down. A little sharper than the Quest 2.

I have a feeling this will be at least $499 if that doesn't even include the controllers... and still wired.

Still, props to Sony for trying something new and innovating.

I agree with Zuckerberg: “some other folks might try to ship something that they claim is higher quality but has a wire, and I just don’t think that consumers are going to want to go for that.”

Every single spec listed for this PSVR2 sound amazing, and yet the knowledge that it'll be tethered with a USB cable has deflated my interest considerably. Once you go wireless it's a bummer to go back, especially when playing 360 degree VR games. I hope Sony can figure out a solution or accessory to allow for wireless display like Quest 2 does with PC.
This has higher specs than most predicted: controlers with hepatic feedback and adaptive triggers, 4K screen, higher FOV and specially eye tracking. Add wireless to that and you have something more expensive than the PS5 itself.

To me they made the right call. I want to play games like GT7 and Resident Evil 8 at the highest possible quality for a reasonable price, so that it has a large install base and developers can make money to produce more games of that caliber. If that requires a cable I'm OK with it.
 
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ThatOneGrunt

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I don't know how I feel about PS and VR. I was pretty annoyed when VR in Resident Evil 7 was made exclusive to PSVR. Even though the game was out on PC where there was already a large community of VR users. If Sony being in the market means games from big developers having VR stripped out of PC games because of a exclusivity deals, then I want nothing to do with them. They suck.
 

Romulus

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I don't know how I feel about PS and VR. I was pretty annoyed when VR in Resident Evil 7 was made exclusive to PSVR. Even though the game was out on PC where there was already a large community of VR users. If Sony being in the market means games from big developers having VR stripped out of PC games because of a exclusivity deals, then I want nothing to do with them. They suck.

There was never a large community of VR users on Steam. Even now. PSVR outsold all the PCVR headsets within its first 2 years combined. It's gaining ground now of course with Quest 2.
 

kyliethicc

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It would be speculation to suggest it’s capable of anything outside of the official specs. Virtual link also never caught on due to reliability issues.
The "official specs" don't list how the PS5 will connect to the its VR headset. All Sony has said is it will use 1 cable.

Everything is therefore speculation.

I'd love to know how you think it will connect.
 
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CS Lurker

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The modern headsets all use foveated rendering. They are just fixed in the middle instead of being eye tracked.

That's why I said dynamic foveated rendering on my first post.

There's a huge difference between it being fixed and dynamic. For example, with the last one, you can be able to render only 5% of the pixels, having the others 95% being filled using deep learning.

It all depends on how good is the eye-tracking. Maybe a not-so-precising eye-tracking can already make up for the difference between 10Gb and 40Gb.
 
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Tygeezy

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There was never a large community of VR users on Steam. Even now. PSVR outsold all the PCVR headsets within its first 2 years combined. It's gaining ground now of course with Quest 2.
It will be interesting if the new headset will support pcvr like the original psvr did. If it's doing compression to send the signal like im guessing, it would most likely need software running on the headset to make it work like oculus does.
 

kyliethicc

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What price are people speculating then? I reckon £399 minimum.
$399 or $499. (That'll be with the controllers included, either way.)

The Valve Index is $999 for headset, cameras, & controllers. I think Sony will want to be about half the price, but deliver more than half in terms of fidelity, games, experience, etc. Same value proposition as a PS5, basically. For sure its gonna cost more than Quest 2 at $299, but it will deliver a higher fidelity experience.

PSVR was $399 but also required the $59 camera and the Move controllers were sold separately (at launch) for like $99. And we know this new PSVR2 will not require any external cameras or sensors.
 
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Tygeezy

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The "official specs" don't list how the PS5 will connect to the its VR headset. All Sony has said is it will use 1 cable.

Everything is therefore speculation.

I'd love to know how you think it will connect.
The official specs do tell us the bandwidth capability of the USB ports though, and virtual link never even took off because of it being unreliable. Based on the information we have I believe the usb c will power the headset and be used to send a compressed hevc or h.264 encode that the headset will then decode similar to what oculus does with the quest and quest 2 with its link cable. USB C has enough bandwidth to do a very high bitrate which would be really difficult to tell from a native signal.
 

ThatOneGrunt

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There was never a large community of VR users on Steam. Even now. PSVR outsold all the PCVR headsets within its first 2 years combined. It's gaining ground now of course with Quest 2.A
Are you talking about active VR users on Steam as your metric? Because if that's the case, how many active PSVR users are there? If you're going by sales, at the start of 2020 Sony had sold 5 million PSVR headsets. PCVR had sold 68 million headsets by that time. So how do you figure the PCVR market was not large?
 

kyliethicc

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The official specs do tell us the bandwidth capability of the USB ports though, and virtual link never even took off because of it being unreliable. Based on the information we have I believe the usb c will power the headset and be used to send a compressed hevc or h.264 encode that the headset will then decode similar to what oculus does with the quest and quest 2 with its link cable. USB C has enough bandwidth to do a very high bitrate which would be really difficult to tell from a native signal.
So you agree with me that it will use the USB-C port on the PS5. Lol.
 
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Tygeezy

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So you agree with me that it will use the USB-C port on the PS5. Lol.
Yes of course. I’m just saying the capability to do wireless is there if they are using compression which they likely will be doing given the bandwidth limitation of the port. By the time this launches wifi 6e will also be out which will allow greater throughput and lower latency on 6ghz channels.

They could include a wifi 6e chip on the headset along with a battery and release a dongle for the ps5 or use your routers 5ghz and( and in the future) 6 ghz signals like airlink currently does on oculus quest.
 
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ZehDon

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Has Starfield 100% been confirmed exclusive to Microsoft then?
Has Phil Spencer turned to a camera, looked deep into your eyes, and said that exact sentence? No.
Did Phil Spencer look into a camera and say that Microsoft bought Bethesda to secure exclusive games for Gamepass? Yes.

As I said... I wouldn't be waiting for Starfield on PSVR2.
 

Bo_Hazem

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The official specs do tell us the bandwidth capability of the USB ports though, and virtual link never even took off because of it being unreliable. Based on the information we have I believe the usb c will power the headset and be used to send a compressed hevc or h.264 encode that the headset will then decode similar to what oculus does with the quest and quest 2 with its link cable. USB C has enough bandwidth to do a very high bitrate which would be really difficult to tell from a native signal.

The wire could be partial for some data and the rest is wireless?
 
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Has Phil Spencer turned to a camera, looked deep into your eyes, and said that exact sentence? No.
Did Phil Spencer look into a camera and say that Microsoft bought Bethesda to secure exclusive games for Gamepass? Yes.

As I said... I wouldn't be waiting for Starfield on PSVR2.
No official announcement then. I thought I had missed something.
 
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kyliethicc

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The wire could be partial for some data and the rest is wireless?
Nah. USB-C allows for power, data, audio, & video. I don't see a reason for using a wired connection for only some of that.

Adding wireless radios into the headset adds cost, weight, and bulk.

I'll be surprised if the PSVR2 is wireless. A single cable solution I reckon Sony well go with.
Sony have literally said it will use a single cable. Confirmed.
 
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Wonko_C

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I don't know how I feel about PS and VR. I was pretty annoyed when VR in Resident Evil 7 was made exclusive to PSVR. Even though the game was out on PC where there was already a large community of VR users. If Sony being in the market means games from big developers having VR stripped out of PC games because of a exclusivity deals, then I want nothing to do with them. They suck.
After RE Village's release with no VR support it's clear now that RE7's VR mode wouldn't have been made without Sony money. And their exclusivity for that mode was only for one year. Capcom have for long been free to update the PC version with VR support but they can't be arsed. At least VorpX works on it and it will probably be the only way to play Village in VR in the future.
 
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