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|OT| The Last of Us Pt II |OT| Oh Ellie...I think they should be terrified of you

GeorgPrime

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If they do a part 3 it will be at the end of the gen. And no way it flops. I believe people will be hungry for another entry by then, especially if the show is successful, and many of the people that had a meltdown over part 2 will have either gotten over it or just moved on completely by 2027 or whenever the hell it releases.
we are already at the end of the gen. If you mean the end of next gen than you can easily wait 5 years or so.
 

Ulysses 31

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If they do a part 3 it will be at the end of the gen. And no way it flops. I believe people will be hungry for another entry by then, especially if the show is successful, and many of the people that had a meltdown over part 2 will have either gotten over it or just moved on completely by 2027 or whenever the hell it releases.
You don't see them doing some kind of Left Behind like DLC for TLOU2?
 
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I know this won't be a popular opinion but I (think?) I'm nearing the final bit of the game and so far I'm enjoying the story. I like how they did a tale of revenge from two perspectives. I also like that you don't get the impression that one is more justifiable than the other. Both have reasons for their revenge that are relatable. Some of it comes off hamfisted but I get the vibe Naughty Dog is going for and I appreciate it.

I also like how the game starts off with you obviously detesting Abby for killing Joel. Immediately you have it in your head that she is the antagonist, yet as the story goes on and it shows her "human" side you see that she is just like anyone else trying to survive and she has a motivation for her actions that are relatable. She gets angry, laughs, sad etc. She isnt just a one dimensional character.
 
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Dorohedoro

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I expect them to do Uncharted now with Nathas daughter as the lead character (to get the female lead momentun running)
I think that's the only logical place the franchise can go if there is ever a new entry. Not really interested in more Chloe and Nadine (god help them from the woke warrior rage if they brought back Laura Bailey to voice her), nor a young Sully game. I think the latter would be better suited for flashbacks or something. I don't see ND making it either way though, it'll be another studio while they work on a new IP.

You don't see them doing some kind of Left Behind like DLC for TLOU2?
Could've sworn they said there wouldn't be any story DLC, unfortunately. Unless they make another Lost Legacy style game instead which would be fantastic.
 
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Woggleman

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I think Neil means that he won't do another one unless he feels that he can take the story where he wants it to go. I hope there is another one but I really hope they don't sell out and try to make a safe crowd pleaser. I hope we don't get an apology game to try and please the people who hated TLOU2. Many also loved and cater to them or better yet make what they want to make.
 

J3nga

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So what happens if Naughty Dog drops Last of Us now and does something new? Sounded like they dont want to make Last of Us 3 even with the good sales.

It seems like they fully expect Part 3 to flop after 2.
What's the reason for Part 3 to exist? Most wanted to see Ellie's and Joel's continuation, but I doubt someone really wants to see more of Abby and Lev.
 

GeorgPrime

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What's the reason for Part 3 to exist? Most wanted to see Ellie's and Joel's continuation, but I doubt someone really wants to see more of Abby and Lev.
Ellie lost purpose in everything. She knows Joel lied. She knows she is the cure. She can now look for the remaining fireflies and try to sacrifice herself for the greater good to find a new reason to exist. On the opposite you could let a "Fungus Cult" come up that wants to create the ultimate clicker beast and wants Ellie to not reach her goal.

Everything is possible. Ellie looking for Abby to ask if she can deliver her so she can die. That would make up for a lot of new emotional stress and a dramatic ending.
 
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Ulysses 31

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Ellie lost purpose in everything. She knows Joel lied. She knows she is the cure. She can now look for the remaining fireflies and try to sacrifice herself for the greater good to find a new reason to exist. On the opposite you could let a "Fungus Cult" come up that wants to create the ultimate clicker beast and wants Ellie to not reach her goal.

Everything is possible. Ellie looking for Abby to ask if she can deliver her so she can die. That would make up for a lot of new emotional stress and a dramatic ending.
More of a focus on the fungus with new enemy types, seeing how the fungus actually spreads, maybe start having animals also be affected.
 

angelic

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And finished. Not one likeable character in it. Gameplay amazing, story stunk. Never ever to be played again, no matter how much of a new game plus it's tried to throw at me. 100% franchise killer, I don't want any more of it, even though it was fun, no more from this writing team.
 

wolywood

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Finished the game this past weekend. A lot of the big plot points felt like Neil Druckmann trying really hard to emulate either HBO (killing off a lead character early) or Hideo Kojima (surprise protagonist switch). That said, I loved almost every minute of it.
 

Ellery

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Finished the game this past weekend. A lot of the big plot points felt like Neil Druckmann trying really hard to emulate either HBO (killing off a lead character early) or Hideo Kojima (surprise protagonist switch). That said, I loved almost every minute of it.
Well you have pretty great intuition then, because they indeed hired a person to help writing this game who previously worked on HBO TV shows (Halley Gross from Westworld) and ND stated that they got inspired by MGS 2 marketing strategy and knowing Neil Druckmann he is a huge fan of video games he knows all about the Metal Gear Series I bet.
Just like Snake (tanker) turned into Raiden, Big Boss (MGS GZ) -> Venom Snake (MGS TPP) we have something similar in TLOU2. Also I think both the MGS games and TLOU2 are anti war at the very essence of the game. MGS through nuclear deterrence (and 50000 other things which I don't need to mention) and TLOU2 through ending the cycle of violence.
 
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TheHustler

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Just rolled the credits a few min ago. I stayed on media blackout with the spoilers and whatever controversy was going on.

Serious question, why is this game so controversial? I saw nothing that would jump out at me and justify the need to rage over the game's existence or spoil the story in advance to warn anyone ahead of playing.

I thoroughly enjoyed the game, and appreciate the different perspectives and the stories converging. Dragged on a bit in some places, especially playing as Abby. But that's my only gripe. Gameplay and graphics were jaw dropping and set a new standard for games. Yes the gameplay is more "last of us", but it's a bit evolved. If it's not broken, don't fix it. I guarantee next gen games will be compared to this game, Naughty Dog is one of my favorite dev teams, excited to see what they do next!

Last comment, I'm indifferent if there is a Last of Us 3. I didn't need a Part 2, I'm okay with stories trailing off to leave it up to the imagination. Some great stories we'll never know the true ending. (Movie the Joker comes to mind).
 

Woggleman

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I just want more gameplay in this world. It could be all characters we have never seen before but I love the vibe and the combat of these games.
 

J3nga

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Just rolled the credits a few min ago. I stayed on media blackout with the spoilers and whatever controversy was going on.

Serious question, why is this game so controversial? I saw nothing that would jump out at me and justify the need to rage over the game's existence or spoil the story in advance to warn anyone ahead of playing.

I thoroughly enjoyed the game, and appreciate the different perspectives and the stories converging. Dragged on a bit in some places, especially playing as Abby. But that's my only gripe. Gameplay and graphics were jaw dropping and set a new standard for games. Yes the gameplay is more "last of us", but it's a bit evolved. If it's not broken, don't fix it. I guarantee next gen games will be compared to this game, Naughty Dog is one of my favorite dev teams, excited to see what they do next!

Last comment, I'm indifferent if there is a Last of Us 3. I didn't need a Part 2, I'm okay with stories trailing off to leave it up to the imagination. Some great stories we'll never know the true ending. (Movie the Joker comes to mind).
Killing protagonist of the first game and then shoveling characters down your throat with words "love those now" is controversial more or less. Maybe new characters aren't that bad themselves, but the way they are presented is just awful IMHO. also ending doesn't make sense, Ellie met Abby like what? 3 times? During previous 2 she wanted nothing but kill her in a 1000 different ways. And 3rd time sudden change of heart for no real reason, if you want a good example where 2 characters are mortal enemies to each other in the beginning and end up being buddies I encourage you watch Enemy mine(1985), TLOU2 has 0 character building between two protagonists nor Ellie has seen Abby's side of things only player did. I see some feeling empathy towards Abby, but I see none from Ellie.
 
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EDMIX

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What's the reason for Part 3 to exist? Most wanted to see Ellie's and Joel's continuation, but I doubt someone really wants to see more of Abby and Lev.
You could have argued that about Resident Evil 1 and been wrong with 2 and 3 released so.....

Not everyone is playing the series solely to play 1 or 2 characters only. So for all you know, the series starts with those 2 and ends with completely different people. I'd buy those games too as I'm not playing it for 1 or 2 characters, I'm playing it for the overall world they crafted. Fallout nor Elder Scrolls have you playing 1 of the same characters and those games move MILLIONS of units because people like the story of the WORLD and its elements.

For all we know, Part 4 is about a Grown ass JJ and he is leader of New WLF lol

So.....I want more Abby and Lev. I'd buy that in a heart beat.

I'm buying it if its just about JJ grown
I'm buying it if its about Ellie
I'm buying it if its about Abby and Lev
I'm buying it if its a prequel about Tommy, Joel and Eugene as fireflys
I'm buying it if its a prequel about Ellie's mother and Marlene when she was the "queen FireFly"

Sooooooo I'm buying Part 3 regardless as I enjoy the universe. I don't buy games for 1 character SOLELY as that sounds really weird... Using that logic I couldn't even buy Metal Gear Solid 2 or 3 or Peace Walker or 5 etc. It boarders silly at this point, most adults are not really buying work based on that, they are buying for the whole package in general. Like Walking Dead or Game Of Thrones or House Of Cards etc.
 

EruditeHobo

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I think an obvious way to go is to have an older Ellie mentoring a younger person, and have her mirror the more jaded, worn-down Joel from the 1st game who has this kid dropped in his lap and he's unsure how to deal with it. In a similar way, Ellie being unsure how to deal with her new role of guardianship in this world would be interesting.

But regardless, I don't need a sequel. I'd play anything from ND and Druckmann, they've easily earned that, but if they moved on from TLoU to other new stuff that would be fine for me. Main difference between the first game and the second is there is no lingering massive question at the end of the second game. The first ended with this lie, and the question of not just where these two characters would go but what would the lie do to them, would it even manifest?

It's obviously a plot question, but is also a significant character question as well. The closest we really get in the 2nd game is a plot question... which kind of sneakily may have already been answered -- where is Ellie going now, will she make up with Dina -- and seems like the answers very well could be Jackson, and yes they already did. Even if they aren't clearly answered, they are more plot questions than character questions, and don't have the same weight as a result IMO.

To be fair, the marketing did some disingenuous model swapping, giving the wrong impressions of Joel's part in the game.
Marketing is marketing... this happens a lot. I don't necessarily like it either, usually, but I think in this case it's a great head fake and in service of preserving the integrity of the story they did tell... while still doing the job of selling the game. It's also just a flash of Joel, right? All the marketing and gameplay overwhelmingly painted this as Ellie's game, with minimal Joel... and we now know why.
 
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EDMIX

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To be fair, the marketing did some disingenuous model swapping, giving the wrong impressions of Joel's part in the game.
That was intentional to maintain the surprise and I'm actually happy they did. I'm tired of games telling you 90% of the fucking plot in a trailer.

Terminator 2's trailer did the same thing as they wanted a surprise that Arnold was the good guy and not bad guy. They have no ode to spoil their own game.
 

Ulysses 31

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That was intentional to maintain the surprise and I'm actually happy they did. I'm tired of games telling you 90% of the fucking plot in a trailer.

Terminator 2's trailer did the same thing as they wanted a surprise that Arnold was the good guy and not bad guy. They have no ode to spoil their own game.
Surely that could've been still been done without making a special render of Joel and voice line that are not in the final game. :lollipop_grinning:

Are you sure about the T2 trailer? In an official trailer it's said that the T800 is now tasked with a new mission to protect the future. The teaser does make the T800 look like the bad one still.
 
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EDMIX

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Surely that could've been still been done without making a special render of Joel and voice line that are not in the final game. :lollipop_grinning:

Are you sure about the T2 trailer? In an official trailer it's said that the T800 is now tasked with a new mission to protect the future. The teaser does make the T800 look like the bad one still.
Could have been done but I see no point in it, it makes sense to actually make it the way it was done bud.

Pretty positive on T2 as well as it was talked about a bunch as even Kojima loved how that teaser fooled people as he would go on to do the same in Metal Gear Solid 2 and 3 as the tanker mission is to throw you off the track of him dying and playing as Raiden and even go as far as having footage of Snake fighting people HE NEVER FIGHTS and in the original Metal Gear Solid 3 trailer does it to where they troll you into thinking its Solid Snake and not Big Boss. They leave out enough information for you to assume its Solid Snake as this is done on purpose.



and



So you could get mad all you want that someone markets their games this way, but thats their choice to do so. When you make a game, you could spoil your whole plot in trailers if you feel just. I see no reason to get worked up over this man.

It sounds silly tbh.
 
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Ulysses 31

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If I was a MSG fan I'd feel deceived with those trailers too. I don't like it when trailers spoil mayor surprises either. It is their choice but it may affect how much stock I put in their future marketing material to buy their product. You seem to think I'm selectively picking on TLOU2's marketing when I hold the same standard for any game or movie. :lollipop_winking:

Kojima stuff does seem to be a special case though, with him I'd expect things not to be as he presents them by now.
 
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EDMIX

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If I was a MSG fan I'd feel deceived with those trailers too. I don't like it when trailers spoil mayor surprises either. It is their choice but it may affect how much stock I put in their future marketing material to buy their product. You seem to think I'm selectively picking on TLOU2's marketing when I hold the same standard for any game or movie. :lollipop_winking:
Thats nice.

Simply sounds silly. Yet those games went on to move millions of units. So most like the surprise, they want to be able to play it while having moments that they didn't see in the trailers or marketing as why would anyone want that in the first place?

"it may affect how much stock I put in their future marketing material to buy their product" Doesn't really make sense as you might as well just watch a lets play or stream of the game to judge if you want to play it or not. If you are going to get triggered or offended by marketing, you can still actually just watch the footage of the game after it releases. So if you are always worried about the "wrong impressions", you wouldn't even be putting any real value in trailers to even be talking about this subject in the first place, just watch a lets play, stream, youtube footage and move on...

I'm not sure why you made it seem as if the only way to view the game was trailers or something. I don't see this as anything to really be getting worked up over. The artist must still maintain the core integrity of the story.

You going to sue M Night Shyamalan for giving you the "wrong impressions" about The Village too or? You don't think this is maybe a bit strange to be so upset over marketing done to maintain a surprise?

 
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Aggelos

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That was intentional to maintain the surprise and I'm actually happy they did. I'm tired of games telling you 90% of the fucking plot in a trailer.

Terminator 2's trailer did the same thing as they wanted a surprise that Arnold was the good guy and not bad guy. They have no ode to spoil their own game.

Yeah I mean, it's up to the company and the game makers/creators to decide how much they will show when marketing their game leading up to its ultimate release.
Whether it's Terminator 2 or Metal Gear Solid 2, I don't think it's a reason to feel mad and infuriated by the plot rope-a-dope. Although I was too young to visit the theaters back in the Terminator 2 days to catch a glimpse of its promo-trailer, I surely remember Kojima's plot rope-a-dope with the MGS2 trailers.
In this day and age of ours, with games and films coming out in spades, it's all about selling a mentionable, noteworthy, praiseworthy, and memorable experience, you need to stand out from the crowd - and the competition is outrageously fierce.
If you unveil everything in the trailers, you take away from the experience based on the surprise factor of the gamer-player-viewer.
It's all about the experience, and the surprise factor is a crucial part of it, without a doubt. Remember how much From Software president Hidetaka Miyazaki fusses over the experience of the players.

FromSoftware president Hidetaka Miyazaki justified the lack of difficulty settings, stating, "We don't want to include a difficulty selection because we want to bring everyone to the same level of discussion and the same level of enjoyment. So we want everyone... to first face that challenge and to overcome it in some way that suits them as a player. We want everyone to feel that sense of accomplishment. We want everyone to feel elated and to join that discussion on the same level. We feel if there are different difficulties, that's going to segment and fragment the user base. People will have different experiences based on that [differing difficulty level]. This is something we take to heart when we design games. It's been the same way for previous titles and it's very much the same with Sekiro"


All in all, there's nothing bad in doing plot rope-a-dopes in your trailers, before the game is out.





Meanwhile, nice cover by Annalisa.





 
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Spukc

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Yeah I mean, it's up to the company and the game makers/creators to decide how much they will show when marketing their game leading up to its ultimate release.
Whether it's Terminator 2 or Metal Gear Solid 2, I don't think it's a reason to feel mad and infuriated by the plot rope-a-dope. Although I was too young to visit the theaters back in the Terminator 2 days to catch a glimpse of its promo-trailer, I surely remember Kojima's plot rope-a-dope with the MGS2 trailers.
In this day and age of ours, with games and films coming out in spades, it's all about selling a mentionable, noteworthy, praiseworthy, and memorable experience, you need to stand out from the crowd - and the competition is outrageously fierce.
If you unveil everything in the trailers, you take away from the experience based on the surprise factor of the gamer-player-viewer.
It's all about the experience, and the surprise factor is a crucial part of it, without a doubt. Remember how much From Software president Hidetaka Miyazaki fusses over the experience of the players.




All in all, there's nothing bad in doing plot rope-a-dopes in your trailers, before the game is out.





Meanwhile, nice cover.



so stron g
 

Vaelka

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The Yahtzee review really summarized my thoughts on the game too and I like how he actually brings up that characters being sad and getting hurt a lot doesn't make them deep... I am so tired of that in AAA games especially devs and sadly a lot of players seem to think that just because a game is torture porn it makes it deep.
 

bhunachicken

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I strongly suspect we'll see one final entry in the series at the end of the PS5's gen, just to round things off.
 

laser_printer

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I think Neil means that he won't do another one unless he feels that he can take the story where he wants it to go. I hope there is another one but I really hope they don't sell out and try to make a safe crowd pleaser. I hope we don't get an apology game to try and please the people who hated TLOU2. Many also loved and cater to them or better yet make what they want to make.
I agree, but you know to save this franchise they're going to make a TLOU based around the time jump before Ellie in the original game. It'll please the crowd, the haters will rejoice that "Naughty dog saw the light! g0 w0k3 go brok3!!" and they got their video game Dad simulator back.

I personally thought the way the game was handled you either got what they were going for and enjoyed it or didn't. The out of context or outright fake spoilers really painted the game in a strange light and once it was confirmed the spoilers I read were fake I went in and enjoyed the experience from start to finish and thought it was one of the best games in a story since Silent Hill 2.
 

Justin9mm

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I know this won't be a popular opinion but I (think?) I'm nearing the final bit of the game and so far I'm enjoying the story. I like how they did a tale of revenge from two perspectives. I also like that you don't get the impression that one is more justifiable than the other. Both have reasons for their revenge that are relatable. Some of it comes off hamfisted but I get the vibe Naughty Dog is going for and I appreciate it.

I also like how the game starts off with you obviously detesting Abby for killing Joel. Immediately you have it in your head that she is the antagonist, yet as the story goes on and it shows her "human" side you see that she is just like anyone else trying to survive and she has a motivation for her actions that are relatable. She gets angry, laughs, sad etc. She isnt just a one dimensional character.
The level of hate the game received was not justifiable, the review bombing etc. I was ashamed to be a gamer it was that bad.

Everyone has the right to not like the game but the amount of uproar was fucking ridiculous.

I personally thought things in the story could of been done better such as Joel's death(was not that well thought out imo) but I still loved the game. I finished it within the first 2 weeks of release. I will do a 2nd play through once it gets a PS5 upgrade/patch.
 
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Woggleman

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People have the right to their opinion and even though I love it I have seen intelligent arguments from those who don't. That being said some of the vitriol was just absurd. As much as some people claim to hate wokeness they acted very much like a woke cancel mob.
 

Aggelos

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The world of "The Last of Us Part 2" is not enough for Ellie, so she thought she might venture out in the dangerous streets of Raccoon City and try her hand there, into the bargain