Support NeoGAF

[Oddspeak]

Jesus, some people really have rose-tinted goggles bolted to their skulls. The original Demon's Souls already had a bunch of by-the-books enemy designs that looked as if they belonged in a He-Man cartoon, and people even shit on the game for it back in 2009, and a washed-out color palette didn't hide that.

I like the OG game's atmosphere a lot, yes, but let a remake be a remake and try to do some shit different.

 

[Rheon]

I agree with OP.

The game is undoubtedly beautiful, but you know you've done something wrong when Mortal Shell evokes more of that Souls mood than your Souls game.

 

[GHG]

Watch this:



Most of the areas shown are actually darker than the original.

 

[Lethal01]

To me it looks so much better to the point they made me consider playing it and I'm not even a Souls fan at all.

I think it looks great.
I just think it would look a lot better if the tried harder to capture the more, bleak tone of the original.

 

[hussar16]

Jesus, some people really have rose-tinted goggles bolted to their skulls. The original Demon's Souls already had a bunch of by-the-books enemy designs that looked as if they belonged in a He-Man cartoon, and people even shit on the game for it back in 2009, and a washed-out color palette didn't hide that.

I like the OG game's atmosphere a lot, yes, but let a remake be a remake and try to do some shit different.

washed out colors is an art style and many prefer it in these games since it gives a mood to it.these games have gotten rid of any mood and look generic now just like shadow of collosus

 

[Dr_Salt]

I like the art directon in the original better. New trailer looks too bright and some of the monster redesigns seem to be taken straight out of Doom Eternal. Maybe it will look better in motion with proper gameplay.

 

[Lethal01]

Do you want a remake or a remaster?

You can get a remake that captures the tons of the original while still making it have far better fidelity and implementing original ideas.
They just didn't make a point to capture the tone.

 

[JLB]

They're not that kind of studio and likely don't have the personell for such a task. Remaking a game is orders of magnitude easier than making your own game.

Maybe im wrong, but i guess these remakes are actually new games from the scratch. I dont think they are using any source code or asset from original title.

 

[Lethal01]

Bluepoint has a better track record. They just came off a near perfect Remake of Shadow of the Colossus. It will be glorious.

Yes, people on the Internet will complain about anything. It will get zeros on Metacritic user scores. It is a Remake and an exclusive.

The shadow of the cololsus remake has the same issues as this remake.
Graphically and artistically great. but feels like it's almost trying to avoid the tone and atmosphere that made the original great.

 

[T_LVPL]

I think this hot take is really funny. When Demon's Souls released back in 2009, it got a lot of flak initially for its graphics, with a lot of people criticizing it for having a "bland and generic fantasy setting".

Yeah i remember that. Height of the console war and it was a PS3 exclusive pinpointed by xbox fans for having rubbish graphics. while the game does look a bit funny the first time you see it, especially the floaty way the characters move, once you play it for 10 hours or so it’s a beautiful game easily one of the best of that generation.

 

[ACESHIGH]

I'll give them the benefit of the doubt as it is too early yet. But yeah… I played Demons Souls for the first time this year on RPCS3 and I think it still looks great. The atmosphere is amazing, very oppresive, hazy, glowy... And to this day its the Souls game with the best fog gates. My worries is that Demon's Souls is a masterclass in level design and enemy encounters. So changing enemy placement and layouts would basically break the game. 1 - 1 is the perfect Souls tutorial level for example.

 

[stranno]

The environments and the main character look great. The monsters are far less disturbing and they look straight out of Doom 2016 or Eternal.

Still, I have not seen anything as outrageous as this

Anyway, never played the original Demon's Souls so I'm looking forward to this.

Yeah, Wander's face looks terrible in the remake. It is my only complain about it.

 

[Velius]

My issue isn't with the environment but the enemy/boss redesigns. This honestly looks like a design I would see Blizzard game or Darksiders.

Jesus fucking christ I forgot how bad they fucked up the Butcher.
Also the fact that he's called "the butcher" in the game.

Seriously fuck Blizzard. The people in Tristram called him the butcher because he fucking chopped people up, not because that was his name. He didn't HAVE a name. It simply was. In Diablo III that stupid butterfly comes and says "Hey look it's The Butcher (TM)!"

 

[Larxia]

I agree. I mean I wouldn't say it looks "terrible", but when I saw the trailer, I immediatly didn't like it.
The game looks more detailed and all, but it looks a bit... generic maybe, more cartoony, there's something off about it to the point where it makes me think of these other games that try to be "souls-like", like Lords of the fallen or stuff like that, rather than an actual, official Souls game.

 

[Cliff Underside]

I agree. I mean I wouldn't say it looks "terrible", but when I saw the trailer, I immediatly didn't like it.
The game looks more detailed and all, but it looks a bit... generic maybe, more cartoony, there's something off about it to the point where it makes me think of these other games that try to be "souls-like", like Lords of the fallen or stuff like that, rather than an actual, official Souls game.

Yeah, I shouldn't have used the word terrible, that was me being a reactionary; I wouldn't hate it as much as I do if I didn't love the OG Demon's Souls so much. Bland would've been a better word. But what you said more or less sums up my feelings for the remake. Lords of the Fallen is another perfect example of a game with an art style that tries to be hardcore but just ends up looking ridiculously overdesigned. By comparison the enemy design in Demon's Souls could be called plain, but the tone is conveyed so well through the art style that you can actually take them seriously as a threat.

 

[HarryKS]

Stop being a weaboo. Seriously.

 

[Mr Hyde]

Yeah i remember that. Height of the console war and it was a PS3 exclusive pinpointed by xbox fans for having rubbish graphics. while the game does look a bit funny the first time you see it, especially the floaty way the characters move, once you play it for 10 hours or so it’s a beautiful game easily one of the best of that generation.

Yeah, it wasn't exactly a game to show off if you wanted to look at impressive graphics. I fully understand why most people rejected Demon's Souls in the beginning. Everything was Uncharted and Gears, high fidelity bombastic action, and suddenly some obscure japanese company takes a stab at western fantasy, a setting which wasn't exactly popular during that time, and with a slow and methodical approach to gameplay.

And not only that, the game didn't give a fuck about explaining shit and steamrolled newcomers and veterans alike with difficult bosses and enemies without ever apologizing once. Not exactly a recipe for success. But alas, here we are 11 years later and the game is still alive and kicking, more relevant than ever.

 

[Danjin44]

Stop being a weaboo. Seriously.

What "weaboo" has anything to do with this?

 

[Phase]

Yeah they can get as detailed as they want, but I hate when art style is changed in remakes. The atmosphere of Demon's Souls is one of a kind and it already looks as if the remake has neglected to retain that uniqueness.

I hope I'm wrong and exaggerating, but I've seen enough examples to know this is a real possibility.

 

[Belmonte]

I think the new art is very good and I'm excited to play it again. But it obviously changed the tone. Boletaria wasn't only dark and violent. There was a limbo-like atmosphere, ghostly, it felt almost like it wasn't a real place. The greens and grays felt unnatural. It doesn't matter if it was hardware limitations, art design or another reason.

 

[Esppiral]

Most of the demons soul remake looked like CGI to me.

 

[Belmonte]

Yeah, it wasn't exactly a game to show off if you wanted to look at impressive graphics. I fully understand why most people rejected Demon's Souls in the beginning. Everything was Uncharted and Gears, high fidelity bombastic action, and suddenly some obscure japanese company takes a stab at western fantasy, a setting which wasn't exactly popular during that time, and with a slow and methodical approach to gameplay.

And not only that, the game didn't give a fuck about explaining shit and steamrolled newcomers and veterans alike with difficult bosses and enemies without ever apologizing once. Not exactly a recipe for success. But alas, here we are 11 years later and the game is still alive and kicking, more relevant than ever.

It was a gaming miracle. The greatest I ever saw in gaming.

When everyone wanted to be a Gears or COD clone, when the japanese industry was confused. Demon's Souls came from nowhere and proved you could make deep and challenging action RPGs. The game wasn't even released in the west, they didn't planned to do it, even high executives from Sony thought it was garbage but players start importing from the east and convinced them to publish here.

 

[GhostOfTsu]

We've heard it all before, anytime they remake a movie/game we have all the "purists" that come out saying "they don't get it!!!" So damn cliche.

I played Demons Souls after finishing Bloodborne and it was such a downgrade. A frustrating mess of a game. The remake looks incredible and next gen.

 

[Yoboman]

washed out colors is an art style and many prefer it in these games since it gives a mood to it.these games have gotten rid of any mood and look generic now just like shadow of collosus

Fuck calling making every texture brown and grey an art style

Thank God that generation is over

 

[BlitzerRadic]

I think some of you need to go back and play Demon's Souls to remember how bad the environments look. What we've seen in the trailer looks so much better.

In the trailer there's a few scenes of world 4 and it actually feels ominous. Stormking doesn't look like a freaking manta ray flying in the sky now.

Since this is a remake, I really hope it goes beyond just the visuals. I know a lot of people love Demon's Souls, and I played it to death, but my nostalgia goggles aren't strong enough to overlook all the jankiness from the original.

 

[bumleforce]

The ps3 version fps was so bad I couldn't play it. I love all the other FROM games so whenever I get a ps5 this is the first game I will buy

 

[Red Rackham's Revenge]

I know what you mean when you say plasticky. There's something about some textures in some games this last gen that gives them a rubbery appearance. But there's also something about the dimensions in some character models that gives them a kind of cartoony appearance. I felt similarly with the gameplay footage for Diablo IV.

I don't know what it is exactly, but it's definitely noticeable.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

Platinumed the PS3 version, will Platinum this.

 

[diffusionx]

I think it looked great, but this really speaks to a basic problem with these remakes. When people ask for one, they have an idea of what they want in their heads. It's inevitable the remake will not match that.

I personally thought BP did a great job with SOTC but I totally get why people would not have been happy with what they did. But you can't make everyone happy.

 

[UnravelKatharsis]

There's a lot of people who prefer seeing new world's, new gameplay mechanics etc.

It's like being more interested in a brand new vehicle being made by Tesla rather than a paint shop down the street.

Paint doesn't excite a lot of people.

This isnt Tesla. This is a company that does resto-mods. I understand the complaint to a degree if it's from a big original IP creating dev. Bluepoint is not this dev.

If you want a new Tesla, you go to Tesla. You dont go to the paint shop.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

No

 

[DragoonWalker]

Nothing that can be done. Bluepoint is western studio with own sensibilities, remaking Japanese game with western setting. Something bound to be lost.

Some people mock you because all they see is obvious technical upgrade without being able to distinguish fine grain visual changes in artstyle/atmosphere. Don't have the eye. For lots of folks looking good in a broader sense is impressive enough, what's to complain about? But don't worry, I understand what you mean. Wouldn't go as far as Warcraft tho. Less drastic change than SoTC.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Nothing that can be done. Bluepoint is western studio with own sensibilities, remaking Japanese game with western setting. Something bound to be lost.

Some people mock you because all they see is obvious technical upgrade without being able to distinguish fine grain visual changes in artstyle/atmosphere. Don't have the eye. For lots of folks looking good in a broader sense is impressive enough, what's to complain about? But don't worry, I understand what you mean. Wouldn't go as far as Warcraft tho. Less drastic change than SoTC.

People can notice the changes and have “the eye for it,” and still not be bothered by them.

 

[O-N-E]

I posted this in another thread, but it seems more appropriate here:

Japanese games generally speaking have 3D models with more angles / straight edges than in the West, which favours more curves, rounded edges and chunk. Overall the shape language is more simple in Japanese games. It might be subtle to some people, but it's really obvious to me. I'm not into the change in the way they're approaching the model designs.

Also the environments... For some reason they decided to add overgrowth to everything? Some places were meant to look stark, without any greenery. They should've kept to the original DNA of the design.

Hopefully, they didn't get rid of that initial fluted armour set. It's iconic and looks awesome. No deal without that set.

 

[existensmaximum]

I totally agree OP. The design of the bosses and enemies shown in this trailer looks like trash. Too.. cartoonish? Warcraft was a good comparison, like.. really cheap. Not that I loved the original graphics or anything but.. this? Just weird.

 

[triplestation]

i gotta agree

with this kind of game i think less is WAY more

i think the monsters are overdesigned

less design with more heft in terms of animation inspired from real world creatures would do wonders

 

[ethomaz]

Looks so much better.

 

[brenobnfm]

Looks like something straight out of Diablo 3.

 

[DragoonWalker]

People can notice the changes and have “the eye for it,” and still not be bothered by them.

You might, but not everybody. But either way there's been a clear change in art direction whether you can see it/mind it or not.

 

[DeepEnigma]

You might, but not everybody. But either way there's been a clear change in art direction whether you can see it/mind it or not.

Of course there’s been a change, and I’m sure almost everybody can see it. You would have to be cognitively blind not to. I think it just comes down to people being bothered and not bothered by it at the end of the day.

I fall in the not bothered camp, because I have two versions of the original that I can still play. They didn’t go away. At the same time I can see why some would be as well.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

The original’s looked terrible too
I loved the game and its atmosphere, but let’s not suddenly get blind to the bloom and gloom that DeS shared with so many titles of the time.

It worked, of course. It was perfect for the game, and I understand what you’re saying, OP. I’m not fully comvinced, either. But we must accept that there’s never going to be a remaster that’s just the original game but perfectly upscaled, or “just as the developers intended”. There’s emulators if you want the first, and the second is just blurb. Hand-drawn is not what the devs intended when they were using low-rez sprites, and DeS remastered isn’t what the devs intended when they made the PS3 game. It’s a different vision. Take it or leave it - and by all means, bitch about it!

 

[Gormless Noodle]

They're not picking up on the subtleties of the level designs in the original DeS. The Tower Knight area in particular looks like a church now, that's not what that was there for though. The vegetation in some of those screens don't make any sense but in general, everything I've seen from this just screams that they don't seem to get it or are just doing it for the spectacle.

But those are the bells and whistles, the real question is if the gameplay survives. And that in particular has to survive 1 to 1. You start changing level layouts, enemy placements, attack timing etc and the entire fucking thing is going to crash and burn.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

To each their own I guess. I thought it looked amazing.

 

[Raonak]

OG demons was not a looker. It had the early PS3 gen look of overly brown and bloom overload.

A 1:1 remake is a bit of a waste of resources. Imo.

I'd like them to add and tweak stuff. Give us a 6th Archstone, give us more weapons, give us more magic, tweak level layouts to fuck with our expectations.

The original still exists. Let the remake feel like a remake rather than a remaster.

 

[Rean no Kiseki]

They're not picking up on the subtleties of the level designs in the original DeS. The Tower Knight area in particular looks like a church now, that's not what that was there for though. The vegetation in some of those screens don't make any sense but in general, everything I've seen from this just screams that they don't seem to get it or are just doing it for the spectacle.

But those are the bells and whistles, the real question is if the gameplay survives. And that in particular has to survive 1 to 1. You start changing level layouts, enemy placements, attack timing etc and the entire fucking thing is going to crash and burn.

Not "subtleties" but "limitations", From Software isn't some ace developer who can squeez every last remaning drip of power juice out of a console, in fact their technical expertise is very lacking (see DaS PC port).

If they had the know how and technical mastery that BP has + the power of next gen they would've done the same.

Anyhow the original is still there to play, it's why this is a remake NOT a remaster/HD mod.

I would've loved to see RE1 fanboys argumantS when Mikami changed RE1's art style/direction.

 

[cormack12]

Watch this:

Most of the areas shown are actually darker than the original.

Atmospherically the art is astounding. But these are screenshots so I'm still 50-50 on whether that's how it will look after Unity/Watch Dogs etc. But yeah, taking them at face value the world looks fucking immense. But the enemy design seems a bit more traditional. Like Diablo etc that people have mentioned. They look more like trash mobs whereas the original skeletons look more menacing but we'll see

 

[Gormless Noodle]

Not "subtleties" but "limitations", From Software isn't some ace developer who can squeez every last remaning drip of power juice out of a console, in fact their technical expertise is very lacking (see DaS PC port).

If they had the know how and technical mastery that BP has + the power of next gen they would've done the same.

Anyhow the original is still there to play, it's why this is a remake NOT a remaster/HD mod.

I would've loved to see RE1 fanboys argumantS when Mikami changed RE1's art style/direction.

Yes subtleties. What I was talking about with the tower knight for example is that they turned what was clearly a guard station, with windows for firing arrows through, into a church. Vegetation in areas that are not supposed to be abandoned etc, this isn't Dark Souls, it's Demon's Souls. These are changes on a more fundamental level than simply art style.

And that "teh origiminal is still here gaaais" is as much of a weak minded cop out argument as it was with FF7 and anything else. And that actually goes past the fact that the original, due to the servers having shut down, is actually NOT 100% still there.

 

[Ar¢tos]

Oh gamers.... The insatiable whores of the XXI century.
No matter how much you give it to them, they are never fully satisfied.

-"I want a remake!"
Here's a remake
-"I don't like it" "too pretty! The original was darker"

-"I want a remaster!"
Here's a remaster
-"I don't like it" "higher res takes away from the original"

- "I want a powerful console"
Here's a powerful console
- "I don't like that color, not gonna buy it until you make it glow in the dark pink"

- "I want an ultra detailed game full of visual effects"
Here's the game you asked
-"I don't like it! That enemy belt buckle should be 2 shades darker"

 

[Balducci30]

It looks like dark souls to me? Is that bad?

 

[yurqqa]

I think Bluepoint could simply add an option of alternative color grading akin to the options in Uncharted.

That would bring the visuals closer to the original for people who want it this way.

Options are good.