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The Ampere 3090 36 tflop beast...is only 10% faster than the 3080

nani17

are in a big trouble
Well I agree, the 10GB 3080 is slightly gimped, would not touch it and wait for 20GB or even 3070 Ti 16GB which was already spotted.


You've dodged a bullet there mate!

I know I've been so excited for months and months doing OT in work to put money aside and all I get is a shitty 10%
 
We should be asking, how come a 36tflop card that has (according to Nvidia marketing slides) 1.9X performance per watt increase over Turing is in reality only 45% faster than the 13 tflop 2080 Ti whilst drawing 40% more power on top :messenger_sunglasses:

It's not 36TFLOPS "according to Nvidia marketing slides" (implying you don't believe it's true)

It's 36 TFLOPS calculated in "exactly the same way that TFLOPS are calculated for Turing and RDNA2 and Xboxs and Playstations"
 
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Diminishing returns?
Yes and also segmentation.
In ideal circumstances the 3090 can be at most 20% faster than a 3080, because it has 20% more Vector ALUs (FP32 Cuda Cores), TMUs etc.
In real circumstances it won't because of scaling at high shader counts.
 
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tillbot8

Banned
Yes and also segmentation.
In ideal circumstances the 3090 can be at most 20% faster than a 3080, because it has 20% more Vector ALUs (FP32 Cuda Cores), TMUs etc.
In real circumstances it won't because of scaling at high shader counts.
Sooooooo the smart money is on a 3080 then?
 

Rikkori

Member
We'll see what AMD can do in a month, I'm mildly optimistic. Though at this point I don't even care, I hate waiting another month but I'm exasperated thinking I won't get one before Cyberpunk. Green or Red, I don't care anymore! Just make the f00kin stock available holmes!
 
Yeah. A lot of us have already known Nvidias new teraflop metrics are pointless.

Wouldn’t be surprised if series x was just as, or only a little behind the 3070.
 
I mean, if you go just by the tech specifications, the 3090 can only be 20% faster than the 3080 in the best case scenario.

And guess what, in applications like Blender, OctaneRender and DaVinci it gets somewhat close to that 20%. Performing as expected.
 

TonyK

Member
I'm technically curious (I have a 1080ti), why more Tflops doesn't translate in proportionately better framerates? What do Tflops mean then? Do they have real value to measure power?
 

thelastword

Banned
It's crazy, but after Jensen gave his speech in his kitchen. People were hyped beyond belief, the green Giants said this announcement buried AMD and they will only have a card to compete with the 2080ti, not even 3070 class, so far less the 3080 with its 30tf and the 8k gaming beast, the 36tf card with 24gb was just going to be several generations ahead of AMD and be the ultimate gaming card to ever surface.

I told folk, open your eyes, the Teraflops are blown up beyond performance returns, it's a marketing gimmick, I told folk if you don't believe me, just observe how Nvidia wants to promote this card as 8k, when that only means a 1080p footprint in real time. Yet here it is at only 10% better over 3080 at 4k.

Folks are pretending the 3090 was not marketed as a gaming card, when Nvidia called it the ultimate gaming gpu, the bfgpu, the 8k gaming gpu. The green toy soldiers were expecting a huge uptick over the 3080, they were expecting mammoth numbers over the 2080ti. Some said Ampere would have 2x RTX performance over TURING. The lie detector proved that was a lie..

If 3090 gave a 30-40% increase over the 3080 like they were expecting no one would have amnesia that the 3090 was marketed as a gaming card. There would be lots of chest beating and even more AMD doom and they won't even dream of something competitive with Nvidia. All I have to say on this is..... Stop the hypocrisy. The 3090 is not called a Titan, the 3080S has 20gb of vram and will be a gaming card, suddenly, production gpus are 21 gb and up. That extra 4gb is no gaming bueno....The hypocrisy is way too palpable.
 

Krisprolls

Banned
All that fuss about consoles being already outdated, and all we get in real world is 10 % over the 3080. But hey it's ok, Nvidia marketing worked, the whales already bought the card. 40 virtual Tflops.
 

Revas

Member
Wait, you think AMD actually has a shot at beating the 3080 or even 3090?! Lol, they barely threw blows with the 2070S. There's still the 2080, 2080Ti, and RTX titan (just to throw in there). I'm pretty sure AMD would be shouting from The mountaintops about their new GPU, if it could even compete with Nvidia. Silence speaks more than words.

80 CU RDNA2 almost has to be competitive with the 3080 - regardless as to how much AMD is talking about it or not.
 
80 CU RDNA2 almost has to be competitive with the 3080 - regardless as to how much AMD is talking about it or not.
Even if it does ( Big if ), there's a near zero percent chance it will have raytracing performance anywhere close and no response to DLSS 2.0 in sight.

There's a big question on the table of how well more CUs will scale. Double the CUs of the 5700XT is not likely to equal double the performance.

Are you expecting a 3080 competitor from AMD at $499? Nvidia will just adjust their prices accordingly anyway.

I would be very very happy to see AMD compete on the high end again, but I have my doubts.
 
I'm looking forward to the Steam Hardware Survey results in a year's time when the 3090 alone has outsold AMD's entire RDNA2 lineup. Should be fun.

Even if it does ( Big if ), there's a near zero percent chance it will have raytracing performance anywhere close and no response to DLSS 2.0 in sight.

There's a big question on the table of how well more CUs will scale. Double the CUs of the 5700XT is not likely to equal double the performance.

Are you expecting a 3080 competitor from AMD at $499? Nvidia will just adjust their prices accordingly anyway.

I would be very very happy to see AMD compete on the high end again, but I have my doubts.
AMD actually needs to and wants to make money too. They will not release a 3080 competitor at half the price of the 3080 when they could release it for $50 or $100 less to undercut slightly and optimize their own profits. Anyone who thinks any for-profit corporation prioritizes anything other than profits is fucking retarded.
 
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llien

Member
Tell me where and how Fidelity FX is better than DLSS 2.0??
Amazing reading comprehension skills.

slightly better than ...native
Oh please..

also can introduce artifacts and grain.
Yeah, as any upscaling (whatever we call it) does.

And, again, completely missing how DLSS 1 was the real AI upscaling with per game trained neural network, which could bring amazing results, at least in theory, except it didn't quite work. (on top of the whole process being helluva expensive datacenter exercise)
 
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All that fuss about consoles being already outdated, and all we get in real world is 10 % over the 3080. But hey it's ok, Nvidia marketing worked, the whales already bought the card. 40 virtual Tflops.

Yep, the XSX/PS5 are around a 3070 seeing as another leaked slide showed Nvidia putting the 3070 under the 2080 Ti in performance. Next gen consoles just 2 tiers below Nvidia's $1400 disappointment.

I'm looking forward to the Steam Hardware Survey results in a year's time when the 3090 alone has outsold AMD's entire RDNA2 lineup. Should be fun.

Not a chance in hell. RDNA2 is not RDNA1, it's a full stack release (eventually).




Everything you say, and the reason you say it, is just so painfully transparent /facepalm

You sound slightly upset in this thread. Did you preorder an Ampere?
What he says is true. The hype that Jensen unveil created was insane to the point people lost all grasp of reality and came out with sensational claims about Nvidia's performance and features comparative to AMD. The casuals got totally suckered in, in unprecedented numbers too, which set this launch apart from any I can remember.

To be fair, I expected much more, but when I learned they were using Samsung 8nm, and read some credible leaks, I knew the reality of Ampere was very disappointing indeed.

- Huge power draw
- tiny performance per watt gains (8-15%, not 1.9X)
- zero appreciable overclocking headroom
- 'Halo' model only 10% faster than flagship
- Small RT performance bump
- Gimped memory capacity on 3080
 
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Reallink

Member
AMD's largest 80CU card will likely perform somewhere between the 3070 and 3080 and will be priced accordingly (i.e. $599). It'll sell like dog shit cause Nvidia will launch the 3060, 3070Ti, and 20GB 3080 alongside it.
 
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You can't be serious.

The PS5 will definitely not perform as well as a 3070. You imagine the consoles to be far more powerful than they actually will be.



Another deceitful move from Ampere unveil was that the 3070 is *faster than the 2080 Ti. It will not be, as this leaked AIB shot shows.

The consoles are around the same level when you consider the heavy customizations to architecture.
 

Sentenza

Member
Another deceitful move from Ampere unveil was that the 3070 is *faster than the 2080 Ti. It will not be, as this leaked AIB shot shows.

The consoles are around the same level when you consider the heavy customizations to architecture.
You are delusional. A 3060 will still run circles around both consoles.

Feeling good with my 3080 right now lol
I would feel great as well if I actually managed to get one.
 
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Armorian

Banned
The point was, 36 tflops is misleading. This thing is 'only' 45% (best case) faster than the 13tflop 2080 Ti.

As I said, XSX/PS5 are around 3070 level already.

LOL, 3070 may not be as fast as 2080ti in some game/scenarios but it will still be much faster than 2070 and 2080 - cards that ARE on PS5 and XSX level.

You would feel 10% better with 3090.

And with more than 2x less money.
 
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You are delusional. A 3060 will still run circles around both consoles.


I would feel great as well if I actually managed to get one.

In raw performance terms: no.

In real-world performance terms: no.

You've got Windows and the general lack of efficiency from having totally disparate components to blame for lower performance comparatively. Anyway console talk is getting off topic. Take PC vs Console insecurities elsewhere please.
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
It's crazy, but after Jensen gave his speech in his kitchen. People were hyped beyond belief, the green Giants said this announcement buried AMD and they will only have a card to compete with the 2080ti, not even 3070 class, so far less the 3080 with its 30tf and the 8k gaming beast, the 36tf card with 24gb was just going to be several generations ahead of AMD and be the ultimate gaming card to ever surface.

I told folk, open your eyes, the Teraflops are blown up beyond performance returns, it's a marketing gimmick, I told folk if you don't believe me, just observe how Nvidia wants to promote this card as 8k, when that only means a 1080p footprint in real time. Yet here it is at only 10% better over 3080 at 4k.

Folks are pretending the 3090 was not marketed as a gaming card, when Nvidia called it the ultimate gaming gpu, the bfgpu, the 8k gaming gpu. The green toy soldiers were expecting a huge uptick over the 3080, they were expecting mammoth numbers over the 2080ti. Some said Ampere would have 2x RTX performance over TURING. The lie detector proved that was a lie..

If 3090 gave a 30-40% increase over the 3080 like they were expecting no one would have amnesia that the 3090 was marketed as a gaming card. There would be lots of chest beating and even more AMD doom and they won't even dream of something competitive with Nvidia. All I have to say on this is..... Stop the hypocrisy. The 3090 is not called a Titan, the 3080S has 20gb of vram and will be a gaming card, suddenly, production gpus are 21 gb and up. That extra 4gb is no gaming bueno....The hypocrisy is way too palpable.
"They"? Again, who is "they"? The misled people probably aren't the target audience, because the target audience knows how to digest numbers.



Everyone waiting in line for the 3090 here knew exactly what they were getting. Perhaps the ones who don't understand are the people who purposefully misunderstand because that's the only way they can push some kind of narrative. The ones who aren't buying these cards anyway.
 
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RaySoft

Member
isnt this more down to games, drivers and engines not being able to make use of the power and the cpu other parts causing bottle necks?
No, it's just that no games uses all those extra ALU's.
It's like what Cerny said, it's hard to have enough work to feed all those ALU's to keep them active. They are just dead weight otherwise.
This is why going by flops alone is kinda useless.
 

GymWolf

Member
Power levels are bullshit
Tell that to vegeta if you have to courage...

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