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Shenmue III |OT| The Dream is Real

Shenmue 1 and 2's combat is based on Virtua Fighter 2 engine, and Virtua Fighter is Sega property so... yeah, not gonna reuse that, sorry everyone.

I'm playing Shenmue 3 right now (i'm currently getting my ass handed to me by 2 thugs) and I think the combat system is... pretty deep?
I mean, from what I gathered until now:
  • button mashing is a no-go. Works only if you spend a big abount of time at the dojo (to over-level any opponent), which is a valid strategy anyway
  • Choosing the wrong move, or the right move at the wrong moment, opens you to a devastating counter
  • Dodge is preferable to parry, as you can avoid all damage
  • Like with attack, defending requires great timing. Dodge at the wrong moment, and all your chakras will be opened with a crowbar. Do it right, and you'll hear an audio-hint (like a loud "swoosh!" sound), suggesting you can go all-out
  • Maybe even parrying with the right timing does something? I have to try that more
  • Enemies telegraph many of their attacks, so you know when to prepare
  • Learn which different combos can knock down opponents (useful with many enemies)
  • Always wait for an opening
This is actually great I think.
BUT...
...it's partially ruined by a single mistake: the lack of feedback, especially when enemies hit you.

If enemies parry, your attacks are ineffective but it's not easy to notice. When they hit you, they deplete your life bar but it's not easy to notice.
Everything is a little too floaty. That's the only sin of the combat system I've found for now. It's a single mistake, but a big one.
Still, it gets many things right, and I want to get deeper with it.
That's what I'm talking about, Yu Suzuki created both VF and Shenmue, but since the rights belong to the company he can't use them to build the sequel. But aside from my frustration with modern property law, I'm not saying the combat system is poorly designed, I'm saying it's poorly executed. Not because they lacked talent, mind you, but they simply didn't have the resources to execute it properly. It may well be mechanically deep, but it's kinda wasted when the hit reactions are barely noticeable, or the ragdolls just collapse without any force behind them.
 

Miles708

Member
Please no spoilers, but: is there a bad ending in Shenmue III too?

Currently I'm still in Bailu and I've just beaten the
2 thugs, and having my ass kicked from the 3rd one in the cutscene. Now I must find the hiding person written in the list
.
I ask because i know people finished the game in March. Now I'm at 1st april and I still have to see all of the first area.
Is there a lot of story left in Bailu? I'm worried about the bad ending :messenger_grinning_smiling: Do i need to speed up a bit?
 
Please no spoilers, but: is there a bad ending in Shenmue III too?

Currently I'm still in Bailu and I've just beaten the
2 thugs, and having my ass kicked from the 3rd one in the cutscene. Now I must find the hiding person written in the list
.
I ask because i know people finished the game in March. Now I'm at 1st april and I still have to see all of the first area.
Is there a lot of story left in Bailu? I'm worried about the bad ending :messenger_grinning_smiling: Do i need to speed up a bit?
Someone said at shenmuedojo forums it's around July?
 

wvnative

Member
How long do i got left?

Getting ready to learn a new technique from that fisherman Martial Arts Master
 

Pidull

Member
I don't understand the battle system for this, and coming straight from Shenmue 1&2 it's frustrating. I need to figure it out.
 

RAIDEN1

Member
The dream maybe real, but clearly the dream ain't all that, near 20 years in the making, and going by the reviews, it is not even as good as part-1 and 2...plus with this entry not being under Sega's wing means that any of the arcade classics didn't come over...its just not the same..for all the money raised, it should have been close to Yakuza levels in terms of combat mechanics, less stilted dialogue, animation...a story that doesn't really go anywhere dramatic...
 

Keihart

Member
That's what I'm talking about, Yu Suzuki created both VF and Shenmue, but since the rights belong to the company he can't use them to build the sequel. But aside from my frustration with modern property law, I'm not saying the combat system is poorly designed, I'm saying it's poorly executed. Not because they lacked talent, mind you, but they simply didn't have the resources to execute it properly. It may well be mechanically deep, but it's kinda wasted when the hit reactions are barely noticeable, or the ragdolls just collapse without any force behind them.
The inputs for specifics moves are garbage tho, and that's design.
pressing 3 or 4 buttons, that have their own animations but those animations can't start because they have to wait a reasonable time for those other button presses? i think the "new" system is pretty trash, animations are a step back but the system itself falls short.

I like everything else, but the combat system i can't justify, most of the design choices are questionable.

The dream maybe real, but clearly the dream ain't all that, near 20 years in the making, and going by the reviews, it is not even as good as part-1 and 2...plus with this entry not being under Sega's wing means that any of the arcade classics didn't come over...its just not the same..for all the money raised, it should have been close to Yakuza levels in terms of combat mechanics, less stilted dialogue, animation...a story that doesn't really go anywhere dramatic...

The first PS2 Yakuza game had like a 20 Million USD budget, i doubt the new ones are any less, how in the world can Yu's team compete in production value?
 
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Pidull

Member
A little deeper into this game now, and it is quickly becoming a favorite.

There are quality of life features that need to be addressed, I hate that I can't skip dialogue like prior games (I am a reader not a listener), and some things like playing lucky hit take way too long to do repeat attempts. There are enough elements of Shenmue that more time wasters are a bad thing.

Regardless, I am now playing this game similar to how I played the previous games. I wake up, I train my martial arts for a little bit, and then I head into town to gamble or follow leads. I don't usually fast travel, I just take my time.

The relationship between Ryo and Shenhua is really driving me in this game, even if dialogue is repeated I love how they interact together. That dialogue tree when she asks Ryo if he is afraid of his father sealed the deal for me (I said no). I am in love with their whole relationship and it might just be the most endearing relationship I've seen in gaming, if not every form of media. Hopefully it stays that way.
 

Yoda

Member
How long do i got left?

Getting ready to learn a new technique from that fisherman Martial Arts Master

95% through act 2, assuming you're actually on the cusp of learning the technique. If it's your first encounter with him I'd say 70%.
 

Miles708

Member
A little deeper into this game now, and it is quickly becoming a favorite.

There are quality of life features that need to be addressed, I hate that I can't skip dialogue like prior games (I am a reader not a listener), and some things like playing lucky hit take way too long to do repeat attempts. There are enough elements of Shenmue that more time wasters are a bad thing.

Regardless, I am now playing this game similar to how I played the previous games. I wake up, I train my martial arts for a little bit, and then I head into town to gamble or follow leads. I don't usually fast travel, I just take my time.

The relationship between Ryo and Shenhua is really driving me in this game, even if dialogue is repeated I love how they interact together. That dialogue tree when she asks Ryo if he is afraid of his father sealed the deal for me (I said no). I am in love with their whole relationship and it might just be the most endearing relationship I've seen in gaming, if not every form of media. Hopefully it stays that way.

I'm playing it extremely leisurely but I agree, the developing replationship between Ryo and Shenhua is a little wonderful gem to discover every night and every morning. Even the way she says goodbye to you when you leave in the morning changes over time, it's a 4-seconds cutscene but it means so much.

Also, the quality of the audio-mixing is seriously overlooked... all ambient sounds change based on your position and, crucially, the ambient volume is cranked up to 11 so you constantly hear the nature around you. Even with TV speakers, you can clearly feel engrossed by the hidden fauna you hear near a river.
Once it rained very heavily, everything was foggy (and beautiful in the early moring) and the LOUD sound of the rain basically covered every other sound, as everything got wet. As it stopped, hours later, the sky was strikingly blue.

This is beautiful.
 
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Kazza

Member
The relationship between Ryo and Shenhua is really driving me in this game, even if dialogue is repeated I love how they interact together. That dialogue tree when she asks Ryo if he is afraid of his father sealed the deal for me (I said no). I am in love with their whole relationship and it might just be the most endearing relationship I've seen in gaming, if not every form of media. Hopefully it stays that way.

I'm playing it extremely leisurely but I agree, the developing replationship between Ryo and Shenhua is a little wonderful gem to discover every night and every morning. Even the way she says goodbye to you when you leave in the morning changes over time, it's a 4-seconds cutscene but it means so much.

Did any of the big review sites even bother to mention the whole relationship aspect of the game? It's a massive oversight if they didn't, as it sounds like one of the most important parts of it. I wonder if it's possible to really mess up your relationship with her by constantly picking the "wrong" choices.
 

Pidull

Member
Did any of the big review sites even bother to mention the whole relationship aspect of the game? It's a massive oversight if they didn't, as it sounds like one of the most important parts of it. I wonder if it's possible to really mess up your relationship with her by constantly picking the "wrong" choices.
They were too busy blaming the game for being dated, or for looking a certain bad.

The graphics complaints confuse me the most, I am amazed by how gorgeous it is, and I loathed the initial reveal. Animations for walking are my biggest complaint.
 

Miles708

Member
Did any of the big review sites even bother to mention the whole relationship aspect of the game? It's a massive oversight if they didn't, as it sounds like one of the most important parts of it. I wonder if it's possible to really mess up your relationship with her by constantly picking the "wrong" choices.

I would think that, not being a central part of the story (so far at least... I'm still pretty early in the game), you can mostly just overlook this whole aspect. I'm fairly sure you could skip most of the dialogue with Shenhua just going through the story and doing the minimum amount of side content.

Reviewing a game like this in a useful timeframe is not easy, because Shenmue 3 (like 1 and 2) are slow-burning games that are better experienced calmly and with the right state of mind. Playing it to finish it as (reasonably) quickly as possible, to meet publishing deadlines, means losing at least 50% of the game.

Like some people already said in this thread, it's the journey more than the goal.
Shenmue III builds on top of this philosophy both its gameplay systems and character development: many times in the past (and I hope in Shenmue III too) you're tasked to do chores, jobs and "time wasting" activites repeatedly for many days, just to make Ryo (and the player) understand how much these little things matter.
The more you're laser-focused on your goal, the faster the rest of the world loses focus. As you begin to lose sight of the little things around you, your world becomes less beautiful and less surprising day by day.

I think the pacing of the game perfectly conveyes this way of thinking.
Slow life.
 
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Pidull

Member
Yowza, spent so much time in Bailu, only just moved on to the next area. This game is much larger than I expected, I am genuinely surprised at how massive it is. Ys Net knocked it out of the park!

Continue to be impressed by the graphics as well. I love the materials, so much shiny wood! Also a fan of the lens flares, in this generation it is something a little different that sets Shenmue 3 apart.

I'm not even disappointed about reused and sometimes rough animations at this point.
 

Miles708

Member
Yowza, spent so much time in Bailu, only just moved on to the next area. This game is much larger than I expected, I am genuinely surprised at how massive it is. Ys Net knocked it out of the park!

Continue to be impressed by the graphics as well. I love the materials, so much shiny wood! Also a fan of the lens flares, in this generation it is something a little different that sets Shenmue 3 apart.

I'm not even disappointed about reused and sometimes rough animations at this point.

What was the date, in your in-game calendar, when you got to the second area?
I want to do everything but i'm really starting to worry about the bad ending...
 
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Pidull

Member
What was the date, in your in-game calendar, when you got to the second area?
I want to do everything but i'm really starting to worry about the bad ending...
Late April I think, I don't have a specific date because I overwrote the save file. Bad ending isn't until July though.
 

Miles708

Member
I've noticed that I don't have the block bar during combat, is it because i choose the hard difficulty? Or is it patch related?
I'm currently playing on version 1.0 (PS4)
 

TaroYamada

Member
I posted this in the review thread but thought I'd post it in here for good measure, my impressions:

So two weeks ago I replayed Shenmue I and II on the HD compilation, in preparation for Shenmue III.

Thoughts on first two:
  • Shenmue 1 is the best in the series imo, the scale and intimacy of its world is phenomenal, QTEs aren't abused, the forklift section is fun.
  • Shenmue 2 is a bit of a stepdown, it nails the environments but they're not as intimate as Shenmue 1, the QTEs are a bit too heavily relied upon. Furthermore, it doesn't make a lot of sense that the forklift isn't available as an option for beating the money gates -- this leads to cheesing the gambling system.
  • Both games have absolutely phenomenal combat, with the main issue in both being camera control and ability to focus on enemies.
  • Great art direction, great graphics for its time and great music.
  • The way you learn moves and how that ties into the combat directional inputs is very uniquely Shenmue
  • I can easily recommend folks try the first two games via this HD compilation
  • I marathoned both on a staycation in under 40 hours, by the end I wanted more Shenmue and was ready for 3.
  • These are truly some of the best games ever made, especially considering the time for which they were made. The good news is they've aged well, play the HD compilation and you're in for a treat.
Thoughts on three:

  • Shenmue 3 immediately threw me off with its implementation of a stamina system that requires you to eat throughout a day to be able to run, as I'll discuss the game has many shortcomings but most feel like they can be blamed on budget. Not this choice and it's a bad one.
  • The combat is a massive step-down from the first two games Virtua Fighter basis and I describe it as "Arkham Shenmue", the sacrifice of the combat system is very likely due to budget
  • There's a lot of padding and gating that didn't exist in a serious way in the first two games, in the first two you can often sequence skip to a target destination if you deduce how to get there or already know how, in Shenmue 3 this is largely impossible, if I figured something out before Ryo and tried to go to the destination it wouldn't work and I'd need to hunt for a random NPC to make Ryo aware of what I already knew. Potentially tied to budget (having to record and script alternative events/dialog).
  • The game has a lot of unnecessary padding, near the end there's a 5,000 yuan moneygate but you can't cheese the gambling system in this game and the forklift doesn't pay out the same way relative to this gate. This is another odd choice because the first game is 20 hours long and folks are saying it's taking about 26 hours to beat 3. Why not target a shorter length? Another odd design choice not explicitly tied to budget.
  • Gambling loop is bad, even if it's more authentic. Buy gambling tokens > gamble > trade out tokens for prizes > sell prizes vs. Shenmue II loop: Money > Gamble > Money.
  • Environment, art direction and design are great. Graphically I'm impressed and feel he retained the Shenmue "vibe" with the locales. Disagree with folks in here about the faces being bad, I think they are stylized and I like them.
  • I cannot easily suggest Shenmue 3 to a newcomer to the IP, it's for mega fans who can live with the sacrifices to see some more story, though the story doesn't move much in this game.
  • Where are the Sega arcade games?
I was a KS backer. Don't regret it but me and some friends had talks at the beginning of this KS that we would prefer he save the budget and just build Shenmue 3 in the engine they used for Shenmue 2, re-using Dreamcast assets. To be honest, I'd preferred he had done that with the visual limitations and all vs. sacrifice so much gameplay that made this series unique and special. My hope for four should it happen is that Sega will become involved, help resolve the combat situation and lend more IP to the game.
 

Miles708

Member
I posted this in the review thread but thought I'd post it in here for good measure, my impressions:

So two weeks ago I replayed Shenmue I and II on the HD compilation, in preparation for Shenmue III.

Thoughts on first two:
  • Shenmue 1 is the best in the series imo, the scale and intimacy of its world is phenomenal, QTEs aren't abused, the forklift section is fun.
  • Shenmue 2 is a bit of a stepdown, it nails the environments but they're not as intimate as Shenmue 1, the QTEs are a bit too heavily relied upon. Furthermore, it doesn't make a lot of sense that the forklift isn't available as an option for beating the money gates -- this leads to cheesing the gambling system.
  • Both games have absolutely phenomenal combat, with the main issue in both being camera control and ability to focus on enemies.
  • Great art direction, great graphics for its time and great music.
  • The way you learn moves and how that ties into the combat directional inputs is very uniquely Shenmue
  • I can easily recommend folks try the first two games via this HD compilation
  • I marathoned both on a staycation in under 40 hours, by the end I wanted more Shenmue and was ready for 3.
  • These are truly some of the best games ever made, especially considering the time for which they were made. The good news is they've aged well, play the HD compilation and you're in for a treat.
Thoughts on three:

  • Shenmue 3 immediately threw me off with its implementation of a stamina system that requires you to eat throughout a day to be able to run, as I'll discuss the game has many shortcomings but most feel like they can be blamed on budget. Not this choice and it's a bad one.
  • The combat is a massive step-down from the first two games Virtua Fighter basis and I describe it as "Arkham Shenmue", the sacrifice of the combat system is very likely due to budget
  • There's a lot of padding and gating that didn't exist in a serious way in the first two games, in the first two you can often sequence skip to a target destination if you deduce how to get there or already know how, in Shenmue 3 this is largely impossible, if I figured something out before Ryo and tried to go to the destination it wouldn't work and I'd need to hunt for a random NPC to make Ryo aware of what I already knew. Potentially tied to budget (having to record and script alternative events/dialog).
  • The game has a lot of unnecessary padding, near the end there's a 5,000 yuan moneygate but you can't cheese the gambling system in this game and the forklift doesn't pay out the same way relative to this gate. This is another odd choice because the first game is 20 hours long and folks are saying it's taking about 26 hours to beat 3. Why not target a shorter length? Another odd design choice not explicitly tied to budget.
  • Gambling loop is bad, even if it's more authentic. Buy gambling tokens > gamble > trade out tokens for prizes > sell prizes vs. Shenmue II loop: Money > Gamble > Money.
  • Environment, art direction and design are great. Graphically I'm impressed and feel he retained the Shenmue "vibe" with the locales. Disagree with folks in here about the faces being bad, I think they are stylized and I like them.
  • I cannot easily suggest Shenmue 3 to a newcomer to the IP, it's for mega fans who can live with the sacrifices to see some more story, though the story doesn't move much in this game.
  • Where are the Sega arcade games?
I was a KS backer. Don't regret it but me and some friends had talks at the beginning of this KS that we would prefer he save the budget and just build Shenmue 3 in the engine they used for Shenmue 2, re-using Dreamcast assets. To be honest, I'd preferred he had done that with the visual limitations and all vs. sacrifice so much gameplay that made this series unique and special. My hope for four should it happen is that Sega will become involved, help resolve the combat situation and lend more IP to the game.

Nice post. I'm not sure I agree with everything but you make some fair points.
I'm not sure Shenmue II is inferior not being as intimate as S I, being that the point of the journey. I, too, prefer the atmosphere of Yokosuka, but I think Shenmue II is a massive improvement in pretty much every aspect, from gameplay to cutscenes. It also introduces many of the best characters ever:


As for Shenmue 3, I still need to reach the second area so I'll not comment very much for now, but I agree with the gambling (more authentic but more problematic). I feel like some faces are a bit too much cartoonish, and enviroments are gorgeous.0

I also think that it's not easy to suggest Shenmue 3 to a newcomer, the easiest to get into i think it's 2. It would be nice to see Sega and Deep Silver make an edition including Shenmue 1 and 2 HD and Shenmue 3... even if with 2 cases held together by duct-tape.

Don't regret it but me and some friends had talks at the beginning of this KS that we would prefer he save the budget and just build Shenmue 3 in the engine they used for Shenmue 2, re-using Dreamcast assets. To be honest, I'd preferred he had done that with the visual limitations and all vs. sacrifice so much gameplay that made this series unique and special.

I'm not sure this could have been effective in saving money... probably you had to customize the engine very much to simulate that kind of graphics, and also it maybe would have been even more work from the artistic side, AND it would have thrown off newcomers.
Also, for the "sacrificed gameplay", are you referring to the combat or something else, too?


My hope for four should it happen is that Sega will become involved, help resolve the combat situation and lend more IP to the game.

YES.
 

TaroYamada

Member
Nice post. I'm not sure I agree with everything but you make some fair points.
I'm not sure Shenmue II is inferior not being as intimate as S I, being that the point of the journey. I, too, prefer the atmosphere of Yokosuka, but I think Shenmue II is a massive improvement in pretty much every aspect, from gameplay to cutscenes. It also introduces many of the best characters ever:

The QTEs are a step down. In I they impact the cutscene but you can still succeed by failing some far more frequently, I feel to save money/time in the sequel and in the third they lead to instant fail if you mess up even one prompt far more frequently (in III it seems all the time in fact).

I'm not sure this could have been effective in saving money... probably you had to customize the engine very much to simulate that kind of graphics, and also it maybe would have been even more work from the artistic side, AND it would have thrown off newcomers.
Also, for the "sacrificed gameplay", are you referring to the combat or something else, too?

It would have saved money in terms of animations and assets for sure. But the main thing it would have salvaged was the Virtua Fighter combat design -- which must have been far too expensive to rebuild in the new game. I mean we're talking about a Jujitsu practitioner in Ryo and III doesn't have throws. It's a big loss for the franchise and there's no way of getting around that.
 

Miles708

Member
The QTEs are a step down. In I they impact the cutscene but you can still succeed by failing some far more frequently, I feel to save money/time in the sequel and in the third they lead to instant fail if you mess up even one prompt far more frequently (in III it seems all the time in fact).

Yes, I also think QTEs not "branching" are purely a budget/time constraint.
Making action sequences takes a great amount of time and effort, making them branching double as much... now imagine making a branching cutscene for each failed command prompt, for every scene.
They made "fail" animations and that's already a great thing to NOT take for granted. Other games (like Capcom's Ninja Blade) simply rewind the scene when you fail a QTE, to save on animations, and even big titles like the latest God of War had to cut down on bosses because these scenes take so many development resources.

It would have saved money in terms of animations and assets for sure. But the main thing it would have salvaged was the Virtua Fighter combat design -- which must have been far too expensive to rebuild in the new game. I mean we're talking about a Jujitsu practitioner in Ryo and III doesn't have throws. It's a big loss for the franchise and there's no way of getting around that.

Here I disagree. I don't think content from Shenmue 1 and 2 could have been reused whatsoever. Even porting the engine would have been a non-trivial undertaking (Shenmue 1 and 2 HD took 9 months and were, initially, full of gigantic bugs) and, don't forget, we're always talking about a 18 years old engine. You can't have fluids, or foliage, or a million techiques we have now already embedded in modern engines. But now you have a lot less money and a MUCH smaller team. It's just not a sensible choice.

Same for animations. Like QTEs, leaving throws out was a budget/time affair that would have not been solved by copy/pasting... you can't re-use this info between engines, and that's assuming Sega even gave YSnet the permission to use the Virtua Fighter engine at all.

As much as combat in Shenmue 3 is a step down from the previous ones, it's good to remember that the previous fighting engine was created by the best team team in the world for fighting games, at the top of their shape, with a massive budget, time and experience.
 
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TaroYamada

Member
Glad to see you have the same assessment of the QTEs.

On the rest you're misunderstanding me, I (and my friends) would have been fine with the those assets and that engine. I agree it would have ruled out newcomers, but don't kid yourself and think III is going to mainstream the franchise. So we tarnished the gameplay in exchange for foliage, and other modern effects, I hate to sound like a Wii owner/Nintendo guy (especially as a primarily PC gamer) but gameplay > graphics. Every time.

I'd take Shenmue III with Shenmue I/II's graphical quality and combat over Shenmue III's upgraded visuals in exchange for massive gameplay concessions.
 

Miles708

Member
Glad to see you have the same assessment of the QTEs.

On the rest you're misunderstanding me, I (and my friends) would have been fine with the those assets and that engine. I agree it would have ruled out newcomers, but don't kid yourself and think III is going to mainstream the franchise. So we tarnished the gameplay in exchange for foliage, and other modern effects, I hate to sound like a Wii owner/Nintendo guy (especially as a primarily PC gamer) but gameplay > graphics. Every time.

I'd take Shenmue III with Shenmue I/II's graphical quality and combat over Shenmue III's upgraded visuals in exchange for massive gameplay concessions.

It would have been really interesting to watch, that's for sure.
For example Bailu village would have been completely different with such an engine. Shenmue 1 and 2 do not have big natural vistas (being mostly big urban mazes) so it' unclear if the engine would have even allowed for a big open natural areas, without major re-writes. Also, Unreal Engine streamlines and helps with the creation of fields of terrain, where instead you manually have to put every element on the old engine. With the reduced budget and team, I suspect it could have been even more work.

But of course I'm speculating. It could have been immensely strange and interesting, I'll give you that. I actually now kind of want the old Shenmue engine hacked/open-sourced, just to see what can be done with it.
 
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Keihart

Member
Anyone here knows if you can somehow have the PS4 prompts on PC? i'm kinda used to the xbox buttons now but i would still prefer having the promts match the controller i'm using.

halp plz
 
Have no idea what this game about

Need to do a story recap first before dive into it

Im actually gonna buy the remastered collection first. I only played Shenmue 1 back in 2005. Im aware its an old mechanic but fuck, if people can play 50 hours of walking simulators, I might as well jump back into an older title that is slow paced and complete the story so that I can fully enjoy Shenmue 3.

People, I'd like to get the Shenmue 1 and 2 pack as well, but don't let that stop you from jumping into 3! 3 has a catch up movie that explained everything up to 3's story pretty well! It'd be a shame to miss out on 3 just because you want to play the previous games first.

Speaking of 3...still really enjoying it. I'm currently stuck because I dunno where to find old man Sun, but hopefully I'll find him and progress....I hope to change scenery and enter the city area....the countryside is nice and all, but I feel like after a while it gets same-y.
 

lachesis

Member
So after sitting on it for more than a month as I was finishing up some other games (Trails in the sky FC and SC on steam) - I finally picked up the game over the weekend.

I hadn't put much time into trial version (as I didn't want to spoil the game) - but so far, the game has been great - and so much more that I expected.

The whole time management theme of day to day routine is great as I expected. I am actually trying my hardest to not to progress the game's story too much - currently looking for the old man Sun, but before I get to him - thinking about doing few more sub quests, collecting all the herbs and make myself more comfortable with the environments. (Still getting lost a lot).

I am still struggling with the battle though - I mean, I beat the opponents pretty easy as my Kung Fu level is pretty high - but I just feel like I won the battle because I was lucky and overpowered, not because I was proficient. So far, only opponent that I had trouble was the 5th dan, Yellow Tiger at the dojo - but rest of the battles were pretty easy.

Trying to remember the strings of moves are a bit difficult change to accept for me either. To be honest, I really miss that tactile feel of S1 & 2 battles. If S4 ever comes out, I really wish Yu would bring it back.

But I am noticing a ton of neat things - like 1 inch punch training... at beginning Ryo seemed like he's just punching like normal and made me wonder "why is this called 1 inch punch, while he's full swining?) - but as I master the technique - it becomes like Kill Bill / Bruce Lee 1 inch punch. Also how the Afterburner II music makes wood chopping so much more exciting LOL... There are just so much to love about the game because sometimes it's so... off and wonky. :)

After reading a lot of reviews - I know the story won't progress much further - but for me, it's about the journey and everyday life in these village/cities... so I am very much looking forward continuing the game. (And gamble)!
 

Geki-D

Banned
Is it me or are the QTEs broken in this game? I mean besides the fact you barely have like a second (maybe even less) to do them, it seems like sometimes there's a delay between when the button is shown and when you can actually press it. So if you fail a QTE and know what button is coming up the second time, you'll press it as soon as you see it but the game won't register that you pressed it so you failed it again (this has happened to me loads of times). It would appear that within the crazy short time the button is shown, a part of that time is actually not pressable.

How could they fuck up QTEs so badly? Whenever a section starts, I roll my eyes at the BS that I know I'm about to endure.
 

Pidull

Member
Is it me or are the QTEs broken in this game? I mean besides the fact you barely have like a second (maybe even less) to do them, it seems like sometimes there's a delay between when the button is shown and when you can actually press it. So if you fail a QTE and know what button is coming up the second time, you'll press it as soon as you see it but the game won't register that you pressed it so you failed it again (this has happened to me loads of times). It would appear that within the crazy short time the button is shown, a part of that time is actually not pressable.

How could they fuck up QTEs so badly? Whenever a section starts, I roll my eyes at the BS that I know I'm about to endure.
I noticed this as well and now just spam the necessary input, pretty broken.
 

Geki-D

Banned
So I finally got round to beating this. Man, that was disappointing. I can get over the dodgy gameplay, broken QTEs, no more grab in fights, the bizarre move queue in combat, the awful voice acting, the stiff animations, ridiculously slow draw in, the lack of Sega arcade games... But what I can't abide, what is totally unacceptable is how shitty the plot and writing is. Okay, bad voice work/lines I can pass on, the other games weren't masterpieces of writing but they were consistent and well put together. The story was actually good and you wanted to know what happens next. But after nearly 20 years, this lazy-ass story is what we get? Utter nonsensical, jumping around, DBZ "gotta raise my powerful" schlock.

Some of the great highlights of this 20 year in the making masterpiece:
-That magic stuff at the end of S2 (the sword)? Nah, no mention of that. It's either no longer canon or the characters just don't care.

-Ryo, after learning so much, overcoming such powerful foes in S2, comes across some random-ass thug leader who is more powerful (and by proxy is therefore stronger than everyone Ryo has beaten till that point). But don't worry guys, learning one new move get's him by it.

-Oh shit, in Niaowu there's another random-ass thug leader who is even strongerer guiz. But don't worry, learning one new move get's him by it. Again. Power level raised! I can't wait to see how Ryo will beat every other guy in the next game, maybe: Meet foe -get beat - find master - learn move- beat foe -repeat.

-Want to show how good a master martial artist is?; Just have them dodge every one of Ryo's attacks. They're so powerful Ryo can't even touch them! This happened in past games but it was once or twice per game. Now it's just the go-to "OMG they're so good!" trope and it was already old coming into S3 because of the characters who did it in S2. Master can't even be touched. How original.

-Oh no! Shenhua has been kidnapped! Gotta save her... But damn, it's late and Ryo is tired. 9PM?! That's too late to go and save someone. Okay next day, time for a calm chinwag with Ren, better go and wonder round the port looking for a boat. It'll be ready the next morning, so Shenhua has been a prisoner for 2 days now. Ah, I'm sure she's fine. In the meantime Ryo has a day to kill (despite being told that after that point you're in the end game so it could just jump to right to the castle). Time to go play some "arcade" games whilst Shenhua is locked in a cell, hope she's having as much fun as Ryo. ...Remember when Nozomi was kidnapped and Ryo went out into the dead of the night to find a way to get to the port as quickly as possible to save her? He didn't wait till morning because he needed his beauty sleep or because there were no buses, he didn't have a day to kill playing Space Harrier. Yeah, better times...

-Speaking of Nozomi, I'm glad Ryo now calls her Harasaki (in the first game he always called her Nozomi) because that way I can pretend she's a different character. Seriously, that person I got on the phone wasn't Nozomi. The voice actress in no way resembles that one from the first game but that isn't too bad, it's the way she acts that's wrong. In the first game Nozomi is meek, shy and calm, on the phone in S3 she's an excited brat. Same for Guizhang, he doesn't act like he did in the first game. These characters just got outright rewritten. I guess after nearly 20 years the devs forgot how to write these characters.

-The ending was nonsensical:
  • Niao Sun just decides to betray Lan Di? I guess? Why? Because she has the Phoenix Mirror? Ok, but Lan Di still has the Dragon, so...?
  • Who were all these monk guys we had to fight?
  • I guess all those other guys with Lan Di were the other leaders of the Chi You Men, too bad they're all bitches. That bandit guy in Bailu could beat them, apparently.
  • Lan Di just blocks everything, OMG guys, he's so powerful! Ryo can't even touch him! Where have we seen this before? You know, when so many other characters are shown to be untouchable badasses, when you have the main bad guy do the same it just isn't impressive anymore.
  • Why were the other characters there? What was the point of the shrine maiden & the fat kung fu guy being at the castle? What were they doing when Niao Sun was setting fire to the place? They're so dumb and the cutaways to them were pointless filler.
  • Lan Di standing there like a dumbass after Ren threw the fake mirror out the window was hilarious. I guess he was thinking "Oh shit, that guy just ruined all my plans in a split second". It's actually funny to think that Ryo could have at any point dropped the mirror in the ocean and Lan Di would be fucked. Seeing as Niao Sun has it now, I guess it's too late for that.
  • So we save Shenhua's father but what did we actually learn? the answer is absolutely nothing, the whole game is just a stop gap and it was so bad we can be sure we'll never see a sequel.

I was hyped for a new Shenmue but after that, I don't care for a 4th one. I don't trust the devs to make a decent game or a satisfying end to the story and I'm pretty sure the "next Shenmue coming" meme dies here. They killed it with a terrible game.

One last thing, I got the plats for both the other Shenmue games. I'm not really into trophy hunting but I thought seeing as I got them in the remasters, it would be cool to get it in S3. Then I saw the trophies.

Get all move scrolls:


Split 1000 logs:


Catch 1000 fish:


Collect all herbs:


Deal with the bullshit RNG and get all capsule toys:


What a load of crap.
 
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Miles708

Member
Managed to finally finish the game, took my sweet time.

I'm overral satisfied, I feel a little strange about the general consensus about the finale, since the final act actually is one of my favourite parts of the game.
The other part is, of course, the hilarious fail animations for QTEs:

Globally it's Shenmue, meaning a world 100% worth exploring and interacting with.
Still, some choices for story and overall progression are undoubtedly odd.

These 2 aspects of the game sometimes collide with each other, and the game never feels 100% balanced. While the story does not go very far (but, you can tell me what you want, i'll love Niao Sun forever) I particularly liked the ending of the first "chapter", the beginning in Niaowu, and the whole final part.

Globally I think Shenmue 3 nails it in the moment-by-moment gameplay and inspiration, between the exploration, the dialogues (there is a freakin' massive amount of dubbed dialogue for every little thing), the relationship between Ryo and Shenhua, with the other villagers, and the feedback systems in place for all secondary activities.
Where it falters, is in the choice of some minor events that take just too much "real estate" in the story, and in the combat system that needs some serious improvements despite its nice foundation.

It's very easy to love Shenmue 3 when it works, and very easy to hate it when it doesn't... usually doing both these things at the same time.
In the end, despite its flaws, I've seriously liked it. So much, actually, that i'd like to start it right again on NG+. Maybe i'll do it in a month or so.
Hope Shenmue IV will come out soon because now I really want more.

Lastly, I think this yet another miracle happened in this generation, this incredible generation, and we should all seriously cherish them all much much more than we do.
 
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sunnysideup

Banned
I wonder what the sales where. If its sells 350-400k world wide they should be able to make a sequel right? Im going to be buying this later on.
 

lachesis

Member
So I moved onto Niaowu part after finishing up Bailu as much as I could. (Got all herbs! LOL)

One thing I noticed is that the character models - while each ones are unique - alot of young women are basically same face from the Bailu prize exchange center. A little bit disappointed, but since it's a game that were made by 75 people (according to some article that I read) - far less than several hundreds that were involved in S1 and S2 - I still think this is quite a feat.

Currently enjoying finding all the Chobus in the shops that I can enter for now - and doing different things. This area is so much larger w/ so many shops, it's a nice contrast from Bailu village. Thanks to the backer international phone card - I called every one on the phone book from hotel - pretty neat and had a few good chuckles. (Goro's exaggerations and taking Joy out to dinner etc lol) - only thing that was quite different from the character that I thought was Nozomi. (at least english voice) and Guizang. - that I thought he wasn't much for a chit-chat type of person.

As per the battle - although I'm up to level 32 or so in Kung Fu level - but still struggling at higher level. I do think the battle, so far has been downgraded - which is terrible shame. I really enjoyed S1 and S2's battle system, complete with throws and all. Also some of the moves have same commands - which is rather confusing. I mean, there are a lot of moves you can use... but not sure of tactical uses, especially the countering has been pretty weak. I loved anticipating enemies attack and counter them. Also missing the quick dodging system too.. I hope they'll bring back the older fighting system, as well as some more depth to the fighting system. So far, for me the most effective method has been keeping my distance and waiting for opening, then doing the elbow strikes to knock the opponent down, and kick them on the ground for a bit more of bonus damage.

I do like the training system though - it progresses much quickly in most cases, and it's more visually informative - but I wish the moves that I don't get all blocked during sparring - if I knew the effects of the each moves, I could have think more strategy for the battles easily.

And I agree with others - the QTE timing is way to quick to respond for old man like myself. :( But I guess I can enjoy the funny failures!

All in all... it's a Shenmue game alright and having a blast. I feel like I'm right back to 1999 - even though sometimes Ryo moves like a tank (in corners and all) - but I am very much glad that I'm playing the game that I was waiting for past 20 years. Looks like I've missed a few trophies on Bailu (fishing related) - but I look forward to play the NG+ and DLC as well.
 

Kazza

Member

Ver. 1.04 Patch Notes
General Updates

・ Players can now skip initial conversations.

・ Backer content fixes

・ Event control fixes (Fixed issues which stops game progress when multiple events happen simultaneously at certain timings.)

・ Fixed background collisions which makes players get stuck.

・ Fixed certain localization texts.


Battle

・ Adjusted balances for certain skills.


Minigames

・Adjusted the fishing point of the green catfish in Bailu.

・Fixed a bug where the camera cannot be controlled in the lucky hit minigame.

・Adjusted the wage amount per cargo in the forklift minigame.

・Fixed purchase prices of items which were incorrect.


Other

・Other minor bug fixes

Players can now skip initial conversations.

Well, that addresses a complaint a lot of people had.
 

Miles708

Member
Did you guys buy the DLC ?

Actually, I've just purchased the season pass.
I'm playing the Battle Rally right now and I'm surprised just how much fun it is. It's a totally arcade experiece, in both presentation and gameplay, it's 100% Yu Suzuki arcade, like we're still in the '90s. I already wanted OutRun 3, now I absolutely demand it.

I'd say the combat system benefits greatly from the faster action, it's almost some strange Streets of Rage or Spikeout spin-off, and the rush for the best time can cause addiction if you're in this type of gameplay.
It also has a second mode where you have to find collectibles scattered around the village, like the chobu-chans, and I'm liking it very much too.

Finally, you access the DLC directly from the main menu, but you need a completed save game or, at least, at half game.
 

Geki-D

Banned
stopped reading what everyone is saying because I no longer give a damn

I didn't wait 15 years just to be disappointed because a couple of people likes to do nothing but complain
Game is just bad, the complaints are legitimate. I was on GAF defending it but I can only really admit at this point that the naysayers were right all along.

If you've convinced yourself before even playing it that it's good and that's going to blind you to the actual game then more power to you. Personally I'd rather be honest and say that I was wrong.
 

Miles708

Member
Game is just bad, the complaints are legitimate. I was on GAF defending it but I can only really admit at this point that the naysayers were right all along.

If you've convinced yourself before even playing it that it's good and that's going to blind you to the actual game then more power to you. Personally I'd rather be honest and say that I was wrong.

Can't say I agree with your overrall judgement but yes, the game has some problems. Depends on how much weight you put on them, I guess.
I already said what I think about the game but, globally, I really liked it. Even after finishing it, returning to it gives the same warm feeling of the first 2 games, and that alone is a success as far as I'm concerned.
 

SEGA_2012

Gold Member
what do you guys think about the dub ? I saw many people complaining about Shenhua's voice actress, but i think she did a good job.
 

Clarissa

Banned
When Ryo sleeps over at Shenhua's House, his stamina doesn't replenish right? Bitch should learn how to cook!

Just started the game today and Idk....i loved Shenmue 1 and 2 so much but 3 feels so..... archaic.
 

Hostile_18

Banned
When Ryo sleeps over at Shenhua's House, his stamina doesn't replenish right? Bitch should learn how to cook!

Just started the game today and Idk....i loved Shenmue 1 and 2 so much but 3 feels so..... archaic.

It does on my game.

It's a really hard start but when the first village opens up it becomes as good as 1-2 IMO.
 

lachesis

Member
Take your time and invest in details... that the game is very rewarding journey. On my 2nd playthru, with Japanese voice this time, going for platinum.

I do have gripes and it’s not as good as 1 or 2 - but for what it is,I enjoyed it very much. Not the story nor battles...but the whole sense of being there, day to day life of ding just some things. Such organic way of telling story... but actual cinematics often contradict or just forget what was already told..that’s rather disappointing. End game was also disappointing for me... but I hope the next chapter would give us some closure on at least some of the mysteries
 
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