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[Reallink]

about same performance as a 3090 Ti for £799. a 3090 Ti was like £1,900 only 9 months ago. isn't that good?

but yeah i get it. i paid £750 for a 2080 in 2018 and a 3080 was meant to be £650 in 2020. now a 4080 is £1200. even with inflation that's an insane hike.

the pricing sucks but nvidia can get away with it. they don't have good competition from AMD. Nvidia will only lower prices if sales disappoint. Maybe hold off and see if they do a refresh later this year like the 2000 Super series.... or hope that 5000 card prices don't go higher in 2024 lol

The point you're missing is that the 4080 is actually the 4060Ti or 4070 in terms of chip size, transistor density, and core count. Similarly the 4070Ti is actually a 4050Ti or 4060. So not only have Nvidia raised their pricing $300 - $500, they've also given you 2 tier lower chips for that premium.

 

[amigastar]

This looks interesting

 

[Leonidas]

I never said your math was wrong, not even once, I said you extrapolation was incorrect.

Actually you did.

Then that's you extrapolating (not even correctly, It's not even 45% avg to the 6900 XT) it's not "40% faster in RT vs. 6950 XT (via Techpowerup multi-game RT benchmarks)".

Unless there is some other explanation for the above comment, it implies my math was wrong.

The only thing made up is your explanations and your 7-10% RT average delta (where you still arrive close to my "like 40% better" even though you said there wasn't much difference between the two cards in RT ).

I actually calculated all the RT data from their 6950 XT review to get a 4-5% delta between 6950 XT and 6900 XT average in RT, where did you get 7-10% from?

 

[GloveSlap]

Seems ok, not great. I'll wait for the 5000 series paired with a next gen AMD 3D CPU.

 

[amigastar]

Seems ok, not great. I'll wait for the 5000 series paired with a next gen AMD 3D CPU.

If i only could wait, i have an RTX 2060 so i wanted to upgrade this year.

 

[Turk1993]

In Belgium you can get it at 800 Euros on Amazon DE or FR, I wouldn't pay that for a card but you can get it under 1000.

Again i said Belgium. And i just looked up DE and FR and its 900 actually lol, not close to been 800. Don't forget to add the transport cost which is 16 for one and 10 for the other. As you see the 4070 ti is still the better deal. AMD is mad overpriced in EU. This card is worse in almost every way compared to the 4070ti. And the new 7900xt and xtx are even worst price wise.

 

[Orta]

Growing up as a console gamer PC gaming was always viewed as a niche, only people with deep pockets had £1000 PC's whilst the rest of us had to make do with our NES or Megadrives.

Looks like nVidia is harking for a return to those days. I could go out and buy a 4070ti right now but can't justify the cost. I could buy a 4090 right now too but I'll be fucked financially for about four months!

Oh for a return to the days of five hundred quid buying you a monster high-end GPU.

 

[GymWolf]

The point you're missing is that the 4080 is actually the 4060Ti or 4070 in terms of chip size, transistor density, and core count. Similarly the 4070Ti is actually a 4050Ti or 4060. So not only have Nvidia raised their pricing $300 - $500, they've also given you 2 tier lower chips for that premium.

Isn't the upgrade from a 3080 in line with the past? 40% (44% to be precise)

Like going from 1080 to 2080 to 3080?

You are right about the chip (i mean i believe you, i'm not an expert) but the bump in perf is the same (i think)

edit: well, scratch that, i'm reading now that a 3080 is around 55% faster than a 2080.

 

[Senua]

Terrible

 

[Leonidas]

Isn't the upgrade from a 3080 in line with the past? 40% (44% to be precise)

Like going from 1080 to 2080 to 3080?

You are right about the chip (i mean i believe you, i'm not an expert) but the bump in perf is the same (i think)

edit: well, scratch that, i'm reading now that a 3080 is around 55% faster than a 2080.

2080 to 3080 was a huge jump because it went from TU104 to GA102. Nvidia gave a cut down top chip as the 3080 and now some people expect that every gen even though it only happens once in a while (usually when AMD has something competitive).

The 4090 confused some people with their old ways of thinking because it's a massive GPU.

 

[VAVA Mk2]

Seems like a solid option for 1440p high refresh given the current market.

OK then thanks!

 

[SomeGit]

Actually you did.

Unless there is some other explanation for the above comment, it implies my math was wrong.

I didn’t, I said you were only using the data from one resolution, which you corrected yourself with the 43-45 that you yourself posted after. I made no comment about your math

I actually calculated all the RT data from their 6950 XT review to get a 4-5% delta between 6950 XT and 6900 XT average in RT, where did you get 7-10% from?

You calculated the data from the reference design 6950XT. I mean if we are using OC designs for the 4070 ti, the only onesit’s only fair we use third party ones for the 6950, no? Especially since those are the ones available on Amazon and Newegg right now. I’m not even using “premium” versions I’m talking about the ones on the shelf.

 

[SomeGit]

Again i said Belgium. And i just looked up DE and FR and its 900 actually lol, not close to been 800. Don't forget to add the transport cost which is 16 for one and 10 for the other. As you see the 4070 ti is still the better deal. AMD is mad overpriced in EU. This card is worse in almost every way compared to the 4070ti. And the new 7900xt and xtx are even worst price wise.

Amazon FR and DE ship to Belgium so I don’t see your point and you think you aren’t going to be paying shipping costs for Nvidia cards?

But check the price history they have been 800€ for the last months, lots of people here have commented about it.

Again I wouldn’t buy it at that price, but give that the 4070 ti will be well above 1000 even online in europe and even worse on your local retail Belgium stores, it’s just comical.

Every single card of this generation is grossly overpriced.

 

[Kacho]

1440p performance is really nice

 

[ToTTenTranz]

It's the best value current gen GPU at 1440p at the MSRP, but not by much...

This is the graph that show how stupidly bloated the GPU prices are.
Throughout the >2 decades of consumer dGPUs we always saw the performance/cost needle going up. And now we're seeing brand new mid-range GPUs with brand new architectures / fabric nodes showing the same performance/cost as 2 year-old cards... but on their release MSRPs.

It costs 800$ and could've been more powerful for very little cost to Nvidia, plus it will likely end up being way above 800$ soon

No, at these prices these cards won't sell.
Nvidia and AMD are trying to strongarm consumers into paying almost twice as much for the same performance brackets, but they'll eventually lose and they'll be forced to lower all their prices in a couple of months.
Until then, their sales will look like this:

The RTX30 and RX6000 cards are still readily available on ebay at pretty low prices so consumers can just use those.

 

[Reallink]

Isn't the upgrade from a 3080 in line with the past? 40% (44% to be precise)

Like going from 1080 to 2080 to 3080?

You are right about the chip (i mean i believe you, i'm not an expert) but the bump in perf is the same (i think)

edit: well, scratch that, i'm reading now that a 3080 is around 55% faster than a 2080.

2080 to 3080 was a huge jump because it went from TU104 to GA102. Nvidia gave a cut down top chip as the 3080 and now some people expect that every gen even though it only happens once in a while (usually when AMD has something competitive).

The 4090 confused some people with their old ways of thinking because it's a massive GPU.

The issue is the percent of transistor and core cut down. The die designation number is as arbitrary as the model number. The 4080 and 4070 are the most cut down '80 and '70 chips in Nvidia history by an incredibly wide margin. Even the 4090 is actually a 4080Ti, and not only that, would actually be the worst '80Ti in history.

 

[Turk1993]

Amazon FR and DE ship to Belgium so I don’t see your point, you think you aren’t going to be paying shipping costs for Nvidia cards?

You still don't get it do you. You where the one saying 800, which is far from true. And i can go to a hardware store in belgium or order it from dutch/belgium sites with free transport fees. Its not about the fee its about the total price i pay for. The AMD cards are 300 to 500 euro's more expansive compared to the msrp. Nvidia cards are 200 to 400 more expansive compared to the msrp. They are both rip off, but Nvidia has the better card and the prices are too close to choose Amd with there inferior cards.

 

[SolidQ]

This looks interesting

and NV again lied, because 1080 doesn't look blurry, that more 480p in this video

 

[Leonidas]

I didn’t, I said you were only using the data from one resolution, which you corrected yourself with the 43-45 that you yourself posted after. I made no comment about your math

Why nitpick over 2%?

You calculated the data from the reference design 6950XT.

Yes, because the OC reviews of 6950 XT show it drawing 450w under gaming load, I'd never put such a power hungry card in my PC.

Okay then lets say your 35-37% is accurate I'm fine with that estimation as it's not far from my "like 40% I'm not going to argue 3-5% (which is not noticeable when gaming anyway.

You said this earlier,

you aren’t getting that much better Raster or RT performance.

35-37% in RT isn't much better to you? That's a huge difference, and well worth the extra price.

 

[SomeGit]

You still don't get it do you. You where the one saying 800, which is far from true. And i can go to a hardware store in belgium or order it from dutch/belgium sites with free transport fees. Its not about the fee its about the total price i pay for. The AMD cards are 300 to 500 euro's more expansive compared to the msrp. Nvidia cards are 200 to 400 more expansive compared to the msrp. They are both rip off, but Nvidia has the better card and the prices are too close to choose Amd with there inferior cards.

So you are restricting yourself to higher prices so that you get free shipping? I really don’t get it, it’s not even like Amazon FR and DE are import sites, you can even use Prime to get free shipping to Belgium.

It’s not far from true they’ve often been at that price point, even at 870€ it’s still 200 to 300 below the expected price for the 4070ti, it’s not “close”. It’s still terrible value.

It’s not far from true

 

[twilo99]

This is a really poor showing:

At this price point people should just look for used 3090s.

If only they weren't on those Samsing dies I would agree

 

[HoofHearted]

Let it all fucking burn…

Good job NVIDIA … anyone that buys into this kind of bullshit pricing are Jensens sheep cult at this point…

 

[Turk1993]

So you are restricting yourself to higher prices so that you get free shipping? I really don’t get it, it’s not even like Amazon FR and DE are import sites, you can even use Prime to get free shipping to Belgium.

It’s not far from true they’ve often been at that price point, even at 870€ it’s still 200 to 300 below the expected price for the 4070ti, it’s not “close”. It’s still terrible value.

It’s not far from true

Bruh, the 4070ti shits on the 6950xt in every way possible what are you on. The difference in rt, dlss, cuda, size, drivers and powerdraw is far too big to ignore that 100 euro difference. You need to be a diehard AMD fanboy to consider the 6950xt over a 4070ti if the difference in price is this much.

Why nitpick over 2%?

Yes, because the OC reviews of 6950 XT show it drawing 450w under gaming load, I'd never put such a power hungry card in my PC.

Okay then lets say your 35-37% is accurate I'm fine with that estimation as it's not far from my "like 40% I'm not going to argue 3-5% (which is not noticeable when gaming anyway.

You said this earlier,

35-37% in RT isn't much better to you? That's a huge difference, and well worth the extra price.

This guy really just told us that 37% is not much with that huge powerdraw difference on top lmfoa. He also calls you out on that 3% difference from your estimated 40% while ignore 80 euros from the price on the 6950xt .

 

[SomeGit]

35-37% in RT isn't much better to you? That's a huge difference, and well worth the extra price.

Not really no, if it was across the board it would but just in RT, seems like a mild upgrade. Especially since if we ignore the relative percentages the numbers aren’t really that good, 35/74 fps in Control sounds good to you? For 840 to 880 dollars?

Given that the 7900 XT is 60 to 30 dollars more, marginally worse in RT and better in Raster? Remember this is a card that has been panned for being poor value yet looks much better thanks to the 4070 ti.

 

[FireFly]

The point you're missing is that the 4080 is actually the 4060Ti or 4070 in terms of chip size, transistor density, and core count. Similarly the 4070Ti is actually a 4050Ti or 4060. So not only have Nvidia raised their pricing $300 - $500, they've also given you 2 tier lower chips for that premium.

Well, the 4080/4070 Ti are also on a much more expensive process and are using more expensive GDDR6X memory and better cooling. So Nvidia are likely taking advantage of the current market situation, but with the same profit margins they're also not going to be able to hit last generation's price points.

 

[SomeGit]

Bruh, the 4070ti shits on the 6950xt in every way possible what are you on. The difference in rt, dlss, cuda, size, drivers and powerdraw is far too big to ignore that 100 euro difference. You need to be a diehard AMD fanboy to consider the 6950xt over a 4070ti if the difference in price is this much

We are not talking about 100 euros, we are talking 200 to 300, you need to be a gigantic Nvidia fanboy to say that the 4070ti is 300€ better than the 6950xt.

Me a fanboy? I told you that both are overpriced. Fanboy would be saying one is overpriced and not the other.

 

[Leonidas]

The issue is the percent of transistor and core cut down. The die designation number is as arbitrary as the model number. The 4080 and 4070 are the most cut down '80 and '70 chips in Nvidia history by an incredibly wide margin. Even the 4090 is actually a 4080Ti, and not only that, would actually be the worst '80Ti in history.

None of that stuff matters.
Have you thought of it this way. The 4090 needed that much more silicon to be 25% faster and 10% faster than 4080 at 4K and 1440p, respectively. If they did what you suggest there would be barely any separation between the GPUs and no reason to buy the 4090.

 

[Turk1993]

We are not talking about 100 euros, we are talking 200 to 300, you need to be a gigantic Nvidia fanboy to say that the 4070ti is 300€ better than the 6950xt.

Me a fanboy? I told you that both are overpriced. Fanboy would be saying one is overpriced and not the other.

Again did you even read my previous posts, i called them both overpriced and a bad purchase. And the 4070ti is not 300 more expensive stop the cap. You can buy a RTX 4080 for 1379 here, thats a card that cost 1399 msrp here in Belgium. You think a card that has 909 euro msrp gonna cost 1200 min ?

And even if it was 300 more (its not) its still the better card by a large margin. You need to be blind to not see that. The card is literally better in every way, its not even comparable.

 

[lukilladog]

So a 4060 would be around $500-600?

Of course, you must think of it as "A console for your PC".

*in Jen Hsun's own words when talking to investors.

 

[Celcius]

Ever since the pandemic started it feels like we’re living in an alternate reality. Prices are insane these days. The new nvidia cycle is:

Pascal (good)
Turing (skip)
Ampere (good)
Ada Lovelace (skip)

 

[GHG]

If only they weren't on those Samsing dies I would agree

Not following.

This represents the worst upgrade I've seen in a long time. Both from a price and a performance perspective, there is no redeeming quality to be found here. As a reference point the 3070ti was a 10% jump over the best the 2XXX series had to offer:

 

[Turk1993]

Ever since the pandemic started it feels like we’re living in an alternate reality. Prices are insane these days. The new nvidia cycle is:

Pascal (good)
Turing (skip)
Ampere (good)
Ada Lovelace (skip)

It will only get worse im afraid.

 

[CrustyBritches]

At least they are inching ever so slightly in the right direction. Must have killed them having to chop that $100 off the top.

Surely did. They might have felt compelled since they had to change the name.

These cards are still above my price point for a desktop part. Given how the stack is shaping up, I’m not too hopeful for the 4060/4070. Especially after the crappy 3060 last gen. For Pascal and Turing the -60 equaled or surpassed the -80 from the previous gen. 3060 was a $399 2070 and barely beat out the $399 2060 Super. If that’s anything to go by, we’re probably looking at a $499-550 4060 that’s as powerful as a 3070. Basically making no generational advancement at the price point outside of DLSS3.

And honestly, with a $799 4070ti, a $699 4070 and a $599 4060 wouldn’t be too far fetched. $499-550 is me being “hopeful”.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Trash card at an even trashier price.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Best Buy showing these at $849 and $899

 

[HoofHearted]

WOW …

Watching the Gamers Nexus review now…

Steve is holding nothing back in calling out NVIDIA here….

 

[Leonidas]

This is the graph that show how stupidly bloated the GPU prices are.
Throughout the >2 decades of consumer dGPUs we always saw the performance/cost needle going up. And now we're seeing brand new mid-range GPUs with brand new architectures / fabric nodes showing the same performance/cost as 2 year-old cards... but on their release MSRPs.

Prices aren't great but I do wonder how much AMD and Nvidia are to be blamed.

Console prices have went up in areas (Phil Spencer says they're loosing up to $200 per console) and consoles are using a cheaper process node vs. current gen GPUs, and the AIBs have to take a cut too. Maybe it really is a lot more expensive to put these GPUs together as Nvidia said. I'm just glad the price came down $100 vs. 4080 12GB.

 

[Ronin_7]

Nvidia claimed it was 3x faster than 3090 ti

Dear Lord

 

[twilo99]

Not following.

This represents the worst upgrade I've seen in a long time. Both from a price and a performance perspective, there is no redeeming quality to be found here. As a reference point the 3070ti was a 10% jump over the best the 2XXX series had to offer:

Yes, the performance gains are horrible, from that perspective I absolutely agree.

Its just a personal opinion.. I think the Samsung die on the 3xxx series are inferior, so I just wouldn't buy any of them, but that's just me.

 

[NeonDelta]

So glad I got my 3070 for £520 2 years ago.

 

[SomeGit]

Again did you even read my previous posts, i called them both overpriced and a bad purchase. And the 4070ti is not 300 more expensive stop the cap. You can buy a RTX 4080 for 1379 here, thats a card that cost 1399 msrp here in Belgium. You think a card that has 909 euro msrp gonna cost 1200 min ?

Yes? Every leak is pricing the card in continental Europe between 1050 to 1200€ (so even accounting for that 875€ card 175€ to 325€), every AIB is complaing that the US's MSRP is unobtainable and you think that it will be in Europe?
Ignore my posts, why do you think this card is being panned as comically overpriced in Europe? The 4070 TI makes the 7900 XT and the 4080 look good in comparison.

And even if it was 300 more (its not) its still the better card by a large margin. You need to be blind to not see that. The card is literally better in every way, its not even comparable.

I'll repeat, the 6950 XT at that price is still absurd, but to say that 200-300€ is not even comparable is just being a blind fanboy. Their drivers aren't made in gold, DLSS is not that good and you aren't using CUDA. Do you know how many years you have to run a card to make a 200€ difference in power draw alone?

Don't excuse their crappy coolaid, the 4070 ti isn't that good.

 

[lachesis]

Welp, I think I will just get a good CPU and lower priced GPU for my next build. It's not like I use my rig to play games extensively nor most of JRPGs that I play don't have to have that high end graphics card... (and my current 970 works pretty well at 1080p res for those Falcom games + I got steam deck, PS5/XSX/Switch to cover my gaming need)

I use my PC mostly for work and internet - so I will just not think about joining the Master PC race. I think my 970 was a bit over 300 bucks, and I thought I was spending so much money on GPU... but I don't think I want to spend that much money now. Probably would settle around upcoming $4-500 GPU card for my next build and just not think about it much - because it will be good enough for what I do with my PC.

 

[HoofHearted]

Best Buy showing these at $849 and $899

Fucking hell… ASUS strix is $1049 at Microcenter…





I now understand… EVGA saw the stupid train coming with Jensen driving and decided to get off the tracks….

 

[twilo99]

The current GPU market is just bizarre

 

[Leonidas]

Not following.

This represents the worst upgrade I've seen in a long time. Both from a price and a performance perspective, there is no redeeming quality to be found here. As a reference point the 3070ti was a 10% jump over the best the 2XXX series had to offer:

If not for the 3090 Ti (a GPU which probably shouldn't have existed) the 4070 Ti would have been around 8% better than the flagship 3090 at 1440p. Not far off 3070 Ti vs. 2080 Ti.

The 3070 Ti/2080 Ti comparison is helped by the fact that the 2080 Ti was never refreshed, that gap could have easily closed if they did a 2080 Ti refresh (like 3090 Ti) and raised power, pushed clocks and released the full die.

3070 Ti also used more power than the 2080 Ti for 10% more perf.
4070 Ti uses less power than 3090 for around 8% more perf @1440p

 

[Hot5pur]

Will stick to my $630 RTX 3080.
Probably for the next 4 years.
Thank you byeeee.

Unless you need 100 fps and fancy gimmicks like RT that add next to nothing in most games, should be all set (at 4K, with DLSS). I guess we'll see what happens, though.

 

[Turk1993]

I'll repeat, the 6950 XT at that price is still absurd, but to say that 200-300€ is not even comparable is just being a blind fanboy. Their drivers aren't made in gold, DLSS is not that good and you aren't using CUDA.

Tell me you are a Amd fanboy without telling me.

The 4070 TI makes the 7900 XT and the 4080 look good in comparison.

Fuck no haha. The 7900 XT will costs roughly the same as the 4070 TI or even more. If the 4070 TI is badly overpriced, so is the 7900XT and the 4080 lol.

 

[Sleepwalker]

Underwhelming and not interested in pleb 1440p. Will go for a 4090 at some point. Maybe a 4080 if I cave and cant find a 4090.

 

[SomeGit]

Tell me you are a Amd fanboy without telling me.

Feel free to post your GItHub here with your CUDA projects. Or even a simple Hello World, with a square root calculation just to check.
Also feel free to pay 300€ for marginally better upscaling (that's not even avaliable) in most games.

Fuck no haha. The 7900 XT will costs roughly the same as the 4070 TI or even more. If the 4070 TI is badly overpriced, so is the 7900XT and the 4080 lol.

Why do you think both the 7900 XT and 4080 were panned for being overpriced? The 7900 XT especially that thing even was claimed to be worthless at it's price point, yet it still outperforms the 4070 ti, so props to Nvidia for making the 7900XT look good.
Oh wait we're talking to the CUDA developer here.

 

[Neo_game]

So far the best of the new gen cards released. PC gaming is expensive and I am not sure it is going to get cheaper. 4060ti could be even better but GPU is a one time investment IMO for most guys and those guys who like to build PC are going to keep buying parts lol. If Sony and Microsoft can make a decent Pro console next year I think it would be great. I would love to buy a decent spec console which sadly never happens