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PS5 and PS4 System Software Updates release globally today. VRR update coming soon.

Reallink

Member
What? No. The Tempest chip is their alternative to Dolby Atmos. It's there since day one, it has a headphone and a TV version and it'll have a soundbar version. You're 100% wrong here.

I referenced "discrete surround sound systems", not headphones, TV's, or Soundbars. I'm talking about the discrete multi-channel variant of Tempest which was intended to virtualize the "height" and "sound bubble" effects of real Atmos with a proper 5.1. or 7.1 bedlayer.


The Tempest portion of his Road to PS5 deep dive video (last 15 or 20 minutes or so). IIRC he refers to it with some variation of "we hope to", and "if we can get it working".
 
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Swift_Star

Gold Member
I referenced "discrete surround sound systems", not headphones, TV's, or Soundbars. I'm talking about the discrete multi-channel variant of Tempest which was intended to virtualize the "height" and "sound bubble" effects of real Atmos with a proper 5.1. or 7.1 bedlayer.



The Tempest portion of his Road to PS5 deep dive video (last 15 or 20 minutes or so). IIRC he refers to it with some variation of "we hope to", and "if we can get it working".
Source? AFAIK, Tempest is exactly what you’re implying here and it’s there since day one. I still stand: you’re wrong.
 

FrankWza

Member
Cerny himself always referenced it as experimental and tentative.

Shake Head No GIF
 

retsof624

Member
Is this a thing? I thought rest mode was flawless, I haven't had a single issue with it
I went a while without it happening and then the last couple of weeks it's been happening more. I'll put it in rest mode and instead of seeing the rest mode screen it just goes black and then the light on the console is completely off. Then I have to press the power button on the console twice (because the first press and beep does nothing) and then I have to sit through that "repairing console storage". Then I get a screen that says the console wasn't turned off properly. It's happened 4 times in the last two weeks. Not a huge deal, but its annoying. Especially if I had a game going and just wanted to put it in rest mode.
 

GymWolf

Gold Member
People keep saying in this thread that they need to update games to disable vsync, but vsync shouldn't be disabled with VRR because like I said, the frame rate could then be free to go outside of the VRR range and you DO NOT want that. Vsync stops the frame rate from going above max refresh rate.
Yeah, i have v-sync on in my pc with a g-sync panel.
 

NEbeast

Member
VRR is an absolute game changer and extremely under-rated. People poo poo it I suspect have never used it. I've been using a 144hz Gsync monitor since 2016, and now an LG C1 OLED since last year. The lack of tearing is nice, but what people overlook is the lack of any judder in most games. Framerate drops to 57fps now feel barely different from 60fps - like it should.
57-60
Gordon Ramsay Facepalm GIF by Masterchef
 

recursive

Member
Figured I'd get the typical response of someone who has never experienced VRR. I'n genuinely perplexed and curious as to why you are even in this thread, if you don't care about the feature? Fun fact: PC gamer here. No foot in you weird console warriors race. I just love the feature, used with g-sync compatible monitors/tv's.


You'd vouch for it to, if you could use it yourself. But since you can't... Warrior mode activate. Smh. Tag me when you can finally use it, and let me know if you change your opinion on the tech. Cheers love 😘
Interestingly enough after I reascended when I got my hands on a 3080ti a couple weeks ago I decided to pick up elden ring on pc despite playing it on ps5 already. I first started playing on my g sync compatible monitor and still had some stutters and such. When I switched to my g sync monitor it became smooth as fuck.
 

Hobbygaming

has been asked to post in 'Grounded' mode.
I went a while without it happening and then the last couple of weeks it's been happening more. I'll put it in rest mode and instead of seeing the rest mode screen it just goes black and then the light on the console is completely off. Then I have to press the power button on the console twice (because the first press and beep does nothing) and then I have to sit through that "repairing console storage". Then I get a screen that says the console wasn't turned off properly. It's happened 4 times in the last two weeks. Not a huge deal, but its annoying. Especially if I had a game going and just wanted to put it in rest mode.
Hmmm that sucks. I fall asleep with my PS5 on nearly every night and I am always able to pick up where I left off
 

Any framerate that is not divisible into monitor refresh rate will produce judder. That's why games are capped at either 30fps or 60fps, because that number is divisible into a 60hz or 120hz display refresh rate. This is why developers did not just arbitrarily choose something like 35 to lock their FPS to.

We have only just recently seen developers starting to offer 40fps modes because 120hz TVs are becoming common (120/3 = 40).

A 57hz signal will not divide properly into a monitor's refresh rate and will produce screen tearing if not v-synced, or noticeable input lag and judder if v-synced. VRR eliminates needing to worry about this completely.

It's not a case of "hur dur number is close". Get a fucking clue about how the technology works before commenting.
 
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JaksGhost

Member
Previously released PS5 games can be fully optimized for VRR through a game patch
Insomniac is for sure going to do patches for Miles Morales and Ratchet and Clank to take advantage of this. Both games probably have enough headroom in their Fidelity modes to support native 4K with unlocked frame rates in the necessary zone. Same goes for a few other 1st and even 3rd party games with the incentive now being that both consoles are VRR capable. It's only a matter of time before that unlock frame rate toggle becomes standard.
 

Swift_Star

Gold Member
Any framerate that is not divisible into monitor refresh rate will produce judder. That's why games are capped at either 30fps or 60fps, because that number is divisible into a 60hz or 120hz display refresh rate. This is why developers did not just arbitrarily choose something like 35 to lock their FPS to.

We have only just recently seen developers starting to offer 40fps modes because 120hz TVs are becoming common (120/3 = 40).

A 57hz signal will not divide properly into a monitor's refresh rate and will produce screen tearing if not v-synced, or noticeable input lag and judder if v-synced. VRR eliminates needing to worry about this completely.

It's not a case of "hur dur number is close". Get a fucking clue about how the technology works before commenting.
This right here, people, is a prime example of HYPERBOLE.
 
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Thaedolus

Gold Member
Any framerate that is not divisible into monitor refresh rate will produce judder. That's why games are capped at either 30fps or 60fps, because that number is divisible into a 60hz or 120hz display refresh rate. This is why developers did not just arbitrarily choose something like 35 to lock their FPS to.

We have only just recently seen developers starting to offer 40fps modes because 120hz TVs are becoming common (120/3 = 40).

A 57hz signal will not divide properly into a monitor's refresh rate and will produce screen tearing if not v-synced, or noticeable input lag and judder if v-synced. VRR eliminates needing to worry about this completely.

It's not a case of "hur dur number is close". Get a fucking clue about how the technology works before commenting.
This. I got a gsync monitor almost 8 years ago now and it’s insane the difference it makes when going back to something with screen tearing or judder. I don’t really seem to notice it too much on consoles though, likely because of frame rate caps and v sync, which both are suboptimal. VRR is where it’s at. Can’t wait to try it on my TV.
 
This right here, people, is a prime example of HYPERBOLE.

What I said is exactly correct. Watch the Digital Foundry video for the explanation of why - maybe some people smarter than you can educate you on the subject. Any time a framerate is not sticking to its intended target, there will be a measurable increase in input lag and frame judder. Whether you want to drool "WELL I DON'T NOTICE IT!" doesn't change reality.

I swear people in this forum are somehow more retarded than those on Resetera.

Will this be able to kind of fix Bloodborne framepacing? Is the only thing I want 🤣

I can't answer your question, but Bloodborne is a perfect example of a game that has the exact problem I am describing.

For people who don't know, Bloodborne actually sticks pretty close to its 30fps target. However, the framepacing is fucked. There are frequent dips and fluctuations between 29-31fps.

The game is notorious for how awful it feels to play for this reason, compared to other 30fps games with perfect pacing. But the spastics of Neogaf think that's HYPERBOLE because "number looks similar" or "it's only 1fps difference bro".
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
What I said is exactly correct. Watch the Digital Foundry video for the explanation of why - maybe some people smarter than you can educate you on the subject. Any time a framerate is not sticking to its intended target, there will be a measurable increase in input lag and frame judder. Whether you want to drool "WELL I DON'T NOTICE IT!" doesn't change reality.

I swear people in this forum are somehow more retarded than those on Resetera.



I can't answer your question, but Bloodborne is a perfect example of a game that has the exact problem I am describing.

For people who don't know, Bloodborne actually sticks pretty close to its 30fps target. However, the framepacing is fucked. There are frequent dips and fluctuations between 29-31fps.

The game is notorious for how awful it feels to play for this reason, compared to other 30fps games with perfect pacing. But the spastics of Neogaf think that's HYPERBOLE because "number looks similar" or "it's only 1fps difference bro".
Bloodborne is far far from feeling awful to play, so you want to convince people it is not a hyperbole by tripling down on hyperbole? 🤔
 
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Swift_Star

Gold Member
What I said is exactly correct. Watch the Digital Foundry video for the explanation of why - maybe some people smarter than you can educate you on the subject. Any time a framerate is not sticking to its intended target, there will be a measurable increase in input lag and frame judder. Whether you want to drool "WELL I DON'T NOTICE IT!" doesn't change reality.

I swear people in this forum are somehow more retarded than those on Resetera.



I can't answer your question, but Bloodborne is a perfect example of a game that has the exact problem I am describing.

For people who don't know, Bloodborne actually sticks pretty close to its 30fps target. However, the framepacing is fucked. There are frequent dips and fluctuations between 29-31fps.

The game is notorious for how awful it feels to play for this reason, compared to other 30fps games with perfect pacing. But the spastics of Neogaf think that's HYPERBOLE because "number looks similar" or "it's only 1fps difference bro".
Doesn't matter if it's correct, it's still hyperbolic. It's factual that most people won't notice frame drops from 60 to 57, it's not about reality, it's about relevance. This drop is irrelevant no matter how much you cry like an infant about it. Stop being a petulant child. Nobody cares about your childish sensibilities.
 
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BreakOut

Member
Real quick has anyone noticed anything that wasn’t in the beta? I was in the beta and I’m wondering if there was anything now that wasn’t available before. At first I thought VRR was available by the title of the thread.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
Real quick has anyone noticed anything that wasn’t in the beta? I was in the beta and I’m wondering if there was anything now that wasn’t available before. At first I thought VRR was available by the title of the thread.
Apparently ALLM is there too, verified by Vincent from HDTVTest.
 

Lognor

Member
If the screen capture of the VRR option is accurate that means that VRR will be set to off for unsupported games. People will need to go into the options menu to turn it on. I'm guessing a lot of people will never know to turn it on. On XSX it's on automatically. I think VRR should be an option that is on automatically and people can turn off if it's causing issues.

And I wonder how many games will be unsupported. I would guess Sony would go back and patch their own games to make them supported, but what about third parties? Will devs go back to games that released a year ago and patch it to support VRR? Or will we have to rely on its implementation on an unsupported basis?

Also, I think VRR will work on Xbox One games played on XSX, right? But will VRR work on PS4 games played on a PS5? Or those unsupported games or are PS4 games out of scope?
 

ethomaz

Banned
Real quick has anyone noticed anything that wasn’t in the beta? I was in the beta and I’m wondering if there was anything now that wasn’t available before. At first I thought VRR was available by the title of the thread.
The beta ended.
You move to official firmware.

The new beta is not out yet.
 
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Bloodborne is far far from feeling awful to play, so you want to convince people it is not a hyperbole by tripling down on hyperbole? 🤔

I think it feels awful to play, yes. In spite of the rest of the excellent gameplay like the combat mechanics and design, the amount of judder and input lag in Bloodborne is a big damper on enjoyment.

And that's not just my opinion, it's a frequently voiced sentiment online - to the point where you always see people begging for a PS5/PC port, or a patch to fix it (like in this thread). There are a dozen threads of people complaining about it on this forum alone. John Linnemann called it "The posterchild for bad frame pacing" in the Digital Foundry video he made with Lance McDonald, which gives a hint at its notoriety.

So no, it isn't a niche viewpoint at all that seemingly minor framerate fluctuations can have significant detrimental consequences on game enjoyment. And to get back to the topic at hand - VRR solves it.
 
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Reallink

Member
Source? AFAIK, Tempest is exactly what you’re implying here and it’s there since day one. I still stand: you’re wrong.

Developers are able to leverage the audio processor for in game effects (like more accurate reverb simulations), but the output surround formats are not processed or altered in any way. It's bog standard MPCM, Dolby Digital, or DTS (same as PS3 and PS4). If or when they ever implement multichannel Tempest, it will likely require a calibration step with the controller mic like the TV implementation currently employs. Multichannel support has always been last on their roadmap and will be included in a firmware update like TV speakers were 7 or 8 months ago. You will know if or when it's implemented as it'll be an advertised feature update, it's certainly not there now.
 
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Fafalada

Fafracer forever
People will need to go into the options menu to turn it on.
People coped just fine with FSAA being a menu-option on PS4 Pro - they'll figure this out too.

And I wonder how many games will be unsupported. I would guess Sony would go back and patch their own games to make them supported, but what about third parties? Will devs go back to games that released a year ago and patch it to support VRR? Or will we have to rely on its implementation on an unsupported basis?
Does it matter? Majority of games aren't optimized for VRR on any platform - you just get a dynamic VSync. Nothing in Sony's wording suggests it works any different on PS5 (outside of 'concerned' posters, which are concerned every single time anything is announced for the PS platforms).
But it is possible to go beyond that if you specifically target VRR. Of course, like the 40fps mode, only select few devs will likely bother, particularly given the market penetration being so low.
 

Lognor

Member
No it's not. You need to go and turn it on under Video Modes in the settings.
Really? I just got my tv with VRR and when I went in it was already on. Not sure I would be able to switch that to on when I didn't have a VRR tv before. It's a mystery.
 

ethomaz

Banned
Yeah I mean is the official firmware any different from the beta that just ended.

Yeah, so it’s probably the same as with the beta had. Was wondering if there was any fine-tuning done between Beta 4.1 and now.
It is basically the same.
 

Arioco

Member


He's not wrong. Even a small dip to 57-58fps causes a stutter, which won't happen if you have VRR enabled.

Playing a game that constantly changes from 55 to 60 fps on a 60 Hz display that doesn't support any form of VRR is VERY annoying (and I know too well, I've been there and I ended up lowering the setting to get to 60 fps locked).

What's more, in my opinion that's the ideal scenario to use VRR: to smooth out small dips. Remember VRR doesn't magically turn 40 fps into 60 fps. If that happens you'll notice the hit to fluidity, you'll just won't get the judder you'd normally see without VRR.


Off topic: I hope SONY won't even try to deny they were holding back this update for PS5 for over a year just to sell more TVs. I mean, only a few days after they update their TVs they release new info about VRR on PS5? What a coincidence! 🙄 Come on, SONY, come on...
 
Gonna guess since it’s 60fps with drops it’ll be supported as it’s system level implementation. Patches will likely only be needed for games locked to 30fps/60fps with overhead or to disable vsync. Would be nice to get an always on 120hz mode as well like XSX, but one step at a time.

People need to learn Sony PR is overly safe, just like with BC, which has been a thing since the “Other OS” class action.
Interesting perspective. We’ll see soon.
 

RafterXL

Member
Fuck Sony and their "months". The damn console is a YEAR AND A HALF old already and still missing a feature that should have been available day 1.
Regarding consoles, I also have both and I'm looking to get Elden Ring soon. I've played a lot of Xbox recently and fancy playing it on PS5 but I'm finding it a little hard to choose that knowing there's no VRR, with the performance as it is. I hope we get VRR on PS5 sooner rather than later so who whole topic can be put to bed.
I have the game on both systems and 180+ hours in the game. Either wait until the PS5 has VRR or buy it in the Xbox. People will tell you to play the PS4 version but it looks significantly worse during motion in the open world, has major CBR artifacting on enemies at a distance, and artifacting/ghosting around the character when you pan the camera quickly . The PS5 version just plays like shit without VRR, everything from the choppy frames to the lack of camera smoothness and even the map scrolling isn't as smooth.

Either way, don't buy the game on the promise the feature will be available at some point, the way they've been dragging their feet who knows how long it will actually be.
 

MasterCornholio

Gold Member
Fuck Sony and their "months". The damn console is a YEAR AND A HALF old already and still missing a feature that should have been available day 1.

I have the game on both systems and 180+ hours in the game. Either wait until the PS5 has VRR or buy it in the Xbox. People will tell you to play the PS4 version but it looks significantly worse during motion in the open world, has major CBR artifacting on enemies at a distance, and artifacting/ghosting around the character when you pan the camera quickly . The PS5 version just plays like shit without VRR, everything from the choppy frames to the lack of camera smoothness and even the map scrolling isn't as smooth.

Either way, don't buy the game on the promise the feature will be available at some point, the way they've been dragging their feet who knows how long it will actually be.

Sometime this year.
 

Shmunter

Gold Member
Point of note, If you have PSVR (rev2) you are downgraded to Hdmi 2.0. No 120hz, no VRR.

Thought I’d share my brilliant wisdom.
 

mitch1971

Member
No chance they allowed us to watch any youtube video using the pin feature, and not just select gaming videos? Didn't think so.
 

Fafalada

Fafracer forever
Halo: Infinite is one of the rare cases where it doesn't work out of the box*, possibly because of an issue/bug with the games V-Syncing.
While I don't know what Halo does, it's entirely possible to break VRR through certain implementation approaches - on consoles at least, without bugs.
 
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