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Phil Spencer confirms that some new future Bethesda titles will be Xbox and PC exclusive

Mister Wolf

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I posted the links. Look at them. I also posted a wiki link saying otherwise. Is Jeff Gardiner lying on his resume?
 

NickFire

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This confuses me because a game like Spiderman would sell well on both Xbox and Switch yet Sony does not release it anywhere but PlayStation, but MS should put their big titles everywhere because why? Wouldn't making the big titles exclusive get more people to your services rather than putting your titles everywhere so people can easily avoid Gamepass the thing you want to expand? Which grows Gamepass faster making the games available everywhere or exclusive to the Xbox platform?
I understand the argument that they should be exclusive because then people have to buy an Xbox to play them. But any comparison between Halo / Forza / Gears / Spiderman / other Sony games, and the AAA games MS just bought, miss an elephant in the room. Every AAA games requires investment including the new ones, but the new ones also have an acquisition cost that is very high. MS can afford it sure, but they spent it intending to make money from it. It might actually be in the best interests of every GP subscriber's wallet to not make them exclusive if you think about it, because one way or another MS wants a return on that investment.
 
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Reality Czar

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Spider-Man was a single game developed for PS4. DOOM, Fallout, Skyrim, etc. are all games that have existed for years, some over a decade, across platforms. Them being sold multiplat is part of what made them so big in the first place.
 
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DarkMage619

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I understand the argument that they should be exclusive because then people have to buy an Xbox to play them. But any comparison between Halo / Forza / Gears / Spiderman / other Sony games, and the AAA games MS just bought, miss an elephant in the room. Every AAA games requires investment including the new ones, but the new ones also have an acquisition cost that is very high. MS can afford it sure, but they spent it intending to make money from it. It might actually be in the best interests of every GP subscriber's wallet to not make them exclusive if you think about it, because one way or another MS wants a return on that investment.
Can't they get a return on investment by getting more subscribers? If you can get the games and avoid Gamepass altogether you would be delaying that return over accelerating it. Plus games on other consoles costs more money both in terms of development costs and the cut those platform owners receive.

Spider-Man was a single game developed for PS4. DOOM, Fallout, Skyrim, etc. are all games that have existed for years, some over a decade, across platforms. Them being sold multiplat is part of what made them so big in the first place.
The games you mentioned made a name for themselves on the PC. PC will still get those titles. So those games will remain multiplat.
 
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Bernkastel

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Wow. The anger. Half of this makes no sense. If Sony is doing something now they didn’t do for 15 years then can we assume that Microsoft wasn’t capable of doing it for 15 years? Because they were allowed to and didn’t.
If Sony is doing something now they didn’t do for 15 years then can we assume that Microsoft wasn’t capable of doing it for 15 years? Because they were allowed to and didn’t.
They don't have a sport studio. I don't even know how you come to these conclusions, but no one at Xbox were panicking over not having a baseball game for the last 15 years. Being able to make a baseball game is not the first concern of a platform holder.
Wow. The anger. Half of this makes no sense.
Says the guy who has been arguing with digital avatars for 19 pages. You are now trying to hide your own confusion by projecting yourself on others.
 

DaGwaphics

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Spider-Man was a single game developed for PS4. DOOM, Fallout, Skyrim, etc. are all games that have existed for years, some over a decade, across platforms. Them being sold multiplat is part of what made them so big in the first place.

There were a lot of Spider-Man games before that one, and those sold as well as they did because they were mult-plat. Each individual entry in a franchise is a single game at the end of the day. Street Fighter V literally has a number attached but was still a single entry.
 

NickFire

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Can't they get a return on investment by getting more subscribers? If you can get the games and avoid Gamepass altogether you would be delaying that return over accelerating it. Plus games on other consoles costs more money both in terms of development costs and the cut those platform owners receive.


The games you mentioned made a name for themselves on the PC. PC will still get those titles. So those games will remain multiplat.
Maybe they can. But there are a lot of unknowns and little reason to believe their existing console market share is rapidly changing from what I can tell. And I'd still think it makes more sense from a consumer standpoint to let someone else pay for those returns, but that's just me.
 

Genx3

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Even as an Xbox owner this kind of sucks, Bethesda were a profitable company who were able to make the games they wanted without Microsoft investment.

There are many smaller and struggling indy companies to whom that money would have been mutually beneficial and really made a difference. But instead it's lining people's pockets in what is basically a permanent exclusively deal for games that would have been made anyway.

It's a good business move by Microsoft, but it's buying themselves out of a problem and isn't really good for the consumer.

There is also the gamepass business model to worry about, all these Bethesda games are going to have a lot more DLC or software as a service stuff bolted on now, single player AAA titles cannot afford to be on gamepass without them.
Yup getting more games on Game Pass for $15 a month totally sucks.
I feel you there.
Even the fact the Zenimax/Bethesda were going to sell to the highest bidder anyway this sucks. Imagine a scenario where Sony would have bought Zen/Beth and Xbox the console where Marrowwind first launched as an exclusive never got another Zen/Beth game.
 

driqe

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I think Xbox would rather get Ark 2 as exclusive rather than TES6, just my take tho.
 

driqe

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Yea that's likely true.
That is why Xbox/MS bought the Ark2 Dev and publisher and that is also why XGS did not buy Zenimax/Bethesda because they absolutely wanted the Ark 2 as an exclusive over the Elder Scrolls 6...
Ark 2 would sell more Xbox consoles than TES6 or Starfield, Microsoft are the good guys so they don't care about exclusives, I can also bet that Halo is a 6 month timed exclusive too

Ark 2 has also been confirmed as exclusive already
 
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Genx3

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Ark 2 would sell more Xbox consoles than TES6 or Starfield, Microsoft are the good guys so they don't care about exclusives, I can also bet that Halo is a 6 month timed exclusive too

Ark 2 has also been confirmed as exclusive already

Where do you think Halo Infinite will land 6 months after the XSX launch?
 
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Hezekiah

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In 2013 under a different CEO

They have since simplified the top level reporting into cloud, business and personal computing. They still give revenue numbers for personal computing and the device lines under that category

To link that to gamepass being a massive loss leader with any reasonable sources is a stretch but okay.
Pretty sure they stopped doing it before Nadella took over.

In terms of GamePass you've got Greenberg publicly admitting 'it doesn't make them much money'. No financials released, lots of gamers paying pennies for it thanks to long-term deals. Then you have the development and marketing costs of all their internal studios. And the money paid to third-parties to host their games, and for every individual download. And then the costs marketing the service itself.

Do you really believe it's some big money-spinner? Sounds like head-in-the-clouds stuff to me. GamePass will be getting price increase sooner than later because it's a money sink.
 

driqe

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Where do you think Halo Infinite will land 6 months after the XSX launch?
Playstation 4/5.

It's clear Xbox is going 3rd party. They acquire a 3rd party publisher only to continue making 3rd party games.

Halo cost more to develop than any Bethesda game, if they can't recoup the cost on Bethesda games being exclusive, that surely means that Halo and all other Xbox Studios titles will be on ps4/5.
 

Genx3

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Playstation 4/5.

It's clear Xbox is going 3rd party. They acquire a 3rd party publisher only to continue making 3rd party games.

Halo cost more to develop than any Bethesda game, if they can't recoup the cost on Bethesda games being exclusive, that surely means that Halo and all other Xbox Studios titles will be on ps4/5.
Oh boy.
Not happening.
 

DaGwaphics

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Playstation 4/5.

It's clear Xbox is going 3rd party. They acquire a 3rd party publisher only to continue making 3rd party games.

Halo cost more to develop than any Bethesda game, if they can't recoup the cost on Bethesda games being exclusive, that surely means that Halo and all other Xbox Studios titles will be on ps4/5.

In all honesty, they might look at Bethesda different from their in-house teams. They did stress that it was important for Bethesda to operate as it always has. If Bethesda does stay primarily multi-plat it would be unorthodox but could lead to more acquisitions/expansion in a shorter period of time. Maybe more "free" games for us.
 
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junguler

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it's their right as they have bought bethesda but we don't have to like it and this comes from a pc only gamer, i didn't like sony making exclusive spider man games after decades of them being multi platform either. we all lose in these situations no matter if you have the console getting the game or not.
 

Mister Wolf

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Have we seen any gameplay footage or had confirmation? Heard very little about what the game is about.

We haven't seen footage because Todd Howard doesn't want to show footage. The last game he directed Fallout 4 was revealed at E3 in June and released in November.
 

Shelookdlvl18

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Are these two scenarios (Bethesda Games vs. PlayStation Studios games) even comparable?

Sony makes God of War to sell to PlayStation users. All cost-related and design-related decisions are made in accordance with the available user base.

With Bethesda, it is different. MS does not only have to bear the development cost of the game, but they also need to amortize the $7.5B they paid for the acquisition on top of that. Additionally, PS userbase is 3x higher than Xbox userbase. In other words, keeping games off of PS is roughly 300% more expensive for Xbox than it is for PS to keep games off of Xbox. That's why we see so many high-quality timed exclusives on PS. And that's why recovering that $7.5B acquisition money is an issue for MS -- which is why they said "some new future games will be exclusive."

In other words, Sony recovers the development cost of the game. MS needs to recover the development cost + the $7.5B acquisition cost from Bethesda games to make the investment worthwhile.
This isn't how it works... Like at all.

Sony does indeed make God of War to sell to Playstation users, and more importantly... Potential Playstation users. Content attracts customers to their platform.

I'm assuming it was at this point that you suffered a stroke? Because from this point on, you're pretty far off the mark on just about everything.

First, your assertion that MS needs to replace the cash it spent on Bethesda is simply false. There's no spin or angle needed. MS's cash reserves sit at almost $140b. That's compared to Alphabet's $117b, and Amazon's $49b. If that weren't enough, MS is 1 of only 2 US companies which hold a God-like AAA credit rating. If you're not familiar with the S&P's credit ratings... In short, it means that MS can borrow money from whoever, and whenever they want. The United States of America is far more likely to default on it's loans, and go bankrupt than MS is. To believe that MS has backed itself into a corner here, and NEEDS to release Bethesda games on Playstation is absurd. Because now that they're owned by MS, Bethesda games serve much the same purpose that God of War does for Sony.

Just to ensure your argument is completely devoid of logic, you matter of factly state that the Playstation userbase is 3x higher than the Xbox userbase. Nevermind a simple Google search would've spared you the time to even post it. For reference, The Playstation Network has 114 million active users, compared to Xbox Live's 90 million active users.
 

Shelookdlvl18

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PS5 games will join PSNow sooner or later and PSNow is also on PC so PC + Steam 120 millions (more ports coming) + all their consoles and they basically have the same "reach" (or more since they have like 4 times consoles sold). They might even add PSNow on mobile...
I hope you're counting all Sony's consoles, going back to the PS1.

Because even basic math, and logical estimates show that it's unlikely the PS4 outsold the Xbox One by anything more than 2 to 1. If that.

Why even bother forming an argument if you plan on ruining any chance of being credible right off the bat?
 
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Hitchyhero

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Pretty sure they stopped doing it before Nadella took over.

In terms of GamePass you've got Greenberg publicly admitting 'it doesn't make them much money'. No financials released, lots of gamers paying pennies for it thanks to long-term deals. Then you have the development and marketing costs of all their internal studios. And the money paid to third-parties to host their games, and for every individual download. And then the costs marketing the service itself.

Do you really believe it's some big money-spinner? Sounds like head-in-the-clouds stuff to me. GamePass will be getting price increase sooner than later because it's a money sink.

How do you go from "not making much money" to money sink. Those are completely two different things.

Let's be honest, you don't know squat about the profitability of gamepass and neither does anyone else (who doesn't work for MS). You don't know once the people on trials or deals end if the profitability will rocket. You don't know if gamepass hits a certain subscriber number that the profitability will scale much better.
 
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Batiman

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Pretty sure they stopped doing it before Nadella took over.

In terms of GamePass you've got Greenberg publicly admitting 'it doesn't make them much money'. No financials released, lots of gamers paying pennies for it thanks to long-term deals. Then you have the development and marketing costs of all their internal studios. And the money paid to third-parties to host their games, and for every individual download. And then the costs marketing the service itself.

Do you really believe it's some big money-spinner? Sounds like head-in-the-clouds stuff to me. GamePass will be getting price increase sooner than later because it's a money sink.
Holy shit you’re still going on? Every time I pop into this thread you’re putting in work. Keep fighting the good fight.
 

Aguero9320

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Attack? Microsoft has trillions blah blah blah...7.5 billion chump change blah blah...
Let’s see it! These exclusives that nobody is excited about are 2 more exclusives than are on their consoles. Does that mean the evil within 3 should come to PS? They never sell particularly well.
Okay, as you clearly aren't living in the real word, and have no understanding of how contracts and commitments work, I'll back away from commenting further here on the detail :messenger_tears_of_joy:

I might play those two games on GamePass at some point if they add a rewards quest. Getting close to a free HD expansion now thanks to that.
Holy shit you’re still going on? Every time I pop into this thread you’re putting in work. Keep fighting the good fight.
Working 9 to 5, what a way to make a living...
 

Gods&Monsters

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I hope you're counting all Sony's consoles, going back to the PS1.

Because even basic math, and logical estimates show that it's unlikely the PS4 outsold the Xbox One by anything more than 2 to 1. If that.

Why even bother forming an argument if you plan on ruining any chance of being credible right off the bat?
I was just using his dumb logic of counting every Steam user as a Xbox user because MS games are on Steam (Sony games are also on Steam but whatever). That you're fine with but you had to jump and break your heels as soon as I mentioned a random number about PS Now compatible devices?

The numbers he pulled from his ass are so accurate I have to be careful.

Lol go hide
 
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KungFucius

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PS fanboys are nuts if they think that Sony games would do better on PC than MS games because PS sells more systems than Xbox. I am sure I am not the only PC gamer that bought a PS5 to play Sony games and didn't even consider an XSX because I already have access to those games. Same held for the Xbone as soon as MS started putting exclusives on PC.

If Sony put their games on PC I would have 530 more bucks to spend on games instead of buying their loss leading hardware to play disk based games I may buy or sell used. What choice would I have on PC but to buy them digitally at market price without taking an available console away from someone who will buy more games on it? MS doesn't force me to pay such a high entry fee to play their games.

The thing that is interesting here is that MS's move might push more people towards PC gaming from/ in addition to consoles who are less price sensitive but it also gives a path to those who are price sensitive in the XSS. I find it hard to believe that there aren't PS5 gamers who have gamed for generations that will pony up some dough for a way to play the follow up to Skyrim.
 

MonarchJT

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I was just using his dumb logic of counting every Steam user as a Xbox user because MS games are on Steam (Sony games are also on Steam but whatever). That you're fine with but you had to jump and break your heels as soon as I mentioned a random number about PS Now compatible devices?

The numbers he pulled from his ass are so accurate I have to be careful.

Lol go hide
It is not really difficult to understand a simple concept. If Sony released Spiderman, or every other big NEW game, on Steam it would instantly access that users (currently more than 120 million users) The game would have sold more than double (given the large increase in user reach), certainly bringing perhaps less revenue to Sony than its store on its console but still huge revenues. Well that's exactly what ms is doing. Nobody cares if you want to call these users, Xbox users, steam users, PC users, users and that's it. Ms (just like Sony) is mainly interested in selling software, we know well for example that ps5 (especially Digital) sells in great loss and you know why? Precisely to increase rapidly the user base because without that every console would be thin hot air. Do you think a game like Sea of Thieves without having that huge user base (steam + console). would have had a chance to survive if it were confined to Xbox One and its 50 million users? Sony will certainly do better than Xbox, albeit not as in the last gen, as far as sales of consoles are concerned, but after the unification of the platforms owned by Ms, if does not decide to release every new game on PC, Sony will have a lot less smaller user reach than Microsoft. This is simple
 
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reksveks

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You need to know the following key information, how much money does console make from:
- mtx transaction
- services like ps+, gold, now, gamepass
- game sales

I wonder what the breakdown is like for both companies.
 

MonarchJT

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You need to know the following key information, how much money does console make from:
- mtx transaction
- services like ps+, gold, now, gamepass
- game sales

I wonder what the breakdown is like for both companies.
i think we saw it ..more than half come from mtx,dlc,services
 
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Heisenberg007

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"MS doesn't need to recover the acquisition costs"
"MS does not need PlayStation sales"
"MS is playing the long game"

Yet the same people can't explain why MS said that only "some new future games" will be Xbox/PC exclusives and why they haven't said that all Bethesda games will be 100% exclusives to Xbox/PC, now that there is no more legal binding post acquisition. lol
 

Hitchyhero

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"MS doesn't need to recover the acquisition costs"
"MS does not need PlayStation sales"
"MS is playing the long game"

Yet the same people can't explain why MS said that only "some new future games" will be Xbox/PC exclusives and why they haven't said that all Bethesda games will be 100% exclusives to Xbox/PC, now that there is no more legal binding post acquisition. lol
I don't really care what MS does with their games tbh. I do find it ironic that for years PS gamers said 'lol Xbox has no games' and now they are port begging (when many claimed they had a gaming PC prior)

Fact of the matter is no one knows why they havnt said all future games will be exclusive. Perhaps they can't make that blanket statement because some bathesda games are in a binding contract to be on PS. Perhaps they want people to realise the gamepass benefits by releasing the game with the advertisement of $70/€70 on PS or free with your gamepass sub.
 
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DaGwaphics

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"MS doesn't need to recover the acquisition costs"
"MS does not need PlayStation sales"
"MS is playing the long game"

Yet the same people can't explain why MS said that only "some new future games" will be Xbox/PC exclusives and why they haven't said that all Bethesda games will be 100% exclusives to Xbox/PC, now that there is no more legal binding post acquisition. lol

There are different long games that can be played.

1). You integrate everything full first-party, but you do have to keep an eye on the overall cost of running first party (though I'm sure MS can still afford it, LOL). What would be expected, but maybe could be limiting regarding future growth (in number of studios etc.). I still think this is what the end-game will be, but maybe there is some red tape on some of the unannounced games also. 🤷‍♂️

2). You make these major purchases for GP and Xbox (benefit for Xbox because the games will now be optimized primarily for that system, you have marketing locked in, etc.) but try not to rock the boat on the bottom line too much (obviously being available on GP is going to erase some sales). This might free MS up to be very aggressive in growing first-party in the short term, as long as these acquisitions continue to break-even at least, there is no additional burden with costs. The sky becomes the limit.

We have to wait and see what they are doing.
 
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MonarchJT

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"MS doesn't need to recover the acquisition costs"
"MS does not need PlayStation sales"
"MS is playing the long game"

Yet the same people can't explain why MS said that only "some new future games" will be Xbox/PC exclusives and why they haven't said that all Bethesda games will be 100% exclusives to Xbox/PC, now that there is no more legal binding post acquisition. lol
You know that literally SOME new ps5 games will be exclusive to the console right ?