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Analysis [NX Gamer] AC: Valhalla - XsX vs PS5 - The first REAL head to head battle.

Aug 28, 2019
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But why are you even listening to the idiotic fanboys that made those claims in the first place? You don’t get to listen to the worst of the worst and then quote them to laugh at people that didn’t agree with them in the first place.

You won’t find many that don’t have an Xbox avatar that said anything remotely close to that the Xbox will be running games 33%+ better, you just ignore those dipshits that say stuff like that, much like how you just ignore any of the morons with Craig and Sony/PlayStation avatars.

Every thread you're in you're arguing with people you disagree with about console x or y, not really the person to give advice on ignoring other people's arguments.
 

anothertech

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But why are you even listening to the idiotic fanboys that made those claims in the first place? You don’t get to listen to the worst of the worst and then quote them to laugh at people that didn’t agree with them in the first place.

You won’t find many that don’t have an Xbox avatar that said anything remotely close to that the Xbox will be running games 33%+ better, you just ignore those dipshits that say stuff like that, much like how you just ignore any of the morons with Craig and Sony/PlayStation avatars.
Man. This news is just killing some of these Xbox guys lol.

Happy face mask indeed.
 

Truespeed

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1. Lol, no the CPU on PS5 isn't performing better than Xbox series x.

2. The bolded text proves my point that game development kit and time developers have with it plays a role. You can't brute force your way through bad coding / non efficient coding. Just look how emulation works on PC for example. Multiplatform games are having slight issues on xbox series x right now because of the dev kits being late and developers scrambling (especially now because of covid). This is why the xbox series x is getting late patches. I have no doubt this game will probably get patched on xbox series x soon.

He clearly said CU. You know what that is, right?
 

longdi

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This is getting boring, to hang onto ACV slightlier spotty performance on SX, yet DMC5SE was a clear win for SX.
The screen tear can be resolved by playing on a VRR display, and hope Ubi issue a stability patch for consoles..

When will the next compare be out? Dirt5? WDL? NBA2K1? Next plz :messenger_unamused::messenger_ok:
 
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Aug 28, 2019
8,239
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This is getting boring, to hang onto ACV slightlier spotty performance on SX, yet DMC5SE was a clear win for SX.
The screen tear can be resolved by playing on a VRR display, and hope Ubi issue a stability patch for consoles..

When will the next compare be out? Dirt5? WDL? NBA2K1? Next plz :messenger_unamused::messenger_ok:

Hear that people having trouble with screen tearing? Just buy a new TV! I like that your "clear win" for SX is a game where it's anything but a win in high framerate mode, I mean I guess you can claim "hey look, in 3/4 modes it does better, that's good!" but what sort of victory is it when in that 4th mode the framerate can drop to half of PS5's?

BTW here's what DF said about DMC 5: RTX Perf mode: "The overall takeaway here is that both systems are essentially like-for-like." high FPS mode: "Meanwhile, in many of the gameplay areas we tested, PS5 is significantly faster and more consistent that Series X overall." "In normal mode, Xbox Series X is consistently faster than PlayStation 5 but only in single digit percentage terms - around eight per cent." "In terms of correlating on-paper specs to the actual experience on-screen, PlayStation 5 is either punching above its weight, or Xbox Series X isn't delivering on the full potential promised by a bigger silicon investment and a much more substantial memory interface."

They seem to indicate the only reason PS5 has issues is it's forced 120hz which they hope will be patched... what happens if that gets a patch? Are you going to be okay?
 

SlimySnake

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Feb 5, 2013
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This is getting boring, to hang onto ACV slightlier spotty performance on SX, yet DMC5SE was a clear win for SX.
The screen tear can be resolved by playing on a VRR display, and hope Ubi issue a stability patch for consoles..

When will the next compare be out? Dirt5? WDL? NBA2K1? Next plz :messenger_unamused::messenger_ok:
Dmc was a clear win for the xsx? In which reality?
 

longdi

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Dmc was a clear win for the xsx? In which reality?

In DF report, it's on their website, easier to read.
3 of 4 tasks went to SX. The high fps tasks loss seems like a bug on SX, as the fps did not do any better than the normal fps mode

Reminder, capcom almost released the SX version without RT, to be patched later. This is another clue SX dev environment is not as easy to tap out than PS5
 

longdi

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Hear that people having trouble with screen tearing? Just buy a new TV! I like that your "clear win" for SX is a game where it's anything but a win in high framerate mode, I mean I guess you can claim "hey look, in 3/4 modes it does better, that's good!" but what sort of victory is it when in that 4th mode the framerate can drop to half of PS5's?

BTW here's what DF said about DMC 5: RTX Perf mode: "The overall takeaway here is that both systems are essentially like-for-like." high FPS mode: "Meanwhile, in many of the gameplay areas we tested, PS5 is significantly faster and more consistent that Series X overall." "In normal mode, Xbox Series X is consistently faster than PlayStation 5 but only in single digit percentage terms - around eight per cent." "In terms of correlating on-paper specs to the actual experience on-screen, PlayStation 5 is either punching above its weight, or Xbox Series X isn't delivering on the full potential promised by a bigger silicon investment and a much more substantial memory interface."

They seem to indicate the only reason PS5 has issues is it's forced 120hz which they hope will be patched... what happens if that gets a patch? Are you going to be okay?

The frame rate mode sounds like a bug and an area for software fix. Otherwise SX leading in the other 3 modes, on a consistent 8% basis, is pretty good for a game that wasn't quite ready for it, wont you say? (Hint:RT mode was a very last minute add back for MS consoles)
 

Tajaz2426

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I don’t think that the adaptive triggers would work well in multiplayer, but they can be used in the SP campaign. You just get a little more immersion from it.

I hoping they bring out a controller for PC that can do what the dual sense does, as I mostly game on PC. It really could add to playing games all together.
 
Aug 28, 2019
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The frame rate mode sounds like a bug and an area for software fix. Otherwise SX leading in the other 3 modes, on a consistent 8% basis, is pretty good for a game that wasn't quite ready for it, wont you say? (Hint:RT mode was a very last minute add back for MS consoles)

The port seems hasty in general (no 60hz option for PS5) but you seem to only be looking at where that can be used as an argument for SX. You'd be better off just admitting the only contests we have are so close neither side should really be celebrating instead of pretending you're side is ahead.
 

Truespeed

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Anyone from Ubisoft here? Can you ask them to add the following to their XSX AC Valhalla bug tracker?

1. Replace broken API's with optimized API's
2. Switch from Alpha SDK to Release SDK
3. Apply CU boost patch
4. Fix tearing
5. Stop PS5 preferential treatment
6. Reassign lazy devs
 

geordiemp

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Sep 5, 2013
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But why are you even listening to the idiotic fanboys that made those claims in the first place? You don’t get to listen to the worst of the worst and then quote them to laugh at people that didn’t agree with them in the first place.

You won’t find many that don’t have an Xbox avatar that said anything remotely close to that the Xbox will be running games 33%+ better, you just ignore those dipshits that say stuff like that, much like how you just ignore any of the morons with Craig and Sony/PlayStation avatars.

 

longdi

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The port seems hasty in general (no 60hz option for PS5) but you seem to only be looking at where that can be used as an argument for SX. You'd be better off just admitting the only contests we have are so close neither side should really be celebrating instead of pretending you're side is ahead.

I am not celebrating, i already said to the next game.
The 2 titles we seen DMC5E and ACV are indeed close. I would say SX edged it on average because it was clearer in DMC5E.

I also said we should wait until at least 2021 for developers to get comfortable with both systems, and hopefully a few exclusives built without the jaguar cores.
Right now, PS5 is punching well above its weight (quote DF Richard).
It is not without merit to say Mark Cerny built a system from a software developers pov which he is.
PS5 was aimed to have the quickest turnaround time of all PS, and it shows with early class leading results and developers profess of love. 🤷‍♀️
 
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rnlval

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Love it. XSX is less complex to program for than PS5 but we need to wait for devs to catch up to that truth because... reasons. XSX went with fixed clocks because it’s better and MS knows best but just in case it isn’t, they can... patch PS5 variable clocks because... reasons.

The denial is strong. Meanwhile people who predict these results are still being doubted, because somehow reality will bend itself to please people like you. We just need to wait for Doctor Strange to open up the multiverse portal and transport another dimension into our own.
The context: XSX is less complex to program in relation to clock speed frequency handling and that's just a single aspect!
 
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rnlval

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Assuming that Microsoft flips a switch and enables variable clocks.

How would that work?

The system was designed around fixed clocks so it can't be just a simple flip of a switch. The cooling system needs to be taken into consideration as well as the power controller. I don't know of either are built for higher variable clocks since they wanted fixed clocks in the beginning.
Examples,
1. Trade lower CPU clock speed for higher GPU clock speed.
2. Trade non-AVX 256-bit CPU workload for higher GPU clock speed.

XSX CPU is already trading non-SMT for a higher 3.8Ghz clock speed via runtime profile software mode.
 

Razvedka

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Oct 20, 2018
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Examples,
1. Trade lower CPU clock speed for higher GPU clock speed.
2. Trade non-AVX 256-bit CPU workload for higher GPU clock speed.

XSX CPU is already trading non-SMT for a higher 3.8Ghz clock speed via runtime profile software mode.

This isn't going to happen. Sony's cooling solution is exotic and their box enormous because of the heat generated by their GPU clocks + I.O. complex. The XSX box is much smaller by comparison, and the cooler is not as beefy. My bet here is there's not going to be any variable clock boost like on PS5 for XSX in the future. They have fixed clocks, it's done.

It is a marvel though to see people even talk about this. Up until this very week there were constant posts saying that the PS5 clocks 'weren't real' and that it was basically just a 'boost' mode similar to what we've seen in the past that was unsustainable.

As for the CPU side of things, at this juncture I'd also bet that the PS5 has more resources there. Possibly from some of the Zen 3 stuff but also due to additional dedicated silicon offloading a greater degree of workload vs XSX.

All of this said, I'm trying to withhold judgment until the DX12U stuff gets sorted. To me that's basically the final 'barrier' for a final performance analysis, because I don't believe that the XSX is super hard to develop for overall. It won't take us 'years' of developers figuring out that box ala PS3 to squeeze secret performance out of it relative to the easier competition. If MS gets their devkit and API situation sorted and we're still seeing results like this then that's obviously game set and match.
 
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longdi

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And Call of Duty isn't?

I would like to know why you think that.

Edit: Maybe you didn't see it since it's fairly new.


I'm sure we will get better comparisons soon.

What am i supposed to say here? Besides reporting geordiemp for troll warring again. 🤷‍♀️

Im sure you seen the comments, bot match vs online match, killcam/online match start fps dips.

It is a stretch to compare them, but let's just say gameplay wise fps about the same, ps5 has more spikey frametimes(smartshift contention?), series x has a pinch more droppy fps (devkits less mature).

PS fans sure are getting aggressive to push the idea both hardware are on level terms. Oh well, the bigger the push, the bigger the crow to serve.

I have already laid down my marker, i expect SX games to have up to ~30% hardware win at the end.
 
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Mar 27, 2020
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Uncharted bunghole
What am i supposed to say here? Besides reporting geordiemp for troll warring again. 🤷‍♀️

Im sure you seen the comments, bot match vs online match, killcam/online match start fps dips.

It is a stretch to compare them, but let's just say gameplay wise fps about the same, ps5 has more spikey frametimes(smartshift contention?), series x has a pinch more droppy fps (devkits less mature).

PS fans sure are getting aggressive to push the idea both hardware are on level terms. Oh well, the bigger the push, the bigger the crow to serve.

I have already laid down my marker, i expect SX games to have up to ~30% hardware win at the end.

Not at the end of the generation right?
 
Mar 27, 2020
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Uncharted bunghole
Nope, i am hopeful latest being holidays 2021 for crow eating time.

Well at least you have a date for that. But what happens if it's still a problem?

Surely dev kits can't take that long to get used to. I don't know if a 3X increase in the performance difference can be achieved by then.
 
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rnlval

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This isn't going to happen. Sony's cooling solution is exotic and their box enormous because of the heat generated by their GPU clocks + I.O. complex. The XSX box is much smaller by comparison, and the cooler is not as beefy. My bet here is there's not going to be any variable clock boost like on PS5 for XSX in the future. They have fixed clocks, it's done.

It is a marvel though to see people even talk about this. Up until this very week there were constant posts saying that the PS5 clocks 'weren't real' and that it was basically just a 'boost' mode similar to what we've seen in the past that was unsustainable.

As for the CPU side of things, at this juncture I'd also bet that the PS5 has more resources there. Possibly from some of the Zen 3 stuff but also due to additional dedicated silicon offloading a greater degree of workload vs XSX.

All of this said, I'm trying to withhold judgment until the DX12U stuff gets sorted. To me that's basically the final 'barrier' for a final performance analysis, because I don't believe that the XSX is super hard to develop for overall. It won't take us 'years' of developers figuring out that box ala PS3 to squeeze secret performance out of it relative to the easier competition. If MS gets their devkit and API situation sorted and we're still seeing results like this then that's obviously game set and match.
XSX reaches 211 watts with Gears 5. From https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/...-series-x-power-consumption-and-heat-analysis This box has a fixed clock speed frequency config.

PS5 reaches 200 watts.. https://www.gizchina.com/2020/11/10...00w-no-significant-increase-from-the-ps4-pro/ This box has a variable clock speed frequency config.

XSX's cooling solution is superior when compared to PS5's.

Depending on workload, the CPU component is about >25 to 45 watts,

Ryzen 7 3700X has 65 watts TDP which includes 3.6 Ghz base clock and 4.4 Ghz boost.

---------------

PlayStation 5 uncovered: the Mark Cerny tech deep dive

www.eurogamer.net

Cerny also stresses that power consumption and clock speeds don't have a linear relationship. Dropping frequency by 10 percent reduces power consumption by around 27 percent. "In general, a 10 percent power reduction is just a few percent reduction in frequency," Cerny emphasises.


"In general, a 10 percent power reduction is just a few percent reduction in frequency," Cerny emphasises.

---------


A few percent reductions in frequency has reduced GPU's paper TFLOPS number in general. This POV is from Mark Cerny himself.



The statement "Zen 3 stuff" = RGT's rumor, If you accept RGT's rumor, then you should accept RGT's PS5 's effective clock speed rumor.


The statement "additional dedicated silicon offloading a greater degree of workload vs XSX" = unproven. PS5 has additional CU for DSP work. XSX also has additional DSP hardware on top of GPU's 52 available CUs(with machine learning dot math capable).
 
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cyber69

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But why are you even listening to the idiotic fanboys that made those claims in the first place? You don’t get to listen to the worst of the worst and then quote them to laugh at people that didn’t agree with them in the first place.

You won’t find many that don’t have an Xbox avatar that said anything remotely close to that the Xbox will be running games 33%+ better, you just ignore those dipshits that say stuff like that, much like how you just ignore any of the morons with Craig and Sony/PlayStation avatars.


 
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