• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

News Platform Netflix Sets Prequel Series The Witcher: Blood Origin

IDKFA

Member
Jan 15, 2017
2,448
3,237
540
Why are they disgusting? What makes it disgusting? You know people would flip their shit if an Asian fantasy or Middle Eastern fantasy, for example, prominently featured white people. It would be called whitewashing. We've seen it happen time and time again. Remember Ghost in the Shell? If this is disgusting, then that outrage was disgusting.

Personally, if the show ends up being good I'll give it a watch, but this casting certainly makes me suspicious of their intent.

It's 2021 FFS. We live in diverse communities. We should be striving for more colour blind casting. Skin colour is just that. A colour of a persons skin. It shouldn't define a character. To say there are too many nonwhites in a show based in a fictional TV show based on a fantasy world with dragons, magic and witches etc is just lunacy.

To answer your other point, I must admit, I've struggled myself with this concept. Why would it be okay to have a show with all black or all Asian cast, but not be okay for an all white cast?

It took some time, some reading of certain books and speaking to minority friends, but I now understand the issue. See, for decades we've had shows and films that have been exclusively white only casts, with minority actors shunned because of the colour of their skin. Now times have changed, and it's time we now let minority races tell their stories, but at the same time not exclude them from any movie or TV show.

It's called making amends for past mistakes. Hopefully you'll understand this like I have.

LotR and GoT would never hare become global phenomena if they hadn't been so faithful to the source material and that meant an all-white cast. That's how the books described these characters and the show runners made sure that the casting reflected the authors' (and the fans') wishes. Just imagine how Netflix would fuck over a tv series based on the books with a modernized genderblind/colorblind, recasting of LotR with a black Gandalf, a few gender and race swapped members of the Fellowship of the Ring and an all-female version of the Riders of Rohan. The bad guys (Denethor , Saruman, the Nazgul, Gollum, etc) would remain white of course.

How odd. I don't remember critics praising LotR or GoT for having a pretty much all white cast?

Oh yeah. That's because they didn't.

Both of those were not successful because of the skin colour of the cast members. They were successful because the source material is fantastic and they were amazing adaptations.
 
  • Fire
  • Like
Reactions: thewire and e&e
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
It's 2021 FFS. We live in diverse communities. We should be striving for more colour blind casting. Skin colour is just that. A colour of a persons skin. It shouldn't define a character. To say there are too many nonwhites in a show based in a fictional TV show based on a fantasy world with dragons, magic and witches etc is just lunacy.

To answer your other point, I must admit, I've struggled myself with this concept. Why would it be okay to have a show with all black or all Asian cast, but not be okay for an all white cast?

It took some time, some reading of certain books and speaking to minority friends, but I now understand the issue. See, for decades we've had shows and films that have been exclusively white only casts, with minority actors shunned because of the colour of their skin. Now times have changed, and it's time we now let minority races tell their stories, but at the same time not exclude them from any movie or TV show.

It's called making amends for past mistakes. Hopefully you'll understand this like I have.

"We live in diverse communities." Who is "we?" I know I do here in America, but "diverse communities" are certainly not the norm for most of the world, and Neflix shows are made available in over 190 countries.

Lord of the Rings is a fantasy world with dragons, magic, and witches, etc. but that doesn't mean the ethnic representation of its cast should resemble that of Hollywood, California. I think people were right to rail on the casting of Ghost in the Shell, but I would hope for consistency

I have zero issue with diverse casts, but it doesn't make sense in European fantasy unless the character's setting is that they came from another land, for example. It wouldn't make sense in a Chinese fantasy for white or black dudes to be cast alongside Chinese actors with no explanation for their characters background, pretending as if they all just came from the same native land. You will never see that in a Netflix Original show not made in the west and I wouldn't want to see it. Multiculturalism, as in enjoying many different cultures, is great, but this kind of forced diversity is not in my opinion.

Both of those were not successful because of the skin colour of the cast members. They were successful because the source material is fantastic and they were amazing adaptations.

And believable casting is part of an "amazing adaptation."
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • Like
Reactions: GreenAlien

IDKFA

Member
Jan 15, 2017
2,448
3,237
540
"We live in diverse communities." Who is "we?" I know I do here in America, but "diverse communities" are certainly not the norm for most of the world, and Neflix shows are made available in over 190 countries.

Lord of the Rings is a fantasy world with dragons, magic, and witches, etc. but that doesn't mean the ethnic representation of its cast should resemble that of Hollywood, California. I think people were right to rail on the casting of Ghost in the Shell, but I would hope for consistency

I have zero issue with diverse casts, but it doesn't make sense in European fantasy unless the character's setting is that they came from another land, for example. It wouldn't make sense in a Chinese fantasy for white or black dudes to be cast alongside Chinese actors with no explanation for their characters background, pretending as if they all just came from the same native land. You will never see that in a Netflix Original show not made in the west and I wouldn't want to see it. Multiculturalism, as in enjoying many different cultures, is great, but this kind of forced diversity is not in my opinion.



And believable casting is part of an "amazing adaptation."

US, UK, hell even a lot of Europe is diverse. The world itself is thankfully becoming more diverse and multicultural. This should not only be celebrated, but also reflected in our art. Why should a minority actor be declined a role, just because the fantasy world is based on a fictional, medieval Europe?!

Lord of the Rings were made 20 years ago. Different time. If they were made today, you can bet that the cast would be a lot more diverse. Guaranteed the Amazon show will be far more diverse and inclusive than the films.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
US, UK, hell even a lot of Europe is diverse. The world itself is thankfully becoming more diverse and multicultural. This should not only be celebrated, but also reflected in our art. Why should a minority actor be declined a role, just because the fantasy world is based on a fictional, medieval Europe?!

Lord of the Rings were made 20 years ago. Different time. If they were made today, you can bet that the cast would be a lot more diverse. Guaranteed the Amazon show will be far more diverse and inclusive than the films.

Yes, just because the fantasy world is based on fictional, medieval Europe. The setting kind of matters.

Just like I would not want to see a bunch of white people milling about without explanation in a Korean fantasy drama like Kingdom, or Asians and black people popping up as Britons in a King Arthur tale or something.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

IDKFA

Member
Jan 15, 2017
2,448
3,237
540
Yes, just because the fantasy world is based on fictional, medieval Europe. The setting kind of matters.

Just like I would not want to see a bunch of white people milling about without explanation in a Korean fantasy drama like Kingdom, or Asians and black people popping up as Britons in a King Arthur tale or something.

Kingdom and anything based on King Arthur are a little different because they're fantasy set in the real world. Witcher isn't set on Earth, so no reason for it not to have a diverse cast.

However, like I stated above, we've had decades of western made, all white TV shows and films. Now our communities are more diverse, western media should reflect that. There is no reason for western made a show/film, even a historical one, to be all white in this day and age.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Toons

Cyberpunkd

Member
Dec 16, 2020
1,956
2,790
455
Any polish person that could earn money would flee there country in a second. Its very much a 3rd world country. There is absolute no reason for anybody to move to poland and that's the reality of it.
TF is this shit?

I’m a Pole living in Paris. I will never come back to Poland since France is where my life is, my kids grow up, etc.

Having said that - Poland is doing infinitely better than France, the unemployment is lower, the wages grow faster, cities develop more rapidly. You can have a very good life for yourself and your family in Poland, and many Poles do.

The reason why Poland doesn’t have many foreigners living here is due to always being on the side of things - no colonies, rather eccentric language, no social net so no benefits, etc.


Regarding the Witcher - the first story came out in the 1980s, heavily influenced by the Slav culture and history. Guess what, no black people in medieval Poland. If you want to stir shit I would say Lord of the Rings with orcs and Harad coming from the East is probably more problematic than the Witcher. Either way Zerrikania shows similar fetish with the East, but how is that different than being a Sinophile and thinking The Three Kingdoms actually shows you real life in ancient China?

Btw, after the Witcher Sapkowski wrote a trilogy called Narrenturm dealing with Hussite Wars which shows he is very heavily drawing inspiration from medieval times when writing his novels.
 
Last edited:

GymWolf

Member
Jun 11, 2019
20,652
31,178
670
Ah yes, another show by the acclaimed writers of Iron Fist.

Exactly what Witcher IP needs.

Fucking christ there are talented people in hollywood still (looking at you, The Boys), why did my most cherished book and game IP had to get these people.

Oh well, hope dies last, maybe first season of Witcher was a fluke, miracle will happen and future seasons and this show will not suck donkey balls while butchering the source.
Oh jesus, is scott buck involved with this?!
 

FunkMiller

Member
Aug 14, 2014
8,800
27,407
990
As a ethnic minority myself I don't mind this we have built communities, and not all ethcnic minorities are poor anymore we have become landlords, CEOs, lawyers and etc. We have so many mosques and temples and less churches. I'm loving this.

Ooh. Somebody’s accidentally showing their true colours, eh?

The cultural problem in the UK isn’t with race, it‘s with backwards fucking religions (Whatever the colour of the indoctrinated).

On Witcher: never read the books, only played the games, loved season one, don’t give a fuck about what skin colour anyone is, but never agree with colour or gender changes for no other reason that a political agenda.
 
Last edited:
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
There is no reason for western made a show/film, even a historical one, to be all white in this day and age.

I disagree. I think if it's a historical show or based on source material that has a clearly defined setting, the adaptation should try to accurately represent it with its casting, too. Now if you want to call it "alternate history" like Bridgerton, which is Netflix's original setting, then sure, have a ball. I've got no problem with that, just like I wouldn't have any problem with a modern city setting, for example, featuring a cast that represents, or at least is believable, within its setting.

It all comes down to the ability to suspend disbelief. In that sense, Scarlett Johanson playing a character named Motoko Kusanagi in a fantasy future Japan setting is just as ridiculous as the casting we're talking about here.
 

Azurro

Member
Jun 11, 2018
2,582
4,699
485
Now times have changed, and it's time we now let minority races tell their stories, but at the same time not exclude them from any movie or TV show.

It's called making amends for past mistakes. Hopefully you'll understand this like I have.

White people haven't done anything to me. If anything, they have been extremely nice to me, whether it was in Canada or Europe, even in Eastern Europe, where some people with two neurons in their minds think everyone is really racist. They simply don't subscribe to this insane ideology that white people are somehow the cause of the world's evil.

Fuck off with this bs rhetoric, it's ignorance to the highest degree, as if us "minorities" haven't also done our own horrid shit, we are also human and also have done fucked up shit in our history.

The Witcher is based on Eastern European myths, let me watch that fucking world instead of making a character I love like Triss Merigold be replaced by some random black character. Create new worlds if you want your checklist production, let great existing worlds be brought to live as they were written.
 
Last edited:

e&e

Banned
Nov 17, 2020
1,154
1,040
485
Why not just live in a country with people just like you instead of demanding that everything around you change?
“If you don’t like it, leave”!

Fuck outta here with that disgusting talking point…
Netflix acting like they already have a Game of Thrones when the first season sucked hard.
76 million views in just 2019…
 
Last edited:

Atrus

Gold Member
Jul 16, 2007
4,720
955
1,485
It's 2021 FFS. We live in diverse communities. We should be striving for more colour blind casting. Skin colour is just that. A colour of a persons skin. It shouldn't define a character. To say there are too many nonwhites in a show based in a fictional TV show based on a fantasy world with dragons, magic and witches etc is just lunacy.

To answer your other point, I must admit, I've struggled myself with this concept. Why would it be okay to have a show with all black or all Asian cast, but not be okay for an all white cast?

It took some time, some reading of certain books and speaking to minority friends, but I now understand the issue. See, for decades we've had shows and films that have been exclusively white only casts, with minority actors shunned because of the colour of their skin. Now times have changed, and it's time we now let minority races tell their stories, but at the same time not exclude them from any movie or TV show.

It's called making amends for past mistakes. Hopefully you'll understand this like I have.



How odd. I don't remember critics praising LotR or GoT for having a pretty much all white cast?

Oh yeah. That's because they didn't.

Both of those were not successful because of the skin colour of the cast members. They were successful because the source material is fantastic and they were amazing adaptations.

As a minority, I'd say that people should keep their anglocentric white guilt to themselves. Casting should be contextual to the plot and story elements that it is trying to convey.

A multiracial casting makes sense when the plot reflects a multiracial setting or when the underlying historicity is completely unimportant to the performance but there are stories that are presented in context of specific culture or historicity that do not avail themselves to multiracial casts.

I do not want to see a Black Adolf Hitler or a Chinese William Wallace or a multiracial Lord of the Rings that is clearly inspired by European history any more than I want a multiracial Romance of the Three Kingdoms story. Just as there are stories where the casts will reflect actors resembling the stories setting, there will in fact be all-white casts for stories originating out of Europe. Some incongruities can naturally arise out of talent where an individual is so amazing at their work, it eclipses any inaccuracy or inconsistency but these are rare. Alternatively, some people are racially ambigious enough to seamlessly fit into the plot. Instead we just have white people trying to make a name for themselves out of how sorry they are by placing non-white people in European histories and stories.

Minorities don't need to be assimilated into European settings out of misguided pity. We can tell, create or portray our own in due time. For actors, I can understsnd these may represent more paycheques but these "dancing monkey" roles are not favorable to ones career or to minorities in general.
 

Edokataki

Banned
Sep 18, 2020
73
73
180
32
Germany
Yeah, where in the world would a black person be the primordial of anyone, amirite?

So the black exist for 100.000 years and they still live in fucking straw homes in shity villages and they are still stuck 100 years behind any first world country?
 

Edokataki

Banned
Sep 18, 2020
73
73
180
32
Germany
As a minority, I'd say that people should keep their anglocentric white guilt to themselves. Casting should be contextual to the plot and story elements that it is trying to convey.

A multiracial casting makes sense when the plot reflects a multiracial setting or when the underlying historicity is completely unimportant to the performance but there are stories that are presented in context of specific culture or historicity that do not avail themselves to multiracial casts.

I do not want to see a Black Adolf Hitler or a Chinese William Wallace or a multiracial Lord of the Rings that is clearly inspired by European history any more than I want a multiracial Romance of the Three Kingdoms story. Just as there are stories where the casts will reflect actors resembling the stories setting, there will in fact be all-white casts for stories originating out of Europe. Some incongruities can naturally arise out of talent where an individual is so amazing at their work, it eclipses any inaccuracy or inconsistency but these are rare. Alternatively, some people are racially ambigious enough to seamlessly fit into the plot. Instead we just have white people trying to make a name for themselves out of how sorry they are by placing non-white people in European histories and stories.

Minorities don't need to be assimilated into European settings out of misguided pity. We can tell, create or portray our own in due time. For actors, I can understsnd these may represent more paycheques but these "dancing monkey" roles are not favorable to ones career or to minorities in general.
This is one very reasonable and intelligent take on a issue that's getting out of hand. I love some black actors more than any other and I don't see them as black but like a normal person, their traits are not their color but their skills. Saying that it's stupid to make a movie about a established story and shoehorn a black actor just so you can have a black actor and virtue signal and except no backlash.
 

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
May 22, 2018
12,680
20,795
935
Why not just live in a country with people just like you instead of demanding that everything around you change?
Why not just accept that the world is constantly changing instead of demanding that everything stay the same?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Toons

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
May 22, 2018
12,680
20,795
935
I’ve demanded no such thing.
It wasn't directed at you specifically. Mainly at your comment. At the idea that people who want change should have to go anywhere. Which is obviously ridiculous.
 

Cyberpunkd

Member
Dec 16, 2020
1,956
2,790
455
It wasn't directed at you specifically. Mainly at your comment. At the idea that people who want change should have to go anywhere. Which is obviously ridiculous.
Agreed but the same way that you are ok with people trying to change the place they live in, one should also give a right to other people to want to keep things the same way.

indont say it’s the right thing to do (it’s not) but we can try and be fair.
 

Boss Mog

Member
Dec 12, 2013
9,204
14,796
1,060
Why not just accept that the world is constantly changing instead of demanding that everything stay the same?
Accepting change is great when said change is beneficial to the majority or at the very least something that doesn't negatively impact them. A change that negatively impacts the majority is not a change that should be accepted.
 
Last edited:

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
May 22, 2018
12,680
20,795
935
Accepting change is great when said change is beneficial to the majority or at the very least something that doesn't negatively impact them. A change that negatively impacts the majority is not a change that should be accepted.
I agree entirely.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Boss Mog

Kimahri

Member
Jul 27, 2020
1,545
2,436
420
I want diversity of everything, not in everything. It's kinda odd, but more and more, no matter how thematically different things might be, I just feel like I'm watching the same shit over and over because the same token characters of representation show up almost everywhere.

It's boring, and I'm losing interest.

Netflix should stop dicking around, and go back to making stuff like Marco Polo. I wonder how that show would have been received today. That was a show of actual, good diversity, not just another hollywoodization of old Europe.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
I want diversity of everything, not in everything. It's kinda odd, but more and more, no matter how thematically different things might be, I just feel like I'm watching the same shit over and over because the same token characters of representation show up almost everywhere.

It's boring, and I'm losing interest.

Netflix should stop dicking around, and go back to making stuff like Marco Polo. I wonder how that show would have been received today. That was a show of actual, good diversity, not just another hollywoodization of old Europe.

100% this. I like multiculturalism as in "a multitude of different cultures" not some US/UK-centric global monoculture with representation quotas.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kimahri

IbizaPocholo

NeoGAFs Kent Brockman
Dec 1, 2014
30,530
37,275
1,415
ibiza

A new interview with The Witcher showrunner and The Witcher: Blood Origin executive producer Lauren S. Hissrich offers some new details on what to expect from the show set over a thousand years prior to The Witcher.

"We have obviously heard in the Witcher show that humans brought civilization to the elves. They're the ones who showed them what it was like to be civilized. And in fact, what we're seeing in Blood Origin is that's exactly opposite of the truth," Hissrich told EW. "The world was much more of a Golden Age than what we see in The Witcher years later."
 

SenjutsuSage

Member
Jan 23, 2010
12,040
7,658
1,295
I was legit just thinking jokingly to myself when I clicked on this thread a moment ago... how will they somehow manage to shoehorn a black women into the main role and now she could possibly be the very first Witcher considering the hack writers involved...


Why does anybody black, be it a black man or a black woman, bother you so much? Seriously, get help.
 

KingGhidorah

Member
Jul 28, 2019
691
1,588
480
Last edited:

Shmunter

Member
Aug 25, 2018
10,771
24,428
835
Why does anybody black, be it a black man or a black woman, bother you so much? Seriously, get help.
Pretty sure it’s not the race but more the cynical pandering to woke awards and mobs.

A Euro centric medieval setting despite being fantasy still needs some grounding to sell itself and not feel disjointed. In those times people were not jet setting across continents so racial diversity like it’s 2021 seems out of place.

Same applies to any other region in the world back when horseback was the prime mode of transport - the inhabitants would have been most certainly native.

Any notion of “its fantasy anyway” so there are no boundaries is not a defence. The inhabitants using mobile phones or sporting light sabres would not enhance this particular brand of fantasy.
 
Last edited: