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Opinion Naughty Dogs The Last of Us Part 2 is the most violent game I've ever played

Jun 28, 2013
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Quote "I applaude ND for having the balls to produce (what is most likely) the defining IP for the Playstation 4-era with such brutality,"
Well, these days making extra violent scenes is not as brave as making a game with controversial social/political themes or making attractive looking characters (especially females) Talking about western gaming industry btw.
Why wont anyone think of the poor bastards that fantasize about video game characters?!


If this was Abby, it would have been a 1000000000000000x better game.
 

Heisenberg007

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That is true, but it is also completely neglecting the difference between violence that entertains and violence that makes your stomach turn. TLOU takes the cake on the latter.
Exactly. That's what makes all the difference.

In other games (e.g., Doom or Ghost of Tsushima), you see gore and violence and you go 'Wow, that was so cool!!". In TLOU Part 2, the violence makes you feel uncomfortable because it is meant to, narratively. The game wants you to feel that what you are doing is not good, instead of celebrating it.

I'm not sure how you far you are into the game, so I'll keep it vague, but the torture in the beginning, the fight in the theatre, the murder around the water, and the ending scenes are so brutal, and make you feel very uncomfortable -- which was the entire point of the game.
 

MarlboroRed

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I'm not sure how you far you are into the game, so I'll keep it vague, but the torture in the beginning, the fight in the theatre, the murder around the water, and the ending scenes are so brutal, and make you feel very uncomfortable -- which was the entire point of the game.
I'm mid cutscene after
Abby fought Ellie in the theatre.
I have yet to dive into the final arc.
The game wants you to feel that what you are doing is not good, instead of celebrating it.
This pretty much hits the nail on the head. From a development/production standpoint, this game celebrates violence like no other. Never has a studio been putting so much effort into detailing post-apocalyptic combat. From a story/cinematographic standpoint, however, it absolutely doesn't. It makes you feel uncomfortable. It shows the characters being miserable doing it.

It want's you to hate what you're enjoying to do. And it succeeds in that masterfully.
 
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nikolino840

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What about Yakuza series? Action scenes in combat are brutal and there's a couple of cut scenes too,like the torture of goro and kiryu
 

nikolino840

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...but once you've just smashed a guy's head in with a motor cycle, and then he gets up and is like "sorry sir, won't do it again" and runs away, it kind of lessens the effect.

(don't get me wrong, Yakuza is amazing)
Yeah maybe the "anime style" tone down the violence 😂 like in tarantino movies when you laugh instead of being unconfortable
 

hemo memo

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This is the sole reason why I have avoided buying the game. How brutal and violent the footage they have showed. Then later I learned about how awful the story is and was glad I didn’t buy it.
 
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Dorohedoro

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You can tell that this game could be more violent but Naughty Dog had to tone it down. I would have loved to see the bloater actually ripping apart Ellie's jaw in that death animation.
Same. And what you described happens when they kill Joel in the original but for some reason it isn't as graphic when they use the same move on Ellie which is kinda dumb but whatever. The game has even gorier stuff so I doubt it was because they had to hold anything back. Just some weird artistic choice I'm guessing.

p
 
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hemo memo

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Same. And what you described happens when they kill Joel in the original but for some reason it isn't as graphic when they use the same move on Ellie which is kinda dumb but whatever. The game has even gorier stuff so I doubt it was because they had to hold anything back. Just some weird artistic choice I'm guessing.

p
Didn’t Druckmann acknowledged the team use of reference videos? I mean that’s just really disturbing.
 

SLB1904

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Muh gore, tho

I've always felt that explicit violence kinda ruins the experience, as if the creators are trying too hard to make something "edgy" and "realistic" for the sake of it.
Kinda like those movies that add that stuff for SHOCK value, but they're as shallow as they've ever been.
Nah. Love me some flying limbs and brains
 
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LMJ

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We've ironically flipped the script from the early 2000's when Mortal Kombat, Manhunt etc were attracting loons like Thompson for their horrific violence and uber sexualization was just fine in most games...

And now we've gone to Mortal Kombat 11 and Last of us 2 having WAY worse violence than they ever did before, but everyone seeming pretty cool with it while almost any sexualization has attracted loons like Sarkisian and company lol

shocked canadian GIF by CBC
 

NinjaBoiX

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The word got overused so much a couple of years back that it became a meme, but it’s “visceral” as fuck.

No other game made me feel that connection of pulling a trigger on my controller to pulling the trigger on screen.

It’s masterful, they are kings of their craft.
 

Calverz

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I’m pretty sure the clicker death scenes were toned down compared to tlou on ps3. I remember them being more violent and gorey in that game
 

Bonfires Down

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Why wont anyone think of the poor bastards that fantasize about video game characters?!


If this was Abby, it would have been a 1000000000000000x better game.
Well, here is the original artwork for Abby. I do believe they made her less conventionally attractive so that the player wouldn't forgive her too easily. Not that I have a problem with how Abby looks even if they did it for another reason. Just pointing it out as I found it interesting.

 
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Alx

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Violence has been part of humanity since the dawn of mankind and its history. In addition, so many other lifeforms kill each other for whatever reason (food, survival, territorial power, you name it).
Therefore, on this planet of ours, I would argue humanity is sick and needs help. If there's another planet with a different system of reality, maybe there lifeforms don't wanna kill each other, and don't feel the urge to perpetrate crimes-acts of violence.
But on this planet of ours, things look grim and dicey.
Violence and gruesome death have always been a part of humanity indeed. But partaking to violence and death for entertainment purpose has most often been considered as mental instability. Sure in this case "it's not for real" so it gets a pass. Nevertheless the infamous "murder simulator" description is becoming more true with time (and you're admitting it in your post, "that's how it is in real life", hence the simulator part).
We've come to accept it in our culture (I don't like those games myself, but am not wishing for them to be forbidden), but I'm pretty sure people from the past would look at our entertainment as a dystopian horror. Ad for how it will be judged in the future, it's impossible to tell.
 
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hemo memo

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Artists pull from references constantly, if a game has gore in it you can bet the artists looked up real life reference, it’s not news
Well, this was actually news:
“And our whole approach is to say, ‘We want to treat this as realistically as possible.’ When you stab someone—if you watch reference videos, which we have, it’s gross and it’s messy and it’s not sanitized like you see in most movies and games. And we wanted to get the player to feel that.”
And you say this is normal for games with gore?

We Talked To The Last Of Us Part II's Director About The Game's Violence
 

SlimeGooGoo

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Because war games aren’t trying to make you feel bad for killing people
Most war games do. Still remember some PS2 Medal of Honor game with soldiers staring at the empty when they were almost dead.
Brothers in Arms uses violence too, but doesn't go to such extreme as The Last of Us goes.

Media that’s actually trying to tell you war is bad ex: MGS, Saving Private Ryan, Full Metal Jacket. They don’t shy away from that violence.
MGS is not that violent. It's Naruto level of violence, shounen or whatever. EDIT: Referring to pre MGS4, before Kojima went full dumb mode

The Last of Us uses extreme violence for SHOCK value, for the sake of it.
Grave of Fireflies is a good example of sending a message without having to resort to gore shoved into the audience's face at all times to look smart and "audacious".
 
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xrnzaaas

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What about Yakuza series? Action scenes in combat are brutal and there's a couple of cut scenes too,like the torture of goro and kiryu
Yakuza games are silly with the brutality. Kiryu or other playable characters perform moves which could easily break someone's spine and send them to the grave, but technically they don't kill anyone and even let the bad guys live (which often bites them back later on in the story ;)).
 

nowhat

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Yakuza games are silly with the brutality. Kiryu or other playable characters perform moves which could easily break someone's spine and send them to the grave, but technically they don't kill anyone and even let the bad guys live (which often bites them back later on in the story ;)).
Hmm - bit offtopic, but is there a single instance in 0 to 6 where Kiryu would have actively (or through inaction even) killed someone? Arriving to a location just to watch the person he was trying to save die, sure. Being a fall guy for deaths caused by others, that too (he may have a huge heart, but can also be a huge idiot). Fighting someone and them ending up dead, but not because of Kiryu, oh so many times.

But really killing someone, if that happens, I don't recall when. Actually that could have been really dramatic moment: yet another random street brawl over, but wait, the guy you just slammed against a pole back first is still on the ground. He tries desperately to move, but his fractured spine doesn't allow him to move his legs. Or arms. Or head. Slowly but surely his ribs, which neatly punctured both his lungs, put him out of his misery. Kiryu just stands there, unable to help in any way or say anything meaningful besides the usual grunting.

...maybe I need to do a petition for a DLC.
 

TonyK

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Same. The brutality was INSANE in this game. This is how humans are and I'm happy a developer made something like this as I don't care for this whole Rated M "aka PG" attitude that developers have, like they are scared to actually REALLY show and talk about dark adult subject matter.

I ask the community, be honest....really look at the mature rated games that have come out over the generations, now look at a normal HBO, Netflix, AMC show or a film etc that is for mature audiences. Its clear a massive difference exist. Gaming is literally in this weird bubble like they are scared to actually go that far, yet that isn't some strange thing for film or shows.

Allow the fucking medium to move on folks.

No one is asking Mario to be murdering Peach, but we have Disney films that exist along with American History X...no one is fucking asking for them to all be the same, but gaming shouldn't be stuck in this "hard PG" situation.

People get raped in real life.

They die and lose limbs....in real life.

SHOW FOLKS what guns REALLY do to people as this game is ALREADY rated M. Allow those titles to freely express that.
In my opinion, there is a big difference between videogames and other media like books or cinema: AAA games are the equivalent to Marvel movies in terms of cost. In videogames, if you want to do something like American History X, with same artistic quality, quality that can reach and impact audience, you need the money of Avengers. And it's incredibly difficult that anyone will greenlight that.

Books are the medium where you can be as much deep as you can with less. Next could be cinema. But videogames, as games still must be produced with graphics custom made, are too expensive to take risky approaches with a production quality enough to represent those topics in a meaningful way.

At the end of the day you can have deep indie games like Lorelai and others, but they are almost not known for general audience. And the only ones we talk are some rare AAA as Last of Us.

I think this medium has not reached yet the technological standardization that will allow the equivalent to American History X, or whatever adult movie you can think, to be done as videogame.
 

Ballthyrm

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Same. The brutality was INSANE in this game. This is how humans are and I'm happy a developer made something like this as I don't care for this whole Rated M "aka PG" attitude that developers have, like they are scared to actually REALLY show and talk about dark adult subject matter.

I ask the community, be honest....really look at the mature rated games that have come out over the generations, now look at a normal HBO, Netflix, AMC show or a film etc that is for mature audiences. Its clear a massive difference exist. Gaming is literally in this weird bubble like they are scared to actually go that far, yet that isn't some strange thing for film or shows.

Allow the fucking medium to move on folks.

No one is asking Mario to be murdering Peach, but we have Disney films that exist along with American History X...no one is fucking asking for them to all be the same, but gaming shouldn't be stuck in this "hard PG" situation.

People get raped in real life.

They die and lose limbs....in real life.

SHOW FOLKS what guns REALLY do to people as this game is ALREADY rated M. Allow those titles to freely express that.

I think not hiding the violence and its consequence is great, but don't ask me to empathize with the "heroine" who is literally a murderous maniac.
The jarring gap between who we are supposed to care about and what we are being asked to do in the gameplay is so huge , I can't really get invested in the story.

I know that this game specifically seeks to address some of these issues and let Ellie suffer some of the consequence of her actions but that's hardly get a pass from me.
You can't magically erase what we have been doing for the past how many hours, just because you address some of it in a cinematic.

I think they use Violence as a crutch in this game, because when all else fail at least they have that.
You can't tell a story with the cinematics and another with the gameplay.


I've yet to see the same approach being pursued toward positive human emotion.
And develop the same Adult theme on thing other than violence. WE barely see any love and affection apart from gratuitous sex scene.
There is myriad of emotions that would make for great gameplay loop I'm sure.
 
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kyliethicc

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Because war games aren’t trying to make you feel bad for killing people. You could argue that their de facto political stance is “war is a necessary evil”

Media that’s actually trying to tell you war is bad ex: MGS, Saving Private Ryan, Full Metal Jacket. They don’t shy away from that violence.
Thats why A Song of Ice and Fire book series is so violent.

The author, George Martin, is a anti-war hippy and he said that he portrays war accurately as brutally violent to send a message. He didn't want to glorify it.
 
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HAL-01

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Well, this was actually news:

And you say this is normal for games with gore?

We Talked To The Last Of Us Part II's Director About The Game's Violence
Like I said, yeah it’s typical industry practice, in games and movies.

Here’s an excerpt from an article about the gore on MK11:

“They told Kotaku that they had worked on the game throughout 2018, and spent their days reviewing violent animation work, discussing it with leads, sharing feedback with animators, and generally being surrounded by the kind of bloody real-life research material that creators reference in order to animate video game gore.“

In that particular instance the references used were much more intense than what’s described in druckmann’s interview, and it did affect the vfx artist
 

Bartski

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Just adressing the actual topic. I totally understand why the violence in the last of us affects people more especially if they actually care about the characters. Seeing someone die with acting that sells their fear while someone who loves them watches is way harder to bare.

But when it comes to the violence itself things like MK are obviously more intense. They said "it's the most violent" which it's not. If you want to talk about the most hard to watch violence that's a different story.

On a personal note. There's only a single time in TLOU2 that violence happens to a character I really care about and that's the only time it's really hard to watch, other than that, I'd be more affected by seeing someone getting their skin ripped off whether it's cartoony or not.

I see what you mean but that only makes sense if you reduce the gore to the anatomic level, isolated from the context you experience it in-game.

Gore in MK is not made to affect you but to make you laugh... don' take my word for it



On the topic then, Manhunt is the only runner up here, being not even remotely as graphic. I'd love to see a next-gen Manhunt 3, until TLOU2 I thought that would never be possible.

I think it is a shame that the current video game sector needs violence to be a "good product".

yeah that's complete bullshit_Xtreme. Graphic violence works only when games make you do violent things and it's warranted by the fiction, otherwise it doesn't work, like forced "blood effects" in some games.

This is why it's great to see so much creativity, especially in the indie scene, inventing new types of gameplay free from shooting/stabbing or killing things in general.
 
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Fredrik

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Because war games aren’t trying to make you feel bad for killing people. You could argue that their de facto political stance is “war is a necessary evil”

Media that’s actually trying to tell you war is bad ex: MGS, Saving Private Ryan, Full Metal Jacket. They don’t shy away from that violence.
I don’t know man, I tried Battlefield 1 after the fps boost update, my first war game since Call of Duty 4 on 360, and the graphics are good enough and the story bits are believable enough that I started questioning why it’s entertainment. Felt bad. Gaming and movies aren’t same, it’s not just that we’re in control instead of a spectator but a game playthrough is literally 10-20 hours of that intense opening beach scene in Saving Private Ryan. It’s just too much. I don’t want to spend hour after hour watching people die in brutal ways.
 
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Nankatsu

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The visually most violent yes, the most violent no.
 
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Beardsalt

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All I gotta say is explosive arrows. Some of the most brutal, violent shit in any game I’ve ever played!

Towards the end of the game, I shot an explosion arrow at 3 unlucky bastards. 2 of them died immediately by being blown in half at the waist, 3rd guy got both his legs blown off crawling, screaming for help leaving a huge blood trail afterwards dying from his injuries!

To realistic for some and i can understand If some think it too violent. Like others have said, the story ties in to the violence and your sense of justification is challenged!
 
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rofif

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The visually most violent yes, the most violent no.
I would put "existential dread" above violence and tlou2 does that amazing too.
But SOMA... now that is the peak dread. It's almost too gut wrenching to think about. All hope lost
 
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