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[mejin]

jesus christ...

nose nerfed.

 

[ThatGamingDude]

Sure but that ain’t what we are talking about here.

You were the one that brought it up lol.

People complaining the women aren’t “sexy” enough based on the size of their tits or waist. And a very mainstream view of beauty

Physical attractiveness - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Physical attraction itself includes universal perceptions common to all human cultures such as facial symmetry,[9] sociocultural dependent attributes and personal preferences unique to a particular individual.[10]

The usage of mainstream in place of universal perceptions is one of the largest atrocities to English.

No argument from me here. I like em thick too

Maybe you misunderstood my point.

I’m saying the modern mainstream view of what we consider “sexy” takes a lot of time and resources that an apocalypse survivor would not have.

Yeah; people in a survival sort of event wouldn't have a lot of free time...
Resources? Sure; but then again wouldn't you think the universal perceptions of physical attractiveness would change due to a world wide apocalyptic event??

Plenty of people in the world. Everything doesn’t have to pander to you.

It’s fine then to say that product is not for you.

But to present it as the creators are wrong for doing the pandering shows a lack of self awareness.

People other than white males learned how to deal with not being pandered to a long time ago. It’s life

On the flip, why is there so much controversy around inclusion of these types in video games?
Maybe the video game wasn't trying to pander to your particular demographic

“The team is very much divided on the game [The Last of Us Part II], and even voicing your concerns on its story will upset certain individuals; it usually results in said person being called closed-minded or even phobic, or some such nonsense. Some people literally have to bite their tongues or fear losing their jobs, even careers, to an outrage mob.”

“From a design stand point, this is a really challenging problem. I’ve had many board meetings about how to tackle this. Trans people want ‘realistic’ representation in our games, but they feel excluded if they are represented as too masculine or too feminine. That’s why you will see a lot of designers ‘nerfing the female form’ so to speak so that the difference between trans women and cis women is a little less noticeable.”

I guess. But that’s up to you. You wanna demonize ND for who they chose to pander to, then I guess you’re the devil too.

I'm not demonizing them for it; no where in my previous posts have I said they're right/wrong for what they did
I did explain to you, that in business and product development, and that include marketing, that it does happen
Also, please refer to the below

People other than white males learned how to deal with not being pandered to a long time ago. It’s life

Who's demonizing who now?

I get what you're saying over all with pointing out that some people are kind of exposing their own mentalities by what they're noticing first in their leisure activities (The strong black woman post lol), just to me it seems like you haven't thought of a clear debate format style way of discussing it, which over all hinders your message IMO.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Like what the fuck even is that?

Oh so they have to be beautiful? Plenty of mma fighters who look like her.

 

[Spukc]

Looks similar? The clothing and lighting on the right certainly makes her look hotter though.

all i see is a picture of a nose

 

[RaySoft]

jesus christ...

Well, women have "fooled" us with pushup bra's full of padding for years. WYSINWYG

 

[Bolivar687]

Very interesting new take on why Amy was forced out.

 

[DaMonsta]

You were the one that brought it up lol.

No I didn’t. Go back and read the exchange.

Physical attractiveness - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Ds
The usage of mainstream in place of universal perceptions is one of the largest atrocities to English.

OK?

Yeah; people in a survival sort of event wouldn't have a lot of free time...
Resources? Sure; but then again wouldn't you think the universal perceptions of physical attractiveness would change due to a world wide apocalyptic event??

Yes I agree they would.

What are we arguing about here? Again. I think you misunderstood my point.

On the flip, why is there so much controversy around inclusion of these types in video games?
Maybe the video game wasn't trying to pander to your particular demographic

Sure the pandering historically has gone one way.

Nothing wrong with some artists trying to change that.

I'm not demonizing them for it; no where in my previous posts have I said they're right/wrong for what they did
I did explain to you, that in business and product development, and that include marketing, that it does happen
Also, please refer to the below

Who's demonizing who now?

You demonized yourself. You literally posted a picture of the devil in reference to yourself.

I get what you're saying over all with pointing out that some people are kind of exposing their own mentalities by what they're noticing first in their leisure activities (The strong black woman post lol), just to me it seems like you haven't thought of a clear debate format style way of discussing it, which over all hinders your message IMO.

This isn’t a formal academic debate. It’s dudes on the internet complaining their game doesn’t have enough tits and ass. I think my arguments are succinct enough lol.

 

[ThatGamingDude]

This isn’t a formal academic debate. It’s dudes on the internet complaining their game doesn’t have enough tits and ass. I think my arguments are succinct enough lol.

And this is why you get no where in your discussions. You don't respect the person you're talking with.
I'm out

 

[Bolivar687]

Havent watched the second fight yet but the first one for her end its all about dodging and timing and precision when she fights him in the library. She counters the hell out of him


She also catches him off guard with a hit to the nose in the beginning as well

She brute forces the hell out of him in the middle and again and tosses him around like a rag doll.

I never had a problem with the Nadine fights but wow is it unrealistic.

 

[Cybrwzrd]

It's obvious female characters have become more masculine in games like TLoU because they want strong, non-sexualized role models for girls.

Why are they worried about putting strong, non-sexualized role models for girls in a game that is obviously not intended for children to be playing?

 

[GrayFoxPL]

Going through hormone therapy is never easy. But after completing this enormous change Nora became successfull tv star Norman Reedus.

Wtf, this is fake, right? Tell me this is just some random model.

 

[Gravemind]

yikes.

 

[oagboghi2]

Shushing idiots who shout "fire" in crowded theaters is pro-social, as is calling for censure of types that sow discord and conflict for their own gain or entertainment.

There was nothing intolerant or undemocratic about what I wrote, it was a call to the masses caught between the twin poles of ideological madness on the far left-and-right wings to make their voices heard and try and restore sanity, civility and decorum to public discourse.

That being in fact, explicitly pro-democracy and moderate in political character.

That you failed to recognize that stands as evidence as to why your opinion on political matters is worthless.

Fuck off dude. You just want to censure people you don't like. It has nothing to do with the public good or civil discourse

 

[DaMonsta]

And this is why you get no where in your discussions. You don't respect the person you're talking with.
I'm out

There’s nothing disrespectful in that statement.

I find it funny you approach me about respect with all the mud being slung in this thread.

I’ve given the same kind of respect I’ve been offered.

 

[NOLA_Gaffer]

I think that headline made me roll my eyes so hard that I broke a blood vessel.

Everybody's gotta be angry about something in 2020. If you don't like TLOU2, don't play the game, FFS.

jesus christ...

I'm not entirely sure what point this post is trying to make.

 

[zcaa0g]

So now they are going to be trans friendly instead of non-trans friendly? That doesn't sound like equality and that is what they are saying. Did the Naughty Dog devs hail from ResetEra?

 

[InterMusketeer]

Why are they worried about putting strong, non-sexualized role models for girls in a game that is obviously not intended for children to be playing?

I dunno. We know that's something Druckmann finds important though.

 

[oagboghi2]

People other than white males learned how to deal with not being pandered to a long time ago. It’s life

I'm not a white male and I don't agree with the choices ND are making.

Maybe know your place, and don't act as if you speak for everyone. People are allowed to disagree with ND

 

[TheStruggler]

She brute forces the hell out of him in the middle and again and tosses him around like a rag doll.

I never had a problem with the Nadine fights but wow is it unrealistic.

After she rocked him, if you get rocked you not going to be on shakey legs?

 

[NOLA_Gaffer]

Never seases to amaze me how in the last few years companies don't care about money anymore and everyone wants to cater to the smallest market possible.

I love that you're implying that this game isn't gonna sell like gangbusters.

 

[LittleBusters]

Naughty dog back to blowing their own horns.
All the PR for their games is look how woke, progressive, and awesome we are.
Also the idea that making female characters less feminine is somehow trans positive is absurd and flawed. By the same logic they may as well give all female characters penises.

Offensive of you to assume who has a penis and who doesn't.

 

[LittleBusters]

Well, women have "fooled" us with pushup bra's full of padding for years. WYSINWYG

Shhhh feminists don't want to hear about pushup bras and padding.

 

[Hostile_18]

What a load of BS to try and get people worked up

I stopped reading as soon as they said about a Lesbian relationship in the Lost Legacy between Chloe and Nadine.

 

[LittleBusters]

I love that you're implying that this game isn't gonna sell like gangbusters.

Yes there are people who will automatically buy it because of the name and then be very disappointed to have 'woke' politics shoved down their throats during gameplay. Sony will still laugh all the way to the bank.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Wouldn't that be insult to trans woman though ? ''lets make all girls less attractive so we don't offend trans woman'' however trans woman want to be a woman not something people would consider a man. Say you gave a large group of of people who want to be woman a million pounds how many are going to try and look like that ?

I'm not expert here and my opinion to the trans community is probably considered transphobic this why tend stay away topic really.

ND's idea of trans women:

Sane Person's idea of trans women:

You done fucked up, Naughty Dog.

 

[NOLA_Gaffer]

Yes there are people who will automatically buy it because of the name and then be very disappointed to have 'woke' politics shoved down their throats during gameplay. Sony will still laugh all the way to the bank.

Imagine anyone actually believing this sort of bullshit.

 

[Lionel Richie]

Going through hormone therapy is never easy. But after completing this enormous change Nora became successfull tv star Norman Reedus.

Goddamn, not like this bro.

 

[DaMonsta]

I'm not a white male and I don't agree with the choices ND are making.

Maybe know your place, and don't act as if you speak for everyone. People are allowed to disagree with ND

“Know your place” lol fuck outa here buddy.

I never claimed I speak for anyone but myself.

 

[buizel]

ND's idea of trans women:

Sane Person's idea of trans women:

You done fucked up, Naughty Dog.

and here is a real trans:

 

[DaMonsta]

and here is a real trans:

A perfect mix of the two

 

[eastwood333]

This kind of stuff turns me off from the game. Its saddens me that ND goes all out for supporting certain views/beliefs while also alienating other peoples beliefs/views in the process and then try to lecture us on how we need to be more tolerable.

 

[Geki-D]

Gotta give credit to sausageroll. They really know how to write a BS story to push the reactionaries, homophobes & transphobes buttons to get them fired up and score clicks.

 

[UnravelKatharsis]

Ever notice how when the topic of trans inclusion/exclusion in media is discussed it's almost always in the direction of male to female transitioning?

That quote about trans women not being able to grow large breasts stood out to me. What about the female to male trans people in the post apocalypse who have naturally large breats and no doctor to perform their double mastectomy? No prescription hormones to alter their natural biology? In the post apocalypse, with sexuality and gender being second or third or not even registering on the scale of importance next to survival I think we'd actually as a whole probably look more like our biological sex than is being represented here. At least as far as physical features are concerned.

I think there are more "straight" men that fetishize male to female trans women than we could imagine. And that's why the conversation always seems to gravitate to that end of the spectrum. Some designers aren't sexualisizing women because internally they've sexualized trans women. And that's just as "bad."

 

[buizel]

Gotta give credit to sausageroll. They really know how to write a BS story to push the reactionaries, homophobes & transphobes buttons to get them fired up and score clicks.

clicks looks like dicks

i kinda wonder. it's always gross weird neckbeard basement dweller men that get a sex change to be 'cute ^^ fairy omg pop punk kawaii princess'. just made me think is it the only way they get to touch some pussy? like i know it's crass, and slightly exaggerated but i kinda believe it. they finally get to touch some poon. maybe to please daddy who is always asking 'whens muh son gunna get knee deep in clunge'? well now he is the clunge. and theyre ALWAYS anime fans. WHY is that? has anyone done any studies because their is a trend or certain people getting sex change ops. or would the basis of a study be considered SEXIST and HOMOPHOBIC?

 

[oagboghi2]

“Know your place” lol fuck outa here buddy.

I never claimed I speak for anyone but myself.

Yes, know it. Don't make wide generalizations about people just becuase they disagree with the art choices of a game studio. It's ridiculous

 

[Forsythia]

Why not make every character this?

 

[oagboghi2]

Gotta give credit to sausageroll. They really know how to write a BS story to push the reactionaries, homophobes & transphobes buttons to get them fired up and score clicks.

 

[DaMonsta]

Yes, know it. Don't make wide generalizations about people just becuase they disagree with the art choices of a game studio. It's ridiculous

I didn’t make any generalizations.

You like your games to pander to white males. Good for you.

 

[chriskun]

She brute forces the hell out of him in the middle and again and tosses him around like a rag doll.

I never had a problem with the Nadine fights but wow is it unrealistic.

dude its a fantasy adventure game, the "woman beating the shit out of a guy" trope has existed for years. And just to be clear im not defending this shit in TLOU2. This ham fisted forced diversity shit is getting ridiculous. Just finished that hunters show and they " divirsified" one of the smallest minority groups in the world (jews). This shit is starting to wrap around on itself, its fucking absurd.

 

[imsosleepy]

I will never really understand why these influences need to be implemented into already running franchises. If there's a demand for female protagonists / trans people in games / games centered around non-cis sexuality.... wouldn't a market develop naturally?

Am I insensitive here? :<

well cyberpunk is very open about that. But they got shit on lol by the same people who want to see more trans repersentatoin!

 

[oagboghi2]

I didn’t make any generalizations.

You like your games to pander to white males. Good for you.

"Pander to white males" what does that even mean? Typical nonsense

You've made generalizations many times in this thread.

 

[eastwood333]

So now they are going to be trans friendly instead of non-trans friendly? That doesn't sound like equality and that is what they are saying. Did the Naughty Dog devs hail from ResetEra?

I believe one of the lead designers at ND is actually trans. Emilia Shatz I think is the name? Even so, their will be Christian devs too, so maybe ND should show equality to them as well

 

[NOLA_Gaffer]

clicks looks like dicks

i kinda wonder. it's always gross weird neckbeard basement dweller men that get a sex change to be 'cute ^^ fairy omg pop punk kawaii princess'. just made me think is it the only way they get to touch some pussy? like i know it's crass, and slightly exaggerated but i kinda believe it. they finally get to touch some poon. maybe to please daddy who is always asking 'whens muh son gunna get knee deep in clunge'? well now he is the clunge. and theyre ALWAYS anime fans. WHY is that? has anyone done any studies because their is a trend or certain people getting sex change ops. or would the basis of a study be considered SEXIST and HOMOPHOBIC?

The bigger question is: "Why are you concerned about someone's personal reason for wanting to transition?"

 

[DeepEnigma]

Most of the women that do crossfit in my gym are hotties, not the monstrosity seen below:



Like what the fuck even is that?

Looks like the kid from Solarbabies all grown up, to something.

 

[CuteFaceJay]

So what has happened? Did they give someone a penis who isn't meant to have one or something?

 

[DaMonsta]

"Pander to white males" what does that even mean? Typical nonsense

You've made generalizations many times in this thread.

Nope have not.

Culture exists.

White males have culture.

Lots of media panders to that culture.

It’s life.

 

[M1chl]

jesus christ...

Well aside from the shitstorm of bad things, I honestly not see a problem, she is probably wearing push-up bra and also when she get slimmer (which certainly possible in this case), boobs rectract. So, yeah...

 

[oagboghi2]

Nope have not.

Culture exists.

White males have culture.

Lots of media panders to that culture.

It’s life.

It's nonsense. You did, I literally quoted one such time to you.

And the idea that disagreeing with the artistic body choices of a game model means you are pandering to "white culture" is retarded. Are body dimensions "white culture" now?

Also, interesting how dedicated you are on turning this into a racial argument. Please go on about white culture in TLOU. This should be good

 

[Venom Snake]

 

[Darkmakaimura]

This is reaching.

Every since it was revealed Elle was lesbian people having been pushing this narrative that ND is trying to make political statements with the game.

If there was a zombie apocalypse there wouldn’t be much “sexuality” in the way were are used to seeing female characters in a game. We have been conditioned for our female characters to ooze sexuality. It makes sense that there shouldn’t be any characters like that in the game.

I think the people beating this “Naughty Dog SJW” drum are only exposing yourselves.

Normally I'd agree because even anti sjws reach. But Druckman is influenced by the head honcho of sjw-ism herself, Anita Sarkeesian, and he's shown slides of her show talking about it as much.

And I think, from what I heard, he's outright stated he has an agenda but maybe someone else can back me or correct me on that.

Besides I've seen enough devs on Twitter during the GG fiasco to see plenty of these people want to push their politics. A lot of it is sadly the result of that movement (and #metoo).