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[Black_Stride]

For instance? I can only think of co-op in that regard, but maybe you know more.

I take it you dont know what copy-pasta is.

Your defense of SP achievements is the same defense for MP achievements.
Your attack on MP achievements is the same attack for SP achievements.

 

[D-ray]

"Main reason is that most of them are just time consuming and/or VERY situational, to the point that there is no REAL challenge in unlocking them."

That's 99% of all "achievements" in video games. They're not achievements at all, they're little notifications designed to give you a very brief serotonin boost and hook you on catching 'em all.

Exact same formula that makes mobile games popular, yet people on forums will shit all over those while driving a car in circles for hours in Dead Rising just to "achieve" something.

Well no. Not always.
For "time consuming" I meant those achievements that just ask you to try and re-try until it will eventually pop up because you need "luck" for it to happen.

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Take "Straight Flush" from Poker Night at the Inventory for instance. It requires almost 0% skill or knowledge of the game to get it. You just need to play, play, play and play until maybe one day you'll receive a straight flush during a game. I don't know if you ever played poker, but the chances of that happening is approximately 0.0014%.
THAT, is a dumb and time consuming achievement.

On the other hand, there's the infamous "The Final Countdown" achievement from Castle Crashers. It takes a long time if you are not good at the game mode that gives it to you, but you can grab it in a day or even less if you are.
THAT, is a fair and skill oriented achievement. Time consuming only if you need to learn the game, not time consuming because you need a chance.

 

[ZehDon]

I dislike them because they fall into one of three categories:

• Dependent on pure luck
• Require world-class performance
• Vast time sinks

Only one of these things is within my control. Multiplayer achievements in multiplayer only games are whatever - you know what you're in for - but having a 100% blocked because the Devs tacked on a multiplayer mode and decided that "Be top of a Seasonal ladder" was an achievement every player should strive for is insane to me.

 

[D-ray]

I take it you dont know what copy-pasta is.

Your defense of SP achievements is the same defense for MP achievements.
Your attack on MP achievements is the same attack for SP achievements.

Well I kinda know what a copypasta is, but I thought you were serious about some games you knew existed.

Also, no, my opinion doesn't work that way.
Singleplayer achievements have the "defense" of being an extra way to replay the game and/or have a new challenge attached to it. You can't ask people to do it for you (unless you are THAT lazy), you don't lose the ability to get them if the game is old.
I can't say that they can't be "time consuming", because some achievements (even in single player) require you do dumb and repetitive stuff to have a chance to get the achievement.

Multiplayer achievements shouldn't exist not because they are not similar to the singleplayer ones or something, they shouldn't exists because (from what I said) they don't make any sense in trying to unlock them. There's no challenge because you can ask someone else to help you VERY easily; you can't grab them if there's nobody playing; and they can be time consuming because they usually need specific multiplayer interactions.

 

[AV]

Well no. Not always.
For "time consuming" I meant those achievements that just ask you to try and re-try until it will eventually pop up because you need "luck" for it to happen.

But these aren't really any better than the string of achievements one gets from just playing a game. "Play one multiplayer match". Some games have them for watching the opening cutscene. Those are just as meaningless as the 0.001% ones.

The core issue is that people feel like they're entitled to fill that bar up, get their 1000 gamerscore or platinum trophy or whatever. Having those stuck at 99% completion is so irritating to a lot of people that they genuinely won't bother playing the game at all because they know they won't be able to finish it thanks to one achievement. It's insane. At that point, people aren't playing games to have fun, they're doing it to watch a number nobody else cares about go up.

 

[D-ray]

I dislike them because they fall into one of three categories:

• Dependent on pure luck
• Require world-class performance
• Vast time sinks

Only one of these things is within my control. Multiplayer achievements in multiplayer only games are whatever - you know what you're in for - but having a 100% blocked because the Devs tacked on a multiplayer mode and decided that "Be top of a Seasonal ladder" was an achievement every player should strive for is insane to me.

Pretty similar to what I think.

But these aren't really any better than the string of achievements one gets from just playing a game. "Play one multiplayer match". Some games have them for watching the opening cutscene. Those are just as meaningless as the 0.001% ones.

Yeah! Exactly! Even those are extremely stupid and non-logical. So why bother making them?

The core issue is that people feel like they're entitled to fill that bar up, get their 1000 gamerscore or platinum trophy or whatever. Having those stuck at 99% completion is so irritating to a lot of people that they genuinely won't bother playing the game at all because they know they won't be able to finish it thanks to one achievement. It's insane. At that point, people aren't playing games to have fun, they're doing it to watch a number nobody else cares about go up.

Mmmmh... I think you are kind of biased on this one, atleast, regarding to what I've seen over the years.
Achievement hunters, like me, usually hunt them just to have a DEEPER experience of the game, in order to study more the mechanics and design of the game.

Personally, I don't have THAT much money to buy every single game I want, so when I get one, I usually play it to the very end, achievements included (if they are not stupid like some of the ones I mentioned). Plus, trying for achievements, made me more critic on games that at first they seemed masterpieces to me.
I mean, always better than those who play the game for 1 hour and immediately say "OMG BEST GAME EVAH!!1!1!1".

 

[AV]

Yeah! Exactly! Even those are extremely stupid and non-logical. So why bother making them?

Mmmmh... I think you are kind of biased on this one, atleast, regarding to what I've seen over the years.
Achievement hunters, like me, usually hunt them just to have a DEEPER experience of the game, in order to study more the mechanics and design of the game.

Personally, I don't have THAT much money to buy every single game I want, so when I get one, I usually play it to the very end, achievements included (if they are not stupid like some of the ones I mentioned). Plus, trying for achievements, made me more critic on games that at first they seemed masterpieces to me.
I mean, always better than those who play the game for 1 hour and immediately say "OMG BEST GAME EVAH!!1!1!1".

They make the filler achievements because they have to - they have to fill the quota laid out by Microsoft and now Sony in regards to 1000 GS / platinum trophies. You can't just have 5 trophies for actual, difficult achievements, you have to have enough that people get their little serotonin hit just by playing the game they were going to play anyway. Then you get 70% of them naturally and think, well, might as well go for the rest, hadn't I? Might as well buy that DLC and get another platinum to boot.

I agree that they can be good for delving into games - I was one of the people who did the HL2:E2 gnome run because it sounded funny - I just think it's very rare that you actually see achievements that encourage it. Most of the time, if you see 100% completion in the game itself, you've probably got close to all achievements anyway, and the rest will be something like "use this move 100 times".

I don't have an issue with achievements being near impossible for whatever reason, if you're one of the people lucky/skilled enough to have it, that's way cooler than having every achievement in a game where everybody else does, too. Nobody cares about a God of War 2018 platinum, but beating The New Colossus without dying? THAT'S an achievement, and that's why 1% of players have it.

 

[The_Mike]

None. So don't make them?

For "singleplayer achievements" I meant those games who have like a campaign other than a multiplayer part (like Doom 2016).

What is this take?

"I don't like achievements in a multi player game, so don't make them".

OP it really sounds like you play the games for achievements and not for the enjoyment of the game itself.

You don't need every achievement in a game.

 

[The_Mike]

They make the filler achievements because they have to - they have to fill the quota laid out by Microsoft and now Sony in regards to 1000 GS / platinum trophies. You can't just have 5 trophies for actual, difficult achievements, you have to have enough that people get their little serotonin hit just by playing the game they were going to play anyway.

Doesn't king Kong actually give 1000/1000 for simply playing the game?

 

[D-ray]

What is this take?

"I don't like achievements in a multi player game, so don't make them".

OP it really sounds like you play the games for achievements and not for the enjoyment of the game itself.

You don't need every achievement in a game.

That's not what I said comrade.
Devs shouldn't make them not because "D-ray don't like them", but because (according to my original post) they don't make much sense in them existing.
They can do them, stupid or not, I was just expressing my thought on them.

 

[The_Mike]

That's not what I said comrade.
Devs shouldn't make them not because "D-ray don't like them", but because (according to my original post) they don't make much sense in them existing.
They can do them, stupid or not, I was just expressing my thought on them.

Achievements in general doesn't really make sense.

 

[D-ray]

Achievements in general doesn't really make sense.

Well that's your take on them. Single player achievements, for me at least, may be a good way to replay the game, have a new challenge or harder challenge, and/or flex because why not.

 

[The_Mike]

Well that's your take on them. Single player achievements, for me at least, may be a good way to replay the game, have a new challenge or harder challenge, and/or flex because why not.

And for online gamers then online achievements are cool flexing.

 

[D-ray]

And for online gamers then online achievements are cool flexing.

Never heard of anyone flexing them, but good for them then.

 

[sloppyjoe_gamer]

Multiplayer trophies should never count towards the platinum, IMO. Let those who enjoy getting platinums not have to deal with the extraordinary nonsense involved with multiplayer trophies

 

[crackajack]

Multiplayer trophies should never count towards the platinum, IMO. Let those who enjoy getting platinums not have to deal with the extraordinary nonsense involved with multiplayer trophies

as though SP trophies are not also often firmly on the same nonsense level
Tetris Effect wants me to turn pieces iirc 1mio times. I played and enjoyed the game quite a lot longer than I believed a Tetris game would, but extrapolating I think I would need 10x more playtime to get to the required turns. An arcade stick with a turbo button, would be the easy solution, but even a good player could only do it in 100h- I am guesstimating very very low I believe- , but still that feels like an unreasonable number for any legit natural progress of average people that are not religious Tetris players. Especially since players who are able to achieve SS ranks for the other trophies would never need that much playtime for SS ranks, even less if already seasoned players of other Tetris games. I can't finish either, fine, but why bother good players with a grind when they should "easily" be able to do the actual hard stuff and move on to their next Tetris game?

While technically this at least never gets impossible, as some hacked leaderboard shit or seasonal online thing does, it still is magnificient nonsense.

 

[AJUMP23]

They exist to torment you.