Support NeoGAF

[Captain Toad]

It seems we are hearing every month about Microsoft or Sony acquiring a third-party studio. But, they appear to be for very different reasons.

Microsoft has been spending big bucks and buying big name developers and publishers with big IPs. Sony, on the other hand, has been buying studios that have shown a ton of talent, but own few, if any, big IPs.

For example, Sony purchased Insomniac. Sure, they were already known for their work in Ratchet and Clank, Spyro the Dragon and Spider-Man, but didn't actually own any of those IPs. In fact, Sony already owned two of three without Insomniac.

Microsoft meanwhile has been acquiring huge IPs such as Elder Scrolls, Minecraft and attempted to get Call of Duty, even as much of the talent that created those franchises already left or transitions away during and after the acquisitions.

Sony has been buying studios that recently formed and haven't even released their first game, because the people who formed those studios have proven track records from working on other games at other studios.

The one big IP Sony did aquire was Destiny with the purchase of Bungie. But, it's clear Destiny was not the focus of the acquisition. Sony believes no developer has more talent in their field of live service games and acquired them for that end. Knowing that these acquisitions often end up in a high turn over, Sony put a ton of money into bonuses for current Bungie employees in order to keep them aboard.

As to which ends up being the right choice - focusing on talent or focusing on brands - has yet to be determined.

 

[Rubik8]

New IP can be created. Recognizing the talent to do so is the tricky part. I have faith in Sony.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Sony focuses on getting competence where they feel they are lacking, such as Bungie and GaaS. They don't think about their competition when making acquisitions.

Microsoft focuses on taking away 3rd parties with established franchises away from their main competitor. Their competition is all they think about when making acquisitions.

Different mentality, different results.

 

[TheGodfather07]

It feels like sony know what they're actually doing and have a clear strategy, whilst Microsoft don't really know and are just buying up ip to close the gap against Sony by taking games away. The last thing I want is Microsoft owning 3rd party ip. Their track record is atrocious! I have no trust in them whatsoever.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

MS is running like headless chicken trying to save the Xbox brand.

 

[Punished Miku]

Microsoft focuses on taking away 3rd parties with established franchises away from their main competitor.

Sony focuses on doing that quite a bit as well. They just have the luxury of doing it very cheaply on a game by game basis. MS would very quickly bleed dry trying to pay for 3rd party exclusives, and pay again to put it on Gamepass, and then repeat that again a year later. And then long term if the 3rd parties find success in subs, they then make their own sub - similar to what happened to Netflix. Makes a lot more sense to pay big up front for MS.

 

[MikeM]

Look at Sony’s latest purchases, then look at MS’. Pretty clear that one is simply buying to fill holes in their portfolio, while the other is buying opportunities and potential.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Sony focuses on doing that quite a bit as well. They just have the luxury of doing it very cheaply on a game by game basis. MS would very quickly bleed dry trying to pay for 3rd party exclusives, and pay again to put it on Gamepass, and then repeat that again a year later. And then long term if the 3rd parties find success in subs, they then make their own sub - similar to what happened to Netflix. Makes a lot more sense to pay big up front for MS.

MS only has themselves to blame. They had the luxury in the 360 era, I wonder what changed

 

[Punished Miku]

MS only has themselves to blame. They had the luxury in the 360 era, I wonder what changed

Cool.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Cool.

Expect better.

 

[feynoob]

Talent can be acquired by money.
MS can just hire those people and pay them double of Sony salary.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Its relentless!

 

[diffusionx]

We really have no idea if Sony's latest acquisitions are going to bear any fruit. The games could easily be crap, or even not come out. In some ways, it is more of a risk to buy a new team working on a new concept than a studio like Bethesda with decades of experience and IP behind it.

The Bungie acquisition is just weird. I know that Bungie ostensibly has knowledge in the GAAS space but how will that translate across all their studios, I don't know. And I also think it is a failure of Sony to have to buy Bungie as they basically ignored live service for years, killed off UC4, shut down games like MAG and Killzone, etc. and then needed to spend imo an inflated value to catch up. They could have gained that knowledge in house but decided to go full bore behind "moviegames" and just pay AB for COD trinkets.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Talent can be acquired by money.
MS can just hire those people and pay them double of Sony salary.

 

[GHG]

Sony focuses on doing that quite a bit as well. They just have the luxury of doing it very cheaply on a game by game basis. MS would very quickly bleed dry trying to pay for 3rd party exclusives, and pay again to put it on Gamepass, and then repeat that again a year later. And then long term if the 3rd parties find success in subs, they then make their own sub - similar to what happened to Netflix. Makes a lot more sense to pay big up front for MS.

Bleed dry? Are you joking?

Be honest, when was the last time you looked at a Microsoft balance sheet?

 

[Punished Miku]

Expect better.

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/why-do-we-have-to-lower-our-expectations.1656113/#post-267897684

Over here.

 

[feynoob]

MS needs better management that can utilize those talents.
Current management is rotten apple.

 

[Crispy Gamer]

IP is important but in the case of Halo they didn't have enough talent to keep it best in class so acquiring talent to create new IP could be more beneficial, but in a perfect world acquiring both IP and talent is what MS and Sony would rather do.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Bleed dry? Are you joking?

Be honest, when was the last time you looked at a Microsoft balance sheet?

their balanced shit is all obfuscated

 

[feynoob]

See Manchester City players. All of these are bought by their oil money.

But that requires a ceo like pep for MS.

 

[Nankatsu]

One knows what it is doing, the other doesn't. It's that simple.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

MS needs better management that can utilize those talents.
Current management is rotten apple.

did you meant "dirty window"?

 

[Brigandier]

Talent can be acquired by money.
MS can just hire those people and pay them double of Sony salary.

 

[DeepEnigma]

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/why-do-we-have-to-lower-our-expectations.1656113/#post-267897684

Over here.

See Manchester City players. All of these are bought by their oil money.

But that requires a ceo like pep for MS.

Man U gets far more on their return tho.

 

[IFireflyl]

Sony focuses on doing that quite a bit as well. They just have the luxury of doing it very cheaply on a game by game basis. MS would very quickly bleed dry trying to pay for 3rd party exclusives, and pay again to put it on Gamepass, and then repeat that again a year later. And then long term if the 3rd parties find success in subs, they then make their own sub - similar to what happened to Netflix. Makes a lot more sense to pay big up front for MS.

This is a thread regarding acquisitions and exclusivity due to acquisitions. What you're talking about is third-party exclusivity agreements, and that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

 

[Banjo64]

Talent can be acquired by money.
MS can just hire those people and pay them double of Sony salary.

Money doesn’t equal good games.

Creatives, programmers, everybody - they need a work environment that fosters joy/happiness/encourages their creativity in order to produce the best results.

Microsoft could pay the best 100 people on Sony’s books twice as much and the result would probably be half as impressive.

 

[DeepEnigma]

This is a thread regarding acquisitions and exclusivity due to acquisitions. What you're talking about is thrid-party exclusivity agreements, and that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

 

[GHG]

their balanced shit is all obfuscated

For Xbox? Yes, for the company as a whole? No.

If they can afford to do a $70 billion dollar cash deal for activision how many timed exclusive deals do you think that gets you? Meanwhile as time goes on Microsoft as a business is still making 10's of billion's of dollars a quarter in the background.

They could easily afford to do a timed AAA exclusive every single month and it wouldn't make a dent on their finances. Not smart business (not that purchasing Activision for the quoted amount is smart business either), but they could do it.

"Bleed dry" my arse. Somehow Sony can afford to do it but if Microsoft were to do the same thing it would bankrupt them. Poor Microsoft.

 

[Magic Carpet]

Talent can be acquired by money.
MS can just hire those people and pay them double of Sony salary.

The 343 way, Sitting around cashing paychecks is hard work.

 

[Woopah]

Definitely them going after Bethesda and Activision was about getting brands for Ganepass, but even so the first 4 games from Bethesda to come to Xbox are new IPs.

But if you look at many of the other studios they bought (Double Fine, Obsidian, Undead etc.) the main aim was not to get big IP. It was to get studios to develop exclusive content for Xbox, similar to what Sony did with many of their developers.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

For Xbox? Yes, for the company as a whole? No.

If they can afford to do a $70 billion dollar cash deal for activision how many timed exclusive deals do you think that gets you? Meanwhile as time goes on Microsoft as a business is still making 10's of billion's of dollars a quarter in the background.

They could afford to do a timed AAA exclusive every single month and it wouldn't make a dent on their finances. Not smart business (not that purchasing Activision for the quoted amount is smart business either), but they could do it.

they could do a lot of things...like, I dunno...develop AAA GOTY contenders in a consistent basis.

this "MS has all the money, the can afford to do this and that" has become a meme at this point.

 

[Punished Miku]

Not smart business

Just because MS is a rich company doesn't mean MS gaming division has infinite access to burn unlimited money on timed exclusives. You admit as much right here. All it would take to understand my post is a tiny bit of thought into trying to understand what I'm saying instead of immediately going for the most argumentative comeback. In this case, you literally agree with me. This place is getting dumber every day.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Talent can be acquired by money.
MS can just hire those people and pay them double of Sony salary.

They didn't get Insomniac.

 

[feynoob]

Man U gets far more on their return tho

Basd on recent results, man City got the best deal.

All they need is to get rid off yaya toure cake curse. They need to give him his cake, and they will win champions league.

My best result on other hand would be complete man City relegation from premier League.

 

[Punished Miku]

has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

You have to read the whole post up to the last sentence and then think about it for a few seconds.

 

[sainraja]

Just because MS is a rich company doesn't mean MS gaming division has infinite access to burn unlimited money on timed exclusives. You admit as much right here. All it would take to understand my post is a tiny bit of thought into trying to understand what I'm saying instead of immediately going for the most argumentative comeback. In this case, you literally agree with me. This place is getting dumber every day.

You need to relax lol.

Xbox has done exactly what you claim they can't do during the Xbox 360 generation. They have done exactly that.

 

[GHG]

Just because MS is a rich company doesn't mean MS gaming division has infinite access to burn unlimited money on timed exclusives. You admit as much right here. All it would take to understand my post is a tiny bit of thought into trying to understand what I'm saying instead of immediately going for the most argumentative comeback. In this case, you literally agree with me. This place is getting dumber every day.

If you want to take what I've said out of context and talk about what would be "smart business" then xbox as a whole isn't smart business, yet its still around. Furthermore, giving a failing division $70 billion dollars to do a cash M&A transaction isn't "smart business" either, but yet they still did it. So instead of being logical you'd rather go down this "woe is Xbox, they can't afford to compete with Sony in the same way that Sony competes with them" path.

And you really want to talk bout things "getting dumber"? Are you sure?

 

[SmokedMeat]

Sony has been buying studios that recently formed and haven't even released their first game, because the people who formed those studios have proven track records from working on other games at other studios.

Who are these people and what games did they work on?

 

[cireza]

Microsoft focuses on taking away 3rd parties with established franchises away from their main competitor.

Can't wait to play FF VII, XVI and Forspoken on Xbox.

 

[sainraja]

This is a thread regarding acquisitions and exclusivity due to acquisitions. What you're talking about is thrid-party exclusivity agreements, and that has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

It must be easy to mix the two! lol

 

[Punished Miku]

And you really want to talk bout things "getting dumber"? Are you sure?

I didn't say I want to talk about it. I said the dumbness is already present, and is consistently increasing in frequency and intensity.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Can't wait to play FF VII, XVI and Forspoken on Xbox.

maybe you can't wait....but you will have to. is not going to be that hard anyway.

 

[diffusionx]

For Xbox? Yes, for the company as a whole? No.

If they can afford to do a $70 billion dollar cash deal for activision how many timed exclusive deals do you think that gets you? Meanwhile as time goes on Microsoft as a business is still making 10's of billion's of dollars a quarter in the background.

They could easily afford to do a timed AAA exclusive every single month and it wouldn't make a dent on their finances. Not smart business (not that purchasing Activision for the quoted amount is smart business either), but they could do it.

"Bleed dry" my arse. Somehow Sony can afford to do it but if Microsoft were to do the same thing it would bankrupt them. Poor Microsoft.

At some point, though, investors are going to demand a return on these investments. MS can't just set money on fire indefinitely because Office makes a lot of cash. This was actually the problem Sony ran into in the early 2000s where they had all these horrible businesses making no money but the PlayStation was just propping them up.

 

[GHG]

I didn't say I want to talk about it. I said the dumbness is already present, and is consistently increasing in frequency and intensity.

This is a subject you brought up.

 

[cireza]

is not going to be that hard anyway.

That's for sure.

 

[Punished Miku]

You need to relax lol.

Xbox has done exactly what you claim they can't do during the Xbox 360 generation. They have done exactly that.

They did it with Tomb Raider for 100 million. And saw almost no benefit. It's a losing strategy. That was the point of my comment. They have more incentive to pay big up front on acquisitions. Sony could probably get that exclusive for a lot less.

I'm relaxed.

 

[sainraja]

They did it with Tomb Raider for 100 million. And saw almost no benefit. It's a losing strategy. That was the point of my comment. They have more incentive to pay big up front on acquisitions. Sony could probably get that exclusive for a lot less.

I'm relaxed.

They shifted their strategy but did not completely move away from it. They still do timed exclusives. Regardless, the point was that they have done it in the past with the X360 and found success. And sure, they have the money to pay big for up-front acquisitions, but the result of that is taking away established IP from their competitors (something you took issue with others saying), and Sony's focus when it comes to acquisitions hasn't been IP, which you were conflating with paying for timed exclusivity in response. Looking at it from afar, you simply wanted to say "Sony too" by ignoring the situation at play.

Basically, your initial post in this thread was a knee-jerk reaction to a comment made by someone else. If you had paused a little to think about it, you would see that most of the acquisitions Sony made did not bring them any IP, and the ones that did will still exist on competing platforms (Bungie with Destiny). To pre-emptively respond to anyone else who might want to jump in, I know MS has done the same with Minecraft.

EDIT
And before someone tries to go even deeper into both companies histories, know that this thread is discussing the focus of recent strategies for both companies.

 

[Punished Miku]

Basically, your initial post in this thread was a knee-jerk reaction to a comment made by someone else. If you had paused a little to think about it, you would see that most of the acquisitions Sony made did not bring them any IP, and the ones that did will still exist on competing platforms (Bungie with Destiny). To pre-emptively respond to anyone else who might want to jump in, I know MS has done the same with Minecraft.

I didn't say anything that contradicts or denies this. That was kind of the point of my post. Sony can easily pursue exclusivity of third parties through other, cheaper means. MS can, but it costs a lot more when you are covering 80% sales not on your platform, and you have a constant long term need for content with a sub model. It makes more sense for MS to think bigger if they look at it long term.

 

[Captain Toad]

Sony has been buying studios that recently formed and haven't even released their first game, because the people who formed those studios have proven track records from working on other games at other studios.

Who are these people and what games did they work on?

Haven Studio - Jade Raymond co-creator of Assassin's Creed and Watchdogs franchises ar Ubisoft. Also includes Paola Jouyaux, Leon O'Reilly, Daniel Drapeau and Mathieu Leduc.

Firewalk was established in 2018 as a subsidiary of ProbablyMonsters, by veterans of game companies such as Bungie and Activision including former Activision executive Tony Hsu and former Bungie creative director Ryan Ellis, who worked on the Destiny franchise together.

 

[sainraja]

I didn't say anything that contradicts or denies this. That was kind of the point of my post. Sony can easily pursue exclusivity of third parties through other, cheaper means. MS can, but it costs a lot more when you are covering 80% sales not on your platform, and you have a constant long term need for content with a sub model. It makes more sense for MS to think bigger if they look at it long term.

Yeah, but you know this thread wasn't discussing timed exclusivity, something they both do and focus heavily on when the market position favors them (Sony PS2/4/5 and MS with X360). You are also ignoring that if MS was doing that, even if they initially paid more, it would eventually influence the price they need to pay to change, depending on how their position in the market changed. Anyway, timed exclusivity was never the point of the thread to begin with.