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MCU's own What If...?

Cyberpunkd

Gold Member
I got a better one:

What If…you would just get nice popcorn movies that can exist separately instead of a BS MCU where it feels like you need to see all the 20 movies to ‘fully understand’ the plot. How about that?
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
They couldn't get Brie Larson, Benedict Cumberbatch (despite him filming TWO movies for them when the show was being made), Chris Evans, RDJ, or Tom Holland (Sony wouldn't let him do it). Everyone else is back including people like Michael Douglas and Kurt Russell.
The whole reason the voice acting was so bad in Ep 4 was that Benedict Cumberbatch DID voice it, lol
 

trikster40

Member
Ok, new episode was really good. Looks like this may actually have some ramifications in the MCU, at least more than I thought it would.
 
Alright, that was awesome! Great episode with a shit ton of actually awesome references to things that happened in the mainline movies. High stakes. An awesome villain. Great fights throughout.

This makes me wish we had seen more of Hawkeye and Black Widow together in the movies. They have great chemistry. (Which makes me realize the OG 6 Avengers have great chemistry "in pairs" -- Iron Man + Cap, Thor + Hulk, Hawkeye + BW).

More episodes like this and the Dr. Strange one, and less "party Thor" stuff, would be fantastic in Season 2.
 

Ownage

Member
Was that Galactus that took a bite out of that world? Or did Super Ultron just grow that big?

Our watcher looks like he may be a member of the Eternals.
 

trikster40

Member
I’mu hr
Was that Galactus that took a bite out of that world? Or did Super Ultron just grow that big?

Our watcher looks like he may be a member of the Eternals.
looked like Galaxtus to me, remember the watcher is being thrown through different universes, so it makes sense. How would ultron magically grow big enough to eat a planet?

 
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I’mu hr

looked like Galaxtus to me, remember the watcher is being thrown through different universes, so it makes sense. How would ultron magically grow big enough to eat a planet?

I thought the same at first too. The problem I had with this episode is it totally went against the existing gauntlet lore, let alone the lore that would stop this from happening.
 

DeafTourette

Older than air but younger than the foundations of the earth
I’mu hr

looked like Galaxtus to me, remember the watcher is being thrown through different universes, so it makes sense. How would ultron magically grow big enough to eat a planet?


Its not Galactus... It's Ultron. And the reality stone is how he did that.

Edit: the stones stopped working at the TVA because they were outside of time. The nexus of all realities exists within time still... Not outside of it. And the stones working in separate universes might be a thing just not following the comic canon.
 
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Amiga

Member
the only episode that's about an important event. like..

what if the Red Skull won.
what if Odin stayed.
what if uncle ben didn't die.
what if Ronan got the Infinity Stone.
what if the Avengers completed their plan in endgame without anything going wrong.
what if Thanos attacked Earth directly the 1st time.
what if Captain Marvel joined the Avengers from the start.
 

Ownage

Member
I’mu hr

looked like Galaxtus to me, remember the watcher is being thrown through different universes, so it makes sense. How would ultron magically grow big enough to eat a planet?

Speaking of which, Captain Marvel looks like she got beat. If she doesn't win, she loses. Did she die when the galaxy blew up?

And who did our guy make a promise to to stay out of meddling with affairs? Again, gonna guess Eternals. But that just opened up another layer of reality and space/time hierarchy.
 
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Speaking of which, Captain Marvel looks like she got beat. If she doesn't win, she loses. Did she die when the galaxy blew up?

We'll see what she's like, actually good for in the MCU. So far, she:

- Was unable to stop Thanos in Endgame. (Granted, he used the power stone for that, but still...)
- Came to a draw with Thor in that one What If episode. (And that was against an alternate "party Thor," not even awakened, Stormbreaker-wielding Thor from Infinity War.)
- Lost against Ultron.

I don't know, for being a "god-tier" character, I haven't been impressed with MCU Captain Marvel at all. And that's not to mention that other heroes like Dr Strange and post Dark-Hold Scarlet Witch can eat Captain Marvel for lunch...
 

hemo memo

Member
We'll see what she's like, actually good for in the MCU. So far, she:

- Was unable to stop Thanos in Endgame. (Granted, he used the power stone for that, but still...)
- Came to a draw with Thor in that one What If episode. (And that was against an alternate "party Thor," not even awakened, Stormbreaker-wielding Thor from Infinity War.)
- Lost against Ultron.

I don't know, for being a "god-tier" character, I haven't been impressed with MCU Captain Marvel at all. And that's not to mention that other heroes like Dr Strange and post Dark-Hold Scarlet Witch can eat Captain Marvel for lunch...

Thanos used an infinity stone on her. As for Thor she could obliterate him. He wasn’t worth the destruction. As for Ultron, no one even stood a chance.
 
Thanos used an infinity stone on her. As for Thor she could obliterate him. He wasn’t worth the destruction. As for Ultron, no one even stood a chance.
All it takes is one infinity stone? Wanda (at nowhere near her full power) held Thanos off, while he was wearing the gauntlet with 5 stones, and she did that with one hand while destroying the Mind Stone with her other hand.

"She could obliterate" Thor. Could she, though? Wasn't SHIELD going to send nukes in?

As for Ultron, obviously people did stand a chance. Otherwise there wouldn't have been an episode.

I stand by my previous opinion: Captain Marvel (MCU version) really hasn't been all that impressive.
 

DeafTourette

Older than air but younger than the foundations of the earth
Speaking of which, Captain Marvel looks like she got beat. If she doesn't win, she loses. Did she die when the galaxy blew up?

And who did our guy make a promise to to stay out of meddling with affairs? Again, gonna guess Eternals. But that just opened up another layer of reality and space/time hierarchy.

Yes she died.

He made an oath to the other Watchers. They're a whole race of beings... They were shown in Guardians 2.
 

DeafTourette

Older than air but younger than the foundations of the earth
All it takes is one infinity stone? Wanda (at nowhere near her full power) held Thanos off, while he was wearing the gauntlet with 5 stones, and she did that with one hand while destroying the Mind Stone with her other hand.

"She could obliterate" Thor. Could she, though? Wasn't SHIELD going to send nukes in?

As for Ultron, obviously people did stand a chance. Otherwise there wouldn't have been an episode.

I stand by my previous opinion: Captain Marvel (MCU version) really hasn't been all that impressive.

He knocked her out with the Power stone. It amplified his strength... So even though he tried to headbutt her and it not fazing her at first... When he used the power Stone, it amplified his strength to knock her back and out.

And ULTRON, not the boys he employs, is pretty equal to Uatu the Watcher. That's on a whole other level from Thor or Capt. Marvel ... BW and Clint weren't fighting Ultron... They were evading and fighting his drones.
 
He knocked her out with the Power stone. It amplified his strength... So even though he tried to headbutt her and it not fazing her at first... When he used the power Stone, it amplified his strength to knock her back and out.

For comparison, awakened Thor wrecked Thanos with lightning, then subsequently threw Stormbreaker at Thanos... while Thanos had a full gauntlet with all six stones. That was an impressive feat.

Wanda holding a five-stone Thanos with one hand, that was an impressive feat. (And subsequently, "angry, heartbroken" Wanda almost single-handedly killing Thanos in Endgame.... that was a fantastically impressive feat)
Dr. Strange holding his own against Thanos on Titan, that was an impressive feat.

I have seen no such impressive feats from Captain Marvel. (Disclaimer: I haven't watched her stand-alone movie yet).

If I interpreted the ending of Guardians 2 correctly, they might introduce Adam Warlock, which would reduce the impact of Captain Marvel anyway.

I'm not a Captain Marvel hater, I just want to see her being put to better use in the MCU, that's all.
 

DeafTourette

Older than air but younger than the foundations of the earth
For comparison, awakened Thor wrecked Thanos with lightning, then subsequently threw Stormbreaker at Thanos... while Thanos had a full gauntlet with all six stones. That was an impressive feat.

Wanda holding a five-stone Thanos with one hand, that was an impressive feat. (And subsequently, "angry, heartbroken" Wanda almost single-handedly killing Thanos in Endgame.... that was a fantastically impressive feat)
Dr. Strange holding his own against Thanos on Titan, that was an impressive feat.

I have seen no such impressive feats from Captain Marvel. (Disclaimer: I haven't watched her stand-alone movie yet).

If I interpreted the ending of Guardians 2 correctly, they might introduce Adam Warlock, which would reduce the impact of Captain Marvel anyway.

I'm not a Captain Marvel hater, I just want to see her being put to better use in the MCU, that's all.

This isn't entirely accurate. Awakened Thor got his butt kicked at the beginning of the movie. He only got his axe into Thanos because he caught him by surprise... And Thanos didn't know how all the stones worked fully. He knew how to turn time back and such but not their full powers! Everything he did was brute force except the time rewinding. It's the difference between a street fighter and a master swordsman. Ultron Supreme is the master swordsman.

Strange still lost because Thanos wasn't trying to kill him. Also, Thanos hadn't mastered the stones yet... He got all of them within days of each other. Ultron had learned more about them FASTER because of his much faster compute ability.

Wanda is the Scarlet Witch, her powers are amplified by the Mind Stone (or were mostly awakened by it as the show explained). The Scarlet Witch is more powerful than the Sorcerer Supreme.

In the Captain Marvel movie, Carol is just learning what she's truly capable of in the 3rd act. So we haven't entirely seen what she can truly do yet. Right now, her biggest feat is holding her own against Thanos before he cheated with the Power stone. Her sequel coming up should give us all a better idea of what she can do. And what Monica can do, as well.
 

DeafTourette

Older than air but younger than the foundations of the earth
Ultron with all five Infinity Stones.

Yep!

Also, Captain Marvel absorbs energy... But even with the absorption of the stones' energy from the gauntlet, when Thanos knocked her back with the power Stone... That was that. A non-power stone wielding Thanos would have been taken out much easier by Capt. Marvel.
 
This isn't entirely accurate. Awakened Thor got his butt kicked at the beginning of the movie. He only got his axe into Thanos because he caught him by surprise... And Thanos didn't know how all the stones worked fully. He knew how to turn time back and such but not their full powers! Everything he did was brute force except the time rewinding. It's the difference between a street fighter and a master swordsman. Ultron Supreme is the master swordsman.

Strange still lost because Thanos wasn't trying to kill him. Also, Thanos hadn't mastered the stones yet... He got all of them within days of each other. Ultron had learned more about them FASTER because of his much faster compute ability.

Wanda is the Scarlet Witch, her powers are amplified by the Mind Stone (or were mostly awakened by it as the show explained). The Scarlet Witch is more powerful than the Sorcerer Supreme.

In the Captain Marvel movie, Carol is just learning what she's truly capable of in the 3rd act. So we haven't entirely seen what she can truly do yet. Right now, her biggest feat is holding her own against Thanos before he cheated with the Power stone. Her sequel coming up should give us all a better idea of what she can do. And what Monica can do, as well.
You bring up some great points (some of which I still disagree with), but I feel like I'm derailing the thread. Perhaps we can take this to the general MCU thread, or to PM?

Either way thanks for taking the time dude, your writeups are well thought out! 👍🏻
 

DeafTourette

Older than air but younger than the foundations of the earth
You bring up some great points (some of which I still disagree with), but I feel like I'm derailing the thread. Perhaps we can take this to the general MCU thread, or to PM?

Either way thanks for taking the time dude, your writeups are well thought out! 👍🏻

Thank you! And I meant Strange list because THEY weren't trying to kill each other. If Thanos wanted to kill Strange, he could have... And Strange was more on the defensive and was more trying to subdue Thanos. That's why Strange held his own... And why it ended in a draw, pretty much.
 
Keep the banter going here, it's relevant imo.
Alright, as you wish.

Thread Creator, mods, or anyone else -- if you feel this is derailing let me know and I'll take my fight with DeafTourette DeafTourette out back and knock him out ( :messenger_tears_of_joy: just kidding; humor like this doesn't translate well on the internet...)

DeafTourette DeafTourette -- nothing but love in here, man. I'm only having this back and forth with you because it's kind of fun to be honest, but no harm meant. Also, can we at least agree on something before we continue? The MCU nerfs/buffs heroes and villains all the time, for story purposes...

This isn't entirely accurate. Awakened Thor got his butt kicked at the beginning of the movie.
True. He didn't have Stormbreaker though. Thanos already had the Power Stone, and was backed up by all his "children" who are pretty damn formidable themselves (esp. Ebony Maw. I mean Maw took on Dr. Strange 1v1 and practically beat him.)

He only got his axe into Thanos because he caught him by surprise...
Yes and no. He caught Thanos with lightning by surprise. But Thanos then recovered and used the full power of the completed Gauntlet against Thor's Stormbreaker. His energy blast from the gauntlet was a direct response to a direct (non-surprise) Stormbreaker throw by Thor.

And Thanos didn't know how all the stones worked fully.
I disagree with this.
- He seemed to be able to use the Space Stone pretty well to open his portals and go places; he did that all the time!
- He had gotten a pretty good handle on the Reality Stone. The way he used it in Knowhere was not the way someone who "doesn't know how the stone works fully" would use it. He knew how to use it, and use it well. The Guardians never stood a chance. (Oh, he used it on Volmir again to prevent Gamora from committing suicide...)
- I'm not 100% sure if it was the Power Stone, but whatever Stone that was, he used it to throw a moon at Stark.
- You already said he knew how to use the Time Stone, which I agree with.

You're not giving enough credit to Thanos. Not only is he tough, but he's got genius-level intellect matching (or surpassing) that of the smartest Earth heroes (Stark, Banner, Shuri, etc). So he's not... a noob.

Strange still lost because Thanos wasn't trying to kill him. Also, Thanos hadn't mastered the stones yet... He got all of them within days of each other. Ultron had learned more about them FASTER because of his much faster compute ability.
This is a fair point. This is a combination of Thanos having "plot armor" and Dr. Strange still learning to master his craft. I mean, can't Dr. Strange technically lock Thanos in the "mirror dimension" for an Insta-Win condition? Couldn't he do the same thing to Thanos that he did to Dormmamu (lock him in a Time Stone-induced infinite loop)? Etc...

Wanda is the Scarlet Witch, her powers are amplified by the Mind Stone (or were mostly awakened by it as the show explained). The Scarlet Witch is more powerful than the Sorcerer Supreme.
YES. I 100% agree. I'm a big fan of Scarlet Witch so I'm a bit biased, but I think out of all the current heroes she's the absolutely most powerful one. She was already god-tier before she became the Scarlet Witch, but now.... (Also in WandaVision, someone (Agatha?) explicitly says that the Scarlet Witch is, verbatim, "... more powerful than the sorcerer supreme.")

In the Captain Marvel movie, Carol is just learning what she's truly capable of in the 3rd act. So we haven't entirely seen what she can truly do yet. Right now, her biggest feat is holding her own against Thanos before he cheated with the Power stone. Her sequel coming up should give us all a better idea of what she can do. And what Monica can do, as well.
You know, because of my back-and-forth with you I actually started watching Captain Marvel last night. I have 20 minutes left of the movie so I'll come back with impressions, but you're absolutely right, she's just learning her powers. That's fair.

And another unfair criticism I've been using against her -- I mean, she's technically only had ONE movie, her own standalone one. (Endgame doesn't really count because she got mostly sidelined to make way for the OG 6 Avengers...)

Anyway, I will go finish the Captain Marvel movie now :messenger_winking_tongue:
 

Ownage

Member
Re: Capt Marvel and Larson, she got a raw deal from the bad press during those SJW days. Now that it's died down a bit, her character is fine. Am curious to see what Capt Marvel can do. What rubbed me the wrong way was being force-fed DE&I. As stated above, Capt Marvel is being set up as an Iron Man tier replacement, but on a larger (cosmic) scale. She won't be able to do big shit on her own, as seen in Wut If... The rules got harder, and bigger and tougher heroes are needed. But tag-teamed with other heroes, they might have a chance. That's my takeaway from all of this.

As far as Super Ultron goes, I loved seeing him trash everyone. His powers should've been what Thanos had during Infinity War. Ultron clearly set the new standard this week. Where can they take the cosmic terrorism from here? What can best this in the next Phase? What can Mephisto or Galactus do that Ultron hasn't?
 
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ManaByte

Member
Re: Capt Marvel and Larson, she got a raw deal from the bad press during those SJW days.

Raw deal? I've talked to people at Marvel and the "real deal" hasn't really ever been talked about. Some pretty big YouTube channels ran daily hate campaigns on her, and it became so bad Disney studio security basically had to set up shop at her house to protect her from psychopaths who have been brainwashed by those channels.
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Really enjoy ep8, is there a part 2? Want see what the watcher and dr strange do.

Ep8 spoilers↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓





I found it pretty unrealistic that a mind stone ultron could take out a 5 stone thanos.
 
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Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Well there is a car commercial that kind of spoiled it already.

The Watcher and Doctor Strange recruit Captain Carter, T'Challa Star Lord, Party Thor, etc to join forces and fight Ultron.

Is that going to be ep9?
 

ManaByte

Member
Is that going to be ep9?

Episode 10.

Episode 9 is Tony Stark on Sakaar. Where he doesn't make it through the portal at the end of Avengers. He lands on Sakaar and Gamora has taken over for Thanos because Thanos was on the Chitauri ship that Tony destroyed with the nuke.
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Episode 10.

Episode 9 is Tony Stark on Sakaar. Where he doesn't make it through the portal at the end of Avengers. He lands on Sakaar and Gamora has taken over for Thanos because Thanos was on the Chitauri ship that Tony destroyed with the nuke.
How u know this?
 

DeafTourette

Older than air but younger than the foundations of the earth
Episode 10.

Episode 9 is Tony Stark on Sakaar. Where he doesn't make it through the portal at the end of Avengers. He lands on Sakaar and Gamora has taken over for Thanos because Thanos was on the Chitauri ship that Tony destroyed with the nuke.

I think that's the episode that's been moved over to season 2. There's only 9 this season.
 

jason10mm

Member
We'll see what she's like, actually good for in the MCU. So far, she:

- Was unable to stop Thanos in Endgame. (Granted, he used the power stone for that, but still...)
- Came to a draw with Thor in that one What If episode. (And that was against an alternate "party Thor," not even awakened, Stormbreaker-wielding Thor from Infinity War.)
- Lost against Ultron.

I don't know, for being a "god-tier" character, I haven't been impressed with MCU Captain Marvel at all. And that's not to mention that other heroes like Dr Strange and post Dark-Hold Scarlet Witch can eat Captain Marvel for lunch...
The problem with the way Captain Marvel is portrayed is that she ACTS like she can whoop up on anyone and when she can't we never get her coming to grips with it. Thor has been able to kick most things ass and when he can't it messes him up. Same with Hulk. Ironman to some extent. But noooo not Captain Marvel. She stays just as cocky as ever 'cause she is puuuurfect :p

To be fair most of these fights don't even bother with her post-reactions just like they didn't really bother with her pre-fight reactions. She is about as lame a deux ex machina as possible.

These types of super-beings ought to be treated more like nuclear weapons or battleships in WW1/2. Too valuable to actually use and risk losing, thus they keep getting sidelined as a way of limiting conflict escalation and playing your trump card too early. But that would require writing character and the MCU isn't really about that.
 
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ManaByte

Member
So there's no multiversal Avengers as seen in the promos?

"We will pop into and re-meet some of our heroes from the previous episodes, including the lovely Captain Carter [Hayley Atwell], Strange Supreme, Party Thor [Chris Hemsworth], and even Killmonger [Michael B. Jordan]," Bradley reveals. "Early on in the first season, like day one talking about it, there was this notion of we're creating all these great heroes, but we only get to sit with them for 20 or 30 minutes. Wouldn't it be great to see them again in the finale? And then once that decision was made, it liberated me to make the endings a little bit darker and bigger, knowing that we can give some sort of resolution in the finale."
 
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