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Joe Staten: The open world of Halo was significantly scaled back compared to original vision

Ozriel

Member
"We didn't end up cutting that much ultimately from the open world but I know that from the original designs there was a pretty significant scaling back of what the team had hoped at one point that they could deliver on."

lol... what?

It’s clear. He means they didn’t cut that much after Staten joined in 2020 after the poor showcase.

Prior to the showcase, they’d cut a lot from the original vision
 

Fredrik

Gold Member
I disagree its still the best feeling fps on the market, despite being and old but regined formula its still more fun then modern shooters like returnal.
Well, I would rather pick my nose for an hour than play another hour of Returnal… would at least sense some progression then lol

So yeah I agree on that last bit.

But I still don’t think Halo Infinite is a good game, great shooting and grappling but in the end I would rate it maybe 6/10, 7/10 on a sunny day.
I got bored. Simple as that. That never happened with Halo 4 or Halo 5 so I was very disappointed tbh. And if it does pick up the pace and become interesting later on then it’s simply not well-directed for waiting so long to introduce the interesting bits.

Tbf, NMS came out 6 years ago.
They’ve released 3 updates in 2022 alone. No downplaying needed here.
 

Dynasty8

Member
The grapple was fun for sure, but the world felt...kinda boring? There was a serious lack of different biomes as well, which made every mission look and feel similar. I remember Halo 2,3 and Reach had jungles, cities, desert, snowy mountains, Covenant ships, and more.

Who knows...maybe they're saving those for future DLCs/expansions.
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Ita funny how Eurogamer just focused on the negetive, in the interview Joe is also very excited for what they have planned for Infinite.
 

Umbasaborne

Member
Yeah no shit, that was evident when the first trailer had multiple different biomes and the final game had copy and paste trees and metal hallways
 

Kev Kev

Gold Member
That campaign was one of the best Halo campaigns ever. And the map was HUGE! I couldn't imagine it being any bigger. So honestly, I'm glad the cuts were made so they could focus on polishing what they did keep in. I can't wait to go back through it one day on higher difficulties. It was such a blast to play.

I would invite some expansions to the campaign with more snowy areas, desert areas, more stuff inside the actual ring, etc. There is a ton they could with DLC/expansions in terms of campaign. But then they would be focusing on that and not Forge so... Yeah just focus on Forge 343. Multiplayer is still fun as hell too. So I think they are doing great :messenger_horns:
 
Should have never made it for Xbox one.

But even without that handicap, I don't know man, 343 is pretty incompetent at this point.
 

sainraja

Member
"We didn't end up cutting that much ultimately from the open world but I know that from the original designs there was a pretty significant scaling back of what the team had hoped at one point that they could deliver on."

lol... what?
haha, I noticed that too and I thought I had read incorrectly.
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Ok but where is the new content today?
I had hoped that by this time, the campaign would have significantly expanded
Why? Other games dont ....

Its funny how people make a complaint like this one about halo but not other games.
 
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Certinty

Member
Can’t say I’m surprised. Bland and boring open world in all honesty, felt even more pointless than half of Ubisoft’s maps.

After Halo 4 and 5 I’m genuinely shocked 343 still got Infinite.
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Can’t say I’m surprised. Bland and boring open world in all honesty, felt even more pointless than half of Ubisoft’s maps.

After Halo 4 and 5 I’m genuinely shocked 343 still got Infinite.
How is it bland and boring? How else would a forested area look?
They add a ton of detail in the world and the materials do have quite a realistic look to them.
 

Robb

Gold Member
For sure, they did a great job with what they gave us. I enjoyed the campaign a lot, and the open world is great fun.

But it lacks variation in biomes, wildlife, vegetation etc. etc. Looking back at the original CGI trailer it’s night and day.
 
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This type of thing is pretty typical for most AAA games.

That said, Halo: Infinite's open-world is so barebones it's pretty clear it was significantly scaled back just to get the game out the door. Hopefully, the ideas left on the cutting room floor will make it into the sequel.
 
Haven't tried halo infinite campaign yet but halo campaigns always had good enemy and difficult encounters that were crafted for each level. Open world for this game doesn't make sense nor can I see it working.
Not everything needs to be openworld.
 
And still it felt like they had to pad lot of content to fill the hours lol.

Totally agree, the last act of the game I was starting to just run through hallways etc wishing for it to get interesting, all the while knowing another speech was just around the next corner. There was none of the brilliance such as Halo CE flood reveals, bridges to and fro combat and hallway encounters or the set pieces of Outskirts/Delta Halo/Regret from Halo 2. It wasn't even executed in an interesting way like Guilty Spark leading you up the garden path chatting all the way. Nope, here's a hologram, again.

It was just padding across the story, action, environment and more. When you consider the wonderful soundtrack to Infinite it just wasn't punched home in game nor with the sort of intrinsic interplay Marty's Halo scores had during gameplay. Halo of old had a sort of intelligence to the backing music while you traversed a level or engaged a stronghold or were taken by surprise. When you fought your way through the flood you can recall the Halo bass and guitar even to this day, frenetic in fact. During a vista moment you had something like Peril dancing around your eardrums giving rise to wonder and mystery. Infinite just queues it up from a volume trigger around a sandbox base thing, again and again.

The fact they basically had one biome with only 2 elements of variety really compounded a lack of interest for me. I got sick of walking/grappling/driving the same forest. I got sick of walking/door opening/button pushing the same Forerunner rooms. Just look over CE or Halo 2 missions and see the massive diversity and vistas from each distinct environment. How they planned that out and revised over and over to only arrive at what was delivered with Infinite's campaign is beyond me.

Having all those similar looking Banished armour/weapons and enemies didn't do the game any favours either. I got sick of the banished pretty early on too, overall the story was pretty shit. Very one dimensional, which sums Infinite's campaign up in one statement.


Compare the open world to say something like Destiny 1 and 2. There is a huge gap between what Destiny has delivered vs what Infinite has delivered thus far. The menu system and UI is already presented far better. The little shared worlds, factions and traders etc are executed better in game for squads to gear up, rest, laugh, chat about what went down, interact with others etc. The sparrows to get around a planet and go where you want, explore/loot/grind, bring up a strike or join a world event and just enjoy experiencing the wonderful environments, art and sandbox etc. Emote with other parties and players. Gambit, compete against other coop players. Dungeons and Raids, what a missed opportunity with Infinite to go full PvE. Morons running 343 to not execute something of this nature at launch. Big fucking mistake. Anyhow you get the point. The level of variety in environments, enemies, weapons, art, gameplay engagements and others is infinitely more engaging and diverse in Destiny than Infinite. Take a look at say bosses of PvE content from Destiny vs Infinite. In Destiny the bosses are extensions of the environments e.g. what they wear suits that environment, what the environment is made of calls back to the type of boss e.g. Vex vs Cabal vs Hive vs Taken. Each unique in their attacks, weapons, enemies, environments and more.

Bungie still taking them to school.

I just hope Joe and the like get enough "pull" in the studio to make very clear and high level decisions that stick and don't get watered down through design by committee bullshit.
 
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Elysion

Member
Reading the title made me think this was about Halo CE on the OG XBox. Didn’t that also have to be ‘scaled back’ in some way? For example, I believe Bungie originally wanted to have wildlife in the game, but had to abandon the idea because it supposedly wasn’t technically feasible at the time.
 
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Totally agree, the last act of the game I was starting to just run through hallways etc wishing for it to get interesting, all the while knowing another speech was just around the next corner. There was none of the brilliance such as Halo CE flood reveals, bridges to and fro combat and hallway encounters or the set pieces of Outskirts/Delta Halo/Regret from Halo 2. It wasn't even executed in an interesting way like Guilty Spark leading you up the garden path chatting all the way. Nope, here's a hologram, again.

It was just padding across the story, action, environment and more. When you consider the wonderful soundtrack to Infinite it just wasn't punched home in game nor with the sort of intrinsic interplay Marty's Halo scores had during gameplay. Halo of old had a sort of intelligence to the backing music while you traversed a level or engaged a stronghold or were taken by surprise. When you fought your way through the flood you can recall the Halo bass and guitar even to this day, frenetic in fact. During a vista moment you had something like Peril dancing around your eardrums giving rise to wonder and mystery. Infinite just queues it up from a volume trigger around a sandbox base thing, again and again.

The fact they basically had one biome with only 2 elements of variety really compounded a lack of interest for me. I got sick of walking/grappling/driving the same forest. I got sick of walking/door opening/button pushing the same Forerunner rooms. Just look over CE or Halo 2 missions and see the massive diversity and vistas from each distinct environment. How they planned that out and revised over and over to only arrive at what was delivered with Infinite's campaign is beyond me.

Having all those similar looking Banished armour/weapons and enemies didn't do the game any favours either. I got sick of the banished pretty early on too, overall the story was pretty shit. Very one dimensional, which sums Infinite's campaign up in one statement.


Compare the open world to say something like Destiny 1 and 2. There is a huge gap between what Destiny has delivered vs what Infinite has delivered thus far. The menu system and UI is already presented far better. The little shared worlds, factions and traders etc are executed better in game for squads to gear up, rest, laugh, chat about what went down, interact with others etc. The sparrows to get around a planet and go where you want, explore/loot/grind, bring up a strike or join a world event and just enjoy experiencing the wonderful environments, art and sandbox etc. Emote with other parties and players. Gambit, compete against other coop players. Dungeons and Raids, what a missed opportunity with Infinite to go full PvE. Morons running 343 to not execute something of this nature at launch. Big fucking mistake. Anyhow you get the point. The level of variety in environments, enemies, weapons, art, gameplay engagements and others is infinitely more engaging and diverse in Destiny than Infinite. Take a look at say bosses of PvE content from Destiny vs Infinite. In Destiny the bosses are extensions of the environments e.g. what they wear suits that environment, what the environment is made of calls back to the type of boss e.g. Vex vs Cabal vs Hive vs Taken. Each unique in their attacks, weapons, enemies, environments and more.

Bungie still taking them to school.

I just hope Joe and the like get enough "pull" in the studio to make very clear and high level decisions that stick and don't get watered down through design by committee bullshit.
Isn't it clear by now that the graphics engine 343 are using has seen better days, and I believe is the biggest problem they have. Obviously can't happen with Infinite but a new graphics engine is what's needed for future Halo projects.
 

GametimeUK

Member
I think the world is fantastic as it is. I hate these boring over sized open worlds in games like Days Gone or realistic looking cities that are set dressing and fun to zip round for 5 minutes like Spider-Man. The novelty wares off quick.

I'm not saying Halo is perfect, but the gameplay and open world blend together well where it makes sense and feels fun to play for hours no matter how repetitive the mission structure can be.
 
Isn't it clear by now that the graphics engine 343 are using has seen better days, and I believe is the biggest problem they have. Obviously can't happen with Infinite but a new graphics engine is what's needed for future Halo projects.

Totally agree, I said it years ago it was too much to handle a new platform (series S/X), new engine, new open world, new multi-player, F2P and cross platform/gen. The decision makers at 343/Xbox really haven't learnt from their mistakes about biting off more than they can chew. MCC was a massive overstep, Infinite just doubled down really and became a mess on so many dev aspects, let alone the player experience. The game, engine and experience is so lacking, well below what should have been at launch and 1 year post launch. It still is. Graphics wise, networking wise, performance wise, modes wise, PvE missing, mods/forge missing, replay wise, content wise, story wise...

For what should have been the pinnacle of xbox games not just on console but on PC ,where $5K-$10K hardware can push your new game engine to its utmost best, what they produced really isn't at the forefront of game engine/experiences. Still no ray tracing? Pretty sad when you've had nearly 7 years at this point and your game/engine doesn't support the very thing marketing pushed so hard with for the launch of the Series S/X.

They should have gone with Unreal engine for the game and show, many years ago and from the drawing board. Total lack of studio vision and experience for the available tools out there over the last 2-5 years. The Mandalorian has shown what can be done, 343 should have slipspace'd Halo past the competition on console and PC and the TV show. They did not, not by a long shot Spartan throwing a grunt.

I think the world is fantastic as it is. I hate these boring over sized open worlds in games like Days Gone or realistic looking cities that are set dressing and fun to zip round for 5 minutes like Spider-Man. The novelty wares off quick.

I'm not saying Halo is perfect, but the gameplay and open world blend together well where it makes sense and feels fun to play for hours no matter how repetitive the mission structure can be.

Honestly if they had of pushed some PvE modes with mini missions, some procedural geometry/waves of enemies mixed it with Forge and given it all a nice UI/progression system like Destiny 2 they would have leagues of players and a solid content pipeline all the same. Imagine the quality of the networking for players, imagine the studio being free from "desync multiplayer PvP" etc. It's just so basic out there in Infinite's open world. Very little reason to replay if you ask me. You cannot even equip your Spartan and head back into the campaign showing your goods off in engine. We had this back in Reach and it was awesome, why go backwards?
 
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M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
Just a shame that games with really good gameplay loop like this game and Destiny, are such a lifeless boring repetive slog. It's just insane to me, how much money development cost and what players get.
Isn't infinite like a half a billion USD project or something like that? Where did it went, why the fuck it needed external studios to even make it shipable.

Well I know, but MS don't want to hear it. H1B visas workers. It's tough to constantly switch, teach and then kick after lapsed visa.

Not sure about Bungie, maybe they just don't give a fuck, when they have the CA$H
 

the_master

Member
Why? Other games dont ....

Its funny how people make a complaint like this one about halo but not other games.
Because they stated many times that this would be a gaas, the halo for the next 10 years, constantly updated nd evolving, new content added continously.

In the end it was a lie
 

sinnergy

Member
Because they stated many times that this would be a gaas, the halo for the next 10 years, constantly updated nd evolving, new content added continously.

In the end it was a lie
How is it a lie ? It’s evolving and changing ? It depends how they build their engine architecture, how big the changes in graphics will be the coming years and generations in hardware .
 
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01011001

Member
Well good job thats not the only metric of quality.
Sure it has not been as popular as previous halos, but that does not make it "embarrassing" or "disappointing"

it does precisely that tho

the hype behind the game was bigger than any Halo since 3, and yet it crashed harder than any Halo game before it.

can't get more embarrassing than that...
oh wait, yes it can, the MP is also free now, meaning people don't even wanna play it for free
 
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CamHostage

Member
The first trailer showed us a lot of variety. So, of course, we are expecting it at some point. Especially as Gaas game.
I loved the campaign - was far better than the other recent halos. Hopefully they add more

I really thought that was the plan even for a while after they finally previewed the full final Halo Infinite, that although the launch game was more limited than anticipated for those who assumed there was more biodiversity based on the first Slipspace Engine teaser, the "Pacific Northwest"-style biome would be one chapter and then future releases of the game would expand into other biomes, thus "infinitely expanding" Halo Infinity. Still wish they could somehow pull that off...
 
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K' Dash

Member
343 really fucked up... also MS not getting Bungie back was also a fuck up.

It's really entertaining to see people salivating over this game struggles, it just gives life to them lol.

Pretty pathetic.
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
it does precisely that tho

the hype behind the game was bigger than any Halo since 3, and yet it crashed harder than any Halo game before it.

can't get more embarrassing than that...
oh wait, yes it can, the MP is also free now, meaning people don't even wanna play it for free

Last time I checked the game reviewed very well.
So you are wrong.
 

Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
Because they stated many times that this would be a gaas, the halo for the next 10 years, constantly updated nd evolving, new content added continously.

In the end it was a lie

stuff has been delayed, pushed back.
More halo infinite content is coming
 

6502

Member
We didn't cut much but there was going to be so much more?...

So you dreamed of a better game before you started. Cheers for the insight.
 

RAIDEN1

Member
For much of an open world it was, after I completed the main story I wasn't bothered about liberating any remaining "camps/bases" that were still dotted about....I was more interested in where the next DLC was..
 

kiphalfton

Gold Member
This happens with most games. Things change and not everything makes it in.

Most open world games are about as deep as a puddle. And a big part of it is because devs spend way too much time creating the world, by then run out of time or resources putting interesting things into said world. Open world games should have hundreds of random events, to actually make it feel loved in, and not like some hollow shell.
 

kiphalfton

Gold Member
For much of an open world it was, after I completed the main story I wasn't bothered about liberating any remaining "camps/bases" that were still dotted about....I was more interested in where the next DLC was..

That's because they all sucked as they're copy/pasted, the NPC's are brain dead, and it only mattered as it allowed you to fast travel to those points. Even the unique weapons sucked, as they were just reskins with slightly different fire modes.

Your entitled to your opinion but i guess my main point is that infinite is objectively as good as similarly scored games like returnal,psychonauts 2, spiderman etc.

"Objectively"

How about no.
 
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Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
That's because they all sucked as they're copy/pasted, the NPC's are brain dead, and it only mattered as it allowed you to fast travel to those points. Even the unique weapons sucked, as they were just reskins with slightly different fire modes.



"Objectively"

How about no.

Then whats the point on even discussing a games quality if there are no objective measures of quality. Might as well be dogs barking at each other.

Saying a game is embarrassing or terrible does not really mean much. But reviews are the best resource we have otherwise is just pointless argument with no rhyme of reason.
 
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Hendrick's

Member
This game quickly fell of didn't it? Mechanics were awesome, MP was awesome. But then the copy paste single player, and the very bare bones MP with terrible battle pass and slow content updates. I never revisited it.
The foundation is really good though. I think they still have a chance to turn it around, even if 343 has done a shit job since release.
 

01011001

Member
Last time I checked the game reviewed very well.
So you are wrong.

bringing up reviews by people that don't even like videogames and are only in the business because they failed as journalists

yeah, that's the kind of audience I would trust with judging a videogame :)

here's another reason the game's a POS, just because I love shitting on this game, it's kinda cathartic you know...


yet another one of many betrails by 343i, shitting on everything that makes Halo what it once was.
"oh it's just a little detail, not important!" (I know that's what you want to say next) yeah, sure, but it's hundreds if not thousands of these little things that added up to the dogshit game that is Halo Infinite
 
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Sosokrates

Report me if I continue to console war
bringing up reviews by people that don't even like videogames and are only in the business because they failed as journalists

yeah, that's the kind of audience I would trust with judging a videogame :)

here's another reason the game's a POS, just because I love shitting on this game, it's kinda cathartic you know...


yet another one of many betrails by 343i, shitting on everything that makes Halo what it once was.
"oh it's just a little detail, not important!" (I know that's what you want to say next) yeah, sure, but it's hundreds if not thousands of these little things that added up to the dogshit game that is Halo Infinite

Well u like shitting on infinite, i like shitting on you. Your opinion is shit.

You see, if you just chat shit you're just going to get shit back.

Saying that reviews mean nothing is just moronic.
 

Topher

Gold Member
Well u like shitting on infinite, i like shitting on you. Your opinion is shit.
Cracking Up Lol GIF by HULU
 
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