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It's all going to be fixed... eventually...

levyjl1988

Member
Jan 31, 2010
1,546
1,349
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Canada, Toronto
Remember the launch of these games...

Destiny 1 - felt vanilla bare-bones, eventually fixed and refined over time.
No Man's Sky - empty promises, eventually became what it was intended.
Star Wars Battlefront 2 - loot boxes, removed loot boxes, changed direction.
Diablo 3 - Real money auction house, removed eventually and ported to consoles.
Grand Theft Auto V (Online) - bare-bones, lack of content, eventually fixed and still ongoing.

Now we have the same thing with...

Anthem - Released poorly, rumors of getting a second revive. Not sure if revive will bring back players, a major haul needs it.
Mass Effect Andromeda - Criticized for being worse than its predecessor, reception got devs patching it. The game was fixed but mediorce.
Marvel Avengers - Very limited, only 4 bosses in Initiative, being constantly patched with more heroes. Free heroes in DLC.
CyberPunk 2077 - Poor launch, broken on current-gen, will be patched eventually. With the track record of CD Projekt Red and the Witcher 3, U.I was revamped etc and expected free DLC.

Launches are bad, but games will eventually get patched. Our first impressions of these taint the initial experience.
These game developers are collecting data. We are all beta testers in a large scale. Eventually, these games will be patched. Eventually...


Anyway, have you returned to these games after its shoddy initial launch?
 
Jan 11, 2019
1,573
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545
Zeus’ butthole
I don't think any of those examples are equivalent to Cyberpunk, for numerous reasons.

Also, how long did NMS take to get fully fleshed out? A couple years?

Nothing fixed Andromeda, was always shit and remained shit.

Avengers is not fixed. Is still shit.

Destiny is designed to get better over time.

GTA Online, Diablo 3, again, these aren't even in the same league as the CP77 situation. Completely different genre and expectations.

I don't think anything you wrote justifies any of these examples, either.
 
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Madflavor

Member
Jul 27, 2018
862
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435
I think it's anybody's guess at this point on how much CDPR are going to improve on the game throughout the next couple years. I hope they do because the core game is great, but there's too many performance issues and missing content that's holding it back and bringing it down to an overall disappointing experience. On one hand CDPR has a history of always doing an exceptional job at supporting their games post launch. On the other hand how much this game gets "fixed" and improved upon, ultimately comes down to management. And we've seen how they've handled the development and release of this game already, haven't we? So I don't know.

I'm just sad over the whole thing. In so many moments of the game you can see the love and passion the development team had for the story, characters, music, and the world. They just weren't given a choice on polishing it up and making everything work. All I can do is hope they fix and improve the game as much as they're allowed, and to also support the modding scene. Incredible vision, talent, and passion, has once again been raped and abused by corporate overlords. No matter how talented and passionate your team of developers are, you are completely at the mercy of management who don't have a creative bone in their body, and only speak in dollars and percentages.

Game development sucks. What an absolute soul sucking career to have.
 
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Tmack

Member
Sep 23, 2020
278
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CP2077 looks amazing. Even "Cyberbugs" videos can`t change that impression.

Currently just waiting for the next version to come out to play it,
 
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Feb 18, 2013
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No , I just held off buying in most cases and never bothered in the first place.

Not much will change as long as the consumer is eager to part with their money at launch and in many cases it’s a given in large numbers.

It’s seems to be forgotten with some, that these companies and products, without people buying them, they don’t have a business. Instead I see more things like “yeah but the day one patch will sort it” or how companies and their executives put on such on such high pedestals with any criticism shouted down with the usual shame tactics routines to quiet them are a detriment to the good of the industry. It’s like we work for them now rather than the other way around and a consumers willingness to part with their money is clearly taken as granted.

I find the whole influencer/shill stuff repulsive and plays a part in some aspect too, it’s getting out of hand, nice chairs or not.
 
Nov 13, 2016
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And so? What is exactly is the point you're trying to make? Is this an excuse for developers and publishers to keep pushing out unfinished games?
 
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LOLCats

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Sep 5, 2013
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diablo 3 redeemed itself imo and there has been much more than just a console port.
 
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K.S v2.0

Banned
Dec 3, 2020
525
857
335
No , I just held off buying in most cases and never bothered in the first place.

Not much will change as long as the consumer is eager to part with their money at launch and in many cases it’s a given in large numbers.

It’s seems to be forgotten with some, that these companies and products, without people buying them, they don’t have a business. Instead I see more things like “yeah but the day one patch will sort it” or how companies and their executives put on such on such high pedestals with any criticism shouted down with the usual shame tactics routines to quiet them are a detriment to the good of the industry. It’s like we work for them now rather than the other way around and a consumers willingness to part with their money is clearly taken as granted.

I find the whole influencer/shill stuff repulsive and plays a part in some aspect too, it’s getting out of hand, nice chairs or not.

QF Absolute T.

Not sure exactly when or where this all started but nowadays devs actually act like, and probably believe, that they not only deserve, but are ENTITLED TO selling well... on top of not only should they be allowed to, but we should be grateful for games being shipped unfinished and that we should be grateful to pay for the 'rest' of the content later.

Somewhere along the line people started not only forgiving, but DEFENDING the practice of selling an unfinished product. Imagine if EVERY industry did this.

"Here's your car, sorry, we didn't have time to finish it so you'll have to make do without a wheel and the roof... you can pay for the rest later."

"Here's your meal, sorry we didn't have time to finish it, you can pay for the rest of it in 30 mins if you still want it."

"Here's your book, sorry the author didn't have time to finish it, you can pay for the last chapter later this week."

Try pulling the above in any other industry and see how that flies.... and no, don't even try to say that the gaming industry is different. Its only that way due to shills and morons defending this BS. There is NO difference and it should never have been accepted in the first place.
 

ReBurn

Member
Dec 6, 2008
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I don't understand why developers release unfinished and broken games.

I also don't understand why people preorder games these days. The victims of cyberpunk are victims of their own hype. I guess I can see wanting to preorder to get the clutter crap that comes with collector's editions, but the people who preordered vanilla console copies when it was blatantly obvious that CDPR was hiding something by not releasing info are morons. Sorry.

The same goes for pretty much any other game released in the past generation. Scarcity hasn't really been a thing since digital distribution, so it's not fear of games selling out like they did in the old days. Most people wouldn't fall victim to broken games if they would just wait a few more days for media to report on them.
 

mitch1971

Member
Jul 7, 2013
708
646
585
Earth, sometimes.
Destiny 1 - Sign of a new generation. Never played a bungie game before. Bought it. Loads of friends played it together. Put 3000 hours into it, although I critizised it more and more as time went on. Hoped Destiny 2 would invigorate my interest again. 90 plus hours and I was done with it. DLC's started taking the piss from a price point of view. Same old enemies, same old game play. Glad I didnt carry on when they said they were taking half the game away, to supply it with new content, and trying to big up returning weapons and old maps as new content. Get fucked bungie.

No Man's Sky. From the get go the guy who made it was the worse PR person I'd ever heard. Like watching paint dry, again. Guy didn't know what the game was about himself. Sounded fishy right from the start. Never interested me because of the guy himself.

Star Wars Battlefront 2 - loot boxes, removed loot boxes, changed direction. Fuck off EA, never touching it even though it's on EA play, you started wrong. No interest.

Diablo 3 - Bought on console when all the bullshit was removed. Enjoyed it for what it was.

Grand Theft Auto V - online or offline, shite. Played a few hours online, one hour of SP and I was done with it. Sold.

Anthem - PLayed for free on EA play. Enjoyed it for what it was after the game was patched.

Mass Effect Andromeda - meh.

Marvel Avengers - Bollocks to that shite.

CyberPunk 2077 - No real interest to begin with. Hyped to fuck. Who buys an RPG day one anyway. You're asking for trouble.
 
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reinking

Member
Jun 1, 2020
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All you did is reinforce that something needs to happen so games start being released complete and major bug free. Glad distributors/gamers are finally taking a stand.
 
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TheMay30thMan

Member
Aug 23, 2018
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And so? What is exactly is the point you're trying to make? Is this an excuse for developers and publishers to keep pushing out unfinished games?
They’ve been doing it for years, whether people excuse it or not. Tearing Cyberpunk apart won’t amount to dick if the usual suspects aren’t treated equally moving forward. This issue is bigger than just Cyberpunk.
 
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THEAP99

Banned
Mar 16, 2020
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670
I don't care when it's going to be fixed. It's a SINGLE-PLAYER GAME. It should NOT take hundreds of patches to get the game where it needs to be.

If they sold the game as an early access early beta thing, sure that's fine, but they didn't. They literally said "no bullshit" in regards to this being a live service title. Not an excuse!

 

Sakura

Member
Feb 13, 2012
9,374
1,428
900
Fukuoka, Japan
Remember the launch of these games...

Destiny 1 - felt vanilla bare-bones, eventually fixed and refined over time.
No Man's Sky - empty promises, eventually became what it was intended.
Star Wars Battlefront 2 - loot boxes, removed loot boxes, changed direction.
Diablo 3 - Real money auction house, removed eventually and ported to consoles.
Grand Theft Auto V (Online) - bare-bones, lack of content, eventually fixed and still ongoing.

Now we have the same thing with...

Anthem - Released poorly, rumors of getting a second revive. Not sure if revive will bring back players, a major haul needs it.
Mass Effect Andromeda - Criticized for being worse than its predecessor, reception got devs patching it. The game was fixed but mediorce.
Marvel Avengers - Very limited, only 4 bosses in Initiative, being constantly patched with more heroes. Free heroes in DLC.
CyberPunk 2077 - Poor launch, broken on current-gen, will be patched eventually. With the track record of CD Projekt Red and the Witcher 3, U.I was revamped etc and expected free DLC.

Launches are bad, but games will eventually get patched. Our first impressions of these taint the initial experience.
These game developers are collecting data. We are all beta testers in a large scale. Eventually, these games will be patched. Eventually...


Anyway, have you returned to these games after its shoddy initial launch?
None of those examples are very comparable to Cyberpunk. Those are all games that are just straight out bad games, or had a severe lack of content.
Cyberpunk's problem is that it performs poorly on consoles. It's already a feature complete, relatively good game, and runs fine on PC.
 

TheMan

Member
Jul 31, 2006
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not holding my breath for an anthem 2.0 at this point, especially since the next-gen consoles are out now. I expect them to just quietly abandon the game
 
Nov 13, 2016
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They’ve been doing it for years, whether people excuse it or not. Tearing Cyberpunk apart won’t amount to dick if the usual suspects aren’t treated equally moving forward. This issue is bigger than just Cyberpunk.
I don't even care about Cyberpunk. It has always looked utterly boring to me. I just want to know what the point of this thread is. Is it telling customers to be more critical of what they spend their money on? Because if so I totally agree. The tone of the OP though seems to be that this happens all the time, so it's normal and people shouldn't complain about shoddy releases. That's a dumb position to take.
 
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crozier

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Apr 18, 2013
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They’ve also vastly improved the framerate for Marvel Avengers. Loot seems to be better and more frequent too.
 
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TheMay30thMan

Member
Aug 23, 2018
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I don't even care about Cyberpunk. It has always looked utterly boring to me. I just want to know what the point of this thread is. Is it telling customers to be more critical of what they spend their money on? Because if so I totally agree. The tone of the OP though seems to be that this happens all the time, so it's normal and people shouldn't complain about shoddy releases. That's a dumb position to take.
I agree, it is a dumb position to take. I think OP is trying to justify their purchase by telling other posters that this is normal, and that we shouldn’t complain. There’s better ways to cope with bad decisions. I’m sorry if I misinterpreted your initial post.
 

Vier

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Jun 7, 2019
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BigBooper

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Feb 28, 2018
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I think it's a fine thing to complain about. Games shouldn't launch so buggy. That said, this game is getting unequivocally targeted because of the pile on from outreeeged games press and activists.

The Witcher 3 was probably as bad. I didn't play it for at least 6 months after release because of persistent crashing bugs.

Just the rage of the month I suppose.
 

K.S v2.0

Banned
Dec 3, 2020
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I don't understand why developers release unfinished and broken games.

I also don't understand why people preorder games these days. The victims of cyberpunk are victims of their own hype. I guess I can see wanting to preorder to get the clutter crap that comes with collector's editions, but the people who preordered vanilla console copies when it was blatantly obvious that CDPR was hiding something by not releasing info are morons. Sorry.

The same goes for pretty much any other game released in the past generation. Scarcity hasn't really been a thing since digital distribution, so it's not fear of games selling out like they did in the old days. Most people wouldn't fall victim to broken games if they would just wait a few more days for media to report on them.

Developers release unfinished games because they can get away with it. The day consoles were allowed to have Hard Drives was the first step towards this decline in quality. The 2nd step was consumerist sheeple accepting this practice.

People preorder also because of FOMO. FOMO on 'pre order' bonuses that will never be sold eventually, or some other FOMO. Then there's 'Day 1' buyers who are in for 'head starts' over others, or just to be part of the 'Day 1' crowd like it confers some sort of status symbol.

IMO, if your peer group or w/e group you hang out with actually is the type who believes you 'aren't cool' unless you're in Day 1 with the rest of them, you seriously need better friends.
 

Jtibh

Banned
Sep 19, 2019
3,738
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Lets stop defending this piece of shit.

Stop making threads about this shit game.

Stop marketing it through gaf.

Enough is enough.

This is a next gen game that has no place on old hardware.

They made a next gen game claiming it was for ps4 and xbox.

Lies lies lies.

This game cant be fixed unless you take out all the npc's and then its not the game anymore they advertised it to be.
 

ThatOneGrunt

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Feb 23, 2015
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I've been playing Cyberpunk every night since I got it. Genuinely have been enjoying it. I can't say the same for a lot of the games on that list. Especially No Mans Sky. Such a boring game.
 
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begotten

Member
Dec 3, 2020
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These damage control posts for Cyberpunk are getting out of hand.

Just go and deal with your buyers remorse & severe depression over a video game in private, no one gives a shit what you have to say.

The game sucks and always will.
 
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VN1X

Member
Apr 21, 2016
1,650
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705
Remember the launch of these games...

Destiny 1 - felt vanilla bare-bones, eventually fixed and refined over time.
No Man's Sky - empty promises, eventually became what it was intended.
Star Wars Battlefront 2 - loot boxes, removed loot boxes, changed direction.
Diablo 3 - Real money auction house, removed eventually and ported to consoles.
Grand Theft Auto V (Online) - bare-bones, lack of content, eventually fixed and still ongoing.

Now we have the same thing with...

Anthem - Released poorly, rumors of getting a second revive. Not sure if revive will bring back players, a major haul needs it.
Mass Effect Andromeda - Criticized for being worse than its predecessor, reception got devs patching it. The game was fixed but mediorce.
Marvel Avengers - Very limited, only 4 bosses in Initiative, being constantly patched with more heroes. Free heroes in DLC.
CyberPunk 2077 - Poor launch, broken on current-gen, will be patched eventually. With the track record of CD Projekt Red and the Witcher 3, U.I was revamped etc and expected free DLC.

Launches are bad, but games will eventually get patched. Our first impressions of these taint the initial experience.
These game developers are collecting data. We are all beta testers in a large scale. Eventually, these games will be patched. Eventually...


Anyway, have you returned to these games after its shoddy initial launch?
 

Jada

Banned
Dec 10, 2020
112
169
145
CP2077 isn’t just a buggy mess. Its core desig ln is hollowed out shit, miles removed from what CPDR promised. To correct this situation, they would quite literally have to go back to the drawing board.
 

hemo memo

Member
Sep 13, 2011
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You are comparing live service and online games to Cyberpunk.... really?

If IGN say “you should absolutely get a refund if possible” for your game, then you fucked up big time.
 
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hemo memo

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Sep 13, 2011
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I think it's a fine thing to complain about. Games shouldn't launch so buggy. That said, this game is getting unequivocally targeted because of the pile on from outreeeged games press and activists.

The Witcher 3 was probably as bad. I didn't play it for at least 6 months after release because of persistent crashing bugs.

Just the rage of the month I suppose.

I bought Witcher 3 and played it on my base console even before the day 1 patch and it is not anywhere near Cyberpunk.
 

Ol'Scratch

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Feb 17, 2019
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Of course it will, and it will be old news before Valentine's Day. Anyone who believes otherwise has had their senses dulled by the prevailing click-bait mentality in social media. But it was on the major news!
Yes it was, because it was controversial, and some will milk it for everything they can. Controversy gets clicks. People love watching things burn.
CDPR are talented devs. They are already balls deep into this getting fixes out there as soon as they can. They are STILL selling copies even with this, and they sold enough PC copies to cover the refunds already. Class action? How about we see if it makes it to court before renting out the CDPR offices yet.
Even Game Awards Geoff's poll about how many would be submitting for refunds would probably disappoint many here because most were not and were going to wait.
Maybe they will be smart and cancel the PS4 and Xbone versions, and just go all in on the next gen and PC as this would be the easiest course but hell if I know.
A couple of more patches, and some free DLC and nobody will care or remember. Until then I do look forward to many more CDPR am dead theads while I will continue to look through and admire all of the great screenshots and video from those that do realize that it is what it is.

You are comparing live service and online games to Cyberpunk.... really?

If IGN say “you should absolutely get a refund if possible” for your game, then you fucked up big time.

IGN is a click bait circle jerk and has been for quite some time. What's next , something from Kotaku or Polygon?
 
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Ol'Scratch

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Feb 17, 2019
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CP2077 isn’t just a buggy mess. Its core desig ln is hollowed out shit, miles removed from what CPDR promised. To correct this situation, they would quite literally have to go back to the drawing board.
The bugs are the only grounds that you have. Developers since the atari have been making promises about what their games will provide only to have a much different monster at launch.
 
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Ol'Scratch

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So IGN a sell out if they give 10s and click bait if they warn buyers... great argument.
I can't seem to find anywhere in the past...I don't know ...forever? Since I have given a rat's ass about 10s or review scores nor anywhere that I have mentioned it?
Don't come to me with something so damned weak and then have the gall to type "great argument".
 

Fredrik

Member
Jun 27, 2005
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Anyway, have you returned to these games after its shoddy initial launch?
I actually never left No Man’s Sky.

It was definitely bare-bone at first but I still enjoyed it for what it was, somehow, and when the updates started arriving it has constantly been among my most played games each year.

Currently I’m building an under water base with my kids, in a super strange solar system with all kinds of weird creatures and things.

Found my first ”hexagonal” planet yesterday with some kind or rotating portals littered on the planet surface with odd story bits.



Still might not be for everyone, it’s an odd game, there is so much to do and very little real payoff besides what you create or find, and it really needs lots of time. But for me it’s all just fascinating and the procedural generation never stops surprising me.
It’s my number 3 at the GOTY voting this year 👍
 

iQuasarLV

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Oct 7, 2020
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QF Absolute T.

Not sure exactly when or where this all started but nowadays devs actually act like, and probably believe, that they not only deserve, but are ENTITLED TO selling well... on top of not only should they be allowed to, but we should be grateful for games being shipped unfinished and that we should be grateful to pay for the 'rest' of the content later.

Somewhere along the line people started not only forgiving, but DEFENDING the practice of selling an unfinished product. Imagine if EVERY industry did this.

"Here's your car, sorry, we didn't have time to finish it so you'll have to make do without a wheel and the roof... you can pay for the rest later."

"Here's your meal, sorry we didn't have time to finish it, you can pay for the rest of it in 30 mins if you still want it."

"Here's your book, sorry the author didn't have time to finish it, you can pay for the last chapter later this week."

Try pulling the above in any other industry and see how that flies.... and no, don't even try to say that the gaming industry is different. Its only that way due to shills and morons defending this BS. There is NO difference and it should never have been accepted in the first place.

Easy.
You got older dude.
Imagine being in this market for over 30 years. Just how many bad-behavior trends have become standard practice disgusts me.

Welcome to the old geezers club.
 

K.S v2.0

Banned
Dec 3, 2020
525
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Easy.
You got older dude.
Imagine being in this market for over 30 years. Just how many bad-behavior trends have become standard practice disgusts me.

Welcome to the old geezers club.

Why in my day!... blabla... Uphill, both ways!... blablabla... Through the rain, sleet, snow, hurricane and inferno!... ALL AT ONCE!!... We walked BAREFOOT!... ipso facto bla bla etc etc :p

Tho say what you want, it truly is sickening that we even got to this point, that people not only allowed this shit to happen but willingly DEFEND it free of charge.

If one of the consequences of getting older is not being able to live in a future where ownership no longer exists, I call that a blessing in disguise.
 

iQuasarLV

Member
Oct 7, 2020
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Why in my day!... blabla... Uphill, both ways!... blablabla... Through the rain, sleet, snow, hurricane and inferno!... ALL AT ONCE!!... We walked BAREFOOT!... ipso facto bla bla etc etc :p

Tho say what you want, it truly is sickening that we even got to this point, that people not only allowed this shit to happen but willingly DEFEND it free of charge.

If one of the consequences of getting older is not being able to live in a future where ownership no longer exists, I call that a blessing in disguise.

Sorry to hit you with a brick of reality dude. We have not owned any software we purchase, ever. We own a license to access said software (IP) which can be revoked at any time by the IP holder.

In context. The statement was not to insult you, but to tell you that you're not alone. A lot of people wake up after their 20s are spent and say, "What the fuck have I been doing the last 10 years?"
I have had your very reaction somewhere around 34, and since drastically dialed back my hype on games, because they are basically assembly line - cookie cutter - copy pasta of the same old shit being spewed out year after year.

To add to your point. I ask you to name 10 AA / AAA games in the last decade that were truly unique, standing on their own, new IPs, sharing NO similarities in the complete package to any other game before it. See below for rules on comparison

Case in point, that is another thing I had to realize. If I need to name more than two games to describe something, new on the market, then I am trying too hard to shit on it in an attempt to validate my hate for it.
 
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Isendurl

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Dec 31, 2013
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I think it's anybody's guess at this point on how much CDPR are going to improve on the game throughout the next couple years. I hope they do because the core game is great, but there's too many performance issues and missing content that's holding it back and bringing it down to an overall disappointing experience. On one hand CDPR has a history of always doing an exceptional job at supporting their games post launch. On the other hand how much this game gets "fixed" and improved upon, ultimately comes down to management. And we've seen how they've handled the development and release of this game already, haven't we? So I don't know.

I'm just sad over the whole thing. In so many moments of the game you can see the love and passion the development team had for the story, characters, music, and the world. They just weren't given a choice on polishing it up and making everything work. All I can do is hope they fix and improve the game as much as they're allowed, and to also support the modding scene. Incredible vision, talent, and passion, has once again been raped and abused by corporate overlords. No matter how talented and passionate your team of developers are, you are completely at the mercy of management who don't have a creative bone in their body, and only speak in dollars and percentages.

Game development sucks. What an absolute soul sucking career to have.

I said it before, Cyberpunk is in the same bout for me as Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines or Kotor 2 for example. Really ambitious games, but never properly finished. I guarantee there will be a lot of missing content found in the game files and eventually restored by the modders. Although I obviously hope CDPR will restore a lot of it themselves and add new stuff on top of it.