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Opinion Community Platform Is the PS5 Sony's most pro-consumer designed console ever? Poll <-----

Do you think the PS5 is Sony's most pro-consumer designed console ever?


  • Total voters
    334

Hix

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I'm curious, how do you feel about paid online, which was absolutely led by Microsoft, even with their competition hesitating for a whole generation before following suit (mind you, except for free-to-play games)?
Do you somehow consider paid online multiplayer pro-consumer, or less anti-consumer than a games prices hike (even keeping in mind that physical copies drop in price over time)?

It's off topic, but yeah I never liked paid online back in the 360 era.

As has been established in this thread, the PS3 was more pro-consumer and, potentially, more than any PS console before or after too.

Presently, Game Pass offers the best, most pro-consumer, deal in gaming and the price hike on Sony games is a black mark against them. In the past, this was different, but this isn't a topic about that.

You can't say charging Europeans over $90 for games is pro-consumer, it's absolutely gauging.
 
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reptilex

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Just preemptively stating any counter arguments:

  1. But no PS1, 2 and 3 back compa
  2. The stand is mandatory in every position and HAS A SCREW
  3. Too big, can't fit my cabinet
  4. 10 ps4 games are unplayable, unacceptable
  5. Less power for same price
  6. Need to open the console to install the SSD
  7. edit: cant use my ps4 controller to play ps5 games

Seriously the PS5 will be a failure just going by the degenerate fanboy syndrome. Everytime a brand or product starts having degenerate fans that you can't distinguish from astroturfing paid account to say things that are blatantly false and will be in denial until past the failure is clear, it's ALWAYS a sign it'll be a failure.

There are probably socio-marketing, as consumer behavior to governance, reasons behind it. What you mention is barely a quarter of the list of everything wrong (and/or anti-consumer) about the PS5 and Jim Ryan's Sony.
 
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I have no idea but I don't think so. I just saw a video about the game showcasing it, and they mentioned the SSD capable of rendering two worlds simultaneously. And to my knowledge, it's the first time I see a game using a design choice like that. Either way, there is no need to downplay it, because it's a cool feature that's (as far as I know) never been used before.

Like FranXico FranXico said above it's probably more due to the capabilities of the GPU than the SSD. Having a really fast I/0 makes games like Ratchet and Clank possible which is handling it's assets differently than The Medium is.

I'm not downplaying The Medium but saying that it's due to the I/O doesn't seem correct to me. It's still impressive nevertheless but I think it's more of the GPU making it possible than the SSD.
 

yurinka

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-Inferior backwards compatibility to Xbox
-Misleading marketing about 'believing in generations'

On the hardware front you also forgot PS4 controllers not working.
For what we know, Series X BC as of now supports 961 games (with 'hundreds more' coming in the next days) while in PS5 BC supports all PS4+PSVR games with 10 games as exception, and both BC systems feature increased/more steady fps specially for those who already aren't 60fps and aren't capped, higher resolution for games with dynamic resolution, have reduced loading times (SSD speed difference lead us to think they may be shorter loading times in PS5) and allows you to get the save data you had in the previous console.

DS4 won't work for PS5 games, but will work with PS4 games running in PS5 (maybe due to less speed and latency, touchpad and motion controls precision, no mic, rumble instead of haptic, no adaptative triggers, etc). The other controllers like arcade sticks, driving wheels, Move, etc will work on PS5, they mentioned it when detailing the backwards compatibility.

Regarding the 'believing in generations' interview, if you go and read it Jim never said they won't make cross-gen games. Instead he says that they plan to support PS4 for years, and that he wants new console to feature meaningful innovative new features like their new haptic feedback, 3d audio, triggers stuff, etc an seeing games taking advantage of them (which doesn't mean that these games can be released in the previous console without these features). What he said is what they are doing, it's the interviewer who thought they weren't going to do cros-gen games, he didn't say it.

Add in Game Pass, BC and cloud saves and MS wins.
I understand you mention Game Pass because of 1st party (and some other) games being included there on their release day. But what BC and cloud saves lead has Series X compared to PS5?

Sony mentioned you'll be use cloud saves to transfer your PS4 savedata to PS5 for all PS5 BC games or cross-gen games that implemented cross-save like Sackboy or Miles Morales, so this confirms will have cloud saves, like PS4. PS5 BC will also feature reduced loading times, improved fps (specially for game with uncapped or unstable framerates that already weren't 60fps) and resolution increase for games with dynamic resolution. They also mentioned only 10 games out of the entire PS4+PSVR library will run on PS5 BC, including all its many PS2 classics and many PS1/PS2/PS3 remasters and remakes. MS promised to increase the list of Series X BC games, but as of now it has 961 XBO games, being some of them some of them 360 and OG Xbox games that were supported by XBO.
 
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01011001

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fuck no, who would even think that for a second? wtf?

the PS3 was BY FAR their most consumer friendly system.

I'm talking the launch 60GB model, especially the NTSC/J and NTSC/NA version.

•Expandable Storage,
•Linux Support,
•Sold MASSIVELY below PoM,
•free User made Customizable Themes,
•a fuck ton of media capabilities and slots for basically every flash media available at the time,
•back compat with basically every previous gen,
•PS Mini series of games that worked on PS3, PSP and Vita with only 1 license needed,
•same with PS1 classics,
•it was basically a PC even without Linux installed... it had a browser and you could download MP3 files and custom themes directly through that and use them on the System, with Linux installed it was a pretty damn open platform for a game console


Of course they fucked up half of what I listed with later models and firmware updates (these total idiots cut Linux support for safety reasons only for the hacking community to crack the system a few weeks after Sony pissed them off by removing Linux support... fucking retards)

BUT the launch model before Linux was removed was by far the most pro consumer system ever released IMO
 
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RoadHazard

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About the same as the PS4 I would say, except for the side panels. But far from the PS3. It allowed you to run Linux originally, and even without that you could rip and store music on it, etc. It was much more like a PC that let you do whatever.
 
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Bonfires Down

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Jul 31, 2007
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I understand you mention Game Pass because of 1st party (and some other) games being included there on their release day. But what BC and cloud saves lead has Series X compared to PS5?

Sony mentioned you'll be use cloud saves to transfer your PS4 savedata to PS5 for all PS5 BC games or cross-gen games that implemented cross-save like Sackboy or Miles Morales, so this confirms will have cloud saves, like PS4. PS5 BC will also feature reduced loading times, improved fps (specially for game with uncapped or unstable framerates that already weren't 60fps) and resolution increase for games with dynamic resolution. They also mentioned only 10 games out of the entire PS4+PSVR library will run on PS5 BC, including all its many PS2 classics and many PS1/PS2/PS3 remasters and remakes. MS promised to increase the list of Series X BC games, but as of now it has 961 XBO games, being some of them some of them 360 and OG Xbox games that were supported by XBO.
I was under the impression that essentially all XB1 games would be BC on Series, but if that’s not the case then Sony certainly has them beat there. I can’t find the source for the 961 number though. And it’s still good to have large selection of BC 360 games.

Cloud saves can be had without a subscription on Xbox.
 

captainraincoat

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Nov 15, 2010
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Going to say no and i think people are confused on what Pro Consumer means
lets look at the definition of what pro consumer is

What is pro consumer?
Things are set up in favor of businesses when relative to consumers. Being pro-“consumer” means undoing a lopsided situation that favors faceless entities with at very least a perceived obligation to make as much money as possible.

They are not really doing anything different (or undoing anything) to whats already been done console wise

Included Stand- Cant put the ps5 on a table without one..you would want it to be free
Removable faceplates - Had it in the ps4 pro and it was because the console design was horrible and collected dust..sony also did fuckall with custom plates
Removable Fan - Cant remove the fan without removing a tamper sticker which hides the fan power pin...outside of the USA most places wont touch your console if the stickers have been removed or damaged
Upgradable Storage - Had those options since the ps3...didnt notice a mounting screw on the teardown video also...you need this to fasten the SSD to the board and most SSDs you buy separately don't have them in the box...they usually come with motherboards

We are also still stuck with
Bad Refund Policies (depending on region)
Region/Account locked content - You cant mix and match game discs to DLC as its locked to the account region...you also cant change your region easily
More Expensive First party games -playstation you are paying more for your first party games....and even the digital versions are still expensive
BC/Paid Remasters - Paying for upgrades on old titles which others offer for free

Undoing those things are what is a pro consumer move
the only thing i have seen that is pro consumer if the psplus deal and getting those free first party titles but everything else is still business as usual

I have both consoles pre-ordered so it does not really affect my decision but i honestly cant say sony are pro consumer
people really need to call them out on this more as the rewards are far better

Cross play is probably the biggest win we have had this gen on pro consumer moves...we need more big stuff like this
 
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I'm going to say no. None of the things in your op are pro consumer. Pro consumer would be not adding in irrelevant features to your controller so ps4 controllers are completely compatible. Pro consumer would be including enough storage space in the console so that a 200$ ssd isn't a mandatory purchase. Pro consumer is not including a non optional stand. Pro consumer would be changing their poor refund policy.

Most of things you have included are pretty much irrelevant like faceplates, or mandatory to compete with what the competition is offering like backwards compatibility. Letting people make low monthly payments on your new console and giving them two years of game pass for free is pro consumer. Letting people use their old controllers on all your games is pro consumer. Focusing on making gaming affordable rather than asking for more money for nothing is pro consumer. The series x, is more pro consumer. Ssd add ons are better on Xbox, one will require the laymen to look up a youtube tutorial, the other will be as easy as using an old school memory card. How is the ps5's design user friendly at all?
 
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sainraja

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Did any of the previous PlayStation models have all it's games costing £70?

Cause that's your answer.

Game prices increased when we switched from the PS2 generation to the PS3/X360 generation and so they are again with the PS5/XSX. It's a industry wide and cannot be credited to a single publisher/manufacturer.
 
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sainraja

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I disagree, mate. The most pro-consumer console was the PS3.

It had the most complete hardware features set for the price at its time (including standard SD card slots, WiFi, and a Blu-Ray player below market price).
It had complete backwards compatibility with both the PS2 and the PS1 in the beginning of the generation. Better BC than the 360, in fact.
It allowed HDD upgrades of any third-party drive (thankfully, at least this will still be the case with PS5 SSDs).
It had much more permissive DRM than either the 360, X1, or PS4 in the beginning of the generation.
It had free online.

But people shat on it back then, and here we all are, still suffering the consequences.

Xbox 360 didn't offer any backwards compatibility during the first few years if I am recalling correctly. It was something they announced later on, didn't they?
 
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This is a sexy console
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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  • Soldered SSD
  • Expensive
  • Opening it breaks part of it like the professional engineer did
  • Games cost more even though they aren't selling cartridges and the medium is highly profitable even with "free" games. IE see Genshin.
Yes, highly pro consooooomer. Next gen is all about (you) the gamer!
 

kingwingin

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Yeah ps3 fat beats ps5.

Can't beat full hardware BC, built in wifi and bluray standard for the price. Worth every penny at the time
 

pullcounter

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I mean, the PS3 launched with like 3 SDCard slots and Linux support. no other system at the time went above and beyond like that

so no?
 

cireza

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Just preemptively stating any counter arguments:

  1. But no PS1, 2 and 3 back compa
  2. The stand is mandatory in every position and HAS A SCREW
  3. Too big, can't fit my cabinet
  4. 10 ps4 games are unplayable, unacceptable
  5. Less power for same price
  6. Need to open the console to install the SSD
  7. edit: cant use my ps4 controller to play ps5 games
Good list. All true.

Also paid upgrade for Spiderman. Can't get more pro consumer than that !
 
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Tschumi

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are we sure the stand is manditory for laying flat? or is it just the storage slot for it? how many of you understood what the guy said?

anyways, i believe ps4 wins this title, though i'm not anti-ps5... ps4 was cheap, really easy to develop for... there's a reason it outsold xBox consoles by a jillion to one.
 
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It also serves a different purpose since you can take games loaded on it to a friends place and play those games there. Can the PS5 NVME drives do that too?

Do you know what convenient means?

Also having more options in the market will allow consumers to be able to choose from different brands, drive sizes and price points. That's the benefit of using parts from the PC market instead of something proprietary.

Each option has their own benefits.
 

wd40

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I'd like to say yes, but paid online and a 40% price hike on games is a pretty big downside to me. I'm so excited to get one, but it's probably less consumer friendly than a PSP or PS3, with their open file systems, and free online.
 

DarkMage619

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Do you know what convenient means?

Also having more options in the market will allow consumers to be able to choose from different brands, drive sizes and price points. That's the benefit of using parts from the PC market instead of something proprietary.

Each option has their own benefits.
It's not just convenience the XSS/XSX drives have additional functionality. Yes they cost a lot now but we'll see what the prices look like as more manufacturers make drives and the price of memory drops. I'm also curious how many people will choose the correct PS5 drive and have no issues. You do have to be more tech savvy to upgrade PS5 storage than XSS/XSX.
 
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wd40

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Too bulky and too much going on with the design, imo.
oh right you just mean the physical appearance of it. yeah it's pretty jarring but I really like that about it. I think 8th gen had some of the most boring console designs ever, but this gen we have the monolith from 2001 vs a router with a big white coat, i fucking love it lol
 
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DJT123

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oh right you just mean the physical appearance of it. yeah it's pretty jarring but I really like that about it. I think 8th gen had some of the most boring console designs ever, but this gen we have the monolith from 2001 vs a router with a big white coat, i fucking love it lol
Yeah it means the most to me personally but nice to see it appeals in different ways. No doubt the value proposition is insane, too. PS2 still my favorite design, but maybe impractical now coz they need to fit heavier parts.
 
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yurinka

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I was under the impression that essentially all XB1 games would be BC on Series, but if that’s not the case then Sony certainly has them beat there. I can’t find the source for the 961 number though. And it’s still good to have large selection of BC 360 games.

Cloud saves can be had without a subscription on Xbox.
Yes, Microsoft mentions 'thousands of games for the BC' on the Series X website and I understand that sooner or later they'll end there. But as of now in the consoles sent to gaming media and youtubers had 961 games available and through NDA they were only allowed to talk only about BC with some of them in this first batch of hands on. MS told them that they'd update the consoles in the upcoming days to add 'hundreds of BC games more' in the following days. Who knows, maybe they speed up their process and have almost their entire XBO catalog (including the XBO and OG Xbox games it supported, that are the games to be supported in Series X BC) in the BC for launch, but as of now it's the current state we know.

Uh, I just checked it and seems that in PlayStation the cloud saves are part of PS Plus (100GB of game save data for PS4, 1 GB for PS3/Vita/TV). I thought they came with the consoles and PS Plus increased the size but seems it isn't the case, you're right.
 
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Sep 15, 2020
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The goodThe bad
Software
  • BC with PS4 (easily the best about it)
  • PlayStation Plus Collection (don't know much about this but sounds like a good thing)
  • No BC with older gens
  • Cloud saves locked to PS+?
  • Cross-saves (is it supported now? what was the whole Dirt 5 thing about?)
  • Cross-buy (if you bought Spiderman on PS4 you have to buy the game again on PS5 to get the version with the upgrades. this coming from first-party titles when even third-party ones are doing them for free and for older games is baffling)
  • Game price hike (€80 in EU...errr...)
Hardware
  • Technical features normally found in a PC, not a console (good for the minority)
  • VR (it will support VR like the previous gen right?)
  • Technical features normally found in a PC, not a console (the vast majority won't use it meaning they will be stuck with something they can't or won't use. a memory card for added storage along the lines of PS1/PS2 would see way more use)
  • Doesn't support PS4 controller but it does support unique controllers like steering wheels :pie_thinking:

I consider BC easily the best thing to happen at the start of this next gen so just that makes it more pro consumer than all previous ones. I also didn't add the controller features because they're a gimmick but may have missed other things.
 
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FrankWza

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Did any of the previous PlayStation models have all it's games costing £70?

Cause that's your answer.

who do we blame for $500 next gen systems?2013 launch had one system at $399 and one at $???. who announced price first for next gen?
 
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It's not just convenience the XSS/XSX drives have additional functionality. Yes they cost a lot now but we'll see what the prices look like as more manufacturers make drives and the price of memory drops. I'm also curious how many people will choose the correct PS5 drive and have no issues. You do have to be more tech savvy to upgrade PS5 storage than XSS/XSX.

Well Sony will give a list of compatible drives and I'm pretty sure some of those drives will state that they are compatible on the box itself. Also the price for those NVMEs will drop alot quicker than the drive for the XSX especially with all those manufacturers making them. I already spotted smaller drives for 150$ that will probably be compatible with the PS5. By the end of next year that selection of drives should be alot larger and there should already be price drops. The same can't be said for those Xbox drives since they are proprietary.

The way that Sony is handling memory expansion will always be the more consumer friendly option. And the way Microsoft is handling theirs will always be the most convenient ones.
 

TGO

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Doesn't really change anything if its included or not.
You sure? Ok I'm not gonna include a stand now.
How you feel about it now?
And while we at it, let's take your TV stand away too as that must be anti-consumer too

Haha that's gold what the hell is that thing?
It's an actual router
 
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The_Mike

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You sure? Ok I'm not gonna include a stand now.
How you feel about it now?
And while we at it, let's take your TV stand away too as that must be anti-consumer too


It's an actual router

I mean. It would be more consumer friendly if it didn't need a stand and could actually stand up or side ways without it.

I still think a product is made stupid if you need something to make it stand. If you move between parents or friends, and you drop the stand or something, then you have a very expensive paperweight.

And it would even suck at that because of its design.
 

Dodkrake

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I'm sure it's a good list of things
The goodThe bad
Software
  • BC with PS4 (easily the best about it)
  • PlayStation Plus Collection (don't know much about this but sounds like a good thing)
  • No BC with older gens
  • Cloud saves locked to PS+?
  • Cross-saves (is it supported now? what was the whole Dirt 5 thing about?)
  • Cross-buy (if you bought Spiderman on PS4 you have to buy the game again on PS5 to get the version with the upgrades. this coming from first-party titles when even third-party ones are doing them for free and for older games is baffling)
  • Game price hike (€80 in EU...errr...)
Hardware
  • Technical features normally found in a PC, not a console (good for the minority)
  • VR (it will support VR like the previous gen right?)
  • Technical features normally found in a PC, not a console (the vast majority won't use it meaning they will be stuck with something they can't or won't use. a memory card for added storage along the lines of PS1/PS2 would see way more use)
  • Doesn't support PS4 controller but it does support unique controllers like steering wheels :pie_thinking:

I consider BC easily the best thing to happen at the start of this next gen so just that makes it more pro consumer than all previous ones. I also didn't add the controller features because they're a gimmick but may have missed other things.

Seems like you are conveniently PS3's FULL backwards compatibility with the PS1 and PS2 at the very start of the gen.

Also, the PS4 controller works on the PS5.
 
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TGO

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I mean. It would be more consumer friendly if it didn't need a stand and could actually stand up or side ways without it.

I still think a product is made stupid if you need something to make it stand. If you move between parents or friends, and you drop the stand or something, then you have a very expensive paperweight.

And it would even suck at that because of its design.
The based seems very flat so I'm sure it can actually stand vertically on it's own, horizontal obviously would be a problem
 

FrankWza

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I mean. It would be more consumer friendly if it didn't need a stand and could actually stand up or side ways without it.

I still think a product is made stupid if you need something to make it stand. If you move between parents or friends, and you drop the stand or something, then you have a very expensive paperweight.

And it would even suck at that because of its design.

i definitely agree with horizontally, unless it’s an additional cooling solution. But vertically, I would end up buying a separate stand anyway once they release if itdidn’t include one or was able to “stand” vertically without it. Too easy to topple over. I’m probably going vertical with minebecause it’ll be easierfor my setup and cooler overall. I have space for it horizontally but only in a closed spot.