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IGN/NXGamer | God of War Ragnarok Performance Review: PS5 vs PS4 Pro vs PS4

drotahorror

Member
tessellation , shadow cascades/detail and AO are paired back in favour perf mode on ps5 compared to the fidelity mode
60 fps has been paired back for fidelity mode.

Sorry but tessellated trees is not worth 30 fps (ala RDR2 PC)

I can’t really speak my mind without being warned. Just know you are a poopy face.
 
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NEbeast

Member
Easy answer- My perception is different than yours. My threshold is greater than yours. Therefore I'm able to enjoy games at a variety of frames per second or refresh rates. You are obviously limited and I'm sorry for that. Cheers. 🍷😋
You prefer fps and the 60fps mode looks better but you're going to play at 30? Huh.
 
You prefer fps and the 60fps mode looks better but you're going to play at 30? Huh.
60fps doesn't look better. It misses graphical features. U may not care about it but I do. So u play at 60+fps and I chose 30fps. I sincerely hope that won't cause too much trouble for u, ur life and your family and friends and their lives. I won't shed a tear nor will i feel even the slightest bit of anger towards you. U do u. Cheers,mate.
 
60fps doesn't look better. It misses graphical features. U may not care about it but I do. So u play at 60+fps and I chose 30fps. I sincerely hope that won't cause too much trouble for u, ur life and your family and friends and their lives. I won't shed a tear nor will i feel even the slightest bit of anger towards you. U do u. Cheers,mate.
In your case why not use the unlocked 40fps mode?
 
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Imtjnotu

Member
60 fps has been paired back for fidelity mode.

Sorry but tessellated trees is not worth 30 fps (ala RDR2 PC)

I can’t really speak my mind without being warned. Just know you are a poopy face.
Poppy face....
Jimmy Fallon Lol GIF by The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
yeah what are hard numbers measured by a high speed camera?
I know, me playing it on PS5 is the better measurement for sure!

I bet you're also into astrology and healing crystals with that mentality.

this is NOT AN OPINION, it's FACTS presented by easy to parse numbers.

more than 100ms of latency in a 60fps game is BAD, it's twice as long as the latency of Destiny 2 at 60fps and actually also still more than Destiny 2 at 30fps.

Destiny 2 at 60fps has ~50ms of input lag on PS5, God of War has ~120ms

not opinions, numbers measured with slow motion cameras...

120ms at 60fps IS BAD, plain and simple. 100ms is the upper limit of "decent" for a 60fps game, and even that would already be pretty bad.
70ms is good, 50ms is optimal on console.

I don't have the latency numbers for the 30fps mode of God of War at hand sadly but I remember them being ridiculous. a good 30fps mode would be in the ~110ms zone basically, and God of War is slower than that already at 60fps

Wouldn't optimal be 33ms (two frames)? Or because of triple buffering it will always be at least three frames?
 

01011001

Banned
Wouldn't optimal be 33ms (two frames)? Or because of triple buffering it will always be at least three frames?

yeah but that's unrealistic due to the inherent lag of any game engine.
super lightweight 2D games could reach something close to that but a complex 3D game would have a hard time to do that.

on console for 60fps 50ms is about as good as it gets. for 30fps it's maybe 85ms to 90ms in the best cases
 
DF measured it on PS5 and PC, both with a 240fps high speed camera.
and both were around 120ms latency (monitor latency removed)




I mean that seems to be necessary with some of the more delusional folks on here.
the amount of clueless casuals on here doesn't help either.
I finally found NXgamer tests about God of War latency. He found from 88ms to 94ms of latency on PS5 (end to end with a LG C9). Compared to PC running at 60fps without latency tricks it's about the same results (80ms - 86ms).

m1jXkdq.png


Like I already told you DF numbers are very surprising as previously NXgamer already found 60ms of raw engine latency on Pro (using a very low latency monitor). DF probably had a problem with their methodology (like for instance a problem of wireless connexion with their Dualsense during the test which is possible in some cases).

By the way NXGamer has being testing input lag in videogames for years, he has plenty of experience doing it.

 
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I'm not talking about FPS, I'm talking about input response, which is a gigantic weakpoint for GoW's engine. at 60fps GoW played on a PS5, so maxed out 60fps, has worse input lag than Halo 3 at 30fps (~120ms vs ~100ms)

so now imagine the latency GoW has at 30fps...


btw. update on the graphics modes, there will apparently be an unlocked, fidelity mode that has no 40fps cap, which I haven't seen mentioned so far but is on their official modes sheet
Simple really. We adjusted to the input lag long ago that we dont even notice while playing. Its how I got my bloodborne plat with smooth motion on (sacrilege!). Throw numbers all you want, the game feel is subjective for everyone.
 

01011001

Banned
I finally found NXgamer tests about God of War latency. He found from 88ms to 94ms of latency on PS5 (end to end with a LG C9). Compared to PC running at 60fps without latency tricks it's about the same results (80ms - 86ms).

m1jXkdq.png


Like I already told you DF numbers are very surprising as previously NXgamer already found 60ms of raw engine latency on Pro (using a very low latency monitor). DF probably had a problem with their methodology (like for instance a problem of wireless connexion with their Dualsense during the test which is possible in some cases).

By the way NXGamer has being testing input lag in videogames for years, he has plenty of experience doing it.



I do not trust anyone who doesn't disclosure the method of how it was measured.

and skimming through I don't find any info on how these latency numbers were measured.

Digital Foundry's tests were done by counting frames on a 240fps camera recording, which they show in the video

so I do absolutely not trust these tests
 

rofif

Can’t Git Gud
Simple really. We adjusted to the input lag long ago that we dont even notice while playing. Its how I got my bloodborne plat with smooth motion on (sacrilege!). Throw numbers all you want, the game feel is subjective for everyone.
It's not exactly like you say.
You guys are NOT WRONG about feeing worse input lag in some games. It's not only being used to it. It is truth.
I've noticed it when Io launched Demons Souls 4k30 mode .. it was very laggy but I never had any problem with 30fps.... so I launched bloodborne and it feel so much fucking snapper. Like waaaaaaaay more responsive.
Turns out my observation was correct. DF did some measurements and 4k30 demons souls is 75ms slower than also 30fps bloodborne.
It is explained near the end of this video:


Some ps5 games (maybe ps4 too, I am not sure) rely on this super slow system level vsync to lock to 30fps. That is Demons Souls.
Difference between 30 and 60fps should only be 16ms of latency. not 75 of course.
And when 60fps patch for GOW came out, I also checked out old 30fps mode and it's terrible... but I've not played for long so I don't know if it was always like that or did they screw up old 30fps mode.
I did finished the game on ps4 slim initially and don't remember it being so slow.
But yeah.... just launch bloodborne to see how fast 30fps can feel. Sure it stutters a bit but it's different from soft problem
 
It's not exactly like you say.
You guys are NOT WRONG about feeing worse input lag in some games. It's not only being used to it. It is truth.
I've noticed it when Io launched Demons Souls 4k30 mode .. it was very laggy but I never had any problem with 30fps.... so I launched bloodborne and it feel so much fucking snapper. Like waaaaaaaay more responsive.
Turns out my observation was correct. DF did some measurements and 4k30 demons souls is 75ms slower than also 30fps bloodborne.
It is explained near the end of this video:


Some ps5 games (maybe ps4 too, I am not sure) rely on this super slow system level vsync to lock to 30fps. That is Demons Souls.
Difference between 30 and 60fps should only be 16ms of latency. not 75 of course.
And when 60fps patch for GOW came out, I also checked out old 30fps mode and it's terrible... but I've not played for long so I don't know if it was always like that or did they screw up old 30fps mode.
I did finished the game on ps4 slim initially and don't remember it being so slow.
But yeah.... just launch bloodborne to see how fast 30fps can feel. Sure it stutters a bit but it's different from soft problem


Idk. Been playing gow 2018 on my ps5 at 30fps in the lead up to Ragnarok. I press dodge, Kratos dodge. I time my parries and he parries. I get to do alll my axe combos like usual. Kratos is a lumbering tank so I dont expect nimble Nero or Dante here.
 

Tripolygon

Banned
I do not trust anyone who doesn't disclosure the method of how it was measured.

and skimming through I don't find any info on how these latency numbers were measured.

Digital Foundry's tests were done by counting frames on a 240fps camera recording, which they show in the video

so I do absolutely not trust these tests
Method

 

01011001

Banned
I finally found NXgamer tests about God of War latency. He found from 88ms to 94ms of latency on PS5 (end to end with a LG C9). Compared to PC running at 60fps without latency tricks it's about the same results (80ms - 86ms).

m1jXkdq.png


Like I already told you DF numbers are very surprising as previously NXgamer already found 60ms of raw engine latency on Pro (using a very low latency monitor). DF probably had a problem with their methodology (like for instance a problem of wireless connexion with their Dualsense during the test which is possible in some cases).

By the way NXGamer has being testing input lag in videogames for years, he has plenty of experience doing it.





ok if we assume that his frame counts are more reliable, we still have a really sub par game here in terms of latency, not quite as bad as what DF had in their numbers, but still very bad.
NXG thankfully has a 30fps measurement in that graph as well. 153+ms of latency is shit... there's no way around that. anything above 130ms is terrible latency at 30fps. above 130ms we get into bad cloud streaming territory in terms of how a game starts to feel.

in the second video you posted we can see AC Vahalla on Series X has an input latency at 30fps of 115ms and at 60fps it has a latency of 61ms, that is pretty decent for most modern games.
even Watch_Dogs Legion, which is a very GPU and CPU heavy title only reaches a latency of 126ms on Series X, more than 20ms less than GoW at 30fps

so maybe Digital Foundry's numbers were indeed a bit too high (but hard to tell without having both full recordings available to make sure there was not any flaw in the methodology, oversights can always crop up), the end results even if we assume NXG is more correct here are that GoW has pretty bad input lag, even at 60fps.
as you can see Dirt 5 in NXG's video has 97ms of input lag at 30fps on PS4. God of War at 60fps on PS4 pro has only 17ms less latency at double the framerate... that is ridiculous, and it's even closer if played on PS5 due to the PS5's increased latency in back compat, with only a 9ms lower latency at 60fps compared to Drit 5 at 30fps.

so either NXG is correct and God of War has pretty bad latency, or Digital Foundry is correct and it has really bad latency. either isn't good and my case stands, 153.32ms of input lag is DOGSHIT, and with high spikes to apparently 167.9ms that's just shit, there's no way around that.
and my initial statement that GoW at 30fps is shit in terms of latency has not been disproven here. I didn't give a number in my original post because I legit didn't remember where I read it and couldn't verify if I remembered it correctly, and maybe it was NXG's video that I remembered, all I could say in my initial post is that to me personally it felt really shit when I tried that mode back when playing it at launch on my PS4pro
 
ok if we assume that his frame counts are more reliable, we still have a really sub par game here in terms of latency, not quite as bad as what DF had in their numbers, but still very bad.
NXG thankfully has a 30fps measurement in that graph as well. 153+ms of latency is shit... there's no way around that. anything above 130ms is terrible latency at 30fps. above 130ms we get into bad cloud streaming territory in terms of how a game starts to feel.

in the second video you posted we can see AC Vahalla on Series X has an input latency at 30fps of 115ms and at 60fps it has a latency of 61ms, that is pretty decent for most modern games.
even Watch_Dogs Legion, which is a very GPU and CPU heavy title only reaches a latency of 126ms on Series X, more than 20ms less than GoW at 30fps

so maybe Digital Foundry's numbers were indeed a bit too high (but hard to tell without having both full recordings available to make sure there was not any flaw in the methodology, oversights can always crop up), the end results even if we assume NXG is more correct here are that GoW has pretty bad input lag, even at 60fps.
as you can see Dirt 5 in NXG's video has 97ms of input lag at 30fps on PS4. God of War at 60fps on PS4 pro has only 17ms less latency at double the framerate... that is ridiculous, and it's even closer if played on PS5 due to the PS5's increased latency in back compat, with only a 9ms lower latency at 60fps compared to Drit 5 at 30fps.

so either NXG is correct and God of War has pretty bad latency, or Digital Foundry is correct and it has really bad latency. either isn't good and my case stands, 153.32ms of input lag is DOGSHIT, and with high spikes to apparently 167.9ms that's just shit, there's no way around that.
and my initial statement that GoW at 30fps is shit in terms of latency has not been disproven here. I didn't give a number in my original post because I legit didn't remember where I read it and couldn't verify if I remembered it correctly, and maybe it was NXG's video that I remembered, all I could say in my initial post is that to me personally it felt really shit when I tried that mode back when playing it at launch on my PS4pro
Of course God of War input latency at 30fps is dogshit. I completely agree here. NXgamer always found around 150ms of latency in that mode since the release on PS4, way more than many others 30fps games like Destiny or Bloodborne which have about 100ms.

But my point was that the input lag at 60fps was quite low and a big improvement compared to at 30fps. It's very easy to check it by playing the game anyways. Nobody has ever complained about bad responsivness at 60fps (or even in the performance mode at ~50fps on Pro).
 

01011001

Banned
Of course God of War input latency at 30fps is dogshit. I completely agree here. NXgamer always found around 150ms of latency in that mode since the release on PS4, way more than many others 30fps games like Destiny or Bloodborne which have about 100ms.

But my point was that the input lag at 60fps was quite low and a big improvement compared to at 30fps. It's very easy to check it by playing the game anyways. Nobody has ever complained about bad responsivness at 60fps (or even in the performance mode at ~50fps on Pro).

it is OK at 60fps. still worse than some 30fps games.
but that was what I always said, my initial post on this topic was basically "who would play this at 30fps with how shit the latency of this engine is at 30", the 60fps mode/unlocked mode was never an issue... it's not great but not an issue.
 

rofif

Can’t Git Gud
Idk. Been playing gow 2018 on my ps5 at 30fps in the lead up to Ragnarok. I press dodge, Kratos dodge. I time my parries and he parries. I get to do alll my axe combos like usual. Kratos is a lumbering tank so I dont expect nimble Nero or Dante here.
good to hear. So maybe only Demons souls 30fps is this bad
 

winjer

Gold Member
I finally found NXgamer tests about God of War latency. He found from 88ms to 94ms of latency on PS5 (end to end with a LG C9). Compared to PC running at 60fps without latency tricks it's about the same results (80ms - 86ms).

m1jXkdq.png


Like I already told you DF numbers are very surprising as previously NXgamer already found 60ms of raw engine latency on Pro (using a very low latency monitor). DF probably had a problem with their methodology (like for instance a problem of wireless connexion with their Dualsense during the test which is possible in some cases).

By the way NXGamer has being testing input lag in videogames for years, he has plenty of experience doing it.



NXGamer has already shown to have very shoddy methodology for testing and benchmarking. I would not trust his results.
DF is not perfect, but they are consistent and reliable in their work.
 

rofif

Can’t Git Gud
Is the fidelity hfr mode 40fps or unlocked?
It doesn’t say in menu. You just select fidelity or performance and hfr or not.
It feels good I am just curious
 
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Tchu-Espresso

likes mayo on everthing and can't dance
Is the fidelity hfr mode 40fps or unlocked?
It doesn’t say in menu. You just select fidelity or performance and hfr or not.
It feels good I am just curious
Yeah not sure exactly what is going on with the 40fps mode. No one has reported on an unlocked mode despite SSM listing it.

My VRR info stays at 118.
 

rofif

Can’t Git Gud
Yeah not sure exactly what is going on with the 40fps mode. No one has reported on an unlocked mode despite SSM listing it.

My VRR info stays at 118.
Mine too but that’s been the case for 40fps modes unlocked or not.

Anyway. The game looks fucking amazing and the 40fps mode whatever it is, controls great. It’s not this slow demons souls lag. It’s really snappy and fast to control.
So fidelity mode is great!!!

The fur, the details, the everything. I am blown away!!!
 
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Gaiff

Gold Member
The texture work in this game is seriously impressive. It doesn`t look much better than its predecessor but the granular detail and quality of every surface is a cut above. Makes for a much more polished-looking game.
 
Almost all benchmarks with PC.
Because he uses settings (vsync ON) and CPU / GPU very different than DF. NXGamer likes to compare using a middle range PC and using similar VSYNC settings than console while DF are using high end 5Ghz CPU + low range GPU + vsync off settings so the results are quite different indeed.

But all those benchmarks are giving expected results.

Anways here it's not about that at all as it's about input latency tests.
 
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winjer

Gold Member
Because he uses settings (vsync ON) and CPU / GPU very different than DF. NXGamer likes to compare using a middle range PC and using similar VSYNC settings than console while DF are using high end 5Ghz CPU + low range GPU + vsync off settings so the results are quite different indeed.

But all those benchmarks are giving expected results.

Anways here it's not about that at all as it's about input latency tests.

Wrong. His results are very incorrect, due to a broken PC.
 
Already did in several threads. Not going to repeat myself.
Well just a recommendation for the future. If you have no issues calling someones work out you should also be prepared to substantiate your claims when asked or challenged. If you dont feel like backing your accusations with specificity when asked you probably shouldnt be bothered making that kinda of stament in the first place.
 
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winjer

Gold Member
Well just a recommendation for the future. If you have no issues calling someones work out you should also be prepared to substantiate your claims when asked or challenged. If you dont feel like backing your aqusations with specificity when asked you probably shouldnt be bothered making that kinda of stament in the first place.

I have already done that with nxgamer.
Me and a few other members compared his results in the UE5 city demo.
So we know exactly how bad his PC results are. That was when we realized why his PC results were always so skewed.
You speak out of ignorance, not knowing about the reality.
 

rushgore

Member
Could someone post a screenshot from the video demonstrating the difference between Performance and Fidelity modes as some people here are mentioning that performance looks better than fidelity. I don’t want to watch and see any spoiler material.
 
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