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[ZQQLANDER]

Before now I've never posted about my personal issues here. But I have read quite a few threads over the years in which the creator discussed his/her personal issues and received insightful advice.

I'm a very private person, particularly when it comes to my relationships. Usually I only discuss my dating life with family or with several close friends. I'm also a part of a fairly large Christian community/social group in a major city. I've become quite involved over the years both with the church and the social activities. In my mind it's a great way to meet a significant other.

In January a young woman (let's call her Sarah) moved to the city and became involved in the community. We hit it off at a party, but I was casually seeing "Leena" at the time so I didn't pursue Sarah. I didn't want to give Sarah the wrong impression. In the beginning of March one of my close buddies said he was interested in Sarah. Even though I wasn't confident my relationship with Leena was going anywhere I encouraged my buddy to ask Sarah out if that's how he felt. I didn't have a right to tell him no.

A week later Leena decides to call it quits. I really liked her, but I could tell she didn't have strong feelings for me. While I was disappointed, we had only gone out several times over the course of two months. Shortly thereafter Sarah texts and asks if I want to go for a walk which I agree too. Things progress from there. We hang out every week or so: get ice cream, play board games, cook dinner, etc. We haven't had sex (waiting for marriage for that) or any sort of physical intimacy. At this point we are simply getting to know one another.

Until this week I had not told anyone in my social group we were seeing each other. At only two months it is much to early for that. However, the buddy I mentioned previously asked over text if I was seeing anyone. Not wanting to lie I told him I was spending time with Sarah. He immediately turned aggressive and said I stabbed him in the back. I texted back saying I'd be happy to have this conversation but I'd like to speak over the phone, feel free to call. He calls back immediately and reiterated how he thought I was his friend. He said he wasn't necessarily mad about me seeing her but the fact that I did not tell him. In his mind I was setting him up for failure as he was going to ask her out. I tried to explain to him my reasoning:

1) It was early in the relationship and I didn't feel like I had the right to tell him I was seeing her. I wouldn't have been pleased if they had hung out together but I would have been ok with it. I didn't want to take away his opportunity to ask her out.

2) If I had told my buddy it would have spread throughout the community which I didn't want at that point. While I love the large social group I'm in, there can be a lot of gossip, a whose who of dating. I didn't want my relationship with Sarah to be under that kind of pressure yet. Additionally, if Sarah or I decided to just be friends no one would ever be the wiser. We could be free to see other individuals in the community without people knowing our history.

That was my reasoning, but my friend went ballistic and called my character into question. He cautioned me on what would happen to my relationship when other guys found out about this. I'm sympathetic to where he is coming from and I'm going to reach out to him for an in-person discussion once things have settled down a bit.

I feel silly even bringing this up given the more serious issues going on in the world right now, but if anyone has any thoughts I would appreciate your input.

 

[Tesseract]

friend sounds like a girl

 

[-YFC-]

Damn, you sound like you live in a gated community and had a sheltered life. That's the vibe I picked up from your post.
But anyway, I think you're at fault here. Just because things didn't work out with Leena you went with Sarah. Why did you encourage your buddy to try stuff with Sarah? And after you encouraged him, when things didn't work out with Lena you went with Sarah. Not cool bro. It doesn't matter if she wasn't going out with him at the time, he did try going out with her and what you should've done is ask your buddy if it's okay you going out with Sarah. Why? Because he's your friend and you know he likes her.
That's my take.

 

[Gallard]

I used to be part of a church community, and talking about dating was a no-go. Instead, the ONLY time you would hear something was when the relationship had progressed far enough so that the news would be "X and Y were now engaged". If people did date and it didn't work out, it was all hush-hush. Prevented drama.

I didn't understand it then, but I understand it now. I'm not sure what your church community is like, but if you have a spiritual leader/small group leader, you should consult with him and have him help mediate this between you two.

 

[The Cockatrice]

I dunno my dude, the way you're phrasing things sounds good but all I can think of is that you wanted both Sarah and Leena and whichever works, you'll continue on and thats exactly what happened, aka dick move from your friends perspective. Obviously the girl can choose whomever she wants to date at the end of the day so you're also kinda right.

 

[ZQQLANDER]

Damn, you sound like you live in a gated community and had a sheltered life. That's the vibe I picked up from your post.
But anyway, I think you're at fault here. Just because things didn't work out with Leena you went with Sarah. Why did you encourage your buddy to try stuff with Sarah? And after you encouraged him, when things didn't work out with Lena you went with Sarah. Not cool bro. It doesn't matter if she wasn't going out with him at the time, he did try going out with her and what you should've done is ask your buddy if it's okay you going out with Sarah. Why? Because he's your friend and you know he likes her.
That's my take.

Yes, granted I have other social circles (work, alumni, high school), it is a very gated community.

 

[Husky]

From your side of the story, it sounds like both of you have valid reasons for your behavior here. You have very fair reasons for not telling him, and his reasons for feeling betrayed are also pretty fair.

Maybe there was a way to tell your friend you were hanging out with Sarah, a way that wouldn't let this secret get out. Or maybe you should've taken the risk of it getting out, and put that trust in your friend, especially since it concerns something you might've figured he'd care so much about. But there's nothing wrong with your motives for keeping this private, so I can't fault you for the break in this friendship. Maybe with enough explaining, your friend will understand. And after a little time's passed, what'll he remember most about you--the final argument, or the fun time he's spent with you?

 

[ZQQLANDER]

From your side of the story, it sounds like both of you have valid reasons for your behavior here. You have very fair reasons for not telling him, and his reasons for feeling betrayed are also pretty fair.

Maybe there was a way to tell your friend you were hanging out with Sarah, a way that wouldn't let this secret get out. Or maybe you should've taken the risk of it getting out, and put that trust in your friend, especially since it concerns something you might've figured he'd care so much about. But there's nothing wrong with your motives for keeping this private, so I can't fault you for the break in this friendship. Maybe with enough explaining, your friend will understand. And after a little time's passed, what'll he remember most about you--the final argument, or the fun time he's spent with you?

You make a good point. Even though I wasn't trying to be malicious I could have handled the situation better. Given that we were friends I should have trusted that we could have worked things out in confidence when this first came up.

 

[SKM1]

I don't know how it works in your community but from what I gather you put your dick-needs well above that friendship, so what happened was totally expected.

 

[Despera]

Well if you can't trust him to keep a bro secret like that then you may have a valid reason to wait.

Otherwise from what I understand you went out with your close friend's crush a little over a week after he told you about his intentions, and you went on for 2 months with that same girl. As a rule of thumb that's just not cool.

Imagine you were in his shoes it would feel like shit.

 

[Papa]

Ah, to be young again

 

[Rentahamster]

No offense, but it sounds like your social group consists of whiny, immature, drama loving children.

OK, so this happens:

I encouraged my buddy to ask Sarah out if that's how he felt. I didn't have a right to tell him no.

Shortly thereafter Sarah texts and asks if I want to go for a walk which I agree too. Things progress from there. We hang out every week or so: get ice cream, play board games, cook dinner, etc. We haven't had sex (waiting for marriage for that) or any sort of physical intimacy. At this point we are simply getting to know one another.

You go out with Sarah, after encouraging your buddy to ask her out? That's kind of a dick move dude. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt behind your reasoning because you know your social group better than I do, and normally I would be on your side on this issue except... you encouraged him to ask her out. If you hadn't done that, your actions would be perfectly fine, but you did and that's not cool. Try to think how that looks from his perspective. "Hey bro, you should totally ask Sarah out! Psyche! I already did it get rekt".

A couple of questions:

1. Before that text from Sarah asking you to go for a walk, how many times did you text back and forth or exchange any kind of messaging on phones or other social media?

2. "waiting for marriage" - is that only penetrative vaginal intercourse? Is oral and/or anal permitted?

 

[Yoshi]

Yes, I think it is your fault. You told your friend to persue Sarah and then went out with her anyway and did not even tell him, so you have put him into a shitty situation where he possibly asked her out just to be rejected. Your worries that he might tell someone else (even though you might have told him not to do that) is of much lesser significance.

 

[Cunth]

I couldn’t read the whole thing but RIP in peace to your friend

 

[ZQQLANDER]

No offense, but it sounds like your social group consists of whiny, immature, drama loving children.

OK, so this happens:




You go out with Sarah, after encouraging your buddy to ask her out? That's kind of a dick move dude. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt behind your reasoning because you know your social group better than I do, and normally I would be on your side on this issue except... you encouraged him to ask her out. If you hadn't done that, your actions would be perfectly fine, but you did and that's not cool. Try to think how that looks from his perspective. "Hey bro, you should totally ask Sarah out! Psyche! I already did it get rekt".

A couple of questions:

1. Before that text from Sarah asking you to go for a walk, how many times did you text back and forth or exchange any kind of messaging on phones or other social media?

2. "waiting for marriage" - is that only penetrative vaginal intercourse? Is oral and/or anal permitted?

1) We corresponded occasionally over social media/text for about 1 -2 weeks.

2) None of the above

 

[Rentahamster]

1) We corresponded occasionally over social media/text for about 1 -2 weeks.

How many times is "occasionally"? Like, go to your conversation. Go to the very beginning from your first text. Is her first text to you about the walk on the same page, or do you have to scroll down before you get to it? If so by how much?

2) None of the above

You can at least kiss and hug and stuff, right?

 

[SKM1]

So is the poophole loophole a myth?

 

[ZQQLANDER]

How many times is "occasionally"? Like, go to your conversation. Go to the very beginning from your first text. Is her first text to you about the walk on the same page, or do you have to scroll down before you get to it? If so by how much?


You can at least kiss and hug and stuff, right?

1) We started texting on 3/19 and she asked if I wanted to go on a walk on 3/23.....so not even a week :/. The conversion where I encouraged my friend to ask her out was in person so I can't provide an exact date.

2) Yes. We haven't because of COVID, but that is not an issue for me.

 

[Rentahamster]

1) We started texting on 3/19 and she asked if I wanted to go on a walk on 3/23.....so not even a week :/

I'm not concerned with the time. Just the volume.

From the beginning of your text conversations - do you have to scroll down until you get to the 3/23 "let's go for a walk" message?

 

[ZQQLANDER]

I'm not concerned with the time. Just the volume.

From the beginning of your text conversations - do you have to scroll down until you get to the 3/23 "let's go for a walk" message?

15 texts

 

[Rentahamster]

15 texts

I see, thanks. Is that the shortest conversation chain you've had with her? As in, do you have a longer conversation chain on FB or Instagram or something else?

At the time Sarah asked you to go for a walk - did she already know you were broken up with Leena? How did she find out? From you or someone else?

Sorry for asking so many questions. You don't have to answer them if you're not comfortable. I'm just curious.

 

[Super Mario]

This sounded like the biggest soyboy drama I have ever read

 

[ZQQLANDER]

This sounded like the biggest soyboy drama I have ever read

It is. I was ashamed (still am) when talking about it. But since I bear most of the responsibility in how this turned out I want to be able to get advice so I can articulate my feelings and try and repair the friendship.

I see, thanks. Is that the shortest conversation chain you've had with her? As in, do you have a longer conversation chain on FB or Instagram or something else?

At the time Sarah asked you to go for a walk - did she already know you were broken up with Leena? How did she find out? From you or someone else?

Sorry for asking so many questions. You don't have to answer them if you're not comfortable. I'm just curious.

We have an equally as lengthy chain on FB during the same time frame. That's it.

Sarah never knew I was seeing Leena. I kept my relationship with Leena private. After several weeks of spending time with Sarah I told her I was interested if her as more than a friend, the typical "define the relationship type talk." It was at that point Sarah asked me about my dating history. I told her my last serious relationship ended last spring but that I had seen people since. I told her I went out several times with someone in January and February (Leena) but I didn't give her a name. I also told her I wouldn't advertise that we were seeing each other given the close community we were both involved in. I told her that's how I handled relationships in the beginning (that I wasn't going to tell any of my guy friends), but she was free to tell who she wanted. As Gallard mentioned earlier, these young adult religious communities are known for drama.

 

[TaySan]

At the end of the day she can date whoever she wants he's not entitled to anything. But you could have more considerate of his feelings and been honest with him from the beginning.

 

[Yoshi]

How many times is "occasionally"? Like, go to your conversation. Go to the very beginning from your first text. Is her first text to you about the walk on the same page, or do you have to scroll down before you get to it? If so by how much?


You can at least kiss and hug and stuff, right?

Christian fundamentalism is not for hamsters, sorry .

 

[Rentahamster]

Christian fundamentalism is not for hamsters, sorry .

Of course not. I fuck even before the first date

 

[KielCasto]

Heh. I kinda understand your buddy since I was in a similar situation. Honestly, it sounds like you are at fault but you had your reasons. Give him time after speaking with him. Hoping for the best especially since you’re kind enough to reach out to your buddy.

 

[iconmaster]

ZQQLANDER Your approach to relationships is completely wholesome and gives me hope that at least not all of today’s youth are sex-obsessed. Don’t let these maniacs make you feel bad for it.

I understand your buddy’s frustration since from his point of view telling him Sarah was unattached and finding out Sarah was attached – to you – were basically concurrent. I think you just need to lay out the order of events for him as you have for us, but accept that he may not be satisfied by the explanation.

She’s not engaged so he still has a shot if he wants to take it, same as any other man.

 

[M1chl]

Moral of this story is don't talk your friends about girls in your life. Like how is that even a thing...

 

[Stiflers Mom]

So you are secretly dating the girl your friend told you about that he is having the hots for and you told him before that he should go for it?

Off course he is pissed.
You were setting him up for failure and defeat.
Friends don't do that to each other.

 

[Foamy]

My adivice is to leave the gun, take the cannoli.

Or something like that.

 

[Starlight Lotice]

Sounds like a difficult scenario regarding your religion.

It sounds like you encouraged him to talk to her but she decided to hang out with you instead.

Nothing wrong there but I can see why he'd be upset however you have not cheated on him and have told him your intentions to be questioned of your character.

It sounds like she wasn't interested in him and he didn't act fast enough to become her friend before she went to you.

It is bad timing and perhaps it makes you look worse seeing her before him, but it sounds like he didn't act fast enough and she did towards you, and you got stuck in the middle.

I would suggest having all 3 of you hang out together and if she is willing, to discuss this between all 3 of you of her intentions and explain what you both wish to do in the scenario. Being a Christian is hard with community rumblings so it is best to all discuss as adults if she is interested in you and whether he was right to judge you because she made the first move which you agreed to.

 

[DKehoe]

Your friend can’t be pissed at you over this. It sucks for him but that’s just how things go. He doesn’t have a right to her. It’s not like he can complain you stopped him. If you had talked him out of asking her out only to do so yourself that might be something. You are entitled to your privacy and since he’s part of this community too he should understand.

 

[Kamina]

One on hand you should have told him that you seeing seeing her, as you encouraged him previously. So you should apologize for that.
On the other hand she has a right to decide too, and if she is interested in you (and you in her) why would you refuse seeing her? Sending her away for your friends sake, who she is likely not even interested in, would only hurt her, and you for that matter.

 

[Cato]

This sounds like virgin 16 year olds high-school drama.
Seriously, if your "friend" has been trying to date her for months and she is still reaching out to other men (you) to hook up with,
this is not your fault. Maybe he should self-reflect on why women try to avoid bonding with him?
I.e. the problem is he, not you.

Second. Never under any circumstances listen to TaySan when it comes to romantic affairs.
His dream woman is a hot-wife that will act as his own private porn-star. His words.
Is your friend taysan?

 

[iconmaster]

I would suggest having all 3 of you hang out together and if she is willing, to discuss this between all 3 of you of her intentions and explain what you both wish to do in the scenario.

No, sorry, but this would be a very bad plan. The poor girl. It's not her problem. The two dudes need to work this out and not burden her with their petty jealousies.

 

[Stilton Disco]

You were a git for not at least telling your mate you were also interested in her, would be hanging out with her more and wouldn't say no if something developed between you and her. So you need to face up to the fact you behaved like a bit of a cunt.

But your mate also sounds like a whingey little prat, so don't be too hard on yourself either. I mean he had months to make his move and apparently didn't, so it's his fault he missed his shot.

Next time you go out, tell him you're sorry for not being straight with him and that all his drinks are on you tonight.

 

[StormCell]

Before now I've never posted about my personal issues here. But I have read quite a few threads over the years in which the creator discussed his/her personal issues and received insightful advice.

I'm a very private person, particularly when it comes to my relationships. Usually I only discuss my dating life with family or with several close friends. I'm also a part of a fairly large Christian community/social group in a major city. I've become quite involved over the years both with the church and the social activities. In my mind it's a great way to meet a significant other.

In January a young woman (let's call her Sarah) moved to the city and became involved in the community. We hit it off at a party, but I was casually seeing "Leena" at the time so I didn't pursue Sarah. I didn't want to give Sarah the wrong impression. In the beginning of March one of my close buddies said he was interested in Sarah. Even though I wasn't confident my relationship with Leena was going anywhere I encouraged my buddy to ask Sarah out if that's how he felt. I didn't have a right to tell him no.

A week later Leena decides to call it quits. I really liked her, but I could tell she didn't have strong feelings for me. While I was disappointed, we had only gone out several times over the course of two months. Shortly thereafter Sarah texts and asks if I want to go for a walk which I agree too. Things progress from there. We hang out every week or so: get ice cream, play board games, cook dinner, etc. We haven't had sex (waiting for marriage for that) or any sort of physical intimacy. At this point we are simply getting to know one another.

Until this week I had not told anyone in my social group we were seeing each other. At only two months it is much to early for that. However, the buddy I mentioned previously asked over text if I was seeing anyone. Not wanting to lie I told him I was spending time with Sarah. He immediately turned aggressive and said I stabbed him in the back. I texted back saying I'd be happy to have this conversation but I'd like to speak over the phone, feel free to call. He calls back immediately and reiterated how he thought I was his friend. He said he wasn't necessarily mad about me seeing her but the fact that I did not tell him. In his mind I was setting him up for failure as he was going to ask her out. I tried to explain to him my reasoning:

1) It was early in the relationship and I didn't feel like I had the right to tell him I was seeing her. I wouldn't have been pleased if they had hung out together but I would have been ok with it. I didn't want to take away his opportunity to ask her out.

2) If I had told my buddy it would have spread throughout the community which I didn't want at that point. While I love the large social group I'm in, there can be a lot of gossip, a whose who of dating. I didn't want my relationship with Sarah to be under that kind of pressure yet. Additionally, if Sarah or I decided to just be friends no one would ever be the wiser. We could be free to see other individuals in the community without people knowing our history.

That was my reasoning, but my friend went ballistic and called my character into question. He cautioned me on what would happen to my relationship when other guys found out about this. I'm sympathetic to where he is coming from and I'm going to reach out to him for an in-person discussion once things have settled down a bit.

I feel silly even bringing this up given the more serious issues going on in the world right now, but if anyone has any thoughts I would appreciate your input.

I really like this post. What you're doing and going through, that was kinda me too when I was in college. It's also how I approached and pursued my wife (DTR talk and all).

When it comes to guys friends and girl interests, I'm not sure that there is a cut and dry right way. How close was this friend? And what does he mean what would happen to your relationship when other guys found out about it? I'm not sure I follow. Unless you're just being cavalier about dating girls and just not calling it dating, I wouldn't think you're about to walk into some sort of intervention consisting of your closest friends and mentors...

I'm not sure I ever handled this sort of thing well. I did make some mistakes along the way, one that even resulted in a little wrestling match at a bowling alley. As it turned out, the girl wasn't really in to either of us, but I gained a lifelong friend and brother!

Ahh... young Christian dating drama.

 

[Xaero Gravity]

You can at least kiss and hug and stuff, right?

Are you nuts? What about Listerfiend and Pillow Pants?

 

[Xaero Gravity]

At the end of the day she can date whoever she wants he's not entitled to anything. But you could have more considerate of his feelings and been honest with him from the beginning.

The OP is better off asking Casey Anthony for parenting advice than he is asking you for dating advice.

 

[Tesseract]

The OP is better off asking Casey Anthony for parenting advice than he is asking you for dating advice.

 

[Night.Ninja]

Imagine if you never get married you will never get to feel the sensation of a warm wet vagina

Well look you gave your friend a head start and his game was slacking he only has him self to blame at the end of the day the fact that Sarah started texting you says a lot, if anything your saved you friend from disappointment down the line but its understandable that hes angry.

If Sarah wants to have sex before marriage are you going to say no?

its fucked up that religion is so fucked up

 

[EviLore]

So much drama, so little sex.

 

[Jooxed]

Are you nuts? What about Listerfiend and Pillow Pants?

Spoiler: NSFW

 

[Nester99]

The OP is better off asking Casey Anthony for parenting advice than he is asking you for dating advice.

wow that was 12 years ago.......

 

[Nester99]

Imagine not fucking the girl who you love and loves you because some old dude convinced you the sky wizard thinks it’s “nasty”

 

[The Pleasure]

So much drama, so little sex.

This is the plot for a memoir from Japan.

 

[StormCell]

Imagine not fucking the girl who you love and loves you because some old dude convinced you the sky wizard thinks it’s “nasty”

Imagine some psychotic woman having your baby because your dick told your heart and brain you were in love with each other!

 

[Nester99]

Imagine some psychotic woman having your baby because your dick told your heart and brain you were in love with each other!

or you could use a condom like a non retard.

 

[appaws]

There has been a big upswing in arrogant fedora wearing non-showering atheists here lately. The kids making good safe choices, give him a break.

It sounds to me like nobody made any commitment or even thought of themselves as boyfriend/girlfriend so I am on your side, OP. It is understandable if he’s a little bummed but he really has no beef with you.