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How Microsoft isn’t getting its deserved credit.

EDMIX

Member
Microsoft are killing it outside of everything but big blockbuster games....and we are in the games business. Good quality AA games only get you so far and they need the triple AAA bangers. Even just one or two a year with the rest and gamepass to flesh out the offerings.

Anyone who is already invested knows how good it is, it's winning over the others that is MS's biggest issue and challenge. Will have to see if they can do it. They set themselves up for the best position this gen but its been a middling start to the generation imo.

Agreed.

I think MS will be just fine as they have some massive AAA heavy hitters in the pipeline, I mean generation defining stuff like Starfield. So I think its more of a when then if as those acquisitions still take time to bear fruit.
 

feynoob

Banned
It's simple. There are way more fans of Nintendo and Sony on here and people like to talk shit about huge successful companies. Apple, Walmart, Mcdonald's, Microsoft, etc are have legions of haters.
The problem with MS/Xbox have been games.
People recognize their other stuff.

But what matters the most are games. There is a reason x360 is beloved by alot of people. It had bangers, compared to x1. X1 was MS trying to be entertainment company, instead of a gaming company.

These stuff would go away by the end of this gen. Until then, MS would have Xbox one reputation on their neck.

DaGwaphics and adamsapple adamsapple

These 2 are super Xbox fans, and they can agree with my take.
 

Sw0pDiller

Member
I have the feling OP is living on another planet. Xbox and particurly GP is being praised to high heavens on just about every mayor website i visit. MS can thank God on their knees that PS5 was severely supply constrained. Because Sony is delivering the games for PS4 and PS5. And games is what it's all about.
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
The problem with MS/Xbox have been games.
People recognize their other stuff.

But what matters the most are games. There is a reason x360 is beloved by alot of people. It had bangers, compared to x1. X1 was MS trying to be entertainment company, instead of a gaming company.

These stuff would go away by the end of this gen. Until then, MS would have Xbox one reputation on their neck.

DaGwaphics and adamsapple adamsapple

These 2 are super Xbox fans, and they can agree with my take.


giphy-downsized-large.gif
 

DavidGzz

Member
The problem with MS/Xbox have been games.
People recognize their other stuff.

But what matters the most are games. There is a reason x360 is beloved by alot of people. It had bangers, compared to x1. X1 was MS trying to be entertainment company, instead of a gaming company.

These stuff would go away by the end of this gen. Until then, MS would have Xbox one reputation on their neck.

DaGwaphics and adamsapple adamsapple

These 2 are super Xbox fans, and they can agree with my take.

Wasn't it just last year that MS got publisher of the year? It really doesn't matter what they release. Microsoft Flight Simulator, Forza Horizon 5, Psychonauts 2, Halo Infinite, Age of Empires 4, Grounded, etc within the last year and they have "no games". They will probably say the same thing next year or laugh the games off because they aren't a 95 on meta.
 

feynoob

Banned
Wasn't it just last year that MS got publisher of the year? It really doesn't matter what they release. Microsoft Flight Simulator, Forza Horizon 5, Psychonauts 2, Halo Infinite, Age of Empires 4, Grounded, etc within the last year and they have "no games". They will probably say the same thing next year or laugh the games off because they aren't a 95 on meta.
Having games means maintaining the release for every year.
MS is a big company. They should have had some games ready in 2022.

I know the delay, but they needed to have contengency plan for cases like these. Having a publisher means nothing, when you are dry for the entire year.

I sympathize with xbox during xbox one, but that shouldnt be the excuse for this gen. Last gen they started with 5-7 devs, and had to close other studios. This gen, they have more. So how is 2022 is dry? At least 1 game would have been better than nothing.
 

twilo99

Member
True, I see little praise for the XSX hardware which is one of if not the best engineered console ever, It's a masterpiece

It’s a toss up with the series s really considering the price point target and the performance they got out of it.

Not sure if they were both designed by the same team, but the engineers behind both projects did an amazing job.
 

DavidGzz

Member
Having games means maintaining the release for every year.
MS is a big company. They should have had some games ready in 2022.

I know the delay, but they needed to have contengency plan for cases like these. Having a publisher means nothing, when you are dry for the entire year.

I sympathize with xbox during xbox one, but that shouldnt be the excuse for this gen. Last gen they started with 5-7 devs, and had to close other studios. This gen, they have more. So how is 2022 is dry? At least 1 game would have been better than nothing.

I've been eating good with Game Pass. My PS5 will be dusted off soon for Ragnarok, otherwise I haven't touched it much this year. I think Microsoft's contingency plan has been great. Didn't they just say they've made 2.9 billion in the least year with Game Pass? I can't keep up with the games on there. Persona 5 is up next.
 

feynoob

Banned
I've been eating good with Game Pass. My PS5 will be dusted off soon for Ragnarok, otherwise I haven't touched it much this year. I think Microsoft's contingency plan has been great. Didn't they just say they've made 2.9 billion in the least year with Game Pass? I can't keep up with the games on there. Persona 5 is up next.
No one is denying gamepass. Its the only thing that have been making xbox fans quite. Without it, MS would have been in a bad spot.

MS seriously need to decide, whether working with 3rd party is good for them or not. Look at PS. They managed to get tons of great IP, by making 3rd party do those games for them. MS needs that, if their 1st party output is weak during that year.
 

DavidGzz

Member
No one is denying gamepass. Its the only thing that have been making xbox fans quite. Without it, MS would have been in a bad spot.

MS seriously need to decide, whether working with 3rd party is good for them or not. Look at PS. They managed to get tons of great IP, by making 3rd party do those games for them. MS needs that, if their 1st party output is weak during that year.

They bought Bethesda and are now more worried about getting the ABK deal approved before getting too crazy with moneyhatting 3rd parties Sony style. Besides, getting games on Game Pass is essentially a 3rd party moneyhat.

I won't deny that it's taking some time for the 1st party to get going, but once they do, Game Pass will snowball and instead of laughing, fanboys for other systems will complain about how MS just bought everyone up. They can't win when it comes to fanboys.
 

feynoob

Banned
They bought Bethesda and are now more worried about getting the ABK deal approved before getting too crazy with moneyhatting 3rd parties Sony style. Besides, getting games on Game Pass is essentially a 3rd party moneyhat.

I won't deny that it's taking some time for the 1st party to get going, but once they do, Game Pass will snowball and instead of laughing, fanboys for other systems will complain about how MS just bought everyone up. They can't win when it comes to fanboys.
That is not the point.

Look at Sony. Their strategy is partnering with 3rd party devs, in order to make exclusive games. That is how they bought insomniac and returnal devs. MS needs that approach, and should have done during late xbox one. They had orio and flight SIM. they didnt capitalize from those tactics.

What happens if activision deal fails? Is MS guarentee to have stream of games from their 1st party every year?

The 3rd party dev partnership can also help gamepass. Since that means more games for the service, instead of relying on 3rd party games.
 

recursive

Member
I feel the consensus is that the lack of first party output is the main gripe here. Well then give MS credit for moving to remedy this complain as well no? I mean they're obviously aware of it and try to fix it.
The astroturf is strong with this one.
 

DavidGzz

Member
That is not the point.

Look at Sony. Their strategy is partnering with 3rd party devs, in order to make exclusive games. That is how they bought insomniac and returnal devs. MS needs that approach, and should have done during late xbox one. They had orio and flight SIM. they didnt capitalize from those tactics.

What happens if activision deal fails? Is MS guarentee to have stream of games from their 1st party every year?

The 3rd party dev partnership can also help gamepass. Since that means more games for the service, instead of relying on 3rd party games.

They will still own more studios than Sony without ABK. The whole Sony nurtures before absorbing thing is so lame lol. Besides, didn't MS do that with Bethesda? Oblivion was moneyhatted back in the day. I'm not sure what you want. MS to double Sony Studios? Isn't that about to happen, essentially?

How are we to know what happens behind the scenes? Maybe the Austian team that made Ori didn't want to be bought out. What do you mean with Flight Sim? MS already owns it.
 
How Microsoft isn’t getting its deserved credit.

I understand that after the debacle that was the Xbox One reveal we’ve all been a bit hesitant to cut MS some slack (and believe me I was part of the band wagon back then - and it was deserved). But come on, today, they should get more credit for what they’ve done to the industry (in regards to history and since Spencers take over)

Microsoft have been investing huge amounts of money, time and thought in projects that are beneficial for us as gamers. Let’s just take a few examples.


GamePass.

I don’t think I’ve ever seen someone complaining about this but big picture wise I don’t think people give it the credit that it is due. It’s a great affordable service. I work in IT so I understand why MS is pushing it but in this instance its a positive for their business (long term) and the consumer.

Backwards compatibility.

I am amazed at how MS have introduced all generation Backwards Compatibility for so many games (not all). I’ts really a great feature. An anecdote from my own life. I bought and XSX instead of buying a new PC (I’ve mainly been a PC game for the past 20 years) because with age I couldn’t really justify spending 2000 dollars on a new PC instead of 600 for a console - I don’t play as much anymore since I don’t have the time. Why an XSX then? Well disregarding GamePass when I understood that I could put a disc in the console from any generation and be fairly certain I would be able to play the game i was astonished (that is how it’s been on PC always). My favorite console game franchise has been MGS since I watched my brother play it in the late 90s and myself playing MGS 2 and MGS 3 on his PS2. I was astonished that I now could buy the Xbox 360 MGS HD Collection and just put it in my console and play (and I have), what joy. These games I haven’t played for 15 years.

Messaging.

I think MS and the Xbox division has been great these past years when it comes to trying to deliver a product that is most enjoyable and available to the most amount of customers. Platform agnosticism, GP, BC what have you. It really shows that they understand. I know some will say that this is a detriment to the development of games (like MS wanting games to be available on as many platforms as possible), and it might be but in the end that’s cause we’re enthusiasts, but I’ve been thinking and for especially many younger people this is giving them an in to the entertainment we enjoy so much. I think the hammer hit the nail with the documentary MS released on youtube this spring ”Power On”, they were humble and admitted to their mistakes (Don’t know how few times I’ve seen that since the 90s)


There’s probably more to say about this, I think for instance that the RROD debacle was handled properly in the end and that there’s multiple companies that would’ve done way worse. MS is willing to look to consumer satisfaction to build a stable business model and I think that is the best we can hope for of any large company as consumers ourselves (and believe me last gen Sony did absolutely the same, but they’re not receiving the same hate).



So this is not a Console War thread, I don’t care about that, I just wanted to share some revelations I’ve had the past years - like I said I've been mainly a PC game and the last console I bought before the XSX was a PS4, and before that the original Xbox - and before that GC. What you all think, have I perhaps left out some scummy behavior or do they indeed deserve some credit?

They have gotten credit. Claiming otherwise means you haven’t paid attention.
 

feynoob

Banned
They will still own more studios than Sony without ABK. The whole Sony nurtures before absorbing thing is so lame lol. Besides, didn't MS do that with Bethesda? Oblivion was moneyhatted back in the day. I'm not sure what you want. MS to double Sony Studios? Isn't that about to happen, essentially?

How are we to know what happens behind the scenes? Maybe the Austian team that made Ori didn't want to be bought out. What do you mean with Flight Sim? MS already owns it.
Flight Sim and Ori were from 3rd party devs. Something MS needs to essentially do more. Not just depend on their 1st party, but do more 3rd party deals.

That could have saved them this year. MS needs to learn that 1st party alone isnt enough. especially with how long games take these days.
 

DavidGzz

Member
Flight Sim and Ori were from 3rd party devs. Something MS needs to essentially do more. Not just depend on their 1st party, but do more 3rd party deals.

That could have saved them this year. MS needs to learn that 1st party alone isnt enough. especially with how long games take these days.

It isn't enough until it is. That's what MS is banking on. If this deal goes through, they will be sitting pretty. We'll talk next year at this time.
 

darrylgorn

Member
It's disturbing that people think this much about any company.

I mean, I enjoy steam and half life but I don't actively think about Valve, the company. That's just weird.
 

GhostOfTsu

Banned
enjoy your cuddling homie lol
You don't have any examples and you can't name anyone because they don't exist. I can name over 10 xbox shills in 5 seconds. Two of them liked your posts 😉
I came here to post this. What kind of life must the OP lead in order to decide to go and create a topic like this about a corporation, it's just incomprehensible.
It would make sense if maybe he was playing a MS game but there was a total lack of any game titles besides Metal Gear Solid. A PS2 game 😆
I've been eating good with Game Pass. My PS5 will be dusted off soon for Ragnarok, otherwise I haven't touched it much this year. I think Microsoft's contingency plan has been great. Didn't they just say they've made 2.9 billion in the least year with Game Pass? I can't keep up with the games on there. Persona 5 is up next.
Persona 5 came out 6 years ago and it was literally free on PS+ for years. If you had any genuine interest you would have played it already. Keep shilling David.
 

DavidGzz

Member
Persona 5 came out 6 years ago and it was literally free on PS+ for years. If you had any genuine interest you would have played it already. Keep shilling David.

Fuck out of here with your accusations. You think people who can play things for "free" aren't going to take advantage? You know I also buy old games on Steam and enjoy the hell out of them. I'm not a huge fan of Persona like I was with the original, but I still look forward to it. Older games are still good. It was just released on Steam and is a best seller. Are all those people not interested? Herpaderp
 
I think the thing they don’t get enough credit for, if there is anything at all, is the engineering of the Series consoles. For the price, the S is spectacular. And the X is just an amazing console. The most powerful ever, but also so ridiculously quiet.

I can’t give them any credit in the games department. They’ve had basically nothing in 2022. As amazing as 2021 was, 2022 should never happen. GamePass has kept them afloat this year.
 

sankt-Antonio

:^)--?-<
I would still argue GP is going to reduce the amount of quality content down the line and will massively push monetizing in every aspect of gamedesign to stay viable after the growth phase is over.

Long / massive quality sp games are not going to make a lot of sense going forward. Sneaky thing is, games that are already in development distort my prediction, but the key thing here is that they have started without GP in mind. I’m talking 2025 and beyond.
 

tmlDan

Member
Because all these companies people keep fighting for/defending are not your friends. They are here to try to make money, increase market share/mindshare, please their stock holders. What fairy tale have you been living where companies follow a path of honor and righteousness?
did I ever say that? stop making things up. Doing what i said isn't righteous it would build the brand and foster talent to make fantastic xbox exclusives.

They've been in gaming almost 20 years, they haven't done this before so why now? why couldn't they build something? They did nothing.
 

Elog

Member
They will still own more studios than Sony without ABK. The whole Sony nurtures before absorbing thing is so lame lol. Besides, didn't MS do that with Bethesda? Oblivion was moneyhatted back in the day. I'm not sure what you want. MS to double Sony Studios? Isn't that about to happen, essentially?

How are we to know what happens behind the scenes? Maybe the Austian team that made Ori didn't want to be bought out. What do you mean with Flight Sim? MS already owns it.
With that logic, Nintendo would have the lowest execlusive output since they own the smallest number of studios (with the fewest number of devs).

MS needs to come to terms with that their core problem is that if you are great at what you are doing as a technical person, the likelihood of you working for MS is low. This is the problem they have in every business division. If you are a fantastic coder, graphics designer, sound artist, engineer etc - MS is not the place to be. They need to fix that to really get the 1st party output on fire.
 
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DavidGzz

Member
With that logic, Nintendo would have the lowest execlusive output since they own the smallest number of studios (with the fewest number of devs).

MS needs to come to terms with that their core problem is that if you are great at what you are doing as a technical person, the likelihood of you working for MS is low. This is the problem they have in every business division. If you are a fantastic coder, graphics designer, sound artist, engineer etc - MS is not the place to be. They need to fix that to really get the 1st party output on fire.

Yeah, talentless. https://www.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-game-studios May as well shut them all down. Fanboy drivel keeps being spewed. Then you have the backwards compatibility team. Wizards. But yeah, you're right. I hope MS saw your post so that they can make sure the next Doom, Forza, Hellblade, Sea of Thieves, Gears, etc are actually good.
 
Wasn't it just last year that MS got publisher of the year? It really doesn't matter what they release. Microsoft Flight Simulator, Forza Horizon 5, Psychonauts 2, Halo Infinite, Age of Empires 4, Grounded, etc within the last year and they have "no games". They will probably say the same thing next year or laugh the games off because they aren't a 95 on meta.

Who's talking about a single year? How about all the other years? 1 year out of 10, they actually release many good games for once and you expect praise? Sony and Nintendo release High quality games consistently. Take off your xbox warrior goggles.
 
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Gudji

Member
They get enough credit. Gamepass is good but it's not the best thing in gaming.
Their next gen console has nothing really new outside an OS feature and better hardware, same user interface, same controller with little to no changes, etc.
And they still got the same problem from over a decade ago: no must play games delivered at a good pace.

Phil is lucky the current MS CEO is willing to invest in his division otherwise it would be much worse. That might not happen with the next one tho.
 

RyRy93

Member
It all boils down to their output of great exclusives which is very poor, they appear to have some around the corner but we've seen that before...
 
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GHG

Gold Member
That is attributed the lack of 1st party studios.
5 studios wont be able to support a gaming console for entire generation.

MS played around during x360, and forget what is like to have in house 1st party studios, hence the "no games console".

He was actively shutting down studios in a time when they barely had any. He gets no sympathy from me, especially not due to the way he dealt with Lionhead.

Fuck out of here with your accusations. You think people who can play things for "free" aren't going to take advantage?

If you've been gaming on Xbox/PC exclusively for the last ~5 years then fair enough but the point he was making is the fact that it was already available for "free" for years to those who claim to have all platforms (of which you are one of).

So from that perspective it makes no sense that only now you are celebrating it being on a subscription service, that was already the case.
 
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Elog

Member
Yeah, talentless. https://www.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-game-studios May as well shut them all down. Fanboy drivel keeps being spewed. Then you have the backwards compatibility team. Wizards. But yeah, you're right. I hope MS saw your post so that they can make sure the next Doom, Forza, Hellblade, Sea of Thieves, Gears, etc are actually good.
It is not drivel. Everyone in the industry knows that MS is struggling to develop and retain technical talent across business areas.
 

DavidGzz

Member
If you've been gaming on Xbox/PC exclusively for the last ~5 years then fair enough but the point he was making is the fact that it was already available for "free" for years to those who claim to have all platforms (of which you are one of).

So from that perspective it makes no sense that only now you are celebrating it being on a subscription service, that was already the case.

I don't sub to PS Plus since I don't play online on my PS5 and I didn't play online on my PS4, it's an exclusives only platform. I didn't want to spend money on Persona since I don't know if I would like it. Now that I can play it at no additional cost, I will give it a try,
 

DavidGzz

Member
Who's talking about a single year? How about all the other years? 1 year out of 10, they actually release many good games for once and you expect praise? Sony and Nintendo release High quality games consistently. Take off your xbox warrior goggles.

Warriors don't own all platforms. PC takes up most of my time, so if anything, I'm a PC fanboy. 1 year out of 10? That sounds more like blind fanboy BS to me than what I've been saying. Besides my point is that it doesn't matter to you haters what MS does. Last year was good and still Xbox had no games in your eyes. That's the point.

Here you go. Scroll to 2012 to today on this page. Plenty of great years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_published_by_Microsoft
 

Gudji

Member
Warriors don't own all platforms. PC takes up most of my time, so if anything, I'm a PC fanboy. 1 year out of 10? That sounds more like blind fanboy BS to me than what I've been saying. Besides my point is that it doesn't matter to you haters what MS does. Last year was good and still Xbox had no games in your eyes. That's the point.

Here you go. Scroll to 2012 to today on this page. Plenty of great years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_published_by_Microsoft
You'd be surprised.
 

GHG

Gold Member
I don't sub to PS Plus since I don't play online on my PS5 and I didn't play online on my PS4, it's an exclusives only platform. I didn't want to spend money on Persona since I don't know if I would like it. Now that I can play it at no additional cost, I will give it a try,

Previously you said you "can't keep up" while giving specific mention to that game. But in reality it's not that big a deal for you since it's a game you weren't all that interested in in the first place?

Glad we could clear that up.
 

DavidGzz

Member
You'd be surprised.

Then they wouldn't be warriors. A warrior is like the dude who said they'd sell their PS5 if Sony let MS put Game Pass on it. Warriors would scoff at the thought of buying the competition. I stood in line for 4 hours in the cold for my PS5. I'm buying Ragnarok next month. I'm just using simple logic. All platforms have their merits to a game fan.


Previously you said you "can't keep up" while giving specific mention to that game. But in reality it's not that big a deal for you since it's a game you weren't all that interested in in the first place?

Glad we could clear that up.

I can't keep up with all the games I want to try on Game Pass. I still haven't gotten around to Chivalry 2 either. Glad I could clear that up for you.
 
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Snake29

RSI Employee of the Year
It isn't enough until it is. That's what MS is banking on. If this deal goes through, they will be sitting pretty. We'll talk next year at this time.

Their strategy doesn’t do any wonders. The moment when 3rd party leave GP behind them, MS will have huge problems, and will then be forced going full multiplatform. You can bet that not only Sony but also other platform holders will try to block MS for trying to buy more big publishers.
 
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